Genesis V2100 - Assault & Battery

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teslanv   100 MW

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Re: Genesis V2100 - Assault & Battery - Illegal in all 50 St

Post by teslanv » Feb 18 2015 8:10am

Yes, Kinaye Motorsports is a corporation, so my personal assets are shielded in the event of a lawsuit. Since I only sell parts, and not the whole bike, this should reduce my legal exposure as well. And I do not plan on selling batteries either. The most dangerous thing I will offer is a "Recipe for a High-Speed Ebike" manual, but this I will be giving away free of charge.
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Re: Genesis V2100 - Assault & Battery - Illegal in all 50 St

Post by teklektik » Feb 18 2015 9:25am

teslanv wrote:Yes, Kinaye Motorsports is a corporation, so my personal assets are shielded in the event of a lawsuit.
A common misconception. Bringing a corporate entity into being only protects your personal assets from business debt. You may still have unlimited personal liability in the case of personal injury or similar suits that fall in the category of tort exceptions. Simply anteing up a few bucks to form a corporation doesn't give you a Get Out of Jail Free Card.
Since I only sell parts, and not the whole bike, this should reduce my legal exposure as well.
This eliminates responsibility under CPSC HR 727 - (the familiar 20mph 750W restrictions).
The most dangerous thing I will offer is a "Recipe for a High-Speed Ebike" manual, but this I will be giving away free of charge.
This goes directly to the first point. Here the nuances of the presentation and situation will likely make all the difference - not whether you received direct remuneration.

A chat with your attorney might be a good plan.
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Re: Genesis V2100 - Assault & Battery - Illegal in all 50 St

Post by windtrader » Feb 18 2015 9:30am

100volts+ wrote:
I hate to say - talk to a lawyer because i just felt them prices jump 10% but if you sell only parts and not even all to build the thing, i think you have fairly liability, especially RC batteries if you are not the OEM. If you ever get hit, they will and they'd likely be the bigger pockets.
I don't think he is going to build the bike or even sell RC batteries, only parts and then he would only have the same liability as the 2 million other people who sell kits. Plus I think that is why he started Kinaye. It will be separate from his personnel assets.
I totally agree. On the scale his actual liability is very low. I'm sure he won't lose any sleep over it. Sorry to even raise the issue and go OT.

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Re: Genesis V2100 - Assault & Battery - Illegal in all 50 St

Post by teklektik » Feb 18 2015 9:34am

This is really just a question of going into this with 'Eyes Wide Open' and understanding the situation.
Risk evaluation is a separate issue.
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teslanv   100 MW

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Re: Genesis V2100 - Assault & Battery - Illegal in all 50 St

Post by teslanv » Feb 18 2015 10:22am

Many products, even the most ordinary, pose some level of risk, and the law recognizes that it is often not possible to design a totally safe product. However, manufacturers are legally obligated to warn consumers about known dangers. Manufacturers may be found negligent if:

They fail to warn users about recognized risk
The warning is too vague to be adequate
The warning is not brought to the user's attention
There is no duty to warn against misuse that is so rare or unusual that it cannot be foreseen. The obligation to warn consumers of potential dangers poses a unique difficulty for manufacturers who must not only provide warnings, but must communicate them such that a reasonable person will find and understand them. In some cases a warning buried in a product's instructions may be judged inadequate; in other situations, a warning sticker on the product itself may be considered sufficient.

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Re: Genesis V2100 - Assault & Battery - Illegal in all 50 St

Post by 100volts+ » Feb 18 2015 3:37pm

Personally I applaud teslanv. You have to have focus, perseverance, persistance, and brass balls in business these days.
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Re: Genesis V2100 - Assault & Battery - Illegal in all 50 St

Post by diggler » Feb 18 2015 5:58pm

will the Farfle Swing Arm work on the Kona Stinky?
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Re: Genesis V2100 - Assault & Battery - Illegal in all 50 St

Post by madin88 » Feb 19 2015 4:53am

make the same bike and mount a big block motor on the swingarm :)
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Re: Genesis V2100 - Assault & Battery - Illegal in all 50 St

Post by arkmundi » Feb 19 2015 7:40am

++1 - Looking awesome! Thanks for detailed specs. :mrgreen:
100volts+ wrote:You have to have focus, perseverance, persistance, and brass balls in business these days.
You are just so wrong.... those are IRON balls, iron, not brass! :lol: :lol:

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Re: Genesis V2100 - Assault & Battery - Illegal in all 50 St

Post by teslanv » Feb 19 2015 1:59pm

diggler wrote:will the Farfle Swing Arm work on the Kona Stinky?
I have had a lot of guys ask about the Swing arm fitting the Stinky.

