Advanced ADAPTTO controllers and compatible products

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Ohbse   10 kW

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Re: Advanced ADAPTTO controllers/10%+ discounts/PayPal accep

Post by Ohbse » Nov 16 2015 5:36pm

Microbatman wrote:Any plans to make a controller that will support 100+ volts?
The reason for asking is all about battery choices.

Your current controllers are not compatible with running Four 6cell packs in series. That = more than 100 volts.
A typical setup using your current controller would be Four 5cell packs in series so you would be less than 100Volts

For example. I have a crystalyte X5304.
My X5304 does much better at higher volts. >80

It does not like running a 20cell lipo setup as much as a 24 cell lipo setup.
So if I buy your controller I am forced to shop around for lipos in 5 cell configurations.

There are NOT a lot of choices in lipo land of 5cell packs.
There are many 6cell choices in lipo land.

So buying the controller as you have it now = limiting my battery shopping choices to 5s configurations as 6s will be over your limits.
I want to buy a 10,000mah6s or larger and run 4 of them in series=100 volts..
Or you could just buy 4s packs? These are commonly available, cells are identical, however the connectors are plug and play with the BMS (one of the best features of the controller IMO). Your experiences with your motor running better on a particular voltage are due to limitations of the controllers you have used in the past, nothing to with the battery voltage. Your motor doesn't even see pack voltage.

There is no point in going to a higher voltage FET. The power potential at lower voltage (~90v) is simply higher with current FETs. Not to mention less risk (>90v is becoming hazardous, 130v+ can be deadly)

Many of the reasons for higher voltage do not apply with these controllers. Motor RPM is not limited to pack voltage with OVS. Performance can be controlled precisely, you do not have to increase voltage to increase power. The only possibly valid scenario is when you're limited to a specific motor KV, however this scenario is becoming quite rare as availability of different windings for high performance motors is much better.

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Microbatman   1 kW

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Re: Advanced ADAPTTO controllers/10%+ discounts/PayPal accep

Post by Microbatman » Nov 16 2015 9:56pm

The reason for not choosing 4s packs
Reason #1 There are less choices of large cell 4s packs to choose from than 6s. In my personal experience with shopping around lipo stores I have found that most of them have more 6s options than 4s options. This especially holds true for 10,000mah or more packs. My guess as to why may be due to the popularity of all the quadcopter and RC drones. A lot of them run 6s packs. So to meet consumer demand vendors have a lot more choices of 6s packs than 4s

Reason #2 More connectors More connectors= more points of failure. More points of failure=less reliability and a ton more wire and a messy rats nest of wires

Reason #3 I already own the motors and do not want to buy different KV motors.

My point is not to get into an argument about who knows more about controllers. My point is not to discredit this controller. I think that this controller has a lot going for it. Personally if it was 100volts+ I would have already bot one.

My purpose of posting is to only to suggest that customers would have more large (10,000-20000Mah) battery choices with a controller that is compatible with 100Volt plus controller.
100 volts = Four 6s packs. You cant run Four 6s packs with this controller as it is now.
That's it. I am not trying to start a fight or flame this product.
Also help me understand. I do not know what "OVS" means. I have done plenty of simulations on ebikes.ca motor simulator. On their simulator, voltage does change rpm
I am familiar with KV.
I am not familiar with "OVS" Please help me understand what "OVS" means. I would like to learn more about OVS.

And I am open to doing more research. I like to learn. I like to look at data.
If you can convince me that Three 6s packs would = the same power and speed as Four 6s packs then you may get a new customer.

I just have a hard time understanding that "motor RPM is not limited to pack voltage". I would like to learn more about this. Do you have any more info or websites that talk about this or any data? Data is something that I welcome concerning this subject. So

If this controller is able to do more work on less volts,,,, please show me some test data using this controller doing more for a motor with Two 6s packs than Three 6s packs


I would love to see 500rpm and 5000watts using only two 6cell packs.
I agree that high voltage DC is very dangerous and would welcome and love to have a lower voltage safer solution.
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Allex   1 GW

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Re: Advanced ADAPTTO controllers/10%+ discounts/PayPal accep

Post by Allex » Nov 17 2015 3:03am

You can read Dc bass build threads. A 20s pack can get you to around 120km/h with a 5403, thats a 3-turn motor with max-e, same 18fet but Infineon controller will prob, not get you to more than 90km/h.
All of this has been discussed over and over again in both adaptto threads(lots of videos and pictures), so just start reading.

