Compact Field Oriented Controller, ASI + Grin, limited run

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rowbiker
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Re: Compact Field Oriented Controller, ASI + Grin, limited run

Post by rowbiker » Dec 28, 2017 12:20 pm

MrDude_1 wrote:
Dec 19, 2017 8:52 am
If anyone here is capable of and willing to do a post mortem on my dead phaserunner so we can tell why it failed, I would be willing to ship it. Im kind of curious.
I'm curious as well. I've been running three Phaserunners (two on non ebike projects) for nearly a year now, and just haven't had any hardware problems with any of them (yet!?!). I've autopsied several Infineon type controllers however, and have found that failures, in my environment at least, are caused by human errors. My only reservation for volunteering to dig into your Phaserunner is that if it's the model that's completely 'potted' (embedded in epoxy), I'm not even sure that it's physically *possible* to get down to the components or the circuit board. This is one of those "What would Justin do?" kinds of issues. His previous pronouncements on this issue -- and I may not be presenting his views accurately -- is that the potting adds more reliability to the device than is offset by giving up the ability to repair it if and when it fails. Of course, we're looking for the failure cause here, not necessarily any kind of repair. With this in mind, I'd be willing to give it a shot.

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Re: Compact Field Oriented Controller, ASI + Grin, limited run

Post by smokeywho » Jan 03, 2018 11:47 pm

Has anyone else had trouble with the new v2 Phaserunner? I've had two die within two hundred miles. The unit passes power to the Cycle Analyst but the status light doesn't come on it, doesn't send power to the motor, and I can't access it via the com port. I'm using a Crystalyte 3080 and a 52v battery from Em3EV. I wonder if there is a problem with the new model. Very strange to have both die in the exact same manner so quickly. Still waiting on Grin to get back to me on the second RMA. For the brief intervals it does work, the controller is awesome. I just hope they get the issue sorted out. I love how quiet the system is and the variable regen.

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Re: Compact Field Oriented Controller, ASI + Grin, limited run

Post by amberwolf » Jan 04, 2018 1:55 am

rowbiker wrote:
Dec 28, 2017 12:20 pm
My only reservation for volunteering to dig into your Phaserunner is that if it's the model that's completely 'potted' (embedded in epoxy), I'm not even sure that it's physically *possible* to get down to the components or the circuit board.
It's possible to dissolve epoxy--you just have to find out which kind Grin used to pot that unit. If Grin hasn't already tried stuff to dissolve it, you can contact the company that made that epoxy and see what they recommend. Keep in mind it is possible that whatever dissolves that epoxy might also dissolve other plastics used on components of the controller.


Failing all that, you could try ATF, it's been used to dissolve some epoxies. No guarantees....

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Re: Compact Field Oriented Controller, ASI + Grin, limited run

Post by rowbiker » Jan 04, 2018 12:22 pm

Good suggestion, amberwolf. For the purposes of doing an autopsy, damaging some of the parts may be acceptable, unless it prevents useful test results revealing the original failure of parts in the controller.

One thought I had is that the bottom (non-component side) of the controller, which faces the heat sink base, might be more accessible. If so, it might allow access to more 'test points' on the circuit board, which (assuming one had access to the schematic and knew what he was doing) might reveal the failure(s).

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Re: Compare BAC product to Grin Phaserunner

Post by denialson » Jan 10, 2018 7:28 am

tomjasz wrote:
Dec 27, 2017 11:02 pm
As i’m still learning about advanced controlers, the BAC800 and phaserunner. Can anyone help sort and compare the function of each? Advantage Grin?
I'm also interested in this. As I understand they are the same thing in different packages, or is the phaserunner running another firmware that enables it to be more customized?

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Re: Compact Field Oriented Controller, ASI + Grin, limited r

Post by hjns » Jan 31, 2018 10:39 am

MrDude_1 wrote:
Oct 11, 2017 9:43 pm
with the software connected I could immediately see some faults.

Code: Select all

Faults[0]: Controller over voltage
Faults[1]: Filtered phase over current
Faults[9]: Instantaneous phase over current
Faults[11]: Throttle voltage outside range
Warnings[7]: VdcLowFLDBK
Warnings[8]: VdcHighFLDBK
Warnings[12]: HiSOCFLDBK

So, after more than one year with my PhaseRunner I also get some terrible faults, inhibiting me from riding my bike.

Code: Select all

Faults[0]: Controller over voltage
Faults[2]: Bad current sensor calibration
Faults[9]: Instantaneous phase over current
Warnings[12]: HiSOCFLDBK

Only when I completely redo the Autotune, I can get the PhaseRunner to work again. Very irritating, and I have already ordered a new PhaseRunner. However, it would be great if anyone can give me some advice how to manage these faults.

My system: Front Grin-Through-Axle hubmotor, EM3EV 14S pack (58V HoC), CAv3, Throttle on CAv3, PhaseRunner initially connected with Hall sensors, but in the process of managing the faults now running without the Hall sensors connected.
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Re: Compact Field Oriented Controller, ASI + Grin, limited run

Post by Tats » Feb 01, 2018 6:51 am

Have you checked the three phase connections are sound. One shaking loose can cause over bolts on the other two. I had this intermittently due to a backed out Anderson after hitting bumps.

