TSDZ2 mid drive with 860C, 850C or SW102 displays only -- Flexible OpenSource firmware (Casainho code only)

Electric Motors and Controllers
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Re: TSDZ2 mid drive with 860C, 850C or SW102 displays only -- Flexible OpenSource firmware (Casainho code only)

Post by vshitikov » Apr 05 2020 8:14am

skestans wrote:
Apr 05 2020 7:08am
Out of curiosity: can the firmware be downgraded on the 850C? Or even the original firmware put back?

This is of interest in case a current release has a major bug. I and probably others rely on their bikes to be fully functional at all times to run errands, go to work, etc. Without the possibility of downgrading, a bugged release makes the bikes unusable until a fix is released.
yes there is a bootloader on the display so it can be rolled back.

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Re: TSDZ2 mid drive with 860C, 850C or SW102 displays only -- Flexible OpenSource firmware (Casainho code only)

Post by obcd » Apr 05 2020 4:18pm

Isn't the original firmware protected against readout? If it's the case, we don't have it so you can't restore it.

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Re: TSDZ2 mid drive with 860C, 850C or SW102 displays only -- Flexible OpenSource firmware (Casainho code only)

Post by vshitikov » Apr 05 2020 4:56pm

obcd wrote:
Apr 05 2020 4:18pm
Isn't the original firmware protected against readout? If it's the case, we don't have it so you can't restore it.
Anyways original one is for bafang, so who cares it will never work with tongsheng

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Re: TSDZ2 mid drive with 860C, 850C or SW102 displays only -- Flexible OpenSource firmware (Casainho code only)

Post by r0mko » Apr 05 2020 5:00pm

HughF wrote:
Apr 03 2020 2:50pm
I will flash the new 36v-HC code and go for another spin tomorrow.
How'd it go?

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Re: TSDZ2 mid drive with 860C, 850C or SW102 displays only -- Flexible OpenSource firmware (Casainho code only)

Post by HughF » Apr 06 2020 8:41am

r0mko wrote:
Apr 05 2020 5:00pm
HughF wrote:
Apr 03 2020 2:50pm
I will flash the new 36v-HC code and go for another spin tomorrow.
How'd it go?
Excellent - set the current ramp to maximum (10a), went and did another 20k - great performance. I am going to get my hands on my luggage scales on Wednesday then I can calibrate the torque sensor.

So far, very pleased with this firmware for my single speed bike. I don't really care for my blue gear, if it strips, I will replace it... I just want maximum performance when I stand on the pedals and this gives me that.

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Re: TSDZ2 mid drive with 860C, 850C or SW102 displays only -- Flexible OpenSource firmware (Casainho code only)

Post by ezrider1199 » Apr 06 2020 11:00am

New firmware doesn't work. I went outside and it's getting a trickle of power using throttle and no assist at all. Have to go home. Casainho, are you using a different branch of code when you test? I'm just wondering what the QA and testing is like..


Edit: just experienced the bike lurch full power for a second when I was pedaling off the seat

Edit2: ok this partly my own fault. The assist was set at 0 and I couldn't see it in the sunlight. But why didn't the throttle work?? And why did the bike lurch under assist 0?? Also throttle seems to be going through some bad code logic because it keeps lurching - huge bug.

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Re: TSDZ2 mid drive with 860C, 850C or SW102 displays only -- Flexible OpenSource firmware (Casainho code only)

Post by casainho » Apr 06 2020 11:09am

New firmware release v0.8.0

Download here: https://github.com/OpenSource-EBike-fir ... 102_v0.8.0

Changelog:
- corrected the long delay that motor took to stop after stop pedaling (thank to mbrusa)
- added street mode with quick configuration from display main screen
- added motor max power limit with quick configuration from display main screen
- added internal battery resistance automatic calculation
- corrected issue on motor selection type (thanks to r0mko)
- added negative torque signal for braking that should apply only to TSDZ2 coast brake version (thanks to plpetrov)
- corrected an issue where 860C display buttons were configured to be the same as 850C (no M button usage)
- TSDZ2 FAQ: issues and repairs, etc
- TSDZ2 OpenSource firmware

Developer of the Flexible OpenSource firmware for EBikes: TSDZ2 mid drive motor, KT motor controllers and displays: Bafang 850C color, SW102 Bluetooth and KT-LCD3.

