"Edge" DD hubmotor, 1500W, 35mm, Al core

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Trailblazer   10 W

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Re: "Edge" DD hubmotor, 1500W, 35mm, Al core

Post by Trailblazer » Sep 16 2016 6:42pm

I am having a problem where the CA is not showing speed until I let off the throttle. It appears that the speed is right, but when I'm 'on' the throttle, the speed is 0.

Does that sound like a short, or what?

When I first got the kit, it would only do that after the controller heated up. Now it does it all the time.

Anyone got any ideas?

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spinningmagnets   100 GW

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Re: "Edge" DD hubmotor, 1500W, 35mm, Al core

Post by spinningmagnets » Sep 16 2016 9:17pm

I haven't been able to get the LA eBike 18-FET controller to work yet. It may have gotten bounced around in shipping, and I have no experience trouble-shooting controllers...it runs fine on my 12-FET, but that's just leaving a lot of power on the table.

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Re: "Edge" DD hubmotor, 1500W, 35mm, Al core

Post by Spongeworthy » Sep 27 2016 10:46am

Anyone have the software to program the controller?

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teslanv   100 MW

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Re: "Edge" DD hubmotor, 1500W, 35mm, Al core

Post by teslanv » Oct 15 2016 6:10pm

neptronix wrote:Omg, they won't make a full 40mm version.. that would be a hot seller.. are they out of their minds?

They're already halfway there! :lol: :lol: :lol:
The Stator body is 5mm wider than the stator magnets to allow the windings a home between the side covers. The MXUS motors are made the same way. 35mm is the max stator/magnet side for this body design, I'd say.
Sam and I received samples of this motor from the Manufacturer. With a 4T winding, I get 11.1 Kv and a phase resistance of 0.095 Ohms. Should take the same phase current as a 4T MXUS motor, based on the phase resistance. Maybe even a little more. 8) Only difference will be lower total torque as compared to the MXUS 45mm.
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mrbill   1 kW

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Re: "Edge" DD hubmotor, 1500W, 35mm, Al core

Post by mrbill » Nov 11 2016 12:29pm

Folks:

I bought one of these motors last summer and have only just now finished my testing and written a review on my blog:

https://mrbill.homeip.net/hybridBike.ph ... 500Testing

Summary: I like it. It's a nice DD motor that can take a multi-speed cassette yet has greater torque capability than a 28-30mm stator DD hub motor. My testing involved running controlled trials on a route with a significant hill climb, each trial adding cooling aids such as Statorade and Hubsinks. The motor could use a few improvements, but for the price, it's a good value as is, especially for someone who is comfortable popping the lid and installing their own thermistor.
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Re: "Edge" DD hubmotor, 1500W, 35mm, Al core

Post by Baron » Nov 11 2016 1:46pm

mrbill wrote:Folks:

I bought one of these motors last summer and have only just now finished my testing and written a review on my blog:

https://mrbill.homeip.net/hybridBike.ph ... 500Testing

Summary: I like it. It's a nice DD motor that can take a multi-speed cassette yet has greater torque capability than a 28-30mm stator DD hub motor. My testing involved running controlled trials on a route with a significant hill climb, each trial adding cooling aids such as Statorade and Hubsinks. The motor could use a few improvements, but for the price, it's a good value as is, especially for someone who is comfortable popping the lid and installing their own thermistor.
Your axle nuts could be coming loose because of a lack of clamping torque arms. You have good torque arms, but without clamping I think there's still a tiny bit of play in the axle, which could loosen the nuts over time. IIRC you also use a 20" wheel, which could compound the issue. Smaller wheel = more torque and regen force at the axle. edit: not sure if this is true
Last edited by Baron on Nov 15 2016 6:48pm, edited 1 time in total.

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mrbill   1 kW

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Re: "Edge" DD hubmotor, 1500W, 35mm, Al core

Post by mrbill » Nov 11 2016 7:48pm

Baron wrote:
mrbill wrote:Folks:

I bought one of these motors last summer and have only just now finished my testing and written a review on my blog:

https://mrbill.homeip.net/hybridBike.ph ... 500Testing

Summary: I like it. It's a nice DD motor that can take a multi-speed cassette yet has greater torque capability than a 28-30mm stator DD hub motor. My testing involved running controlled trials on a route with a significant hill climb, each trial adding cooling aids such as Statorade and Hubsinks. The motor could use a few improvements, but for the price, it's a good value as is, especially for someone who is comfortable popping the lid and installing their own thermistor.
Your axle nuts could be coming loose because of a lack of clamping torque arms. You have good torque arms, but without clamping I think there's still a tiny bit of play in the axle, which could loosen the nuts over time. IIRC you also use a 20" wheel, which could compound the issue. Smaller wheel = more torque and regen force at the axle.
Hi Baron:

Since I started using the Nord-lock washers and tightening the nuts to 60Nm and higher, I haven't had any problem with axle nuts working loose. I'm still experimenting to discover the minimum torque needed to maintain tightness.
Bill Bushnell
http://mrbill.homeip.net/
Bike build thread can be seen here.

fussler   100 µW

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Re: "Edge" DD hubmotor, 1500W, 35mm, Al core

Post by fussler » Jan 20 2017 4:01am

Hi all

So where abouts can you buy this kit?