And forget about lipos, those are a thing of the past when talking about bigger bikes - more and more people start realising that. :wink:

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Re: Advanced ADAPTTO controllers/10%+ discounts/PayPal accep

Post by Ohbse » Nov 17 2015 5:56pm

Microbatman wrote: Reason #2 More connectors More connectors= more points of failure. More points of failure=less reliability and a ton more wire and a messy rats nest of wires

I am not familiar with "OVS" Please help me understand what "OVS" means. I would like to learn more about OVS.

And I am open to doing more research. I like to learn. I like to look at data.
If you can convince me that Three 6s packs would = the same power and speed as Four 6s packs then you may get a new customer.

I just have a hard time understanding that "motor RPM is not limited to pack voltage". I would like to learn more about this. Do you have any more info or websites that talk about this or any data? Data is something that I welcome concerning this subject. So

If this controller is able to do more work on less volts,,,, please show me some test data using this controller doing more for a motor with Two 6s packs than Three 6s packs


I would love to see 500rpm and 5000watts using only two 6cell packs.
I agree that high voltage DC is very dangerous and would welcome and love to have a lower voltage safer solution.
My apologies if my tone came across as confrontational, was only trying to be definitive.

OVS is a feature/terminology unique to the Adaptto controllers - it allows for motor speed to increase beyond what is usually possible. This is a setting in the controller that you can adjust on the display from 1-7. Generally it is possible to get a no load speed 50% higher than voltage would ordinarily allow. This means that if for instance your 24s pack on a basic controller would do 1000rpm at 100v (for ease of demo) the adaptto can achieve this same no load speed at 18s. I say no load because the load speed is largely dependent on things like wind resistance as speed increases and this can vary wildly with the configuration of your bike or the total power you're pushing.

Short answer - within the realms of sane power for the motor you're running, the Adaptto will achieve the same top speed at 18s than an infineon controller would at 24s.

Power is volts times amps, so in order to achieve the same *power* output as the higher voltage pack, you will require more amps. Thankfully the Max-e is capable of delivering many of those, however bear in mind your motor must be capable of using those increased amps efficiently. This is where motor KV selection is important - the same motor wound for higher KV will have proportionally less resistance, assuming copper amount stays the same. Thus achieving the desired power with lots of amps is not an issue.

On the wider topic of battery configuration, I would highly recommend that if you're to purchase an Adaptto you buy 4s packs. Primary reason is actually your own point, connector quantity...

If you buy 6s packs in an 18s configuration you will require some sort of adapter harness in order to connect these 6s packs to the BMS which is divided into 4s sections. This is possible and there are examples in the Adaptto discussion thread on how to do this, however it adds significant complexity and actually many more connectors than simply purchasing 5x 4s packs rather than 4x 6s. For any lipo configuration I would HIGHLY recommend you do utilise the BMS, it's a great safety net and will greatly reduce the chances of something going wrong with your pack. It also makes identifying faulty cells trivially easy.

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Microbatman   1 kW

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Re: Advanced ADAPTTO controllers/10%+ discounts/PayPal accep

Post by Microbatman » Nov 17 2015 8:52pm

Ohbse thank you for your explanation. I understand what you are saying. 4s packs are an easy fit for this controller and BMS and with some work you can configure a 6s pack to it also.
Very well explained. Yes a BMS is very important when using li-ion chemistry weather you are using 18650 or prismatic cells.
It is my opinion that this product has brought some great technology to the market!!
Love the fact that the controller can sense the hall setup combo. Also like the fact that do not need a PC or special cables to program it. It is obvious from all the threads, post, pictures, and reviews that there are some very smart people that have put this product together. This controller is job well done.
I think that the MID was a great addition.
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frlecmatjaz   10 µW

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Re: Advanced ADAPTTO controllers/10%+ discounts/PayPal accep

Post by frlecmatjaz » Dec 06 2015 6:12pm

I have some questions regarding the ADAPTTO controllers:

1 - Do they work with non hub motors - especially BIG BLOCK motors ?
2 - Anyone got a some dimensions of the display unit - inside/outside spacing between the mounts ? A drawing would be most welcome.

Thanks !

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sn0wchyld   1 MW

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Re: Advanced ADAPTTO controllers/10%+ discounts/PayPal accep

Post by sn0wchyld » Dec 06 2015 7:08pm

frlecmatjaz wrote:I have some questions regarding the ADAPTTO controllers:

1 - Do they work with non hub motors - especially BIG BLOCK motors ?
2 - Anyone got a some dimensions of the display unit - inside/outside spacing between the mounts ? A drawing would be most welcome.