If you like my work, please consider making a donation. I am being using the donations to buy needed resources for my developments. My paypal: casainho AT gmail.com.

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Re: TSDZ2 mid drive with 860C, 850C or SW102 displays only -- Flexible OpenSource firmware (Casainho code only)

Post by ezrider1199 » Apr 06 2020 12:03pm

Just tested the firmware out. The absence of motor overrun is a great feeling. Found a bug - I had the motor lurch at assist 0 when pedaling off the seat. Another bug - throttle is definitely *broken* in this release. When you try to accelerate with the throttle, it starts jerking as if power keeps coming on and off. Also at assist 0, i was getting a trickle (very little) power when using the throttle. Please please fix!
casainho wrote:
Apr 06 2020 11:09am
New firmware release v0.8.0

Download here: https://github.com/OpenSource-EBike-fir ... 102_v0.8.0

Changelog:
- corrected the long delay that motor took to stop after stop pedaling (thank to mbrusa)
- added street mode with quick configuration from display main screen
- added motor max power limit with quick configuration from display main screen
- added internal battery resistance automatic calculation
- corrected issue on motor selection type (thanks to r0mko)
- added negative torque signal for braking that should apply only to TSDZ2 coast brake version (thanks to plpetrov)
- corrected an issue where 860C display buttons were configured to be the same as 850C (no M button usage)

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Re: TSDZ2 mid drive with 860C, 850C or SW102 displays only -- Flexible OpenSource firmware (Casainho code only)

Post by HughF » Apr 06 2020 12:20pm

r0mko, any plans to add the overrun fix to your quick and dirty torque mode release?

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Re: TSDZ2 mid drive with 860C, 850C or SW102 displays only -- Flexible OpenSource firmware (Casainho code only)

Post by vshitikov » Apr 06 2020 12:30pm

ezrider1199 wrote:
Apr 06 2020 12:03pm
Just tested the firmware out. The absence of motor overrun is a great feeling. Found a bug - I had the motor lurch at assist 0 when pedaling off the seat. Another bug - throttle is definitely *broken* in this release. When you try to accelerate with the throttle, it starts jerking as if power keeps coming on and off. Also at assist 0, i was getting a trickle (very little) power when using the throttle. Please please fix!
I think this is because of the overrun. @Casainho, did you check the original fix from mbrusa. He had to modify ebike_app.c in order not to use overrrun fix when throttle is configured, otherwise it cuts the power if user is not pedaling.
Another question, did you managed to sort what user plpetrov had reported with weird behaviour at assist levels greater than 10?
Thank you
Last edited by vshitikov on Apr 06 2020 5:05pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: TSDZ2 mid drive with 860C, 850C or SW102 displays only -- Flexible OpenSource firmware (Casainho code only)

Post by r0mko » Apr 06 2020 2:52pm

HughF wrote:
Apr 06 2020 12:20pm
r0mko, any plans to add the overrun fix to your quick and dirty torque mode release?
Perhaps it makes sense to integrate the torque mode back into the new firmware, but it seems to have some issues, so for now I'd better stick to the v0.56 FW with torque mode and figure out what is the actual overrun fix among other code changes.

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Re: TSDZ2 mid drive with 860C, 850C or SW102 displays only -- Flexible OpenSource firmware (Casainho code only)

Post by plpetrov » Apr 06 2020 8:20pm

casainho wrote:
Apr 06 2020 11:09am
New firmware release v0.8.0

Download here: https://github.com/OpenSource-EBike-fir ... 102_v0.8.0
Casainho, thank you for the new release. I will finish with the last test you asked me to do on the previous version and then try this one. I was busy with different things and for some other reasons I could not find the motivation to go on with the tests. I see someone mentioned QA and testing. I hope this is only a joke. Otherwise it will be a good idea to think also about project management, product management, product ownership, etc..... Sounds familiar to some of you?!
It’s not about that. We need to help, support and contribute to all the efforts of Casainho in order to achieve good common results. They will not be perfect from the first attempt , will not come immediately and maybe be will take several iterations. It’s just our hobby...

