Advanced ADAPTTO controllers and compatible products

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Allex   1 GW

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Re: Advanced ADAPTTO controllers/10%+ discounts/PayPal accep

Post by Allex » Nov 04 2015 3:51pm

Yup
6,9 and 18FETs

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Rix   100 GW

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Re: Advanced ADAPTTO controllers/10%+ discounts/PayPal accep

Post by Rix » Nov 04 2015 9:26pm

I am thinking the Mini E is a 6Fet, the Midi E is a 9Fet, and the Max E is a 12Fet.
Allex wrote:Yup
6,9 and 18FETs
I guess 2 out of 3 isn't bad. :lol:

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Re: Advanced ADAPTTO controllers/10%+ discounts/PayPal accep

Post by Ohbse » Nov 06 2015 12:05am

DasDouble wrote:@Ohbse: Are you shure about 7kW? Where do you life? For shure somewhere in a cold region.. The controler will get hot really soon if you ask me... :O
Yup very sure, I did over winter with no additional cooling however heading into warmer months I have added a big heatsink. Note that this is in road commuting in traffic so peak 7kw but not constant. 18km one way averaging 32wh/km

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shadow   10 mW

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Re: Advanced ADAPTTO controllers/10%+ discounts/PayPal accep

Post by shadow » Nov 06 2015 11:39pm

will the Max-E work with the Enertrac hubmotor?

I'm looking to upgrade from my 10kw trapezoidal Kelly, (also wishing i could run at 24s ~100v like everyone else)

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Re: Advanced ADAPTTO controllers/10%+ discounts/PayPal accep

Post by Rix » Nov 07 2015 1:36am

shadow wrote:will the Max-E work with the Enertrac hubmotor?

I'm looking to upgrade from my 10kw trapezoidal Kelly, (also wishing i could run at 24s ~100v like everyone else)
Holy shit shadow :twisted: , an Enertrac? Dude, you are serious :?: . With that motor, I would look at an Alltrax controller. Those hub motors can handle 10kw continues pushing a 400 pound machine. More if running a liquid cooled motor. You got a high powered build in mind?

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Re: Advanced ADAPTTO controllers/10%+ discounts/PayPal accep

Post by madin88 » Nov 07 2015 7:29am

is the midi-e really a 9 FET?
9 FET's would mean they allow that 300A phase current flow through one single FET (on low side or high side). On the other side there would be two FET's.
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Re: Advanced ADAPTTO controllers/10%+ discounts/PayPal accep

Post by sn0wchyld » Nov 07 2015 8:51am

madin88 wrote:is the midi-e really a 9 FET?
9 FET's would mean they allow that 300A phase current flow through one single FET (on low side or high side). On the other side there would be two FET's.
https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewt ... 42#p288217
rhitee05 wrote:There are be a total of 3 FET banks which are involved at any given time. Two are switched on by the commutation, usually with the high-side PWMing and the low side held steady on, and the third is involved due to freewheeling (or synch. rectification if implemented). Each sees a different loss:

- One of the three high-side FETs will be seeing switching losses due to PWM, and resistive losses based on the duty cycle on-time.
- The complementary low-side FET will be seeing freewheeling diode losses based on the duty cycle off-time.
- One of the other two low-side FETs will be seeing resistive losses 100% of the time.

Say the current commutation state is A+ and C-. The high-side A FET sees switching + resistive loss*D, the low-side A FET sees freewheeling loss*(1-D), and the low-side C FET sees resistive loss (100% duty).

The sum of those three losses is equal to the total controller heat output (neglecting small contributions). Each bank of high-side FETs will see an average loss of (switching + resistive*D)/3, since the commutation is rotating. Each low-side bank sees an average loss of (freewheeling*(1-D) + resistive)/3. It should be immediately obvious that the low-side losses will always average higher, except for the case D=1, thus the advantage of having an extra FET to share the load here.

explains it quite well... i had wondered too for ages what exactly the advantages of a odd-fet setup were, turns out its more than i thought! basically, at 50% duty cycle you'll have 4 fets sharing the load in a 9 fet controller, vs just 3 in a 6 fet.

what i dont get with the new controller lineup is the battery currents dont match up with the nominal power ratings... 14kw, but 140A? even at 100v that is peak power, assuming no sag. should be more like 160A or more... am i missing something here?

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Re: Advanced ADAPTTO controllers/10%+ discounts/PayPal accep

Post by gensem » Nov 07 2015 1:45pm

Rix wrote:
shadow wrote:will the Max-E work with the Enertrac hubmotor?