I doubt the current version will fit, but I am thinking we may need to develop the Farfle for the Stinky? The big questions is, what changes have been made to the Stinky frame shape/swing arm over the years it has been available? Is there a standard/common design?

What say you all? Do we need a "Stinky Farfle"?
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Re: Genesis V2100 - Assault & Battery - Illegal in all 50 St

Post by sllikskills » Feb 19 2015 3:22pm

teslanv wrote:Do we need a "Stinky Farfle"?
hellzz yeah! Sign me up if it's in the works! I'll take it and make a build thread right away 8)

One quick question - Are there any Genesis v2100 Farfle swing arms available for purchase anywhere still? I'm trying to help my newbie friend learn about e-bikes and build a badass machine for him in the meantime!

Thanks!
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Re: Genesis V2100 - Assault & Battery - Illegal in all 50 St

Post by diggler » Feb 19 2015 5:04pm

The big questions is, what changes have been made to the Stinky frame shape/swing arm over the years it has been available?
I know right?
They have changed it every year sometimes pretty drastically.
They might have kept the same dimensions for there swing arm mount over the years.
Looks like some digging is in order.
GAS ELECTRIC FAT BIKE 49CC/3000W MXUS V1 18s Lipo 18 Fet BUILDING...http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewto ... =6&t=65638
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Re: Genesis V2100 - Assault & Battery - Illegal in all 50 St

Post by teslanv » Feb 19 2015 5:31pm

diggler wrote:
The big questions is, what changes have been made to the Stinky frame shape/swing arm over the years it has been available?
I know right?
They have changed it every year sometimes pretty drastically.
They might have kept the same dimensions for there swing arm mount over the years.
Looks like some digging is in order.
Who wants to send me their Stinky's swing arm dimensions?

Please provide the dimensions (preferably to the nearest 0.1mm) for the Following:
1A. Pivot Tube Outside Diameter
1B. Pivot Tube Inside Diameter
1C. Pivot Tube Width
2. Distance from Pivot Center to Wishbone Connection Center
3. Diameter of Wishbone Connection Through-Hole
4. Clear Distance between Wishbone Mounts

Please also indicate which Year and Model of Stinky you have.
Stinky Farfle Dimensions.pdf
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Re: Genesis V2100 - Assault & Battery - Illegal in all 50 St

Post by sllikskills » Feb 19 2015 10:30pm

Teslanv,

Have you considered putting 20" BMX rims on the front wheel to reduce weight? 2.25 moped tires are pretty small, you probably have an OD of 21-22 inches! What do you think?

Mike
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Re: Genesis V2100 - Assault & Battery - Illegal in all 50 St

Post by teslanv » Feb 19 2015 11:14pm

sllikskills wrote:Teslanv,

Have you considered putting 20" BMX rims on the front wheel to reduce weight? 2.25 moped tires are pretty small, you probably have an OD of 21-22 inches! What do you think?

Mike
Actually I really like the ride quality of the heavier Moped Rims & tires.
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Re: Genesis V2100 - Assault & Battery - Illegal in all 50 St

Post by spinningmagnets » Feb 20 2015 10:40am

I am VERY interested to find out the triangle space dimensions, in order to start on a custom triangle-shaped battery. I am certain the smallest size of triangle pack from em3ev.com will fit, but I also am just as sure that there is room for one more parallel string (for more range). The biggest em3ev pack will not fit here, so I am looking at a middle-sized triangle pack, so...while I'm at it, why not make it fit the popular V2100 frame? (The Walmart Ledge 2.2 very is similar, but the V2100 has a larger triangle).

Dont care about the tiny square space just above the shock, just the main triangle, with three side length measurements, please...

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Re: Genesis V2100 - Assault & Battery - Illegal in all 50 St

Post by teslanv » Feb 20 2015 11:16am

Already made a CAD (DWG) model of the genesis V2100.

Image

[The extension dwg has been deactivated and can no longer be displayed.]