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Re: TSDZ2 mid drive with 860C, 850C or SW102 displays only -- Flexible OpenSource firmware (Casainho code only)

Post by ezrider1199 » Apr 07 2020 12:43am

Sorry, i shouldve filtered myself from posting the first post (which i posted immediately). But in the second one you can see what i've found in the testing, hopefully more objective and composed than the first. I too am super super thankful for casainho and the community. Use my bike nearly every day so the motor & this firmware was a huge lifestyle change.

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Re: TSDZ2 mid drive with 860C, 850C or SW102 displays only -- Flexible OpenSource firmware (Casainho code only)

Post by casainho » Apr 07 2020 5:31am

ezrider1199 wrote:
Apr 06 2020 12:03pm
1. Found a bug - I had the motor lurch at assist 0 when pedaling off the seat.

2. Another bug - throttle is definitely *broken* in this release. When you try to accelerate with the throttle, it starts jerking as if power keeps coming on and off. Also at assist 0, i was getting a trickle (very little) power when using the throttle. Please please fix!
1. I could not replicate yet the changes I did, one of them did not consider the assist level 0. Should be solved now.

2. I don't have throttle and so I could not test but yes, as others alerted, I was keeping throttle disabled while cadence = 0 -- should be fixed now.

Please give feedback, here is the new TSDZ2 motor firmware version 0.57.1: https://github.com/OpenSource-EBike-fir ... Z2-v0.57.1
- TSDZ2 FAQ: issues and repairs, etc
- TSDZ2 OpenSource firmware

Developer of the Flexible OpenSource firmware for EBikes: TSDZ2 mid drive motor, KT motor controllers and displays: Bafang 850C color, SW102 Bluetooth and KT-LCD3.

If you like my work, please consider making a donation. I am being using the donations to buy needed resources for my developments. My paypal: casainho AT gmail.com.

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Re: TSDZ2 mid drive with 860C, 850C or SW102 displays only -- Flexible OpenSource firmware (Casainho code only)

Post by casainho » Apr 07 2020 6:20am

r0mko wrote:
Apr 06 2020 2:52pm
HughF wrote:
Apr 06 2020 12:20pm
r0mko, any plans to add the overrun fix to your quick and dirty torque mode release?
Perhaps it makes sense to integrate the torque mode back into the new firmware, but it seems to have some issues, so for now I'd better stick to the v0.56 FW with torque mode and figure out what is the actual overrun fix among other code changes.
I am now start to thinking on the new feature that is let user being able to disable the sensors:
- torque sensor
- cadence sensor
- brake sensor
- wheel speed sensor

So, when user decides to disable the cadence sensor, then the system should work with torque sensor mode. The contrary for when the user disables the torque sensor, then the system should work with cadence. When both disable (like when with issues like broke pedal or issue on pedal cranks), then system will be able to work with the throttle or virtual throttle.

So my plan is to implement:
- sensors disable by user
- torque mode
- cadence mode
- virtual throttle
- TSDZ2 FAQ: issues and repairs, etc
- TSDZ2 OpenSource firmware

Developer of the Flexible OpenSource firmware for EBikes: TSDZ2 mid drive motor, KT motor controllers and displays: Bafang 850C color, SW102 Bluetooth and KT-LCD3.

If you like my work, please consider making a donation. I am being using the donations to buy needed resources for my developments. My paypal: casainho AT gmail.com.

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Re: TSDZ2 mid drive with 860C, 850C or SW102 displays only -- Flexible OpenSource firmware (Casainho code only)

Post by casainho » Apr 07 2020 6:44am

vshitikov wrote:
Apr 06 2020 12:30pm
I think this is because of the overrun. @Casainho, did you check the original fix from mbrusa. He had to modify ebike_app.c in order not to use overrrun fix when throttle is configured, otherwise it cuts the power if user is not pedaling.
Another question, did you managed to sort what user plpetrov had reported with weird behaviour at assist levels greater than 10?
Thank you
Yes, you were right about the throttle - it is fixed now.

About the weird behaviour at assist levels greater than 10, I don't know... I hope you guys can provide more feedback of your tests as I am not having this issues.

