New BBS powered cruisers

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roshan   1 W

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New BBS powered cruisers

Post by roshan » Sep 09 2015 10:26am

Hi all,

We're designing cruisers to take bbs02 motors inside the frame. The frames are designed and fabricated from scratch. What do you guys think of the design? Any recommendations? We are looking to pricing the base model with a bbs02 36V 500W around $1000 as an pre-launch price and retail later on for around $1600. I really appreciate any feedback!
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Thanks all!

Roshan
http://www.biktrix.com
https://www.facebook.com/biktrixbikes

slacker   10 kW

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Re: New BBS powered cruisers

Post by slacker » Sep 09 2015 7:15pm

48 volt 750 watt at 1000$ and i am in. I think you will do well if you offer this as bafang has just upped their offering"s with a higher powered motor. Good luck with your idea and hope you succeed. :D

roshan   1 W

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Re: New BBS powered cruisers

Post by roshan » Oct 14 2015 2:22pm

slacker wrote:48 volt 750 watt at 1000$ and i am in. I think you will do well if you offer this as bafang has just upped their offering"s with a higher powered motor. Good luck with your idea and hope you succeed. :D
That will be offered as an option. No sure if we can do it under $1000 though.

Here's some pictures of the real bike:
http://www.biktrix.com/stunner.html

Review:
http://electricbikereview.com/biktrix/stunner/

rick (nova scotia)   10 mW

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Re: New BBS powered cruisers

Post by rick (nova scotia) » Dec 07 2015 10:20pm

Well I'm late to the game here, but to answer the original question, I'll say I think the new frame design to keep the motor "up" and safe from bangs is a good one.

The BBS01, 02 seem to have some quality, BaFang have produced a lot of these motors/kits and it seems most reviews are favorable, having produced so many, if there were "problems, we should have heard about it by now ?

WoodlandHills   10 kW

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Re: New BBS powered cruisers

Post by WoodlandHills » Dec 08 2015 2:09am

Welcome, I hope you sell hundreds! I also think you are the first of many to make BBSxx compatible frames and being first to market is important. Will you offer these as bare frames, built bicycles and eBikes and will you offer other styles of bicycle? An off-road type fat bike or MTB would be another ideal candidate for a protected motor up inside the frame.

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Re: New BBS powered cruisers

Post by ecycler » Dec 08 2015 1:57pm

Widen that downtube and you could probably stuff a decent sized 18650 pack in there! :-)
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Lurkin   100 kW

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Re: New BBS powered cruisers

Post by Lurkin » Dec 08 2015 7:38pm

Using a downtube that has a flat inside would make for better installation of dolphin style 18650 packs as the bottom of the mount is also usually flat and poorly supported by round tube frames. They also typically sold with BBS... Could consider the same with the seatpost area... certainly would make for an easy, stable install.

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Re: New BBS powered cruisers

Post by 999zip999 » Dec 08 2015 8:55pm

135mm rear drop outs for 7 speed. To pedal at high speeds.

ls7corvete   100 mW

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Re: New BBS powered cruisers

Post by ls7corvete » Dec 10 2015 1:50pm

Rim brakes on an electric bike...

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Rassy   10 MW

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Re: New BBS powered cruisers

Post by Rassy » Dec 10 2015 2:40pm

When I decided to mount a BBS02 on the boom of a tadpole trike I discovered the BBS02 had drain holes built into the bottom of the controller cavity. When the BBS02 is rotated to an upper position, this cavity could collect moisture. In my case I decided to keep the BBS02 down, which required a small torque arm. What are you doing to eliminate this as a potential problem?
-Rassy-

Two Delta Trikes equipped with a Bafang BBS02
viewtopic.php?f=28&t=88536&p=1291260#p1291260

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tomjasz   10 GW

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Re: New BBS powered cruisers

Post by tomjasz » Dec 10 2015 2:46pm

ls7corvete wrote:Rim brakes on an electric bike...
Just fine on a flat foot with decent pads. I have three bikes very similarly equipped. They stop great with KoolPad Salmon kit.
Thanks Justin_le we're here thanks to you. All the best to the mods for their tireless work keeping it on an even keel.

