Nucular electronics - complete kit for ev! [beta]

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bzhwindtalker   1 MW

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Re: Nucular electronics - complete kit for ev! [beta]

Post by bzhwindtalker » Oct 03 2018 10:22am

Got a sample from Vasiliy in Paris Mondial tech, the display features are impressive.
We can't wait to test them on our bikes.
Adam

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Re: Nucular electronics - complete kit for ev! [beta]

Post by maitilupas » Oct 03 2018 3:26pm

perfect, let us know how it works!

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Re: Nucular electronics - complete kit for ev! [beta]

Post by ElectricGod » Oct 05 2018 1:55pm

bzhwindtalker wrote:
Oct 03 2018 10:22am
Got a sample from Vasiliy in Paris Mondial tech, the display features are impressive.
We can't wait to test them on our bikes.
Adam
Post pictures of what you got please!!!
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Re: Nucular electronics - complete kit for ev! [beta]

Post by csc » Oct 06 2018 9:28am

2wd setup installed !
2wd in the box.jpg
It would have been plug and play if I had known a few tricks

1 - don't plug the brake pin on display for the first auto setup. Just throttle

2 - In auto setup / motor, click "en" : motor should spin

3 - In auto setup / halls, click en : motor will spin in both directions several times

4 - complete the auto setup (brk, thr etc)

A few wires are too long but Ican't wait for a real 50 km trip

edit : did not make 50 km trip but the few first hundred meters are very clear : this is much more powerful than a mini e, and quite simple to setup if you know what a phase, a hall, a throttle are. Then it's very interestingly complicated if you're looking for fine tuning.

The top impressive feature is the multi contoller mode : hyper easy and zero hassle so far

Very very promising

More details to come

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Re: Nucular electronics - complete kit for ev! [beta]

Post by ElectricGod » Oct 08 2018 10:05am

csc wrote:
Oct 06 2018 9:28am
Nice that set up is easy to do. Any chance that you will open one up and take pictures of both sides of the board?
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Re: Nucular electronics - complete kit for ev! [beta]

Post by Altair » Oct 08 2018 12:30pm

ElectricGod wrote:
Oct 08 2018 10:05am
Any chance that you will open one up and take pictures of both sides of the board?
Why don't you just ask for the schematic, while you're at it... :evil:
Don't you have any respect for the work of others?

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Re: Nucular electronics - complete kit for ev! [beta]

Post by brumbrum » Oct 08 2018 3:22pm

bzhwindtalker wrote:
Oct 03 2018 10:22am
Got a sample from Vasiliy in Paris Mondial tech, the display features are impressive.
We can't wait to test them on our bikes.
Adam

fingers crossed the controller works with the lmx motors. Would be nice to have a sinewave option with built in display etc
My NYX and cromotor build
viewtopic.php?f=6&t=74615
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Re: Nucular electronics - complete kit for ev! [beta]

Post by VasiliSk » Oct 08 2018 5:49pm

I have made detection for lmx motor, sound was good, probably should work

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Re: Nucular electronics - complete kit for ev! [beta]

Post by ElectricGod » Oct 08 2018 7:58pm

Altair wrote:
Oct 08 2018 12:30pm
ElectricGod wrote:
Oct 08 2018 10:05am
Any chance that you will open one up and take pictures of both sides of the board?
Why don't you just ask for the schematic, while you're at it... :evil:
Don't you have any respect for the work of others?
I do! And that's exactly why I want to see the innards. Quality speaks for itself...and so does garbage. I'm not imputing anything here, but one look at the board speaks volumes about the quality of the controller. So yes...absolutely...I want to see the controller inside and out. How is that disrespectful?

And why not ask for the schematic? The VESC and VESC 6 are open source and yet make Vedder a nice chunk of money. In fact his designs get reused a good bit thanks to being open source. How is this a bad thing for Vasilly? I'd love it if he opened up his products. It makes what he is doing better. What's more, there's lots of people that will buy his controllers open source or not. I bet he doesn't lose a single sale from publishing everything.
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Re: Nucular electronics - complete kit for ev! [beta]

Post by brumbrum » Oct 09 2018 1:33am

VasiliSk wrote:
Oct 08 2018 5:49pm
I have made detection for lmx motor, sound was good, probably should work
Excellent news. I was tempted to send you my lmx motor for trialing. Looks like there is no need. :D

If you can team up a bms with 12fet controller this is going on my shopping list.
My NYX and cromotor build
viewtopic.php?f=6&t=74615
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Re: Nucular electronics - complete kit for ev! [beta]

Post by VasiliSk » Oct 09 2018 1:34am

ElectricGod This is not open source for schematic, do not publish or distribute any information about internals. China guyz are watching

BMS is WIP

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Re: Nucular electronics - complete kit for ev! [beta]

Post by madin88 » Oct 09 2018 5:51am

VasiliSk wrote:
Oct 09 2018 1:34am
do not publish or distribute any information about internals. China guyz are watching
It might be useful to bind buyers to secrecy (you could add this condition to the terms of purchase), but on the other hand i think that sooner or later someone will take pics of the internals and share them... hmm, or what if a china company tries to buy one of your products directly? I think you cannot avoid..