Thanks !
working pretty well with a RV100pro (revolt) so a big block should be fine, though they (high rpm motors) do tend to need more fine tuning since the higher the rpm (mainly, erpm) the greater the impact from hall offset tuning, particularly for field weakening.

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Adaptto E-Drives Lab   100 W

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Re: Advanced ADAPTTO controllers/10%+ discounts/PayPal accep

Post by Adaptto E-Drives Lab » Dec 07 2015 7:33am

frlecmatjaz wrote:I have some questions regarding the ADAPTTO controllers:

1 - Do they work with non hub motors - especially BIG BLOCK motors ?
2 - Anyone got a some dimensions of the display unit - inside/outside spacing between the mounts ? A drawing would be most welcome.

Thanks !

Sent PM.

Best regards,
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Mammalian04   100 kW

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Re: Advanced ADAPTTO controllers and compatible products

Post by Mammalian04 » Dec 07 2015 2:13pm

Adaptto, I have 4 Adaptto controllers and would be interested in adding a 5th if the Big Block motor is officially supported. Can you let the thread in on the information you sent in PM? If not, could you PM me with the information?

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Re: Advanced ADAPTTO controllers and compatible products

Post by Xantho » Dec 07 2015 3:12pm

Hi, I have a few questions to the password protected firmware:
Is it the actual firmware RC-9G_4.3 only with additional password protection?
What is the password when started? How can it be changed?
I have the max e without PAS. Does this new firmware still work with throttle in ECO mode?

I have a wish for a firmware change. I use a regen button and activated the smooth option. I love the smooth start of breaking which reduces stress on the dropouts. But it really makes no sense to me to have a smooth transition after releasing the button. If this could be changed it would be another great feature which makes the Adaptto controllers even more superior to other controllers.
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Allex   1 GW

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Re: Advanced ADAPTTO controllers and compatible products

Post by Allex » Dec 08 2015 3:55am

Hello,

The firmware is a locked RC-9G_4.3
The password is left-left-up-left-down, the change can be done through the menu settings as always.
Firmware will work with your controller without issues.

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madin88   100 MW

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Re: Advanced ADAPTTO controllers and compatible products

Post by madin88 » Dec 08 2015 5:28am

there was a little bug in the RC-9G_4 firmware i discussed with adaptto. FWIK they have fixed it and released the _4.3 version, but i have not tried it yet (we have winter now here in austria).
why is it locked with a PW now?
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Allex   1 GW

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Re: Advanced ADAPTTO controllers and compatible products

Post by Allex » Dec 08 2015 5:43am

The power profiles are psw protected. This is not the regular firmware, regular one, without psw can be downloaded through adaptto site.

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Adaptto E-Drives Lab   100 W

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Re: Advanced ADAPTTO controllers and compatible products

Post by Adaptto E-Drives Lab » Dec 10 2015 9:17am

Image
For sales enquiries please contact us via: sales@adaptto.com
Technical questions: techsupport@adaptto.com
Web-site: http://adaptto.com/

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DasDouble   100 kW

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Re: Advanced ADAPTTO controllers and compatible products

Post by DasDouble » Dec 10 2015 2:42pm

Thats a nice event. I will join it! :)
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shadow   10 mW

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Re: Advanced ADAPTTO controllers and compatible products

Post by shadow » Dec 23 2015 12:47pm

so still no reply on whether an enertrac 602 will work with this controller?

With this piece of information below it looks like i'm running out of options, i can't sacrifice 20% of my top speed moving to a KLS controller, the Adaptto has the solution to the speed problem but has significantly less power. More importantly though, I don't have any response on whether they are even compatible to begin with.
fany wrote:
As the same goes,the max speed of KLS is lower than KEB or KBS.The speed is less about 15-20% than trapezoidal controller.

Have you already got the special user program from one of our customers?

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Re: Advanced ADAPTTO controllers and compatible products

Post by Doctorbass » Dec 23 2015 1:25pm

shadow wrote:so still no reply on whether an enertrac 602 will work with this controller?

With this piece of information below it looks like i'm running out of options, i can't sacrifice 20% of my top speed moving to a KLS controller, the Adaptto has the solution to the speed problem but has significantly less power. More importantly though, I don't have any response on whether they are even compatible to begin with.
fany wrote:
As the same goes,the max speed of KLS is lower than KEB or KBS.The speed is less about 15-20% than trapezoidal controller.