About the negative torque to brake on the coast brake version, I prepared a display firmware version that shows the ADC torque sensor value instead of the odometer so seeing the odometer on main screen will help to debug and see how the ADC torque sensor value when braking.

https://github.com/OpenSource-EBike-fir ... ases/0.8.1
- TSDZ2 FAQ: issues and repairs, etc
- TSDZ2 OpenSource firmware

Developer of the Flexible OpenSource firmware for EBikes: TSDZ2 mid drive motor, KT motor controllers and displays: Bafang 850C color, SW102 Bluetooth and KT-LCD3.

If you like my work, please consider making a donation. I am being using the donations to buy needed resources for my developments. My paypal: casainho AT gmail.com.

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Re: TSDZ2 mid drive with 860C, 850C or SW102 displays only -- Flexible OpenSource firmware (Casainho code only)

Post by plpetrov » Apr 07 2020 6:51am

casainho wrote:
Apr 05 2020 4:39am
I will make this release and then I hope we can solve this issues, including the ones for coast brake version BUT I don't have one, I really need your help.

Can you please configure the pedal to start at right side and then test to see if the same happens?
Casainho,

I did the test you asked for still with version 0.56.2. And good news :)

Test 1: Configured start pedal ground right. Right pedal placed at the lowest position.
- The system behaves much much better. I could reach assist level 19 and could not get the previous power bursts. There is still wobbling of the motor RPMs with peak when we get the max torque sensor values. Human power increases but only to 2 or 3 at max.

Test 2: Configured start pedal ground left. Left pedal placed at the top position. Same behaviour as in Test 1.

In other two possible scenarios left there is no change and the problem is there.

Based on this, I can suggest that may be we need to take into account the delta in the torque sensor value for 0 load between the right and left pedal. May be better the max and the min values that are different than the ones at the point we do the calibration. How exactly I do not know. May be in the linearisation function to shift the 0 value of one of the pedals or to calculate the average value and subtract it from the pedal with higher value and add the same to the pedal with lower value. This could be the easies solution to implement. If it will work I have an idea of other simple solutions but they may have other side effects.

Do you want me to test the current release also? Which tests you would prefer to be preformed and what data you need?

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Re: TSDZ2 mid drive with 860C, 850C or SW102 displays only -- Flexible OpenSource firmware (Casainho code only)

Post by dameri » Apr 07 2020 7:59am

casainho wrote:
Apr 07 2020 6:20am
r0mko wrote:
Apr 06 2020 2:52pm
HughF wrote:
Apr 06 2020 12:20pm
r0mko, any plans to add the overrun fix to your quick and dirty torque mode release?
Perhaps it makes sense to integrate the torque mode back into the new firmware, but it seems to have some issues, so for now I'd better stick to the v0.56 FW with torque mode and figure out what is the actual overrun fix among other code changes.
I am now start to thinking on the new feature that is let user being able to disable the sensors:
- torque sensor
- cadence sensor
- brake sensor
- wheel speed sensor

So, when user decides to disable the cadence sensor, then the system should work with torque sensor mode. The contrary for when the user disables the torque sensor, then the system should work with cadence. When both disable (like when with issues like broke pedal or issue on pedal cranks), then system will be able to work with the throttle or virtual throttle.

So my plan is to implement:
- sensors disable by user
- torque mode
- cadence mode
- virtual throttle
You are doing very great job. :bigthumb: :bigthumb: :bigthumb:

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Re: TSDZ2 mid drive with 860C, 850C or SW102 displays only -- Flexible OpenSource firmware (Casainho code only)

Post by casainho » Apr 07 2020 8:15am

plpetrov wrote:
Apr 07 2020 6:51am
Based on this, I can suggest that may be we need to take into account the delta in the torque sensor value for 0 load between the right and left pedal. May be better the max and the min values that are different than the ones at the point we do the calibration. How exactly I do not know. May be in the linearisation function to shift the 0 value of one of the pedals or to calculate the average value and subtract it from the pedal with higher value and add the same to the pedal with lower value. This could be the easies solution to implement. If it will work I have an idea of other simple solutions but they may have other side effects.

