60% Of Americans Unaware

(that) Electric Cars Exist:
http://gas2.org/2017/01/01/60-americans-unaware-battery-cars-exist/

It’s hard for people who read Gas2 to believe, but a recent survey of 2,500 people by Altman Vilandrie & Co. finds that 60% of Americans are totally unaware that electric cars with plugs actually exist. 80% have never driven or ridden in one. Whose fault is that? Last week, we called out the auto companies for spending next to nothing on advertising for their electric and plug-in products. The car makers have spent little if anything on charging infrastructure. Their dealers hide the cars out back and try to switch people who ask about them to a conventional car instead.

There appears to be a conspiracy of silence among manufacturers...

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Could these be the same type of surveys as the us election had or brexit

I would really love electric to take off but I know so many petrol heads that love the throb of an ice engine, The car is a extension of themselves and most simply can not express themselves in the sameway with electric, Its took just over a century to get where we are with combustion so a overnight change is unrealistic Im sure oil will be burned for a few decades yet not because people are ignorant but because in some harsh situations there's no alternative.
But the day battery innovation and an ideal charging situation comes along it will be like the day the steam trains were wiped out a technology becomes mature like diesel did and then it took over everywhere to be the most dominant fuel in the world today.

Hehe... Steam engines... Powered by coal/fossil fuel? There was a time when folks were excited about electric traction:

Haha I love the art, I watched back to the future 3 earlier funny enough everyone loves the delorean i say doc browns steam train at the end is the toy to have, As he time travels into the credits its a whooping away looking evil sparking off like a boss, We must remeber for all the embracers in electrics over time there has also been people who run scared from the magic pixxys screaming witch craft too, so its always been strange funny times with us humans.

Unaware? (GASP!) AMERICANS unaware?

Ianhill said:

Could these be the same type of surveys as the us election had or brexit

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If only, sir, if only.

But I don't think its right they don't know it exists, I think they're only aware of the old unreliable short range experiments.

You get the petrol heads all wrong: We just love cars. If Teslas were cheap they'd sell a lot of them. Its just that those pesky problems like charging and range anxiety have to be 100% resolved before most people will touch them. As those issues diminish people will find them around the neighborhood and go pet rock over it.

I have a hard enough time explaining to the unwashed masses what my plug in Prius is about, and how it differs from a regular Prius,I can imagine a pure electric being totally off the radar of most.

Even with my SB Cruiser trike, I tell people I just plug it in to charge it up, and a number still ask where the fuel goes, even when I repeatedly explain it's all electric and just plugs in to charge the batteries.

Most do understand, or at least accept it, but there are some that just can't comprehend it, even when I compare it to their phone or whatever--they often say "but that thing has a motor" (as if that made some difference).

There's more than a few issues here that have created the current environment of present technology. And before "electric vehicles" can be generally accepted, they'll have to meet some important consumer criteria!!! They'll have to be at an acceptable cost, reasonably dependable with little attention or maintenance, or at least reasonably serviceably at an affordable expense. And they'll need a reasonably expected life-time of use.

The "high-cost relative to lifetime expectancy" may likely be the biggest issue to overcome. Many electro-mechanical appliances and equipment have generally established a long serviceable life. But today, most anything electronic in nature, has more and more become viewed as having a short usable lifetime expectancy, and many others are now considered disposable!!! Vehicles have always been plagued by electrical/electronic issues that have affected the entire vehicle, it's serviceability, general dependability, and cost!!! As these systems improved and proven themselves over time, they slowly became more and more accepted as "standard". Early "hybrids" left a bad taste among many, as the "Electrical" part was far less dependable than the tiny engine. But the entire system depended on the fully functional electrical part,.... they were "unserviceable", expensive, short-lived, and often undependable.

Batteries are a significant and costly part of EVs!!! AND,.... EVERYONE has come to expect short lifetimes from most all common batteries. Those "hybrids" previously mentioned??? The cost of replacing a failed battery bank often exceeded the vehicles market value in jus a few short years!!!! Rather than several affordable small repairs, maintenance, and replacements over a specific time period,... EVs and hybrids present the eventual, unaffordable, and very costly repair/replacement over the same time period!!!!