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tomjasz   10 GW

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Re: New BBS powered cruisers

Post by tomjasz » Dec 10 2015 2:48pm

Rassy wrote: potential problem?
I don't think it is. Aluminum frame for starters and with basic attention I don't see the potential problem with this frame.
Thanks Justin_le we're here thanks to you. All the best to the mods for their tireless work keeping it on an even keel.

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tomjasz   10 GW

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Re: New BBS powered cruisers

Post by tomjasz » Dec 10 2015 2:52pm

Lurkin wrote:Using a downtube that has a flat inside would make for better installation of dolphin style 18650 packs as the bottom of the mount is also usually flat and poorly supported by round tube frames. They also typically sold with BBS... Could consider the same with the seatpost area... certainly would make for an easy, stable install.
I think his chosen pack fits better than the Dolphin cases used by others. That and it's a forward thinking design.
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Thanks Justin_le we're here thanks to you. All the best to the mods for their tireless work keeping it on an even keel.

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Rassy   10 MW

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Re: New BBS powered cruisers

Post by Rassy » Dec 10 2015 3:56pm

Tomjasz wrote:
I don't think it is. Aluminum frame for starters and with basic attention I don't see the potential problem with this frame.
Agreed, but I wasn't clear on which problem I meant, mainly water getting into the BBS02 when the controller cavity drains are positioned up instead of down.

Edit: Also agree with using Kool Stop Salmon pads. I've had good luck with them.
-Rassy-

Two Delta Trikes equipped with a Bafang BBS02
viewtopic.php?f=28&t=88536&p=1291260#p1291260

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tomjasz   10 GW

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Re: New BBS powered cruisers

Post by tomjasz » Dec 10 2015 5:30pm

Rassy wrote: I meant, mainly water getting into the BBS02 when the controller cavity drains are positioned up instead of down.
Hmmm I hadn't considered that. I need to look again. Thanks for the clarification!
Thanks Justin_le we're here thanks to you. All the best to the mods for their tireless work keeping it on an even keel.

roshan   1 W

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Re: New BBS powered cruisers

Post by roshan » Jan 11 2016 12:06pm

tomjasz wrote:
Rassy wrote: I meant, mainly water getting into the BBS02 when the controller cavity drains are positioned up instead of down.
Hmmm I hadn't considered that. I need to look again. Thanks for the clarification!
The motor is weatherproofed the same all the way around.

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Leebolectric   1 kW

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Re: New BBS powered cruisers

Post by Leebolectric » Jan 11 2016 12:30pm

A straight 44mm headtube will accept tapered forks and is cheap to make....accepts the widest range of steer tube sizes (1", 1 1/8", and Tapered)

44mm head tube, 67-69degree head angle, 13"bb height, 68mm BB, 135mm rear, disk brake ONLY option, BBSHD1000...and maybe 27.5/26Fat wheels?
...and a derailleur hangar...very necessary for options.
I'd buy one of those^
2015 Intense Tracer275 with Tangent Ascent inside triangle https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewt ... 28&t=75045
2010 Turner 5Spot with BaffangHD https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewt ... 28&t=75569
2009 KHS Velvet 6" with BafangHD (see above thread^)
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Rassy   10 MW

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Re: New BBS powered cruisers

Post by Rassy » Jan 11 2016 2:10pm

Rassy wrote:
I meant, mainly water getting into the BBS02 when the controller cavity drains are positioned up instead of down.
tomjasz wrote:
Hmmm I hadn't considered that. I need to look again. Thanks for the clarification!
roshan wrote:
The motor is weatherproofed the same all the way around.
No, the unit is not weatherproofed the same all the way around. On the controller side there is a drain hole next to each of the bottom screws. You may have to remove the screw to see the hole, because it is very near the head of the screw. If the unit is mounted so these holes are at the top instead of at the bottom I think the controller cavity could fill with water unless a new hole is drilled.
-Rassy-

Two Delta Trikes equipped with a Bafang BBS02
viewtopic.php?f=28&t=88536&p=1291260#p1291260