Do you want me to test the current release also? Which tests you would prefer to be preformed and what data you need?
Did you try to see if you get higher values of ADC at other points different from the calibration points? I remember to test at least one torque sensor and I would get higher values outside of calibration point, where I expect that to not happen!! I guess this is a (bad) characteristic of the torque sensor... and if this happens, then part of the issue can be here? Can you test your torque sensor values?

I will look at code again to see if I can spot something wrong. What I know:
- left and right pedals have different ADC values rate for each increased KG (the firmware considers each pedal different from the other to take this difference in consideration)
- both left and right pedals usually have the same ADC values for 0 KG on the calibration point
- at least some torque sensors measure higher values outside of the calibration point, which I think should not happen

I did not changed anything about torque sensor on latest release BUT you should be able to see the value on the main screen as the odometer value, so, may be useful to use the latest version of display 0.8.1.
- TSDZ2 FAQ: issues and repairs, etc
- TSDZ2 OpenSource firmware

Developer of the Flexible OpenSource firmware for EBikes: TSDZ2 mid drive motor, KT motor controllers and displays: Bafang 850C color, SW102 Bluetooth and KT-LCD3.

If you like my work, please consider making a donation. I am being using the donations to buy needed resources for my developments. My paypal: casainho AT gmail.com.

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Re: TSDZ2 mid drive with 860C, 850C or SW102 displays only -- Flexible OpenSource firmware (Casainho code only)

Post by HughF » Apr 07 2020 8:51am

casainho wrote:
Apr 07 2020 6:20am
r0mko wrote:
Apr 06 2020 2:52pm
HughF wrote:
Apr 06 2020 12:20pm
r0mko, any plans to add the overrun fix to your quick and dirty torque mode release?
Perhaps it makes sense to integrate the torque mode back into the new firmware, but it seems to have some issues, so for now I'd better stick to the v0.56 FW with torque mode and figure out what is the actual overrun fix among other code changes.
I am now start to thinking on the new feature that is let user being able to disable the sensors:
- torque sensor
- cadence sensor
- brake sensor
- wheel speed sensor

So, when user decides to disable the cadence sensor, then the system should work with torque sensor mode. The contrary for when the user disables the torque sensor, then the system should work with cadence. When both disable (like when with issues like broke pedal or issue on pedal cranks), then system will be able to work with the throttle or virtual throttle.

So my plan is to implement:
- sensors disable by user
- torque mode
- cadence mode
- virtual throttle
I like the sound of this, it sounds like a sensible way forward.

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Re: TSDZ2 mid drive with 860C, 850C or SW102 displays only -- Flexible OpenSource firmware (Casainho code only)

Post by vshitikov » Apr 07 2020 8:59am

Hello
I just flashed all the latest FW and the display and performed a quick test run. All seems to work fine, I don't see any regression or problems but I haven't tested all the configurations as I don't have throttle.

The problems that user Plpetrov is reporting with the quick motor bursts: I do not observe it in the real run. I think it might be related to the testing with the rear wheel up. When I test like this motor spins very fast because it has no wheel resistance and it is quickly pushing the rear wheel to the maximum speed. So I think there is no real problem with the FW. Plpetrov you migh test it on the real run.

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Re: TSDZ2 mid drive with 860C, 850C or SW102 displays only -- Flexible OpenSource firmware (Casainho code only)

Post by plpetrov » Apr 07 2020 10:11am

casainho wrote:
Apr 07 2020 8:15am
Did you try to see if you get higher values of ADC at other points different from the calibration points? I remember to test at least one torque sensor and I would get higher values outside of calibration point, where I expect that to not happen!! I guess this is a (bad) characteristic of the torque sensor... and if this happens, then part of the issue can be here? Can you test your torque sensor values?

- both left and right pedals usually have the same ADC values for 0 KG on the calibration point

- at least some torque sensors measure higher values outside of the calibration point, which I think should not happen
It seems we are getting closer to resolve the mystery. As I suspected from the very beginning the problem is due to some specifics of my torque sensor. Both of your assumptions above are not true in my case:
casainho wrote:
Apr 07 2020 8:15am
- both left and right pedals usually have the same ADC values for 0 KG on the calibration point"
It is not the case with me. On the left pedal I have 134 and on the right pedal I have 140. The delta is 6.
casainho wrote:
Apr 07 2020 8:15am
- at least some torque sensors measure higher values outside of the calibration point, which I think should not happen
Again not my case.
On the left pedal I have at the calibration point 134 with maximum of 140. The delta is 6.