Have you already got the special user program from one of our customers?
The Adaptto Will work with the Enertrac. The Enertrac motor are based on Crystalyte stator design with angled tooth and i can confirm that Adaptto work with also the older crystalyte X5 serie and i'm pretty sur eit will work with the X6 (Enertrac)

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Re: Advanced ADAPTTO controllers and compatible products

Post by macribs » Dec 23 2015 2:19pm

If I remember correct that enertec is actually two motors in a dual width config. If that is correct I assume you will need to run 2 x Adaptto controllers for most possible power.

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shadow   10 mW

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Re: Advanced ADAPTTO controllers and compatible products

Post by shadow » Dec 23 2015 2:43pm

the enertrac does have a "dual-motor" version, but i just have the single, is this what you are thinking of?

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Re: Advanced ADAPTTO controllers and compatible products

Post by Doctorbass » Dec 23 2015 2:48pm

shadow wrote:the enertrac does have a "dual-motor" version, but i just have the single, is this what you are thinking of?

So you have the 602 or the 603 ( single) and no prob to drive with an adaptto in sinewave or square wave and enjoy teh timinmg advance feature too.

Even with the dual motor, Usually they are synchronized together precisely enough so you dont have high loss.

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CURRENT PROJECT: 2WD duo MXUS/Max-E ebike 32kW
http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewto ... =3&t=65764
-Fastest speed record 117 km/h on flat
-Fastest 1/4 mile@ 114km/h on flat and 16.316 sec
-Succeded to haul a 19200 pounds schoolbus!
113kmh Gianthttp://www.evalbum.com/3406
Mongoosehttp://www.evalbum.com/1947
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shadow   10 mW

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Re: Advanced ADAPTTO controllers and compatible products

Post by shadow » Dec 23 2015 3:07pm

I have the 602

I hope i'm not getting too far off topic here, my main concern is that i'm upgrading my battery pack, changing my controller, changing my hub motor wheel size, and would prefer not to lose out significantly on top speed.

Before:
24s2p (1.8kWh) LiFe cells, 3.7v/cell
wheel size 90/90-21 (27.38" diameter)
Kelly KEB72100 (10kw)
Top speed: ~52mph

After:
22s3p (6kWh) NCM cells, 4.2v/cell (300A output)
wheel size 130/90-17 (26.21" diameter)
Controller: Kelly KLS/Adaptto Max-e/Sevcon gen4

I haven't purchased the batteries yet, but i'm assuming it's best to stay under 96v full charge voltage rather than try to fix my top speed problem with a higher voltage (The KLS12301 120V controller only has 300A rating while the 96v version is 600A).

So i'm going up in voltage slightly, down in wheel size by 1" and significantly up in battery size/output. I would REALLY prefer to keep my top speed of at least 50mph. Losing 15-20% for FOC just doesn't seem like a good compromise, without field weakening.

I know the answer seems like Sevcon, but i'm a little weary of whether the software is available. $925 for the controller + $900 for the software/adapter also doesn't make sense.

I wish i had a magic ball to know when the next series of controllers are coming out. :\

Thoughts???

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Re: Advanced ADAPTTO controllers and compatible products

Post by chucho » Dec 23 2015 4:05pm

Any news on the famous DC-DC that Adaptto was making sometime ago :?: :?:
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Adaptto E-Drives Lab   100 W

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Re: Advanced ADAPTTO controllers and compatible products

Post by Adaptto E-Drives Lab » Feb 10 2016 5:09am

Dear Friends!
By popular request the timings of our ADAPTTO Photo Challenge were extended until 29th of February.
The open vote for winners will start on the 2nd of March.
Don't miss your chance to participate and to win one of Adaptto controllers!
Don't forget to pay attention to conditions of the contest. Those who will fail to add hashtags to their photos and/or will forget to repost the following banner on Facebook page, will be disqualified from the competition!
Good Luck!

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Re: Advanced ADAPTTO controllers and compatible products

Post by velias » Feb 19 2016 7:25pm

I wish they would concentrate on finding a U.S. dealer instead of a photo contest.

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Rix   100 GW

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Re: Advanced ADAPTTO controllers and compatible products

Post by Rix » Feb 20 2016 1:54am

velias wrote:I wish they would concentrate on finding a U.S. dealer instead of a photo contest.
Just deal with Allex, I got my Max E through him. I live on hour east of you in Fallon and I get stuff from Allex all the time.

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