DRMousseau said:

There's more than a few issues here that have created the current environment of present technology. And before "electric vehicles" can be generally accepted, they'll have to meet some important consumer criteria!!! They'll have to be at an acceptable cost, reasonably dependable with little attention or maintenance, or at least reasonably serviceably at an affordable expense. And they'll need a reasonably expected life-time of use.

The "high-cost relative to lifetime expectancy" may likely be the biggest issue to overcome. Many electro-mechanical appliances and equipment have generally established a long serviceable life. But today, most anything electronic in nature, has more and more become viewed as having a short usable lifetime expectancy, and many others are now considered disposable!!! Vehicles have always been plagued by electrical/electronic issues that have affected the entire vehicle, it's serviceability, general dependability, and cost!!! As these systems improved and proven themselves over time, they slowly became more and more accepted as "standard". Early "hybrids" left a bad taste among many, as the "Electrical" part was far less dependable than the tiny engine. But the entire system depended on the fully functional electrical part,.... they were "unserviceable", expensive, short-lived, and often undependable.

Batteries are a significant and costly part of EVs!!! AND,.... EVERYONE has come to expect short lifetimes from most all common batteries. Those "hybrids" previously mentioned??? The cost of replacing a failed battery bank often exceeded the vehicles market value in jus a few short years!!!! Rather than several affordable small repairs, maintenance, and replacements over a specific time period,... EVs and hybrids present the eventual, unaffordable, and very costly repair/replacement over the same time period!!!!

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Define "often"!!!

Often - frequently, more than typically desired or typically expected.
ex.,... "Modern cell phone batteries often blow up or burst into flames unexpectedly." (more than expected)
"Folks often owe more on their financed car or truck, than current market values."(more than desired)

Hypothetical Ex.,... For Sale, 1yr old e-bike used only 4months for one season. No longer under warranty. Excellent like new condition, but does not work. Original cost-$1200. Best offer.

What would YOU pay for purchase of such????
How much would be acceptable to pay for repairs if it was yours???
What would expect to pay for repairs???
Would you purchase another??? Would you recommend such a purchase to others???
Would your answer differ if you were a typical consumer,.... with far less knowledge, understanding, or skills than you likely have????

Many Americans likely ARE unaware, of the current market availability of Electric Cars. More are probably unaware of the availability of e-bikes!!! And I'd bet that FAR more are aware that "hover boards" are, or rather "were" readily available. I'd love to see the specific demographics of those asked, regarding any of these. It surly shed a bit more light on WHY folks are so unaware.

Main battery failure is of little concern to me in my Plug in Prius. I spend zero time worrying about it. Anti hybrid people exaggerate the issue, not one felllow Prius driver I know worries about it either. Meanwhile my last fill up was 57+ mpg, in winter driving conditions no less. IF the traction battery would take a crap, I'd replace it, or move on. I'd rather spend more on a hybrid, that uses less gas, then less overall/ per mile on a 35 mpg car.

The Prius is also consistently rated in the top ten of the most reliable cars on the road, even though the battery goes out at 185K? Don't think so, lots of them out there 300K +, 180K is just broken in for a Toyota!

But any battery failure is a huge concern of oh so many people. Well over 60% of Americans. And they're not aware that there's anyone like you who doesn't concern themselves with it. There is the direction of the thinking on electrics.

Battery Life IS a pretty important concern of most folks, as is repair and/or replacement costs. While the knowledge and experience of most folks is rather limited to those vehicle batteries of long established norms and familiarity, the new technologies are still hard to accept and relate to. Battery lifetime jus doesn't compare or match the lifetime expected of the product it powers. Unlike most cell phones today, vehicles are still not considered economically "disposable"! While most replaced batteries in early cell phones, maybe several times,... today, most are likely to replace the whole phone when the battery has reached it's lifetime expectancy.

Several years ago, with a tight budget and a busy teenage god-daughter in need of some EXTREAMLY dependable transportation, a typical cheap used clunker jus wasn't going to be acceptable. I was offered an '03 Honda Civic Hybrid at no cost due to it's history of being unreliable for a new young mother with infant. "Excellent condition, but something is bad with the electrical system, sometimes it wouldn't start or would shut down while on the road. We tried to sell as is, but no one would touch it for any price. After a year in the yard, we either have to pay and have it hauled out, or give it away somewhere. Thought you might be able to make it work in some way for your god-daughter, or sell it for scrap toward something more suitable."