On the right side I have at the calibration point 140 with maximum of 143. The delta is 3.

That explains why I have problems mainly on the left side and much lest on the right.
In order to fix that we need to implement some correction in order to avoid the jump when switching from left to right and back right to left, also take into consideration the max values that are different from the calibration ones.

The error in my case only from rotating the pedals is 6 + 3 = 13 and that is equal to about 2.5 kg efforts applied on the pedals to reach these values. Multiplied with the high asset value this gives a burst.

I know that my case might be an exception but I doubt I am the only one. Just the other have not paid attention to that. I remember some previous report on power burst btw. They could have been caused the same reason.

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Re: TSDZ2 mid drive with 860C, 850C or SW102 displays only -- Flexible OpenSource firmware (Casainho code only)

Post by plpetrov » Apr 07 2020 10:18am

vshitikov wrote:
Apr 07 2020 8:59am
Hello
I just flashed all the latest FW and the display and performed a quick test run. All seems to work fine, I don't see any regression or problems but I haven't tested all the configurations as I don't have throttle.

The problems that user Plpetrov is reporting with the quick motor bursts: I do not observe it in the real run. I think it might be related to the testing with the rear wheel up. When I test like this motor spins very fast because it has no wheel resistance and it is quickly pushing the rear wheel to the maximum speed. So I think there is no real problem with the FW. Plpetrov you migh test it on the real run.
It is related to some peculiarities of my torque sensor. See my answer to Casainho. However I doubt that I am the only one with this problem. In my opinion it is there with everyone but in my case is very well represented as I am reaching some extremes due to the sum of two unexpected conditions.

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Re: TSDZ2 mid drive with 860C, 850C or SW102 displays only -- Flexible OpenSource firmware (Casainho code only)

Post by casainho » Apr 07 2020 10:35am

plpetrov wrote:
Apr 07 2020 10:11am
casainho wrote:
Apr 07 2020 8:15am
- at least some torque sensors measure higher values outside of the calibration point, which I think should not happen
Again not my case.
On the left pedal I have at the calibration point 134 with maximum of 140. The delta is 6.

On the right side I have at the calibration point 140 with maximum of 143. The delta is 3.
What do you mean by max of 140 when the calibration value is 134?
- TSDZ2 FAQ: issues and repairs, etc
- TSDZ2 OpenSource firmware

Developer of the Flexible OpenSource firmware for EBikes: TSDZ2 mid drive motor, KT motor controllers and displays: Bafang 850C color, SW102 Bluetooth and KT-LCD3.

If you like my work, please consider making a donation. I am being using the donations to buy needed resources for my developments. My paypal: casainho AT gmail.com.

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Re: TSDZ2 mid drive with 860C, 850C or SW102 displays only -- Flexible OpenSource firmware (Casainho code only)

Post by plpetrov » Apr 07 2020 10:45am

casainho wrote:
Apr 07 2020 10:35am
plpetrov wrote:
Apr 07 2020 10:11am
casainho wrote:
Apr 07 2020 8:15am
- at least some torque sensors measure higher values outside of the calibration point, which I think should not happen
Again not my case.
On the left pedal I have at the calibration point 134 with maximum of 140. The delta is 6.

On the right side I have at the calibration point 140 with maximum of 143. The delta is 3.
What do you mean by max of 140 when the calibration value is 134?
Yes this is exactly my case with the left pedal. At the calibration point I have 134 with the maximum of 140 while on the display I still read left side.

I did two more tests to try to find a solution. The are maybe not the best ones but does not require programming.

Test 1. I changed the calibration values for 0 with the maximum for each side. That improved the situation a lot. Left side 140 right side 143.
Test 2. I tried to equalise the both calibration values changing both to 143. Did not like the result very close to the original problem.

Test 3. Desided to take a value at the middle. Both set to 139. Very good but still improvement to be desired.

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