I don't trust non shop owners that tell me to pay them money over the internet..

markz   100 GW

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Re: "Edge" DD hubmotor, 1500W, 35mm, Al core

Post by markz » Jan 20 2017 4:58am

Luna might still but I dunno

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skeetab5780   10 MW

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Re: "Edge" DD hubmotor, 1500W, 35mm, Al core

Post by skeetab5780 » Jan 20 2017 8:30am

fussler wrote:
I don't trust non shop owners that tell me to pay them money over the internet..
That's the only way to get the good stuff!

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Re: "Edge" DD hubmotor, 1500W, 35mm, Al core

Post by Baron » Jan 28 2017 10:51pm

Anyone know what model temp sensor is in this motor so I can set up my CA3 correctly?

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Re: "Edge" DD hubmotor, 1500W, 35mm, Al core

Post by Trailblazer » Feb 01 2017 12:50am

Baron wrote:Anyone know what model temp sensor is in this motor so I can set up my CA3 correctly?
No matter what I did, I could not get the temp sensor to work. I believe it:

A) Doesn't have one
B) Is shorted out

I am going to disassemble it and put a new one in. Don't forget to read Ron's article about correct disassembly!!!

https://www.electricbike.com/edge-1500w/

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Re: "Edge" DD hubmotor, 1500W, 35mm, Al core

Post by Baron » Feb 01 2017 1:11am

Trailblazer wrote:
Baron wrote:Anyone know what model temp sensor is in this motor so I can set up my CA3 correctly?
No matter what I did, I could not get the temp sensor to work. I believe it:

A) Doesn't have one
B) Is shorted out

I am going to disassemble it and put a new one in. Don't forget to read Ron's article about correct disassembly!!!

https://www.electricbike.com/edge-1500w/
Mine works, I connected the white wire from the motor to the yellow wire on my CA3 temp sensor connector. No need to connect the ground, as it uses a common ground. but if you put in your own temp sensor, it's more accurate to use its own ground connected to the CA temp sensor connector. I set my CA to 10k ntc and it seems to be accurate. Averaged around 60c and peaked around 80c riding about 5 miles with hard stop and go and regen at 72v 45a, i forget what phase amps.

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Re: "Edge" DD hubmotor, 1500W, 35mm, Al core

Post by 999zip999 » Jul 06 2017 4:43pm

Spinningmagnets how's it going ? You riding it yet ?

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spinningmagnets   100 GW

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Re: "Edge" DD hubmotor, 1500W, 35mm, Al core

Post by spinningmagnets » Jul 06 2017 5:55pm

It runs great, but all I have driving it is a 12-FET. I have two 18-FET controllers and no time to sort them out. I am working 12 hour shifts, and nuking about 20 spams from Russia (Ukraine?) A day when I get a few minutes.

I am really excited about resistance soldering, and I have been gathering all the info I can about that. I have "just enough" info that I have actually started buying stuff to test that.

I'm also working on other things I'm not at liberty to discuss yet, will post as soon as I'm allowed. I guess I can sleep when I'm dead...

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Re: "Edge" DD hubmotor, 1500W, 35mm, Al core

Post by 999zip999 » Jul 07 2017 2:34pm

Is The Edge a superior motor to the leaf ? Hauling around a muxus 3000 and 24s of lifepo4 is to heavy.

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spinningmagnets   100 GW

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Re: "Edge" DD hubmotor, 1500W, 35mm, Al core

Post by spinningmagnets » Jul 07 2017 3:05pm

Their performance should be similar. If you apply very high temporary peak amps, the Edge has an aluminum stator support that can absorb heat-spikes, and then shed that heat over time. The Leafbike motor is lighter and less expensive.

Both have 35mm wide rotor magnets, and both have the desirable thin laminations (0.35mm, as opposed to the common 0.50mm).

Both of them would benefit from adding ferro fluid, but the Leafbike hubmotor would benefit the most.

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Re: "Edge" DD hubmotor, 1500W, 35mm, Al core

Post by 999zip999 » Jul 07 2017 6:04pm

Clear thank you . I will get a 4t from evolutions.

markz   100 GW

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Re: "Edge" DD hubmotor, 1500W, 35mm, Al core

Post by markz » Jul 07 2017 7:13pm

Thats the only diff is the alum stator in the Edge, Leaf is steel.
Otherwise same motors.

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Re: "Edge" DD hubmotor, 1500W, 35mm, Al core

Post by Timbecile » Sep 26 2017 3:08pm

Just picked up a 1500w from laebikes, Nader happened to pass by my neck of the woods and was nice enough to rendezvous. Used an 18fet from PowerVelocity and got it spinning with 14s. CA showed 100w at WOT from what sounded like the right phase combo (unloaded/bare hub).