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Re: Nucular electronics - complete kit for ev! [beta]

Post by VasiliSk » Oct 09 2018 6:27am

Well, later is okay, i just need to have some extra time

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Re: Nucular electronics - complete kit for ev! [beta]

Post by icherouveim » Oct 09 2018 6:35am

Even if they copy it, it will never be the same. The original will be always the Russian.

Also the copy version will lack of software development & updates. A good idea is to add a good quality sticker that says warranty avoid if removed.

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Stanislavchik   1 mW

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Re: Nucular electronics - complete kit for ev! [beta]

Post by Stanislavchik » Oct 09 2018 6:51am

It isn't good idea, because body modding for this subject is growing and china guys also have a lot of coders :)

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Re: Nucular electronics - complete kit for ev! [beta]

Post by csc » Oct 09 2018 10:19am

Ok so I won't post pictures, but I'll tell you that I'm super impressed by the power / size ratio. In fact my feeling is that this 12f is easily comparable to a max e in terms of energy transferrred to the wheels : efficiency probaly much higher. So far motors heat less.

Programming a little more before a first video

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Re: Nucular electronics - complete kit for ev! [beta]

Post by brumbrum » Oct 09 2018 10:31am

csc wrote:
Oct 09 2018 10:19am
Ok so I won't post pictures, but I'll tell you that I'm super impressed by the power / size ratio. In fact my feeling is that this 12f is easily comparable to a max e in terms of energy transferrred to the wheels : efficiency probaly much higher. So far motors heat less.

Programming a little more before a first video
Thanks, keep us posted!
My NYX and cromotor build
viewtopic.php?f=6&t=74615
My LMX 161 dirt bike build
viewtopic.php?f=6&t=94074

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ElectricGod   10 MW

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Re: Nucular electronics - complete kit for ev! [beta]

Post by ElectricGod » Oct 09 2018 11:06am

China is always going to copy anything. I work developing another EV related product. The protection is in the software and firmware for that product. Let China duplicate the hardware. That's not overly hard...it's just electronics. And yes, if you sell your products, then it will happen that someone "out there" will buy what you sell, open it up and reverse engineer it or at least look at the internals. In that other product I work on, the firmware is difficult to get a hold of and that means the hardware is useless. AND the hardware won't even be recognized by the software without firmware being loaded on it in advance. It's pretty secure from copying in any kind of effective way.

That's where I would put my security...software and firmware. The actual controller hardware is too easy to copy. I'd be surprised if that doesn't exist on some level already. And if it doesn't, well I recommend that it gets worked on.

Voiding warranties, stickers, whatever...LOL...that won't stop anybody. It certainly wouldn't stop me. The first thing I do after getting something new is try it out. Make sure it all works and then take it apart. If that doesn't void the warranty or does...either way...I'm OK with that. I've been voiding warranties by taking stuff apart since I was a child. I wouldn't bother with something like this at all if I were Vasili. Besides, people will invariably want to do something inside the controller and then the warranty is gone...if they care.

I'm in the USA...the chances that I'll ship a controller back to Russia are minimal. The cost is too significant. To ship to me is $50. I bet return shipping will also be $50ish. IMHO, the only place an actual warranty will be relevant will be in Russia or places where shipping back to Vasilli will be inexpensive. Every place else...you bought it without a warranty. I'm OK with that as long as it got tested before shipping to me. The only way these controllers sell well is if they work well. He is NOT going to ship untested controllers! He will be making sure they leave his possession 100% working. He designed these controllers so he can make a profit and be able to make more products and more profits. That's a good thing! To sell garbage or bad product is not in his best interests and damages his reputation. AKA...I'm not the least bit worried about a warranty. His reputation is all that matters to me. That's better than any warranty. Honestly, I want him to succeed, NOT fail. AND the reason for that is simple...his success helps the EV community. Why would I want to undermine that?
VasiliSk wrote:
Oct 09 2018 6:27am
Well, later is okay, i just need to have some extra time
I'm OK with this...everybody needs to get their feet planted and I don't want to undermine your work.
Last edited by ElectricGod on Oct 09 2018 11:37am, edited 3 times in total.
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Re: Nucular electronics - complete kit for ev! [beta]

Post by icherouveim » Oct 09 2018 11:12am

csc wrote:
Oct 09 2018 10:19am
Ok so I won't post pictures, but I'll tell you that I'm super impressed by the power / size ratio. In fact my feeling is that this 12f is easily comparable to a max e in terms of energy transferrred to the wheels : efficiency probaly much higher. So far motors heat less.