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Alan B   100 GW

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Re: New BBS powered cruisers

Post by Alan B » Sep 12 2016 6:18pm

Rassy wrote:When I decided to mount a BBS02 on the boom of a tadpole trike I discovered the BBS02 had drain holes built into the bottom of the controller cavity. When the BBS02 is rotated to an upper position, this cavity could collect moisture. In my case I decided to keep the BBS02 down, which required a small torque arm. What are you doing to eliminate this as a potential problem?
I heard the newer BBS02's are waterproofed differently (things have changed since this thread was new). Does anyone know if that is the case, so mounting the BBS02 upside down is possibly no longer an issue?

Lurkin   100 kW

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Re: New BBS powered cruisers

Post by Lurkin » Sep 12 2016 8:55pm

tomjasz wrote:
Lurkin wrote:Using a downtube that has a flat inside would make for better installation of dolphin style 18650 packs as the bottom of the mount is also usually flat and poorly supported by round tube frames. They also typically sold with BBS... Could consider the same with the seatpost area... certainly would make for an easy, stable install.
I think his chosen pack fits better than the Dolphin cases used by others. That and it's a forward thinking design.
Dolphin style packs are awesome for getting a retro fit kit to fit something that wasn't designed to take it. It just doesn't really make sense to plan to use these if the frame is being designed from scratch, at least, not in the form they were designed to be used in.

Planning to use bidon mounts for batteries mounts is not a great plan, its just convenient for DIYers. It becomes most obvious when you stress the top of the battery laterally in the frame. It pulls the mounts to the point they are loose or pull out entirely. Pulling out entirely is actually the better scenario - loose bidon cage mounts can stress the frame over time and crack it - which I've done before, resulting in a frame warranty claim (was using larger water bottles, but same scenario). Both mounts were loose when I took the battery mount off the frame (after ~10k kms) and in danger of causing a split from the bidon mount hole in the frame, laterally.

The better option is to use a pack bottom designed to fit the frame - i.e. a rubber or similar adapter between frame and battery mount. Ideally this would have some given, so during a lateral pressure (i.e. crash) the battery has somewhere to 'bend' or swivel outside the frame, rather than being solid and damaging the battery and/or the mounts, as it does with Dolphin batteries. Given the Dolphin style batteries often overhang the width of the frame, the likelihood of damage during an accident is high.

I've solved this issue by refraining from using the bidon cage mounts, drilling out mount holes in the metal part of the battery mount and applying hose clamps with both folded inner tube and foam between the mount and frame. This mount design allows the battery to move slightly under pressure and will swivel around the frame should it face impact during a crash.

After all, the last thing you need after experiencing a monster crash is a lithium fire between your legs.... Ideally you want to have a bike that 'looks after itself' to a certain extent. This is beneficial for both parties - less warranty claims for the supplier, back on bike faster for the user 8)

The ultimate answer is to build a custom battery mount as part of the frame, so the battery clips directly to it..... and a custom battery with the width < frame width... Food for thought anyway.

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tomjasz   10 GW

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Re: New BBS powered cruisers

Post by tomjasz » Sep 13 2016 10:33am

The Reention cases, "Dolphin", are the most durable in my experience. I use rubber mounts under mine and have had zero problems on 4 bikes using them. I bought bare cases to check out. one each Reention Dolphin and Hailong "Shark". The Shark case came with nice rubber mounts between the frames. The same day I dropped a Dolphin from my work rack, about 3/4M and chipped the edge, but no damage otherwise. While helping out in CS last spring I had the opportunity to read thousands of emails and never read about a Dolphin case fail, but saw Shark cases come up damaged in shipment. Not as many as the bottle cases but significant numbers compared to the Reention case.

Once I closely examined the two empty cases side by side the quality difference is noticeable. FWIW. I also prefer a case with a on/off switch, and find the 5V USB port occasionally useful.

I think it's the case least likely to be damaged in a crash.
Thanks Justin_le we're here thanks to you. All the best to the mods for their tireless work keeping it on an even keel.

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