Genesis V2100 Frame.pdf
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Genesis V2100 Custom Battery.pdf
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Re: Genesis V2100 - Assault & Battery - Illegal in all 50 St

Post by Simple818 » Feb 20 2015 4:20pm

20s7p capable. Call Paul !!.

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Re: Genesis V2100 - Assault & Battery - Illegal in all 50 St

Post by spinningmagnets » Feb 20 2015 4:38pm

Thanks teslanv! I appreciate you posting that...

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Re: Genesis V2100 - Assault & Battery - Illegal in all 50 St

Post by lordlo » Feb 20 2015 6:13pm

Possible to buy the swingarms before the website is up? My stock v2100 swingarm does not like regen braking with the mx us 3000. :lol:

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Re: Genesis V2100 - Assault & Battery - Illegal in all 50 St

Post by SuperSJ4Goku » Feb 20 2015 8:29pm

I would like to purchase the package necessary to build this sometime in june or sooner. could you possibly contact me when I could buy the parts necessary ? Thanks for your time =)
New to E-Biking. Due to military knee and joint injuries will be building machine Summer of 2015.

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Re: Genesis V2100 - Assault & Battery - Illegal in all 50 St

Post by teslanv » Feb 20 2015 8:53pm

We are still struggling to source the swing arm fabrication. The first company I found is super busy and is dragging their feet to get me a sample.

I just got a quote from another shop to do a 20-unit production run at $1000 per unit my cost. - Obviously that one isn't going to fly.

Maybe I will take a welding class at the school I teach at and build them all myself ;)
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Re: Genesis V2100 - Assault & Battery - Illegal in all 50 St

Post by windtrader » Feb 20 2015 10:45pm

What say you all? Do we need a "Stinky Farfle"?
Absolutely not. Keep your business focus and achieve the first goal. Get all the key aspects of this project nailed and firmed up, not necessarily all polished up but solid. Stay the course - look at the title if you forgot.

Just the time you spent entertaining a different frame and swing arm was lost to the effort of finding a suitable shop for the first one. Stay focused. There still much to do to define, trial, and test the various components that will become recommended builds. The shopping list and the guides/instructions/tutorials to make this so simple you will have no time to even keep up with filling orders!

Do this right one first. Think about everything single think you do and wherever possible maximize the flexibility and adaptability to be leveraged on future builds and projects.

I understand it is really easy to get off course with the building excitement of all the possible variations but please stay heads down and nail this one first.

EDIT - And for the second configuration, how about a motor mounted on the swingarm. Maybe even an option of the first build. No, second thought there are enough differences to make it a separate effort. Not just selecting a different motor - you got mounting differences, wheel building differences, chain line issues, chains? or belts? etc...
don

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Re: Genesis V2100 - Assault & Battery - Illegal in all 50 St

Post by madin88 » Feb 21 2015 4:20am

windtrader wrote: EDIT - And for the second configuration, how about a motor mounted on the swingarm. Maybe even an option of the first build. No, second thought there are enough differences to make it a separate effort. Not just selecting a different motor - you got mounting differences, wheel building differences, chain line issues, chains? or belts? etc...
don
my suggestion. with 20" wheels the big block should have enough space.
teslanv, what do you say?
- 10kW belt drive with Neumotor 8057: viewtopic.php?f=30&t=91144&start=50#p1377787
- Fully road legal (L1E approval) e-bike based on Votec V-FR frame
/ MXUS 3T / 17" Mitas MC11 / Adaptto Max-E / 20s12p 25R
- KTM Hardtail Pedelec / eZee V2 6T / 27,5" / Kelly KBSX @ 1,5kW / Torque PAS / CA-V3 / 13s4p Sanyo GA in Shark case

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Re: Genesis V2100 - Assault & Battery - Illegal in all 50 St

Post by teslanv » Feb 21 2015 8:28am

madin88 wrote:
windtrader wrote: EDIT - And for the second configuration, how about a motor mounted on the swingarm. Maybe even an option of the first build. No, second thought there are enough differences to make it a separate effort. Not just selecting a different motor - you got mounting differences, wheel building differences, chain line issues, chains? or belts? etc...
don
my suggestion. with 20" wheels the big block should have enough space.
teslanv, what do you say?
A big block will fit. Evolutiongts has already done that mod. All that the swing arm needs is a mounting plate on top. An easy add.
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