Programming a little more before a first video
Great news!
Do u still have two mxus 3K or have u upgraded to qsmotors? What are the max temps of the motors?

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Re: Nucular electronics - complete kit for ev! [beta]

Post by csc » Oct 09 2018 1:27pm

Rear motor is now a qs273 4000w 4t (magnets gaps epoxied, sprayon coated, 20ml ferrofluid). Really huge acceleration and no heating. I bet on field weakening, based on the idea that the most challenging situation for an ebike is start and stop in a city, or high mountain climbing. This genearates more heat than FW on fast road according to my experience. Currently real on road max speed (at 82v) is 92 kmh, without knowing exactly what margin I have with the field weakening on the rear

Front motor is still a mxus 3k 3t, but it behaves very differently than with the max e. Much more torque, I had to reduce power to avoid burning the front tire too fast. Which makes me think I could keep it, as I was formerly thinking of a 4t for the front too

Clearly all what I thought about motor temp has to be reset. Rear saw no more than 45°c (ambient 18) (short distance under 15km) where the max e would have generated 80° at least with the rear mxus 3k 3t (rear takes the whole effort during accelerations). (would appreciate a way to check both motors' temps on the single display, currently you have to chose one motor or the other)

Can't say precisely what's the repartition of improvements between motors and controllers.

But it's a great combo !

Work in progress

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Re: Nucular electronics - complete kit for ev! [beta]

Post by bzhwindtalker » Oct 09 2018 2:28pm

For programming and tuning, we acheived as much in 30 minutes with this one as 6 months with ASI :lol:
First testing in the alps on a new eMTB prototype with torque sensor this weekend hopefully for us at LMX.
Will report here :)

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Re: Nucular electronics - complete kit for ev! [beta]

Post by larsb » Oct 09 2018 3:38pm

Which ASI was that? Thinking about buying a BAC8000. Are they that hard to program?

Sorry Vasili to clutter the thread. I anyway think your controller will have a looong waiting list, and i'm not on it yet so it doesn't make a difference :D

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Re: Nucular electronics - complete kit for ev! [beta]

Post by ElectricGod » Oct 09 2018 6:18pm

larsb wrote:
Oct 09 2018 3:38pm
Which ASI was that? Thinking about buying a BAC8000. Are they that hard to program?

Sorry Vasili to clutter the thread. I anyway think your controller will have a looong waiting list, and i'm not on it yet so it doesn't make a difference :D
I have a BAC2000...they do have some oddities to overcome. It's probably the hardest controller I've ever set up, but not insurmountable. Expect to pay ASI a fee for support...and to deal with their odd business methodologies. You would think they would want to sell controllers, but getting one pried loose from their hands can be quite painful. It took me 3 months. They have no eportal or ordering system that I know of. You contact them repeatedly until they decide they want to respond back...weird!
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Re: Nucular electronics - complete kit for ev! [beta]

Post by ElectricGod » Oct 09 2018 6:20pm

csc wrote:
Oct 09 2018 1:27pm
Rear motor is now a qs273 4000w 4t (magnets gaps epoxied, sprayon coated, 20ml ferrofluid). Really huge acceleration and no heating. I bet on field weakening, based on the idea that the most challenging situation for an ebike is start and stop in a city, or high mountain climbing. This genearates more heat than FW on fast road according to my experience. Currently real on road max speed (at 82v) is 92 kmh, without knowing exactly what margin I have with the field weakening on the rear

Front motor is still a mxus 3k 3t, but it behaves very differently than with the max e. Much more torque, I had to reduce power to avoid burning the front tire too fast. Which makes me think I could keep it, as I was formerly thinking of a 4t for the front too

Clearly all what I thought about motor temp has to be reset. Rear saw no more than 45°c (ambient 18) (short distance under 15km) where the max e would have generated 80° at least with the rear mxus 3k 3t (rear takes the whole effort during accelerations). (would appreciate a way to check both motors' temps on the single display, currently you have to chose one motor or the other)

Can't say precisely what's the repartition of improvements between motors and controllers.

But it's a great combo !

Work in progress
I wonder how much of this is better motor detection? Perhaps you were using the hall combination that works but uses more current previously and now you are not?
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Re: Nucular electronics - complete kit for ev! [beta]

Post by madin88 » Oct 09 2018 6:23pm

csc wrote:
Oct 09 2018 1:27pm
Front motor is still a mxus 3k 3t, but it behaves very differently than with the max e. Much more torque, I had to reduce power to avoid burning the front tire too fast. Which makes me think I could keep it, as I was formerly thinking of a 4t for the front too
wait, this 120/200A controller gave you more torque than max-e which can do what ... 140/350A+?
or are you talking about the difference you noticed at similar A settings?

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