While professionally semi-retired to the "back-yard", I AM an excellent mechanic with a lifetime of experience, skills and knowledge with strong backgrounds in various tech systems. I reluctantly accepted it as a challenging learning experience to satisfy my personal thirst to know more, and with the hopes that somehow, a benefit would be seen in some way. I certainly could not afford the anticipated $2000-$4000 repair estimates the previous owners and potential buyers had rejected. Long story shortened,... in jus few gruesome weeks, I was driving an unusual and quirky little car that I found fascinating!!! The investment of hours in reading and research, troubleshooting, inspection and testing of the various new unfamiliar hi-tech systems had paid off. Real costs were limited to nothing more than a new 12V battery, after it was determined that an unusual and irregular cell failure was the major fault, with current system technologies being VERY critical of battery voltages and current needs. But in short time, it proved to be extremely reliable, dependable, and actually a bit too sporty for a young teen driver!! But even after eventually being totaled out in a roll-over accident, it was brought back to life for a second time, with the only major cost being a windshield replacement. It was finally retired and given to another in need, and while my god-daughter misses the 45mpg and the reliable dependability most, the young now 22yr old driver, loves the performance of other vehicles readily available. Would she consider another hybrid or electric??? SURE,... if it was reasonably affordable for a struggling college student!!!

And me??? Well, there's no way I like the 6mpg from the 460ci Ford power plant in "my rolling upstairs apartment" (I live full-time, year-around in a 34' motorhome),... but I luv my 52V lithium powered 1500w Leaf motored 29" beach cruiser!!!! AWESOMELY dependable, with wonderful performance and much less maintenance care, than most regular bicycles!!!! As much fun and enjoyable as the many various motorcycles I've owned,... including an original '49 hand-shifted Harley, and other modified, classic, custom, and performance rides.

I'd guess that the majority of ebike posters here live in a reasonably large city. I am in rural Kansas, and I rarely see bicycles, much less ebikes.

If you were given a budget, and then put in charge of advertising for a new model of electric car, where would you spend the majority of that budget?

Until market penetration reached a much more widespread demographic, I would only advertise in cities that had a dealer who was set up to perform any required maintenance for that model.

When I asked about buying a VW diesel (years ago), I was told I would have to buy it and get it repaired and serviced from a dealer in the next state over, even though there was a VW dealer nearby.

Dauntless said:

But any battery failure is a huge concern of oh so many people. Well over 60% of Americans. And they're not aware that there's anyone like you who doesn't concern themselves with it. There is the direction of the thinking on electrics.

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I don't concern myself with it, anymore then I would worry about a conventional powered car blowing the engine. You buy the car, you take your chances, isn't that how it works for ANY vehicle? Maybe I've been spending too much time on the Prius forums, but they have a HUGE loyal following. Maybe also, since I've been such a Toyota fan for so many years (due to the great reliability and economy I've experienced with the brand) I simply expect the Prius to be similar, while getting great MPG. And extensive reading on the subject has given me "nothing to be concerned about." I worry more about black ice and deer running out in front of me!

I have far less concern of batteries and many newer technologies than most. And I absolutely NO concern of extended warranties either!!! But I'm also more informed, knowledgeable and experienced than most folks in such matters too. Many were once reluctant to accept front-wheel drive or ABS systems,... today, many may have never experienced anything else, and those reluctant few have now accepted the new environments of evolving technology. But the new environments have also brought new uncertainties as well as unique indifferences and concerns,.... such as "check engine" and other information interfaces. For years, one would NEVER start an engine without first checking the oil level,... wouldn't wanna blow an engine thru ones own fault of neglect!!! Today,... I know far to many who NEVER check their oil level, with no concern what so ever, and ritually have it changed every 2500mi!!!! Various four-wheel drive systems have become so common that MANY have no concerns for even black-ice any more,.... whoops!

