custom 22kw outrunner for ultralight aricraft

Electric Motors and Controllers
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jlcortex   1 mW

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custom 22kw outrunner for ultralight aricraft

Post by jlcortex » Feb 14 2011 5:25pm

hello, we have a project to install a electric motor in a real ultralight aircraft, probably a single seat.

I am searching motors, but i can see it is difficult to found upper to 10Kw brushless motors. in fact i have only found "YUNEEC" motors

I am thinking than it could be funny to build a big direct drive brushless motor, If my customer are agree, I really prefer to design and build a custom motor than expend money in yuneec motor.

i have experience in solidworks 3d drawings, CNC lathe and milling parts, laser cut and there are some re-winding workshops near here, it seems easy to build.

About motor design:
Probably the state of the art are axial flux halbach - litz wire motors, but it could be a risk, brushless outrunner are easy to build, reasonable efficiency and it seems to be reliable design

Target:
22kW 2500rpm (based in piston motor and gear box)
120V/250A?

Controller
15kW - 30kW
http://kellycontroller.com/ksl1225024v- ... p-675.html

What do you think?, is it possible?
Someone with permanent magnet motor design experience interested in help me?

jlcortex


rolf_w   100 W

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Re: custom 22kw outrunner for ultralight aricraft

Post by rolf_w » Feb 14 2011 6:05pm

jlcortex wrote:I am searching motors, but i can see it is difficult to found upper to 10Kw brushless motors. in fact i have only found "YUNEEC" motors
try http://www.enstroj.si/Electric-products ... otors.html
rolf

Biff   100 W

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Re: custom 22kw outrunner for ultralight aricraft

Post by Biff » Feb 15 2011 2:44pm

I have used MotorSolve Before

You are right, there are not very many motors out there in that power range right now.

here are your options.

Cheapest are these:
http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/stor ... duct=14427 but we are still not sure how much power they will actually be able to produce.

More Expensive are:
http://www.freeair.cz/freeairen/index.p ... &TreeId=32

http://www.rs-e-motoren.de/joomla/index ... &Itemid=79

Both around 20kW

If you want to build your own prototype, you should be prepared to pay around USD$1,500 for laminations and magnets. Then on top of that would be all the material and machining costs (which I guess you have covered). I could help you with the magnetic design and simulation to fit your requirements if you are prepared to pay that, otherwise, try one of the motors I listed, even the expensive ones will be cheaper than building one on your own.

-ryan

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Jeremy Harris   10 GW

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Re: custom 22kw outrunner for ultralight aricraft

Post by Jeremy Harris » Feb 15 2011 3:01pm

A friend of mine, Nigel Beale, flew an ultralight here back in around 1996 using a Lynch motor running on NiCd cells. Another friend flew a twin engined ultralight on two Plettenberg Predator motors running on a Kokam LiPo pack back in 2009 (http://www.eng.cam.ac.uk/news/stories/2 ... _aircraft/).

I reckon an Agni motor running on LiPo would probably do the same job today fairly easily and affordably. At 11kg and 30kW peak, 16kW continuous, it's probably the "best bang for your buck" in terms of system power, weight and cost.

If you wanted to go brushless then the Geiger/Eck motor that another acqaintance used to power a powered hang glider is probably a good bet, maybe better than the similar power level Plettenberg motor, as it has a lower Kv, I believe.

Jeremy
Please ask questions on the forum, rather than by PM, as it helps others and you'll get a better range of answers.

regmeister   1 kW

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Re: custom 22kw outrunner for ultralight aricraft

Post by regmeister » Feb 15 2011 3:57pm

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Nuts&Volts   100 W

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Re: custom 22kw outrunner for ultralight aricraft

Post by Nuts&Volts » Feb 15 2011 11:04pm

regmeister wrote:The Werner/Eck motors are now being built by Flytech Only 13.5kW so far.

Sonex has been working on a 50kW'r (or thereabouts) for a few years now.

Please let us know the price on the Emrax, if you find out.
The Emrax are around the 2400 euro range right now, with various added costs for liquid cooling and other options (encoder, larger quantities, etc.).

regmeister   1 kW

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Re: custom 22kw outrunner for ultralight aricraft

Post by regmeister » Feb 15 2011 11:49pm

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Nuts&Volts   100 W

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Re: custom 22kw outrunner for ultralight aricraft

Post by Nuts&Volts » Feb 16 2011 12:53am

They are still developing an in-house compatible controller, but the pitronik sac41 is 3700 euro while a Unitek GmbH is 3300 euro.

The pitronik is sensorless controlled and data from that controller can be found at the enstroj wedsite. The Sevcon Gen5 is still be researched and like i said the in-house controller is still being developed. Send enstoj an email and they can give you more precise numbers. They are very busy, so it may take them a while to get back to you, be patient I guess. (or PM me if you want)

regmeister   1 kW

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Re: custom 22kw outrunner for ultralight aricraft

Post by regmeister » Feb 16 2011 8:38am

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jlcortex   1 mW

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Re: custom 22kw outrunner for ultralight aricraft

Post by jlcortex » Feb 19 2011 2:34pm

Thanks rolf_w, EMRAX seems a great product
I have also asked EMRAX, 2400 is a reasonable price for well build axial flux 50kW (33kw continues) power motor.

geigerengineering seems more expensive (comparatively)
http://www.flytec.ch/e-drive/home.htm
10kW $2700 + drive $1680

+ batteries!, 8kw = 3000€?

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