Compression Molded Carbon Fiber Deck

Lightweight / Folding / Portable EVs - seats optional

Compression Molded Carbon Fiber Deck

Postby CFRP » Mon Sep 01, 2014 10:55 am

I have been reading this forum for a while now and it has taught me a lot. I want to share some pictures of a project I have been working on. This is a carbon fiber electric longboard that integrates all of the electronics in the deck. Using carbon fiber allows for other neat design features like integrating the truck base plates into the deck. This is intended to reduce weight and parts count creating a simpler and cleaner product.

Here are some pictures of a prototype that has been made in a wood mold. The final version of this deck will be compression molded in an aluminum mold that will create a much cleaner finish.

Image
https://scontent-a-dfw.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xap1/t31.0-8/10661697_692002604217243_5929310423682245428_o.jpg

Image
https://fbcdn-sphotos-b-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-xpa1/t31.0-8/1537740_692004197550417_3223069405348680131_o.jpg

Image

I would like your feedback on the design. I plan to get input from several sources before I cut a mold for a final deck design.
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Re: Compression Molded Carbon Fiber Deck

Postby Silenthunter » Mon Sep 01, 2014 11:01 am

Looks great!!! Would you be able to make different deck models and how much would you sell it for?
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Re: Compression Molded Carbon Fiber Deck

Postby psychotiller » Mon Sep 01, 2014 11:19 am

That's an amazing concept!
Do you have a specific manufacturer in mind for the trucks? The one thing I'm thinking is the integrated baseplate may limit the hangers people can use in their set-up. Also, what degree base plate are you using?
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Re: Compression Molded Carbon Fiber Deck

Postby Bob K » Mon Sep 01, 2014 11:51 am

Beautifully done! Psychotiller does have a point. Maybe a poll on base plate angles
would be a reasonable idea before you invest in an aluminum mold. I mean,
who's your market? I would be really interested in your hatch concepts though.
I structurally integrated my CF hatch and it made a HUGE difference in rigidity.
Of course my hatch is 1/4" thick CF tooling board which is overkill, its just what I had on hand.
I really like your integrated design.
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Re: Compression Molded Carbon Fiber Deck

Postby torqueboards » Mon Sep 01, 2014 11:55 am

Amazing setup! Looks awesome. How do you open the enclosure if you need too?
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Re: Compression Molded Carbon Fiber Deck

Postby Hummina Shadeeba » Tue Sep 02, 2014 1:19 pm

How are the trucks doing? Very nice.

I want to do something similar but have been broke cause I haven't worked for 3 months. But hadn't thought of integrating the trucks.

I plan to scan a wood board I routed, cut it out of styrofoam on a cad machine, and carbon over that someday but I'm beyond broke. Spent the little i had on parts and tools for the motor mount I'm trying to run.

Tell us more. How bout more pics. what's the electronics inside look like? I think you could get it much thinner by splitting 2cell packs down to 8mm and make the whole board an electronics enclosure and spread the battery around. Bit longer battery wires would be needed but that can be dealt with adding more electronics more capacitors or something. What's inside yours as a core? I've got access to a cad wood router (can do foam too) and a guy who for 100$ can scan and cut out whatever I wanted. techshop here in sf ca. I cant get on those machines myself at this point.
Attachments
elec.png
this is before i finished routing the board for battery wires. the silver single cell and the 2cell in the blue wrap.
elec.png (89.67 KiB) Viewed 4365 times
Last edited by Hummina Shadeeba on Tue Sep 02, 2014 4:56 pm, edited 2 times in total. View post history.
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Re: Compression Molded Carbon Fiber Deck

Postby Chance2Skate » Sun Sep 21, 2014 8:49 pm

Any new updates on this? Beautiful proof-of-concept. Would love some more pics and details! Thanks
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Re: Compression Molded Carbon Fiber Deck

Postby arkmundi » Sun Sep 21, 2014 8:57 pm

Ditto on all the amazing work high-fives! Would love to see a build-thread as you progress, with pictures. Best. :mrgreen:
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Re: Compression Molded Carbon Fiber Deck

Postby CFRP » Mon Sep 22, 2014 6:26 pm

Thank you everyone for the positive comments.

To address a few questions I will say that I hadn't planned to build decks and sell them individually. I am designing a complete product that I would like to manufacture. My goal is to create a high quality product that uses precision components and is ultra tough.

The integrated trucks are working great, they reduce the weight of the board and function as expected. I am planning to use Surf-Rodz components for the trucks. They make an excellent quality product.

The enclosure for the electronics can be opened from the top. This will be hidden under grip tape as access requirements will be minimal. The board will be powered with LifePo4 batteries that are rated for thousands of charge cycles.

The primary focus as of late has been the completion of the drive train/motor bracket. Here are a few pictures.
Image
This illustrates a 3D printed prototype of the motor bracket assembly

Image
CNC cut parts of motor bracket

Image
Soon to be installed on a deck
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Re: Compression Molded Carbon Fiber Deck

Postby LEVer » Mon Sep 22, 2014 8:27 pm

...mmm....donuts... :)
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Re: Compression Molded Carbon Fiber Deck

Postby Bob K » Mon Sep 22, 2014 9:28 pm

Looking good!
I have to throw this out there.
Have you thought about front wheel drive?
Here are 2 reasons that it is better:
1- The front wheel ( first impact with road irregularities) "motors (torques) up and over" these irregularities better than rear wheel drive.
This reduces the loads on the drive train ( belt, sprockets, motor bearings, deflection of the spinning motor shell)
and provides a better riding experience due to a more favorable "initial impact deceleration profile".
The front wheel does not just hit the hole, it wants to torque up and out of the hole.