I'm looking to upgrade from my 10kw trapezoidal Kelly, (also wishing i could run at 24s ~100v like everyone else)
Holy shit shadow :twisted: , an Enertrac? Dude, you are serious :?: . With that motor, I would look at an Alltrax controller. Those hub motors can handle 10kw continues pushing a 400 pound machine. More if running a liquid cooled motor. You got a high powered build in mind?
Hardly 10kw continuous. Isnt it a clyte 205 stator with 60mm magnets?
Justin we really appreciate what you did!

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Re: Advanced ADAPTTO controllers/10%+ discounts/PayPal accep

Post by Rix » Nov 07 2015 3:56pm

gensem wrote:
Rix wrote:
shadow wrote:will the Max-E work with the Enertrac hubmotor?

I'm looking to upgrade from my 10kw trapezoidal Kelly, (also wishing i could run at 24s ~100v like everyone else)
Holy shit shadow :twisted: , an Enertrac? Dude, you are serious :?: . With that motor, I would look at an Alltrax controller. Those hub motors can handle 10kw continues pushing a 400 pound machine. More if running a liquid cooled motor. You got a high powered build in mind?
Hardly 10kw continuous. Isnt it a clyte 205 stator with 60mm magnets?
Just going off what the web site says, 10kw continues "air cooled" and 20kw continues "liquid cooled. Click on specifications http://www.enertrac.net/product.php#b

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Re: Advanced ADAPTTO controllers/10%+ discounts/PayPal accep

Post by Allex » Nov 07 2015 6:46pm

madin88 wrote:is the midi-e really a 9 FET?
9 FET's would mean they allow that 300A phase current flow through one single FET (on low side or high side). On the other side there would be two FET's.
Whoops my bad, midi is 12Fet.
Adaptto will soon release a new firmware making it possible to set 160Amps on new max-Es

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shadow   10 mW

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Re: Advanced ADAPTTO controllers/10%+ discounts/PayPal accep

Post by shadow » Nov 07 2015 8:22pm

Rix wrote:
Holy shit shadow :twisted: , an Enertrac? Dude, you are serious :?: . With that motor, I would look at an Alltrax controller. Those hub motors can handle 10kw continues pushing a 400 pound machine. More if running a liquid cooled motor. You got a high powered build in mind?
Very serious.

Rebuilding this beast, it's not pushing a heavy ass bike, so i'd like to be able to deliver that full 10+kW. Newer batteries make this a lot easier than when i originally built the thing! I'm working on a wishlist of parts for the winter.
Attachments
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Re: Advanced ADAPTTO controllers/10%+ discounts/PayPal accep

Post by Rix » Nov 07 2015 10:34pm

shadow wrote:
Rix wrote:
Holy shit shadow :twisted: , an Enertrac? Dude, you are serious :?: . With that motor, I would look at an Alltrax controller. Those hub motors can handle 10kw continues pushing a 400 pound machine. More if running a liquid cooled motor. You got a high powered build in mind?
Very serious.

Rebuilding this beast, it's not pushing a heavy ass bike, so i'd like to be able to deliver that full 10+kW. Newer batteries make this a lot easier than when i originally built the thing! I'm working on a wishlist of parts for the winter.
I like your style :twisted: . Is that the 602, or 603 on the rear?

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shadow   10 mW

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Re: Advanced ADAPTTO controllers/10%+ discounts/PayPal accep

Post by shadow » Nov 07 2015 11:07pm

602

I had an alltrax once upon a time, it blew up on me. I'm not really impressed with their product line, the adaptto has everything i want i think, but not sure about its compatibility.

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Re: Advanced ADAPTTO controllers/10%+ discounts/PayPal accep

Post by Rix » Nov 07 2015 11:24pm

shadow wrote:602

I had an alltrax once upon a time, it blew up on me. I'm not really impressed with their product line, the adaptto has everything i want i think, but not sure about its compatibility.
I don't think anyone has attempted to run an Adaptto on the 602/603 yet. If you blew up an Alltrax, that's even more impressive :lol: :mrgreen: Hey Allex, care to chime in on the Max E compatibility with a 35 pound 602?

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Re: Advanced ADAPTTO controllers/10%+ discounts/PayPal accep

Post by Xantho » Nov 08 2015 8:12am

Hello Ebikers,
I ordered one of those 10% discount e max controllers from Alex and expecting it soon. Till now I am using an Infineon controller which I can limit (when necessary :) ) to 25km/h max (unlimiting very difficult). Does anybody know how to make that possible with a max e Adaptto controller?
Disabling all profiles except ECO via one touch button would be great (reset only with password). I think that would be something of big interest for many ebikers. Maybe you Adaptto guys should think of a solution for that.

