LIVE NOW.. Zerocast about Zero motor!

Electric Motors and Controllers
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Doctorbass   100 GW

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LIVE NOW.. Zerocast about Zero motor!

Post by Doctorbass » Dec 09 2015 5:52pm

CURRENT PROJECT: 2WD duo MXUS/Max-E ebike 32kW
http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewto ... =3&t=65764
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-Succeded to haul a 19200 pounds schoolbus!
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ohzee   1 MW

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Re: LIVE NOW.. Zerocast about Zero motor!

Post by ohzee » Dec 10 2015 2:23am

That was pretty cool. You even got some love.

Some day I want to own a Zero. Hopefully in the next couple years.

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liveforphysics   100 GW

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Re: LIVE NOW.. Zerocast about Zero motor!

Post by liveforphysics » Dec 10 2015 3:32am

Ryan rocks, that was excellent.
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Miles   100 GW

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Re: LIVE NOW.. Zerocast about Zero motor!

Post by Miles » Dec 10 2015 5:47am

Thanks! Interesting presentation. Pity I missed it live!

sendler2112   10 kW

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Re: LIVE NOW.. Zerocast about Zero motor!

Post by sendler2112 » Dec 10 2015 9:30am

Zero Motorcycles new Internal Perm Mag motor rotor design results in stable flux through the magnets for greatly reduced internal heat generation within the sensitive magnets. And they are encased in the rotor iron so there is no chance of getting loose. Surface Mount rotors subject the magnets to big flux changes as they rotate raising heat. Zero is running winding temps to 150C.
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http://livestream.com/accounts/14139273/events/4534534
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flathill   100 kW

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Re: LIVE NOW.. Zerocast about Zero motor!

Post by flathill » Dec 11 2015 2:52am

Reminds me of the chevy spark motor which is a great motor

Using smaller magnets and epoxy(non conductive) coating is a great way to reduce eddy current losses in the mags but I bet that is only part of the reason it can be run hotter without the mags demagnetizing

The other part has to do with the better working point of the magnet when fully surrounded by steel allowing for more leeway


sendler2112   10 kW

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Re: LIVE NOW.. Zerocast about Zero motor!

Post by sendler2112 » Dec 11 2015 6:41am

Interesting that Chevy has oriented the "V" of the magnets the other way around so they are even farther from the gap in a TON of steel.

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speedmd   100 MW

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Re: LIVE NOW.. Zerocast about Zero motor!

Post by speedmd » Dec 11 2015 12:03pm

Great presentation. Loved the back to back simulation comparison of the surface vs internal magnet flux patterns. WOW. Huge improvements. Chevy stacking magnets! Wish some affordable simulators were available just to play around with on these design options.

flathill   100 kW

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Re: LIVE NOW.. Zerocast about Zero motor!

Post by flathill » Dec 11 2015 1:48pm

you could probably double the torque with a v shape mag config

partly due to the increased reluctance torque

and partly due to the increased magnet surface area (research papers and multi variate sims dont pick up on this)

you may call this flux focusing but the important thing is the increases surface area for a given pole surface area

increasing magnet thickness hits a point of diminishing returns so the v config allows two thinner magnets meaning you save money

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MrDude_1   100 kW

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Re: LIVE NOW.. Zerocast about Zero motor!

Post by MrDude_1 » Dec 11 2015 9:28pm

man, I wish I saw this when it was live...
Warning:This post is being read via light, a substance known to the state of California to cause cancer.

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speedmd   100 MW

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Re: LIVE NOW.. Zerocast about Zero motor!

Post by speedmd » Dec 12 2015 9:57am

flathill wrote:you could probably double the torque with a v shape mag config

partly due to the increased reluctance torque

and partly due to the increased magnet surface area (research papers and multi variate sims dont pick up on this)

you may call this flux focusing but the important thing is the increases surface area for a given pole surface area

increasing magnet thickness hits a point of diminishing returns so the v config allows two thinner magnets meaning you save money
After seeing the improvements going with internal magnets, I can see no other choice. Only areas in the steel that see much flux change are areas that are most exposed for cooling methods to have major effect. Much more even in flux. Separate v style looks very impressive. Would love to get just one of those sections for a ebike motor. May be worth buying a salvage car just to pull apart / rebuild into something useful.

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spinningmagnets   100 GW

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Re: LIVE NOW.. Zerocast about Zero motor!

Post by spinningmagnets » Dec 12 2015 11:05am

Great info, thanks for posting. Are the Zero magnets SmCo?

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crossbreak   100 MW

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Re: LIVE NOW.. Zerocast about Zero motor!

Post by crossbreak » Dec 16 2015 12:15pm

thanks for sharing, doc.
@ spinningmagnets : ryan seems to still answer questions in the comments. try askin him there

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liveforphysics   100 GW

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Re: LIVE NOW.. Zerocast about Zero motor!

Post by liveforphysics » Dec 16 2015 12:32pm

spinningmagnets wrote:Great info, thanks for posting. Are the Zero magnets SmCo?
N40SH if I remember correctly.
Each carcinogen vapor exposure includes a dice roll for cancer.

Each mutagen vapor exposure includes a dice roll for reproductive genetic defects in your children.

Each engine start sprays them into a shared atmosphere which includes beings not offered an opportunity to consent accepting these cancer experiences and defective genetics life experiences.

Every post is a free gift to the collective of minds composing the living bleeding edge of LEV development on our spaceship.

vehiculeselectriques   10 mW

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Re: LIVE NOW.. Zerocast about Zero motor!

Post by vehiculeselectriques » Jan 16 2016 2:55am

flathill wrote:you could probably double the torque with a v shape mag config

partly due to the increased reluctance torque

and partly due to the increased magnet surface area (research papers and multi variate sims dont pick up on this)

you may call this flux focusing but the important thing is the increases surface area for a given pole surface area

increasing magnet thickness hits a point of diminishing returns so the v config allows two thinner magnets meaning you save money
Hello,

internal permanent magnets motors gives about 30% more torque with the reluctance/saliency effect produced.
so you can design with more torque in mind or use less magnets for same torque, you choose (for car makers it's no doubt less $)
BUT it require special driving parameters to obtain the boost compared to classical PM motor.

there is more and more studies data about these IMPM, as this one :D

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