OK, a little gas every now and then, when no one is watching

Electric cars, trucks, ATVs, NEVs - things bigger than a motorcycle.
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OK, a little gas every now and then, when no one is watching

Post by craneplaneguy » Jul 31, 2017 1:03 pm

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This pic was sent to me by a friend, I have no idea of the context, but it speaks volumes to this hybrid driver. Gas is pretty cool stuff when you absolutely positively need to get there.

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Re: OK, a little gas every now and then, when no one is watc

Post by Izits » Aug 15, 2017 9:09 am

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This reminds me of an article at Treehugger.com talking about how the workers at the Tesla Gigafactory collectively drive 3000 gas powered cars 23 miles to and from Reno every day.

https://www.treehugger.com/cars/whats-c ... ttery.html

Trying to save the world by reducing your carbon footprint is like trying to end world hunger by taking home a starving African child.
Last edited by Izits on Aug 16, 2017 1:46 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: OK, a little gas every now and then, when no one is watc

Post by Dauntless » Aug 15, 2017 9:46 pm

Izits wrote:Trying to save the world by reducing your carbon footprint is like trying to end world hunger by taking home a starving African child.
Meanwhile, if you give a starving African child a fish, you fed him for a day, teach him to fish and you feed him until we over fish the sea life into extinction.
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Re: OK, a little gas every now and then, when no one is watc

Post by Izits » Aug 22, 2017 8:54 pm

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This is from a video where they teach electric car owners to carry a gasoline engine with them. 30 minutes of generator time gives you 4 miles of driving. Now, if they could just strap a few of those to the roof and leave them running while they drive they could have an electric car limited only by the size of the petrol tank. Marvelous.
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Re: OK, a little gas every now and then, when no one is watc

Post by amberwolf » Aug 22, 2017 8:58 pm

Or they could even make a compartment in front between the wheels just to hold one. ;)

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Re: OK, a little gas every now and then, when no one is watc

Post by Hillhater » Aug 23, 2017 7:10 am

Even better..just buy the integrated " Range Extender" generator pack that BMW sell with that i3 ! :roll:
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Re: OK, a little gas every now and then, when no one is watc

Post by spinningmagnets » Aug 23, 2017 7:35 am

The T-Zero played a vital role in the original concept of the Tesla Roadster. During range testing of various batteries, they realized it would simplify things if they added a trailer with a gen-set. Google "T-Zero long ranger". This is one area where a diesel that is capable of running on raw vegetable oil (or of course, also "bio-diesel") would shine. When used in a series-hybrid configuration, the engine runs at a constant RPM, so the NOx issue (that was part of the VW diesel scandal) is no longer an issue.

A full-time series hybrid is not what I am talking about, What I am referring to is a back-up engine for longer trips. Somewhat like the Chevy Volt. My son has one, and he drives 16 miles daily round-trip to work in electric-only mode. His family purposefully uses the Volt on their longer trips about once a month, to make sure the small gasoline engine gets run a little.

This isn't a swipe at "electric only" vehicles, I think we need both...

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Re: OK, a little gas every now and then, when no one is watc

Post by spinningmagnets » Aug 23, 2017 7:53 am

This reminds me of an article at Treehugger.com talking about how the workers at the Tesla Gigafactory collectively drive 3000 gas powered cars 23 miles to and from Reno every day
Some of the pictures shown of the parking lot showed economy cars, that were likely purchased used. I was young once and when I got a job that was quite a drive, I bought economy cars with lots of miles for about $1500, in order to save on gas. This kind of criticism is just nit-picking, and silly.

I recall seeing an article that showed how most of the customer phone-support at the credit-card companies didn't qualify for a credit card. My reaction is..."so?". They hire people who apply to work there, and customer phone support is a low-wage industry. Demanding that any company allow employees to be able to have the product they sell is like telling Mercedes that the janitor at the MB factory needs to be paid enough to afford a Mercedes.

I think it would be cool for Tesla to build a single-adult housing facility nearby (within bicycling distance), but...you just know that married employees would then demand equal "affordable" housing for their families. Then almost immediately after any family housing is built and occupied, there would be protests that the housing does not meet some "quality of life" standard which the employees now demand (children need parks, pools, and trees, not concrete gulags). And of course, when there is housing for families, you need a nearby gas stations, grocery store, and a K-12 school, because it is unreasonable to bus children 45 minutes each way to get to a decent school, amirite?

I think the best thing that Tesla could do, is to use series-hybrid diesel-electric busses to vanpool employees from a car-park in the nearby cities to the factory. I paid to be on a vanpool once and it cost about half of my gasoline bill when using a 4-cylinder.

