Test The Brake Lever Switch help

Lightweight / Folding / Portable EVs - seats optional
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TommyCat   100 W

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Re: Test The Brake Lever Switch help

Post by TommyCat » Jun 10 2019 6:20pm

:shock:

errrrr I mean, no that always works to do a third time try on the break voltage measurement! :lol:
Great news!

Please write down all your troubleshooting check points and their results while they're still fresh in your mind... just in case something changes then you'll have readings to compare. And keep those connections tight!

It's been fun!

Best regards,
T.C.
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omadawn   10 W

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Re: Test The Brake Lever Switch help

Post by omadawn » Jun 11 2019 6:21am

Thanks.
One last thing if you can, the specs of my scooter are identical to the ones of the best selling Xiaomi M365.

Differences commonly known are: my motor is 500 W brushless (nominal) Xiaomi is 250, mine has 40 pound to 25 Xiaomi...

How can one explain the same autonomy (30km) for both, but specially same top speed(25km/h)?

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Re: Test The Brake Lever Switch help

Post by TommyCat » Jun 11 2019 7:57pm

Same battery voltages and capacity? And distance ratings using the same testing conditions? (read the fine print)
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Re: Test The Brake Lever Switch help

Post by omadawn » Jun 12 2019 4:57am

Yes, you are right, that's a 42V. Battery 18.6 Ah totally different. It's explained.

I would like to install a new simple brakes (bicycle type) on my right side to increase security on descending specially.

Can you help me on that, or with some thread that you have seen, where it's explained?

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Re: Test The Brake Lever Switch help

Post by omadawn » Jun 13 2019 12:22pm

[/quote] ... just in case something changes then you'll have readings to compare. And keep those connections tight
[/quote]

You had a feeling...

Was rolling with it last night, light on, with a battery still with more than enought juice... Suddenly it stopped and the LCD went off too... Like if there was a short circuit?...
Have checked for continuity every connector of all cables, all have signal...

Am really sad with all this... :oops:

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Re: Test The Brake Lever Switch help

Post by omadawn » Jun 13 2019 12:55pm

Found out one new thing about the brakes though :
After pushing on the brakes 4 or 5 times continuously, the next (6 th) time it failed (stop light did not turn on). Repeated this test again and the same result, once in a while it fails.

Disconnected the cables of this circuit to see if it runs but it doesn't.

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Re: Test The Brake Lever Switch help

Post by TommyCat » Jun 13 2019 1:40pm

:(

From your latest description with loss of total power (lost light too?) it sounds to me like a poor battery connection or possible battery problem. Or perhaps that circuit breaker!
Take a voltage reading across each side of the connector(s) (red to red and then black to black) any voltage reading would indicate a bad or poor wire or connector connection. Warm or distorted, discolored?
Same with red to red on the circuit breaker that is on the positive wiring side.
Best time to check is when you lose your display if possible.
Any information on the battery?
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Re: Test The Brake Lever Switch help

Post by omadawn » Jun 13 2019 2:02pm

Let's see if I manage to follow up correctly :

From the battery goes :
- a red to the circuit breaker
-a black to the controller
-a pair of black & red to the charger port

Got one red left, from the break circuit, straight to the controller

Now tell me the measures again please

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Re: Test The Brake Lever Switch help

Post by omadawn » Jun 13 2019 2:09pm

tmp-cam-1323581718.jpg
The battery with her first charge gave me 4 drive sessions of a few km each, running fine before the problem appears.
Last edited by omadawn on Jun 14 2019 5:06am, edited 2 times in total.

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Re: Test The Brake Lever Switch help

Post by omadawn » Jun 13 2019 2:38pm

I guess only now I made a good measure on those:
14V break off, 0 V break on
The above is not certain, Not anymore, sometimes correct, sometimes no, definetly the break lever switch is not working well no more, but that's not the main problem right? (anyway am already trying to fix it)

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Re: Test The Brake Lever Switch help

Post by TommyCat » Jun 14 2019 9:31am

A valuable lesson of electrical troubleshooting is... You always fix the obvious first :!: So get that brake switch working properly and go from there.
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Re: Test The Brake Lever Switch help

Post by omadawn » Jun 14 2019 10:02am

You are absolutely right, but just for the record, with the brake lever cables disconnected (as i did) it proves that the break lever circuit is not interfering with the motor to run, correct?

