power stage using SMD and IMS

Electric Motors and Controllers
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ElectronS   10 mW

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power stage using SMD and IMS

Post by ElectronS » Nov 30 2016 4:16pm

Anyone has considered building a high current (above 200A-400A at 48v or 72v ) power stage using SMD mosfets or IGBTs in to-263-7 package or TO-leadless (ex:IPT020N10N3)

Using an IMS (aluminum substrate board) does help greatly in heat transfer and easy connection to an external heatsink.

something like this : http://www.infineon.com/dgdl/Infineon+- ... df8a0457ab

Image
isnot this kind of SMD design better interms of build quality , size , repeat ability . why is every one still using To-220 and to-247 or the gaint and absurdly expensive Power modules
Attachments
New Bitmap Im2age.jpg
from the PDF , the gerber of the top layer and the thermal clad type
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Last edited by ElectronS on Dec 01 2016 9:53am, edited 1 time in total.

Animalector   10 kW

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Re: power stage using SMD and IMS

Post by Animalector » Nov 30 2016 6:32pm

I am doing something similar with my lebowski controller power stage but i had thought if using these: FDBL0240N100
https://www.fairchildsemi.com/datasheet ... 40N100.pdf

I haven't put linking Caps between the phase output and the rails before, I wonder what the purpose is? they're only 100n as shown. Also, they do not note on their schematic what they have used for the Capacitors between +VBat and -VBat again these look only small, and there is no provision for the DC-Link big suckers that we typically use. but I like a few things about this which is giving me some ideas. :?:

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marcos   100 W

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Re: power stage using SMD and IMS

Post by marcos » Nov 30 2016 7:33pm

If you can point me to the gerber files of that application note I can get it quoted, I guess aluminum substrate pcb are on the expensive side.

Animalector   10 kW

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Re: power stage using SMD and IMS

Post by Animalector » Nov 30 2016 8:28pm

Are they using aluminium substrate?. I just read 30oz copper. Oh yeah... chunky :twisted:

I'll finish my layout and post it on my 3kw micro lebowski thread.

I wonder how much these fets cost I haven't looked at them yet? Anyone have a link to a supplier

whereswally606   100 kW

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Re: power stage using SMD and IMS

Post by whereswally606 » Dec 01 2016 6:52am

ElectronS wrote: Image
isnot this kind of SMD design better interms of build quality , size , repeat ability . why is every one still using To-220 and to-247 or the gaint and absurdly expensive Power modules
My guess, for the hobbyist, smd is still abit far from reach, sure you can get small batches of pcb made cheap and build yourself a reflow oven from a toaster. but then placing the smd by hand is more work (I am speculating). There are cool new things like pick and place machine based on 3d printer stuff and a reversed fish tank pump, but again this is all fringe stuff at the moment. for the one off through hole is still more accessible. I think as well when we talk about china, labour is cheap, people are still cheap so they will keep producing what works not what is best, Till they get undercut which will happen eventually.

Bobc and I are using a mti ixys 6 pack smd part which is capable of about 10kw, but he isn't your average hobbyist, he is a pro.
Distributing "Lebowski" FOC Controller PCB (Through hole) since 2016
Moped: Emax 110s 2009

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ElectronS   10 mW

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Re: power stage using SMD and IMS

Post by ElectronS » Dec 01 2016 10:04am

Animalector wrote:Are they using aluminium substrate?. I just read 30oz copper. Oh yeah... chunky :twisted:

I'll finish my layout and post it on my 3kw micro lebowski thread.

I wonder how much these fets cost I haven't looked at them yet? Anyone have a link to a supplier
You have not read it correctly , it is 3oz or 105um copper thickness with aluminum substrate , check the new image i attached , taken from the PDF file (app note).

it is really interesting to know that you are working on similar part ( the fairchild mosfet ) which is almost the same performance of the infenon part , i am interseted in seeing your progress ,
1-did you post any ??
2-and how many mosfets are you paralleling ?
3-do you use SMD aluminum /polymer capacitors , or through hole ones on a separate board

regarding the post about assembly difficulty , i think nowadays there are many shops that are willing to work with small quantities ( reflow soldering) especially with such low count of components .

Animalector   10 kW

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Re: power stage using SMD and IMS

Post by Animalector » Dec 01 2016 5:57pm

Ahh yup.. 3Oz not 3oz or 30oz.. My bad. That makes more sense, I had never heard of anyone ever having a board made with 30oz copper.

Its funny you ask about capacitors, I think.i have a nice layout, with good current path, nice isolation layout of gate traces positioning of the current sensors, but last night I was stareing at thescreen thinking wtf I.should do about the caps.

I haven't posted anything on my thread yet, ran out of.time last night

Animalector   10 kW

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Re: power stage using SMD and IMS

Post by Animalector » Dec 03 2016 1:30am


Dileepsetty   10 µW

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Re: power stage using SMD and IMS

Post by Dileepsetty » Feb 07 2017 6:31am

Hi All.... I am done one IMS power board with 500 microns custom one... for DC-Dc converter 3kWatts stackable to 10kWatts

Now I am building PMSM / BLDC drive with unique concept

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ElectronS   10 mW

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Re: power stage using SMD and IMS

Post by ElectronS » Feb 21 2018 4:57pm

why donot you post some pics on your 3kw design and share your thoughts about the subject :)
and what is the unique custom design you are talking about :twisted: :mrgreen:

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ElectronS   10 mW

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Re: power stage using SMD and IMS

Post by ElectronS » Mar 29 2018 7:07am

another interesting design by infeinon ac motor driver for installing on 150mm Diameter motors
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