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Re: Compact Field Oriented Controller, ASI + Grin, limited r

Post by jPas » Feb 04, 2018 12:55 pm

justin_le wrote:
Oct 01, 2017 9:21 am

Also, please just leave the rated system voltage alone (at 48V) after you've done the autotune etc. it says so clearly in the manual and on the tooltips, there are lots of dependencies with other parameters that get affected and then clamped when you change this setting after the fact.
I just borrowed a friend's 72V battery and went to tweak the settings in my phaserunner, of course I didn't hover over any tooltips and cranked up the Rated system voltage up to 72V from 52V.

It was confusing why there was no wheel spin at all when I brought it outside for a test ride, luckily I had saved the previous settings in an xml file so I re-imported them and things were working again. I ended up figuring out by trial and error to just leave it and change the regen settings and max power etc.

I don't see any reference to leaving the System voltage alone in the Phaserunner manual in either the 1.0 or newer 2.0 manual pdf.. unless I missed it?

Could you add a note in there under section 4.2 about leaving the system voltage alone?

Thanks for the great product! :)

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Re: Compact Field Oriented Controller, ASI + Grin, limited run

Post by Alan B » Feb 04, 2018 11:05 pm

They should move the "system voltage" settings to an advanced tab. It is not something one changes lightly. Perhaps it should also be referred to in different terminology, as it is a master scale setting that affects many, many things.

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Re: Compact Field Oriented Controller, ASI + Grin, limited run

Post by racingame » Feb 16, 2018 11:34 am

Hello, I'm looking for a controller that can let me handle the cutoff (the time for how long the motor temporary turns off) when I switch gears. What I'd like achieve is that the more power I'm squeezing out of the motor (the faster I'm going), the faster the gears get switched. My current motor (Bafang BBSHD) has the problem that there is just a default value set inside the controller for all gears and that is not configurable via software, while I'd like to link this "cutoff" time to both the speed and power so that I don't get sudden "strokes" while switching gear at high speeds.

Is this something already possible with current PR software? Do you think Justin would be available to add such feature? :roll:

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Re: Compact Field Oriented Controller, ASI + Grin, limited run

Post by teklektik » Feb 16, 2018 2:58 pm

racingame wrote:
Feb 16, 2018 11:34 am
Is this something already possible with current PR software? Do you think Justin would be available to add such feature? :roll:
Nope.
Nope.
The gear change feature is provided by the CA3 via a configurable fixed length minimum time ebrakes are applied. You can trigger it either by tapping the brakes or by installing a gear change detector that drives the CA ebrake input. You can use the brakes normally to stretch the brake application to be longer than this minimum for regular braking or slow-shift situations.

The automatic variable-length delay you describe is not available.
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Re: Compact Field Oriented Controller, ASI + Grin, limited run

Post by racingame » Feb 16, 2018 5:55 pm

teklektik wrote:
Feb 16, 2018 2:58 pm
racingame wrote:
Feb 16, 2018 11:34 am
Is this something already possible with current PR software? Do you think Justin would be available to add such feature? :roll:
Nope.
Nope.
The gear change feature is provided by the CA3 via a configurable fixed length minimum time ebrakes are applied. You can trigger it either by tapping the brakes or by installing a gear change detector that drives the CA ebrake input. You can use the brakes normally to stretch the brake application to be longer than this minimum for regular braking or slow-shift situations.

The automatic variable-length delay you describe is not available.
So, provided that I've already mounted a gearsensor on my bike, I can make its signal intercepted by CAv3, right? This signal is just a true/false thing or can actually bring data within it about what gear I have actually selected so that I can cutoff the motor by the amount of time I desire based on 1) what gear is selected and 2) what speed I'm going? Is this thing feasable for the features the CAv3 already provides? I need to make the cutoff time as short as possible for high gears, currently I'm really not satisfied by the amount of time it takes, since it's exactly the same one for every gear. I'm sure Bafang could have just added some extra parameters to his controller firmware and thus software interface to let you handle the time for each Assist Level and Gear selected, but they didn't.

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Re: Compact Field Oriented Controller, ASI + Grin, limited run

Post by racingame » Feb 19, 2018 12:18 pm

This controller doesn't allow you to have 2-3 profiles like any bike controller out there? I couldn't find any options in the software.

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Re: Compact Field Oriented Controller, ASI + Grin, limited run

Post by amberwolf » Feb 19, 2018 6:24 pm

racingame wrote:
Feb 19, 2018 12:18 pm
This controller doesn't allow you to have 2-3 profiles like any bike controller out there? I couldn't find any options in the software.
Most common ebike controllers dont' have profiles either (most dont' even have software to program them at all--you buy them the way you want them and if they don't do what you want you either modify their hardwrae (if possible) or toss it and buy a new one that does it instead (possibly losing other features the old one had in the bargain).

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