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Re: Test The Brake Lever Switch help

Post by TommyCat » Jun 14 2019 6:21pm

TommyCat wrote:
Jun 08 2019 9:12am
With your meter set at 40vdc range, leads in common/ground and voltage jacks. With black test ground probe on a known good battery ground. And take readings...

With power on.
Voltage @ Red wire connection, brake on reading, brake off reading.
Voltage @ Black wire connection, brake on reading, brake off reading.

This would clear up some uncertainties about the brake circuit (hopefully). Still no controller wiring information.
Sorry, but I have not been satisfied with the testing results. Hence the request quoted above from a few posts back to get some different test results.
These are the wire connections on each side of the brake switch. As such I'm still not clear as to the actual brake circuit operation or connection... :?:
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Re: Test The Brake Lever Switch help

Post by TommyCat » Jun 15 2019 9:00am

omadawn wrote:
Jun 13 2019 2:02pm
Let's see if I manage to follow up correctly :

From the battery goes :
- a red to the circuit breaker
-a black to the controller
-a pair of black & red to the charger port

Got one red left, from the break circuit, straight to the controller

Now tell me the measures again please
To test the circuit breaker, choices...
1) Battery plugged in. Using meter voltage setting, put a test lead on each side(red wire terminal to red wire terminal)and check for voltage potential. You should have 0vdc, any thing more is a bad C.B. Try testing while pushing/moving reset button and wiring, checking for intermittent operation.
2) Battery unplugged. Remove both red wires from the C.B. terminals. Meter on Ohms. Read across both terminals. Should read infinity or absolutely no resistance.

These same tests can be used to check each battery connection on the same wire. Keep in mind you have to think about the wire to connector connection itself (solder or crimp) as well as the actual connector contact points.(pin or receiver)

Checking for intermittent loss of battery voltage...

Use two battery power line connections closest to the controller. Or known full battery power wiring coming out of controller, hey perhaps even using your displays voltage reading... With your voltage test leads on them, check that you have full battery voltage as measured from directly off the battery. Move the wiring and connectors around to check for an intermittent voltage fluctuation.

No information found on that battery from the part number... Looks like it's a Li-Ion type?
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Re: Test The Brake Lever Switch help

Post by omadawn » Jun 15 2019 10:36am

Battery plugged in. Using meter voltage setting, put a test lead on each side(red wire terminal to red wire terminal)and check for voltage potential. You should have 0vdc, any thing more is a bad C.B. Try testing while pushing/moving reset button and wiring, checking for intermittent operation
One of the 2 red, the one that goes directly to controller, have no way to read voltage.. (spades are rubber protected) :oops:
No information found on that battery from the part number... Looks like it's a Li-Ion type?
Yes, 24 V & 10.4 Ah

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Re: Test The Brake Lever Switch help

Post by TommyCat » Jun 15 2019 11:49am

Pull the connection apart just enough to allow for good contact, yet let the meters probe touch some unprotected metal.
Or carefully stick a straight pin under the protective tubing, and test to it. Or just use the continuity test with battery and wires disconnected

So your Li-Ion battery may be protected by a Battery Management System. (BMS) Read anything about that in your manual?
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Re: Test The Brake Lever Switch help

Post by omadawn » Jun 17 2019 2:17pm

Break lever circuit working good again (breaks off 14V, and on 0 V) .

Now the measures u requested :

Red wire to the battery gives 29V. (same with break on or off)
Red wire to the controller delivers exactly the same.
Isolated (alone) Black from battery to controller: 0 V (brakes on & off)
Also measured the charging circuit 29V.
So your Li-Ion battery may be protected by a Battery Management System. (BMS) Read anything about that in your manual?
No, This manual is a crap, super basic, and very poor images /drawings.
Just for the record, front & back lights work fine as well as the Horn. Voltage indicator seems to be working fine also, full charged (did it twice so far) it gives 29.7 V, now with my fixes is at an expected 29.2 V

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Re: Test The Brake Lever Switch help

Post by TommyCat » Jun 18 2019 8:33am

So the readings from the 2 red circuit breaker wires look good. Did you try testing whist moving the wires a bit or wiggling the reset button?

On the brake switch testing I'm thinking you are testing between the Red and Black wire terminals on the switch. Which is indicating a closing switch, a good thing.