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Re: OK, a little gas every now and then, when no one is watc

Post by spinningmagnets » Aug 23, 2017 8:29 am

Hey...what ever happened to those one-square-meter solar-PV panels that were going to be built into the roof of every electric car?

That way, when you're stranded in an EV with a dead battery, you can charge your laptop and still be able to order stuff to be delivered with a drone by Amazon? Especially if you test EV's for the TV show "Top Gear"?

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Re: OK, a little gas every now and then, when no one is watc

Post by wineboyrider » Aug 23, 2017 9:41 am

Tesla should build a electric bicycle path and pay employees to ride to work.:)
Also, a park and ride is surely in the future, because this Gigaplant is definitely not even built out yet. An electric proterra bus would be awesome.
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Re: OK, a little gas every now and then, when no one is watc

Post by spinningmagnets » Aug 23, 2017 12:06 pm

The induction road that charges electric vehicles while you are driving on it did not live up to expectations, but...I like the idea of a common voltage ebike system, where the place you park the ebikes charges the batteries. Maybe deploying the kickstand also lowers a plate for the pick-up coil?

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Re: OK, a little gas every now and then, when no one is watc

Post by Dauntless » Aug 23, 2017 11:12 pm

https://www.rqriley.com/t-car.html

So the big promise of the 'Mechanic Ilustrated' build of the 70's was the lead acid getting you over 60 miles then running the generator while you drive would add more than 30. People get so---Optimistic.

As with expecting Elon to pay for everything as he builds Utopia.
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Re: OK, a little gas every now and then, when no one is watc

Post by Izits » Aug 25, 2017 12:28 pm

spinningmagnets wrote:Some of the pictures shown of the parking lot showed economy cars, that were likely purchased used. I was young once and when I got a job that was quite a drive, I bought economy cars with lots of miles for about $1500, in order to save on gas. This kind of criticism is just nit-picking, and silly.
I can't understand what you're saying at all. It seems like you're saying that because many of the cars have lots of miles on them, or because some of them might be inexpensive cars, that negates the amount of pollution they create or the irony of the situation? How does that make the criticism silly? If anything, having lots of miles on them makes them pollute more, not less.

You aren't saying the 3000 cars don't drive the 23 miles back and forth every day. Are you saying the pollution they create is irrelevant? Honestly, I can't figure out what your point is.
The only enemy of the electric bicycle community is the government. Think about it. Who bans or restricts your use of electric bikes, other than the government? Smaller Government = More Freedom.

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Re: OK, a little gas every now and then, when no one is watc

Post by speedmd » Aug 25, 2017 12:38 pm

wineboyrider wrote:Tesla should build a electric bicycle path and pay employees to ride to work.:)
Also, a park and ride is surely in the future, because this Gigaplant is definitely not even built out yet. An electric proterra bus would be awesome.
Or a nice level underground "tube" where the air can be drawn the direction of travel and not need much of any separate propulsion. 8)

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Re: OK, a little gas every now and then, when no one is watc

Post by The fingers » Aug 25, 2017 3:23 pm

I would like to coast downhill on a bike in a tube with a tailwind all day long. :mrgreen:
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Re: OK, a little gas every now and then, when no one is watc

Post by wineboyrider » Aug 27, 2017 11:23 am

Izits wrote:
spinningmagnets wrote:Some of the pictures shown of the parking lot showed economy cars, that were likely purchased used. I was young once and when I got a job that was quite a drive, I bought economy cars with lots of miles for about $1500, in order to save on gas. This kind of criticism is just nit-picking, and silly.
I can't understand what you're saying at all. It seems like you're saying that because many of the cars have lots of miles on them, or because some of them might be inexpensive cars, that negates the amount of pollution they create or the irony of the situation? How does that make the criticism silly? If anything, having lots of miles on them makes them pollute more, not less.

You aren't saying the 3000 cars don't drive the 23 miles back and forth every day. Are you saying the pollution they create is irrelevant? Honestly, I can't figure out what your point is.
Carpools, self driving cars, uber, buses and bicycles all drive the amount of miles driven down overall. With Tesla's culture I eventually see a logical answer to this current dilemma.
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Re: OK, a little gas every now and then, when no one is watc

Post by spinningmagnets » Aug 27, 2017 1:03 pm

I can't understand what you're saying at all
It seems like no matter what Tesla does, they will be criticized for some facet of their efforts. The article seems to be saying that... "sure Tesla makes electric cars, but...their employees still drive to the Tesla factory in cars that burn gasoline".

My response is..."so?"

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Re: OK, a little gas every now and then, when no one is watc

Post by markz » Aug 28, 2017 2:57 am

If I were to take a test drive, which of the electric vehicles is the best?
I definitely wont be buying, but I've done test drives before just for shits n giggles.