I've always had a greater concern for clean, dry, and secure electrical connections between increasingly complicated and integrated system components! And IMO, they've MUCH improved over the recent decade!!! What good is a lifetime L.E.D. if the system connections were still prone to the same problems as earlier incandescent technology, and made worse with added necessary components?!? I have always loved the simple technologies of the past that could be easily serviced and maintained with little more than a screwdriver, pair of pliers and an adjustable wrench. Todays technology, requires a million dollar investment jus to identify a simple loose or dirty connection!!!

Change is always filled with emotion. Electric brakes are nothing new,... would you accept them in your new electric car???

The average person doesn't know electric cars exist, because the average person sees very few of them. Imagine the look the general public gave when the first thousands of Model T's rolled out! This is the realm of marketing experts for the future. I do believe as there are more and more EVS and PHEV's there will be mass adoption. Perhaps 20 years max, but possibly sooner. :?

My Mother remembers her Grandfather in Canada having an electric car, and that would've been in the 50s or 6os. Guess they're just not noticeable or something.

Spoton, "alpharalpha".

In the daze B4 Canada legalized electrics I was "scooting" all over town ("big" city, Toronto) on a "little" two-wheeled kick scooter... the Curry-built Phat Bike thingee, that had an "extra kick" via a chain-driven motorized rear wheel and two "tiny" 12V 10Ah SLA batts. I was kicking for warmth and exercise, but also learning to use tailwinds and gravity ("down" hills), seeing stops/slow-downs coming so coasting... etc.

My "rules" were 1) not to get smacked by other vehicles and 2) not to bother anybuddy else.

Went to a trike lately (with a front hub) but basically same rules applied. On one long/day trip through the city parks (sign says "NO electrics") if was sorta natural for me to do a bit of faux pedaling any time others were in sight.

One theory? To introduce "new" tech make it look like "old" tech. :wink:

Stealth is key.

I am a "rev" head (aka petrol head, AKA gear head). I love acceleration and the feel of testing a car at it's limits.

I have found that my electric car can give the best of both worlds, less impact on the environment while still providing me with my buzz.

But I also like the sound of a nicely tuned ICE. I personally own a couple of Datsun Z cars and love them to bits.

Alternate powered cars will not mean the death of ICE. They will prolong their life. But the life of ICE cars will be transformed. Much like steam was transformed into a passion for enthusiasts.
They will nolonger be the only option or transport. They will fit into a niche. They will be special interest vehicles or vehicles for specific purposes that can't be satisfied with alternate powered vehicles.

Some race cars, Hot rods, long distance travel, historic vehicles are just a few niches that I think will remain for ICE. But I think these will soon represent an extremely minor percentage of the overall automotive population. This will mean the impacts on the environment will be reduced and the availability of fossel fuels prolonged. I'm not saying alternate powered vehicles will never break into those niches. I am just saying some of the vehicles in these niches hold special places in our hearts even if the impact is in all reality is in our lungs and ears.

I think the overall outlook for us rev heads is positive as there will be a time when we no longer need to feel guilty about having/driving an ICE.

One of the hardest for us "rev heads" to accept EVs in, is Drag racing, but it is probably the one competition where Electric can at least be competitive .
Drag cars are so much more than just power and performance, there is the sound, smell, spectical of both special vehicles and old familiar car shapes , doing incredible things on the track.
Circuit racing, rallying, and these off road "Raids" will have to wait for much better batterys before they can even become near competitive.
Look at F E, it is so contrived and restricted that it is dull.

That boggles my mind if true. Even in the always behind Midwest, I regularly see 1 or 2 Tesla Model S’s a day driving around. Not to mention essentially everyone these days owns at least some type of lithium ion rechargeable electronic device be it a smartphone, tablet, or laptop. It would seem to be an obvious connection to realize the same technology can be used to power a vehicle.

If the price of crude ever gets back up to 100 USD/barrel, EV will sell themselves. No marketing necessary. Until then, most Americans won't care about EVs. Although, a simple test-drive is about all it takes to get people on board. Something about EVs (be it bikes, cars, whatever) just "feels" right. Everyone who rode my e-Bike loved it. People love their electric cars. If the cost of fuel goes back up, the industry will really take off.

All of the above are great observations. Luke LFP said that ice engines will be relics, still loved and cherished, but none the less only relics. Not quoted exactly, but pretty much what he said.