A last try at the other checks I was shooting for...

Would you test once again on your brake switch connections. With your meter set at 40vdc range, meter leads in common/ground and voltage jacks. With black test ground probe on a known good battery ground. And take readings...

With power on.
Voltage @ Red wire connection,(one side of break switch) brake on test reading, brake off test reading.
Voltage @ Black wire connection,(other side of brake switch) brake on test reading, brake off test reading.
(Reading all to ground) Thank you.

So the lights are on, but no motor again eh? Have you tried disconnecting and reconnecting the battery? Hey, it works for computers... :)
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Re: Test The Brake Lever Switch help

Post by omadawn » Jun 18 2019 10:22am

So the readings from the 2 red circuit breaker wires look good. Did you try testing whist moving the wires a bit or wiggling the reset button?
No, forgot...will do it as soon as I can.
Would you test once again on your brake switch connections.
AS I told u on the above post, my break switch test was made with the black probe on black wire and red probe on red wire (of the same break lever circuit)
With power on.
Voltage @ Red wire connection,(one side of break switch) brake on test reading, brake off test reading.
Voltage @ Black wire connection,(other side of brake switch) brake on test reading, brake off test reading.With power on.
Now u want me to make the same test but, with the black probe on some other ground wire, and take readings from both black and red wires of that circuit, correct?

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Re: Test The Brake Lever Switch help

Post by TommyCat » Jun 18 2019 11:22am

yes, with brake -on and then brake -off, both sides...
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Re: Test The Brake Lever Switch help

Post by omadawn » Jun 18 2019 2:37pm

TommyCat wrote:
Jun 18 2019 11:22am
yes, with brake -on and then brake -off, both sides...
Same results, red 14 V (breaks off) 0 V (break on), as for black 0 V no matter breaks on or off.

Break circuit tested again, with "smashing" the cables, and pushing reset button (that seems loose), same results 29 V on the reds.
you tried disconnecting and reconnecting the battery? Hey, it works for computers... :)
What do you mean? How to turn off the battery besides turning it off with the LCD screen?
Well got my brains working on this, and decided the disconnect the black alone that goes from that battery straight to the controller.... Have done it before, But this time left the LCD screen on, while running the disconnect & connect process...

And voilá... Had a feeling, pushed the throttle, and... Motor working again... :lol:

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Re: Test The Brake Lever Switch help

Post by TommyCat » Jun 18 2019 5:09pm

omadawn wrote:
Jun 18 2019 2:37pm
Same results, red 14 V (breaks off) 0 V (break on), as for black 0 V no matter breaks on or off.
Alright! from this you would have a low brake type operation. This requires 2 wires at the controller. But from your newest report below, it appears the brake issue can be set aside!
omadawn wrote:
Jun 18 2019 2:37pm
Well got my brains working on this, and decided the disconnect the black alone that goes from that battery straight to the controller.... Have done it before, But this time left the LCD screen on, while running the disconnect & connect process...

And voilá... Had a feeling, pushed the throttle, and... Motor working again... :lol:
Nice one! Keep that good feeling going! If it works twice in a row, will look into it further. Unless you'd like to do things now.
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omadawn   10 W

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Re: Test The Brake Lever Switch help

Post by omadawn » Jun 19 2019 5:52am

Thanks
Was wondering about a forgotten issue:

Noticed on the previous runs, that when the scooter hit a hole in the ground, something is loose inside, and I hear what I believe to be the controller beating on the plastic base above it.

I will end with that swinging now, with some cartoon glued to the controller, remaining between both surfaces to absorb the shock.

Do you think this is somehow possible to be related to our quest?

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Re: Test The Brake Lever Switch help

Post by TommyCat » Jun 19 2019 8:26am

Yes, I believe both battery and controller should be well supported and not banging around. Good catch.
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Re: Test The Brake Lever Switch help

Post by omadawn » Jun 20 2019 4:16pm

Hi
Almost draining this battery, everything is fine.
(Drained now to 22.5 V. When it went dark) I guess that's normal.

About mounting a second brake on the right handlebar, can you give me a hint?
How do we test if a brake is tooned to be at hit's full power?
tmp-cam-825136368.jpg
tmp-cam-825136368.jpg (129.64 KiB) Viewed 445 times
My front 9" wheel

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