FF and hubsinks are in the mail as of today! *rubs hands together* All that’s left is for me to deflower my first motor. My finger tips are tingling in anticipation, and slight fear of being magnet chopped. How does one tell what KV they have after the tops off?

Is it worth changing the phase wires before the axle? My gut is tellling me another 6 inches of 16 gauge won’t have enough resistance to cause heat issues. Controller is set for 21s / 4kw

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Cowardlyduck   10 MW

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Re: "Edge" DD hubmotor, 1500W, 35mm, Al core

Post by Cowardlyduck » Sep 26 2017 5:56pm

Timbecile wrote:Is it worth changing the phase wires before the axle? My gut is tellling me another 6 inches of 16 gauge won’t have enough resistance to cause heat issues.
Wrong.
Adding thicker phase wires does two things when running high power.
1) It reduces resistance, which reduces heat build up.
2) The thicker wire also acts as a heat-sink pulling heat away from the motor.

That being said, if the motor only comes with 16awg wire through the axle, IMO that's inadequate for decent power. For my Leaf motor and HS40xx motor's I always upgrade the wire through the axle to fine stranded 12awg silicone wire with the silicone replaced with heat-shrink. If you can manage, at least go to 14awg wire through the axle, otherwise you seriously risk burning it out at anything over about 3KW IMO.

Cheers
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Re: "Edge" DD hubmotor, 1500W, 35mm, Al core

Post by Baron » Sep 26 2017 6:10pm

Timbecile wrote:Just picked up a 1500w from laebikes, Nader happened to pass by my neck of the woods and was nice enough to rendezvous. Used an 18fet from PowerVelocity and got it spinning with 14s. CA showed 100w at WOT from what sounded like the right phase combo (unloaded/bare hub).

FF and hubsinks are in the mail as of today! *rubs hands together* All that’s left is for me to deflower my first motor. My finger tips are tingling in anticipation, and slight fear of being magnet chopped. How does one tell what KV they have after the tops off?

Is it worth changing the phase wires before the axle? My gut is tellling me another 6 inches of 16 gauge won’t have enough resistance to cause heat issues. Controller is set for 21s / 4kw

You mean you're going to open it up just to add ferrofluid? I just added FF to my Edge motor, using this video from Justin as a guide:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JZU-mhlNcqE

No need to crack open the motor.

the stock phase wires look small, but I am running 50A battery / 130A phase at 64V without issue. but, if you're going to open it up anyway, it's worth it to swap in some thicker phase wires

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spinningmagnets   100 GW

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Re: "Edge" DD hubmotor, 1500W, 35mm, Al core

Post by spinningmagnets » Sep 26 2017 6:47pm

Luke / LFP showed that the fattest wire you can fit is when you slice off the thick insulation, and then cover the bare wire with thin heat shrink. Its not as difficult as it sounds, because you only need to do it for about 18 inches of each phase wire to carry the current from the inside of the hubmotor to a few inches outside the hub. Link and pic from Allex.

https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewt ... 5#p1047303
Image

At that point, you can actually gain a heat-shedding benefit from going to fatter wire outside the hub, and butt-splice the ends, then cover the joint with marine-grade waterproof glue-lined heat shrink. I think the most important part of a butt-splice (whether soldered or crimped) is to interlace the strands from both sides. The length of the interlaced part should be at least four times the diameter of the thickest wire.

Image

If you don't have a preference for the skinny hall wires (plus temp probe and speedometer?), I recommend braided 24-ga with thin temp-resistant PTFE / Teflon insulation. The copper is 24ga, but the overall diameter is surprisingly thin. The 5V / low-amp signals can work well with thinner wire than this, but...I find that anything thinner is hard to manipulate when crimping or soldering. Hall wires will never get hot from their own current, but if they are squished against hot phase wires, the motor phase heat can deform the Hall PVC insulation...

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Cowardlyduck   10 MW

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Re: "Edge" DD hubmotor, 1500W, 35mm, Al core

Post by Cowardlyduck » Sep 26 2017 7:01pm

YUP ^^^ This is what I'm talking about.
As I said, I usually put 12AWG through the axle using the heat-shrink mod above, then I switch to 8AWG just outside the axle.

The Edge motor looks like the perfect candidate for this kind of upgrade IMO.

The other mod that's worth mentioning is to make sure you use decent connectors, like the XT150.

Cheers
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Re: "Edge" DD hubmotor, 1500W, 35mm, Al core

Post by teslanv » Sep 28 2017 10:45pm

I've been pairing the 4T and 6T windings of these motors with my 6FET irfb3077 controllers that put out about 30A. Running them on a 48V-15AH Hailing XL pack of 13S5P Samsung 30Q cells. This combination is rock solid, and a whole lotta fun.

I run the 4T (11Kv) on a 26" tire and the 6T (~8.5Kv) on a 29er tire (Shown below).

Just an awesome set-up all around.
Custom Motobecane 29er.jpg
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