Next point is I would also be interested in a 150V Adaptto e max for 130V battery max voltage. I had changed in an 18 FET Infineon controller all MOSFETs to IRF4115 and all capacitors. The bike was very difficult to drive at 130V because of this speed control and when I tried to reach 100km/h the controller exploded and burnt down. But I really think these higher voltages make sense. I read that the max output power of a 100V Controller is because of RDSon maybe a little higher than with 150V, but the disadvantages of a high KV motor (which needs high phase currents), high OVS, big battery stress with voltage sag I think are much more of a problem. This would be my next wish for Adaptto :wink:

I was strongly involved in the development of the powerelectronics for the Renault ZOE and believe me this 450V battery voltage makes sense...
Raptor 140, QS 205 50H Extra V3 Hubmotor 9KV, Adaptto max-e, 22s Lipo

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Re: Advanced ADAPTTO controllers/10%+ discounts/PayPal accep

Post by DasDouble » Nov 08 2015 8:53am

Xantho wrote:Hello Ebikers,
I ordered one of those 10% discount e max controllers from Alex and expecting it soon. Till now I am using an Infineon controller which I can limit (when necessary :) ) to 25km/h max (unlimiting very difficult). Does anybody know how to make that possible with a max e Adaptto controller?
Disabling all profiles except ECO via one touch button would be great (reset only with password). I think that would be something of big interest for many ebikers. Maybe you Adaptto guys should think of a solution for that.
Same here. I also would like to know if it´s possible to deactivate the throttle and just activate pedal assist system in ECO, while in the other two profiles throttle is activated and pas is deactivated...

If this is possible, then I would like to run my ebike as a pedelec at 25km/h.To do this the bike have to be powered by pedaling and not by throttle. And if my friends in blue (I mean tha police) is looking for me, I will drive just 25km/h. If they are not watching me, then I will activate the throttle / Normal- / Boostmode. :)

-Elias
"..the crazy kid exploring hipower ebike world ^^"
-Built own ebike: ✔
-Built own 3.2kWh LiIon battery (300Amps): ✔
-Overtake Porsche with own Ebike: ✔
-Take off with ebike: ✖

~14kW, 3.2kWh LiIon, QS 205 8ml ff, hubsink

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Adaptto E-Drives Lab   100 W

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Re: Advanced ADAPTTO controllers/10%+ discounts/PayPal accep

Post by Adaptto E-Drives Lab » Nov 10 2015 3:18am

DasDouble wrote:
Xantho wrote:Hello Ebikers,
I ordered one of those 10% discount e max controllers from Alex and expecting it soon. Till now I am using an Infineon controller which I can limit (when necessary :) ) to 25km/h max (unlimiting very difficult). Does anybody know how to make that possible with a max e Adaptto controller?
Disabling all profiles except ECO via one touch button would be great (reset only with password). I think that would be something of big interest for many ebikers. Maybe you Adaptto guys should think of a solution for that.
Same here. I also would like to know if it´s possible to deactivate the throttle and just activate pedal assist system in ECO, while in the other two profiles throttle is activated and pas is deactivated...

If this is possible, then I would like to run my ebike as a pedelec at 25km/h.To do this the bike have to be powered by pedaling and not by throttle. And if my friends in blue (I mean tha police) is looking for me, I will drive just 25km/h. If they are not watching me, then I will activate the throttle / Normal- / Boostmode. :)

-Elias

Hello,
Our controllers operate exactly like you describe. In ECO mode only PAS is active and once switching to Normal or Boost - throttle is activated.
To make your bike even more legally compliant we have firmware requiring password every time you switch from ECO to any other mode.
For enquiries regarding this firmware please contact me via techsupport@adaptto.com with topic: "Password protected firmware".

Best regards,
For sales enquiries please contact us via: sales@adaptto.com
Technical questions: techsupport@adaptto.com
Web-site: http://adaptto.com/

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Re: Advanced ADAPTTO controllers/10%+ discounts/PayPal accep

Post by DasDouble » Nov 10 2015 10:30am

Adaptto E-Drives Lab wrote:
DasDouble wrote:
Xantho wrote:Hello Ebikers,
I ordered one of those 10% discount e max controllers from Alex and expecting it soon. Till now I am using an Infineon controller which I can limit (when necessary :) ) to 25km/h max (unlimiting very difficult). Does anybody know how to make that possible with a max e Adaptto controller?
Disabling all profiles except ECO via one touch button would be great (reset only with password). I think that would be something of big interest for many ebikers. Maybe you Adaptto guys should think of a solution for that.
Same here. I also would like to know if it´s possible to deactivate the throttle and just activate pedal assist system in ECO, while in the other two profiles throttle is activated and pas is deactivated...