2- better protection of the motor versus rear mounting when hitting road irregularities ( IE: potholes! )
because it is BEHIND the wheel.

Just a thought.
Keep up the really nice work!

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Re: Compression Molded Carbon Fiber Deck

Postby Gregory » Mon Sep 22, 2014 9:40 pm

Looks amazing, great design.


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Re: Compression Molded Carbon Fiber Deck

Postby sk8norcal » Tue Sep 23, 2014 1:18 am

looks good,
but forget that integrated baseplate, (so many negatives for that idea)
adjustable steering angle is somewhat more interesting (but requires the motor mount plate to be adjustable also)
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Re: Compression Molded Carbon Fiber Deck

Postby CFRP » Tue Sep 23, 2014 6:55 pm

Bob K, Thanks for you input about FWD. I will look into this in more detail.

sk8norcal, I would like to hear more about the "many negatives" you see in the integrated base plate design. Feedback like this is very helpful.
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Re: Compression Molded Carbon Fiber Deck

Postby Silenthunter » Tue Sep 23, 2014 8:55 pm

The bracket looks fin from the angle you took the pictures. Is it welded or mounted in bolts? Can you post pictures of the bracket from other angle...
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Re: Compression Molded Carbon Fiber Deck

Postby sk8norcal » Tue Sep 23, 2014 11:12 pm

CFRP wrote:sk8norcal, I would like to hear more about the "many negatives" you see in the integrated base plate design. Feedback like this is very helpful.


no angle adjustment, no height adjustment, no fore/aft adjustment and you are stuck with that truck design.
kingpin replacement?


too many disadvantages just to not have nuts and bolts.

that deck would not do well in the longboard world...

i been longboarding for a long time and only seen one home built board with integrated baseplates,

otherwise, only rollerskates use integrated baseplates.
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Re: Compression Molded Carbon Fiber Deck

Postby matty_x » Wed Sep 24, 2014 4:01 am

Good answer sk8norcal. Integrated baseplates offer few advantages but present many disadvantages. Perhaps not as relevant with an electric longboard, but the ability to swap out trucks is a big advantage of traditional baseplates. And the issue with swapping out the kingpin is not to be underestimated. Tracker trucks back in the 80s had a plastic baseplate design with the kingpin molded into the plastic. If you broke the kingpin or stripped the threads (or the kingpin got rusty and corroded -- which happens in saltwater climates), then you had to buy a complete baseplate. That was costlier than buying a 2 dollar kingpin. If the kingpin is integrated into the deck, it seems to me that it might end up being a likely point of failure. My 2 cents.
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Re: Compression Molded Carbon Fiber Deck

Postby Dauntless » Wed Sep 24, 2014 11:20 am

Dang, look at that rear truck. Dying to see inside.

Are you talking about Resin Transfer Molding to make the board?
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Re: Compression Molded Carbon Fiber Deck

Postby CFRP » Mon Sep 29, 2014 9:40 pm

Thanks for the feedback guys. I will keep these concerns in mind throughout upcoming tests.

A few points.

The kingpins are defiantly user replaceable...they just slide into the ingratiated base plate like they would slide into a standard base plate. Actually they are easier to replace then many kingpins due to the fact that the base plate does not need to be removed from the deck to remove the kingpin from this design.

Dauntless,
This deck will be compression molded. That means a resin saturated core and Carbon Fiber is compressed in a heated steel or aluminum mold. The pressure that is applied to the mold ensures that there is not an excessive amount of resin in the product. This makes a light, strong, consistent product. Resin Transfer Molding is another good process. It involves putting the base material into the mold and then forcing the resin into the mold.

Silenthunter,
The bracket is actually pretty thick. It is just tapered. And it bolts on the inside (side towards timing pulley). Here is a pictures of it from a different angle.
Image

I will have some updated project pictures shortly.
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Re: Compression Molded Carbon Fiber Deck

Postby Bob K » Tue Sep 30, 2014 7:57 pm

That is a really beautiful motor mount.
However....
I don't know for sure, but I see a possible "stress riser" right at the motor mount-to-truck location.
Right where the truck has a machined step is where you have clamped your
beautiful motor mount. If you can do a FEA or have someone who might
perform a FEA at that junction, it might be good insurance against metal fatigue
right at that step.
Hey, I'm known for being "too conservative" and it's probably nothing, but,
I'm just throwing it out there.

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Re: Compression Molded Carbon Fiber Deck

Postby CFRP » Wed Nov 12, 2014 8:09 pm

Board has been working great. I've ridden it around 50 miles with no problem.
Image

Here is a video I put together a while ago of an older revision. It a bit grainy but its a start.

http://youtu.be/v2vygqleJDA

BobK,
Thank you for your comment. I am also a supporter of being "too conservative" and the area you mentioned will be improved in the next revision of the part. Here's one more picture for the current motor bracket for reference.
Image

I have been testing LifePo4 batteries using 10 cells. So far I have tried A123 ANR26650 cells and some Turnigy prismatic cells.
Image
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Re: Compression Molded Carbon Fiber Deck

Postby Silenthunter » Wed Nov 12, 2014 9:54 pm

The deck looks great. Would 18650 cells fit inside? How many? How strong are those mounts?
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Re: Compression Molded Carbon Fiber Deck

Postby Hummina Shadeeba » Thu Nov 13, 2014 12:37 am

How do those mounts stay put on the hanger?

What's in the middle of the deck? Wood? Foam?

Very nice design. Congratulations. U must get lots o looks
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Re: Compression Molded Carbon Fiber Deck

Postby beetbocks » Thu Nov 13, 2014 4:18 am

very nice looking ...super stealth..
beautifully finished bracket..
What sort of performance and range are you looking at?
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