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Re: OK, a little gas every now and then, when no one is watc

Post by Hillhater » Aug 28, 2017 4:44 pm

markz wrote:If I were to take a test drive, which of the electric vehicles is the best?
I definitely wont be buying, but I've done test drives before just for shits n giggles.
If you can find one to try,..i would suggest a Sinclair C5 :wink:
It will certainly give you the shits and make you larf .! :lol:

Then go do a comparison with a Tesla S, P100D.
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Re: OK, a little gas every now and then, when no one is watc

Post by markz » Aug 28, 2017 5:22 pm

The Tesla stealership is in a shopping mall, not typical by any means. They must have test drive vehicles parked somewhere in the mall parking lot.

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Re: OK, a little gas every now and then, when no one is watc

Post by spinningmagnets » Aug 28, 2017 6:25 pm

If I were to take a test drive, which of the electric vehicles is the best?
The early Nissan Leafs (Leaves?) from cold country are fine, but...in places with very hot summers (Phoenix, Saudi Arabia, etc) The batteries suffered from a weak pack cooling system.

I remain a fan of every model Tesla has produced so far. I didn't want to like the Chevy Volt, but...my son bought a used one and so I did some research on them (to help avoid common pitfalls) and I came away impressed.

The Fiat e500 is very hard to find outside of California, and its even hard to find inside California, but...I have also read that the performance is very good.

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Re: OK, a little gas every now and then, when no one is watc

Post by craneplaneguy » Aug 30, 2017 5:02 pm

During these warm summer months, I am getting up to 70 mpg with the Prius Plug in. I almost ran out of gas the other day, as after you go several weeks without getting gas, you tend to forget about it. That's 70 as measured at the pump, MUCH more when I do my usual 13 mile commute to my crane yard, usually several hundred mpg! That is with the 1200' descent from my place, with a fully charged battery, and keeping it under 60 mph. Best was 761 mpg, I can't do better as no matter what the ICE starts at some point, just to warm itself up in case it is needed. This is a bit frustrating when I see 9 miles or whatever left on the e only range meter, but makes sense if you're merging on a freeway I guess. The freeway ICE usage is what drags the mileage down, but never below 50 MPG.

I just bought a little Yamaha 1000 watt generator (lighter and quieter then the Honda, by just a bit) to run a AC unit for the cab of my crane (after a day spent in 104 degree temps, screw that) and have yet to secure it to my Travoy trailer and hook it up behind my BBSHD ebike.....but it has occurred to me. Before I do that, I will take all my batteries from my various rides, 46 AH worth, @ 52 volts, and get on the fat bike and ride, just because I can.

Here is where I want to do this: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gravelly_Range An easy dirt road ride, but the high altitude would decrease my range and power.... oh wait a minute, that's right, electric motors aren't effected by density altitude, cool! I was thinking of the airplane, I've low flown this area many times, like less then 50' above the road, but still want to put rubber on the ground and ride it. I'll drive the Prius up there and charge my bike batteries while driving, then camp out that night with heat or AC in the Prius, it makes a great camper and mine is rigged to sleep in, fuel usage for overnight climate control is minuscule, thanks to the big traction battery and the ICE, when it does wake up to recharge it, running at optimum efficiency.

The only reason I have not done so yet is I get a great ride, "enough", on just my usual 11.5 AH battery, I guess I need to quite pedaling so much.

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Re: OK, a little gas every now and then, when no one is watc

Post by Izits » Sep 02, 2017 9:16 am

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This one is a Nissan ENV200. The owner claims his electric will go 9 miles after an hour of running the gasoline engine.

Electric cars would virtually not sell at all if it weren't for government violence-backed subsidies. This tells us that electric cars really aren't viable or desirable at the present time.
Last edited by Izits on Sep 05, 2017 1:24 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: OK, a little gas every now and then, when no one is watc

Post by Punx0r » Sep 05, 2017 3:04 am

Ever notice how some people manage to get stranded at the roadside because their ICE vehicle ran out of fuel? Or their phone battery runs out because they neglected to charge it? The tech is sufficient, it's the user that is not.

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Re: OK, a little gas every now and then, when no one is watc

Post by craneplaneguy » Sep 05, 2017 9:41 am

I just wired in a spring wound timer, like a bathroom fan uses, in the shed I park the pluginPrius in. I live 1200' up a mountainside and it had been bugging me to leave home with a full charge, and then basically throwaway the regen available on the down slope. Today will be my first trial run, I want to get to the top of the downhill section reading about 7 mile E range available on the dash display, that will put me with about 10 miles at the bottom, and it's only 9 miles to my crane yard. Just fine tuning things..... don't really know why I bothered as I charge it for free anyway but I like playing around with efficiency things and I was throwing away power by leaving with a full charge.

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