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Speed record with scooter requirements?

Posted: Nov 19 2021 9:31am
by rg12
I've got a really ambitious customer who wants to do a custom Dualtron build for breaking the current 149kmh scooter speed record.
* Rion apparantly only claim 100mph while no one ever proved that so I call that bs

So, let's say aim for 155-160kmh

This guy is not a noob, he built quite a few custom Dualtrons with dual Nucular F12 controllers and tons of customization and loads of high end gear.

So, my thought was like this...
Has to be dual motors, wheels will be 11" (almost certain) with custom wounded motors aimed for speed, battery will be made according to controller choice which is 21S in case of Nucular or ASI. or anything higher if going with a different higher voltage controller.

About Nucular, they are the best, much better acceleration and all but ASI always had a better top speed since their software enables the user to stretch the field weakening alot more.
Still, it's a serious build and we can't be guessing how much it will go as he never tried the top speed of his builds, just built for fun and sold it right afterwards.

So...what do you think?

Re: Speed record with scooter requirements?

Posted: Nov 20 2021 8:50pm
by LewTwo
Might want to try posting the question to this forum instead ....
viewforum.php?f=35

Re: Speed record with scooter requirements?

Posted: Nov 20 2021 10:38pm
by Chalo
/dev/null

Speed record with scooter requirements?

Posted: Nov 21 2021 2:23pm
by rg12
I've got a really ambitious customer who wants to do a custom Dualtron build for breaking the current 149kmh scooter speed record.
* Rion apparantly only claim 100mph while no one ever proved that so I call that bs

So, let's say aim for 155-160kmh

This guy is not a noob, he built quite a few custom Dualtrons with dual Nucular F12 controllers and tons of customization and loads of high end gear.

So, my thought was like this...
Has to be dual motors, wheels will be 11" (almost certain) with custom wounded motors aimed for speed, battery will be made according to controller choice which is 21S in case of Nucular or ASI. or anything higher if going with a different higher voltage controller.

About Nucular, they are the best, much better acceleration and all but ASI always had a better top speed since their software enables the user to stretch the field weakening alot more.
Still, it's a serious build and we can't be guessing how much it will go as he never tried the top speed of his builds, just built for fun and sold it right afterwards.

So...what do you think?

Re: Speed record with scooter requirements?

Posted: Nov 21 2021 2:26pm
by rg12
LewTwo wrote:
Nov 20 2021 8:50pm
Might want to try posting the question to this forum instead ....
viewforum.php?f=35
Done, thanks :)

Re: Speed record with scooter requirements?

Posted: Nov 22 2021 4:28am
by c.wagner
I´d say go for a belt or chain driven rear wheel setup. I personally don´t like that due to noise/inefficiency but in your case this sounds optimal, because you can change the gearing to fulfill your needs.

A single motor would be sufficient ih he doesn´t want to set the acceleration record aswell :D
Maybe look into a ASI BAC 8000. It can deliver up to 32kW with 21S battery.

Re: Speed record with scooter requirements?

Posted: Nov 22 2021 4:27pm
by rg12
c.wagner wrote:
Nov 22 2021 4:28am
I´d say go for a belt or chain driven rear wheel setup. I personally don´t like that due to noise/inefficiency but in your case this sounds optimal, because you can change the gearing to fulfill your needs.

A single motor would be sufficient ih he doesn´t want to set the acceleration record aswell :D
Maybe look into a ASI BAC 8000. It can deliver up to 32kW with 21S battery.
No need for ASI 8000 as the huge current wouldn't get the thing going faster but only to go fast (faster).
Voltage, gearing and field weakening are responsible for speed and only some amount of current is needed in order to get to max rpm.

I was thinking maybe look at the Sabvotons with 120V so I can have both high voltage AND field weakening as opposed to ASI and Nucular having a 21S limit.
With the sabvoton I can go 28S

Re: Speed record with scooter requirements?

Posted: Nov 23 2021 7:49am
by c.wagner
huge current wouldn't get the thing going faster but only to go fast
Depends. You can play around with the Kv-rating of the motor. And motor with higher KV are more common than these with lower ones. My idea was to use a very high Kv motor and use a big inverter to supply enough current to reach these speeds.