If this is possible, then I would like to run my ebike as a pedelec at 25km/h.To do this the bike have to be powered by pedaling and not by throttle. And if my friends in blue (I mean tha police) is looking for me, I will drive just 25km/h. If they are not watching me, then I will activate the throttle / Normal- / Boostmode. :)

-Elias

Hello,
Our controllers operate exactly like you describe. In ECO mode only PAS is active and once switching to Normal or Boost - throttle is activated.
To make your bike even more legally compliant we have firmware requiring password every time you switch from ECO to any other mode.
For enquiries regarding this firmware please contact me via techsupport@adaptto.com with topic: "Password protected firmware".

Best regards,
Well that´s perfeckt - nothing more to add. Just perfeckt! Thank you :)
"..the crazy kid exploring hipower ebike world ^^"
-Built own ebike: ✔
-Built own 3.2kWh LiIon battery (300Amps): ✔
-Overtake Porsche with own Ebike: ✔
-Take off with ebike: ✖

~14kW, 3.2kWh LiIon, QS 205 8ml ff, hubsink

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Re: Advanced ADAPTTO controllers/10%+ discounts/PayPal accep

Post by Mammalian04 » Nov 10 2015 12:56pm

EDITED:

Adaptto E-Drives Lab, is this something you could post on your website or a link it here or should we all email you for the firmware? As a side question, why not on the web site?

Thanks!

Mammalian04
Last edited by Mammalian04 on Nov 10 2015 5:07pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Advanced ADAPTTO controllers/10%+ discounts/PayPal accep

Post by DasDouble » Nov 10 2015 4:03pm

Mammalian04 wrote:Same here. I also would like to know if it´s possible to deactivate the throttle and just activate pedal assist system in ECO, while in the other two profiles throttle is activated and pas is deactivated...

If this is possible, then I would like to run my ebike as a pedelec at 25km/h.To do this the bike have to be powered by pedaling and not by throttle. And if my friends in blue (I mean tha police) is looking for me, I will drive just 25km/h. If they are not watching me, then I will activate the throttle / Normal- / Boostmode. :)

-Elias
Mammalian04 wrote:Elias, is this something you could post on your website or a link it here or should we all email you for the firmware? As a side question, why not on the web site?
[/quote]
Hello Mammalian04,

sorry, I don´t know what you mean with "your website". I have no website, and Im not selling anything, if you think I do.

-Elias
"..the crazy kid exploring hipower ebike world ^^"
-Built own ebike: ✔
-Built own 3.2kWh LiIon battery (300Amps): ✔
-Overtake Porsche with own Ebike: ✔
-Take off with ebike: ✖

~14kW, 3.2kWh LiIon, QS 205 8ml ff, hubsink

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Re: Advanced ADAPTTO controllers/10%+ discounts/PayPal accep

Post by Mammalian04 » Nov 10 2015 5:06pm

Lol... Sorry, that was meant for Adaptto E-Drives Lab. I thought I saw Elias at the bottom of their signature. My mistake! :lol:

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Re: Advanced ADAPTTO controllers/10%+ discounts/PayPal accep

Post by Microbatman » Nov 10 2015 9:24pm

Is there a throttle included in this kit?
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Re: Advanced ADAPTTO controllers/10%+ discounts/PayPal accep

Post by chucho » Nov 10 2015 11:22pm

Microbatman wrote:Is there a throttle included in this kit?
No
Someone who does not doubt is a danger to the rest

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Re: Advanced ADAPTTO controllers/10%+ discounts/PayPal accep

Post by Adaptto E-Drives Lab » Nov 12 2015 4:07am

Mammalian04 wrote:EDITED:

Adaptto E-Drives Lab, is this something you could post on your website or a link it here or should we all email you for the firmware? As a side question, why not on the web site?

Thanks!

Mammalian04
Hello,
Such firmware is needed by only a small number of users. In addition regular firmwares are upgraded with higher frequency than protected FW does (so it is better not to confuse customers).
That is why it is only available upon email request.

Best regards,
Last edited by Adaptto E-Drives Lab on Nov 12 2015 4:44am, edited 1 time in total.
For sales enquiries please contact us via: sales@adaptto.com
Technical questions: techsupport@adaptto.com
Web-site: http://adaptto.com/

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Re: Advanced ADAPTTO controllers/10%+ discounts/PayPal accep

Post by Mammalian04 » Nov 12 2015 4:21am

Thanks for the answer Adaptto. I'll reach out through email when I get to that point with my last build.

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