Re: Speed record with scooter requirements?

Posted: Nov 23 2021 11:47am
by jas67
100 MPH on a stand up scooter? Make sure you have good medical insurance. Also, seriously consider investing in an airbag equipped race suite like the one of Alpinstars Tech Air Race compatible suits (+ the actual Tech Air Race vest, of course), or Dainese Misano.

Re: Speed record with scooter requirements?

Posted: Nov 24 2021 10:53am
by rg12
jas67 wrote:
Nov 23 2021 11:47am
100 MPH on a stand up scooter? Make sure you have good medical insurance. Also, seriously consider investing in an airbag equipped race suite like the one of Alpinstars Tech Air Race compatible suits (+ the actual Tech Air Race vest, of course), or Dainese Misano.
Haven't thought about safety yet...maybe because im not the one riding it to my doom :lol:
but will consider that of course, thanks!

Re: Speed record with scooter requirements?

Posted: Nov 24 2021 10:58pm
by LewTwo
rg12 wrote:
Nov 24 2021 10:53am
jas67 wrote:
Nov 23 2021 11:47am
100 MPH on a stand up scooter? Make sure you have good medical insurance. Also, seriously consider investing in an airbag equipped race suite like the one of Alpinstars Tech Air Race compatible suits (+ the actual Tech Air Race vest, of course), or Dainese Misano.
Haven't thought about safety yet...maybe because im not the one riding it to my doom :lol:
but will consider that of course, thanks!
Well if you build it and someone else 'rides it to their doom', then you might want a LOT of liability insurance.

Re: Speed record with scooter requirements?

Posted: Nov 25 2021 4:56pm
by rg12
LewTwo wrote:
Nov 24 2021 10:58pm
rg12 wrote:
Nov 24 2021 10:53am
jas67 wrote:
Nov 23 2021 11:47am
100 MPH on a stand up scooter? Make sure you have good medical insurance. Also, seriously consider investing in an airbag equipped race suite like the one of Alpinstars Tech Air Race compatible suits (+ the actual Tech Air Race vest, of course), or Dainese Misano.
Haven't thought about safety yet...maybe because im not the one riding it to my doom :lol:
but will consider that of course, thanks!
Well if you build it and someone else 'rides it to their doom', then you might want a LOT of liability insurance.
I was kidding of course
The guy who builds it is not me, I'm just there as a consultant with some ideas for reaching those speeds and wanted to hear your opinions to see how far off I am

Re: Speed record with scooter requirements?

Posted: Nov 28 2021 2:20pm
by HTTR
Could that customer be based in Tel-Aviv ?

Either way for the speed it might be worth looking at fitting some 13" tires in the 6.5 hubs or use the DTX motor/hub/tire combo which would give you increase speed per RPM.

Re: Speed record with scooter requirements?

Posted: Nov 29 2021 1:41pm
by rg12
HTTR wrote:
Nov 28 2021 2:20pm
Could that customer be based in Tel-Aviv ?

Either way for the speed it might be worth looking at fitting some 13" tires in the 6.5 hubs or use the DTX motor/hub/tire combo which would give you increase speed per RPM.
I heard you uncovered me today :D
Nicely done :wink:

Re: Speed record with scooter requirements?

Posted: Nov 29 2021 4:11pm
by HTTR
It's a small world indeed and it's nice to e-meet the king of battery porn. Absolutely love your builds.

Re: Speed record with scooter requirements?

Posted: Nov 30 2021 2:37am
by c.wagner
So I was at EICMA last friday and they had a prototype of an ESC championship scooter there.
The facts were astoundingly...boring :D
If I recall it correctly, it was 200A*2 @96V ?! Propably limited due to championship rules. The scooter was massive, like 30cm wide..and only housed a 1kWh battery.

But maybe look into these brands or the ESC championship for design references :)
IMG20211126133459.jpg
IMG20211126133459.jpg (4.66 MiB) Viewed 45 times

Re: Speed record with scooter requirements?

Posted: Nov 30 2021 9:18am
by rg12
HTTR wrote:
Nov 29 2021 4:11pm
It's a small world indeed and it's nice to e-meet the king of battery porn. Absolutely love your builds.
Ahhh thank you sir!