Anti spark XT90 connectors

Lightweight / Folding / Portable EVs - seats optional
User avatar
jackjetful
100 W
100 W
Posts: 159
Joined: Feb 15, 2013 7:15 am

Re: Anti spark XT90 connectors

Post by jackjetful » May 20, 2015 3:39 am

I've got them, use them on 48v and 72v setups. Work great, no fuss no spark. Easiest precharge resistor setup I have seen.
Ok thanks, but whats about the wattage? ... the big 1k Resistor is the recomended one from kelly! ... If capacitors draw some current verry fast will these small resistor hold that at 70V? .. I thought this wouldn't work long but maybe I am false!

User avatar
riba2233
1 MW
1 MW
Posts: 1868
Joined: Jun 30, 2013 10:23 am
Location: Croatia

Re: Anti spark XT90 connectors

Post by riba2233 » May 20, 2015 4:57 am

Don't worry, precharge lasts very short, and resistor has low value (5.6r).

User avatar
Vanarian
10 kW
10 kW
Posts: 583
Joined: Nov 26, 2014 12:24 pm
Location: France!

Re: Anti spark XT90 connectors

Post by Vanarian » May 22, 2015 5:32 am

Hummina Shadeeba wrote:I went crazy buying plugs of different types. these I have at least 6 extra. you need two. connect the black then the red.

write me pm and we can figure out what you can send me in exchange. Maybe you can let me live on your nice outdoor patio I saw in your video.
Why didn't I see your post sooner, sorry! you're welcome haha if you pass by Nice I'll take you to a tour ;)

I'll pm you in a minute.
I needed to turn Air Gear stuff into reality so I am making this!
-+Electric inline skates - no remote control - weight / angle sensor - hub motors - one frame for all wheels sizes between 80/125mm - from 3.2 to 12 KW :mrgreen:

Rollo Ergo Sum!

cwah
10 GW
10 GW
Posts: 4461
Joined: Jul 24, 2011 5:42 am
Location: Between paris and london

Re: Anti spark XT90 connectors

Post by cwah » May 23, 2015 10:53 am

Can they handle daily plug/unplug without becoming loose over time?
Help me find my stolen electric brompton: http://bit.ly/1a0vbBC and Bosch Sinus B3 http://bit.ly/1eV0WQz

CSN
100 W
100 W
Posts: 162
Joined: Mar 05, 2015 12:59 am

Re: Anti spark XT90 connectors

Post by CSN » May 23, 2015 1:29 pm

Does using an anti spark switch mitigate the need for anti spark connectors?

torqueboards
1.21 GW
1.21 GW
Posts: 3907
Joined: May 27, 2013 10:02 pm
Location: San Francisco, CA
Contact:

Re: Anti spark XT90 connectors

Post by torqueboards » May 23, 2015 2:06 pm

CSN wrote:Does using an anti spark switch mitigate the need for anti spark connectors?
Yes, correct. Ideally, you don't need it all but the spark can eat away at the connectors depending on the connectors.
DIYElectricSkateboard.com Electric Skateboard Kits

User avatar
sl33py
10 kW
10 kW
Posts: 697
Joined: Apr 24, 2015 5:21 pm
Location: Seattle, WA

Re: Anti spark XT90 connectors

Post by sl33py » May 23, 2015 3:47 pm

torqueboards wrote:
CSN wrote:Does using an anti spark switch mitigate the need for anti spark connectors?
Yes, correct. Ideally, you don't need it all but the spark can eat away at the connectors depending on the connectors.
Hey Torque - I have some of these anti-spark xt90's and was going to use them instead of an on/off switch.

Can you clarify for me your anti-spark mosfet switch - does it or does it not work well w/ regen system? I thought i'd heard that it's effectively "one-way" and wouldn't allow for regen to battery.

I plan to use two xt90's - one inline on power as master On/Off, and one on the battery wires to ESC's. so either way i'm preventing spark whether the on/off is connected or not. I wanted your power switch, but decided to go simple w/ these xt90's.

torqueboards
1.21 GW
1.21 GW
Posts: 3907
Joined: May 27, 2013 10:02 pm
Location: San Francisco, CA
Contact:

Re: Anti spark XT90 connectors

Post by torqueboards » May 23, 2015 5:39 pm

sl33py wrote:
torqueboards wrote:
CSN wrote:Does using an anti spark switch mitigate the need for anti spark connectors?
Yes, correct. Ideally, you don't need it all but the spark can eat away at the connectors depending on the connectors.
Hey Torque - I have some of these anti-spark xt90's and was going to use them instead of an on/off switch.

Can you clarify for me your anti-spark mosfet switch - does it or does it not work well w/ regen system? I thought i'd heard that it's effectively "one-way" and wouldn't allow for regen to battery.

I plan to use two xt90's - one inline on power as master On/Off, and one on the battery wires to ESC's. so either way i'm preventing spark whether the on/off is connected or not. I wanted your power switch, but decided to go simple w/ these xt90's.
XT90's are a great and simple option. I would go with the anti-spark XT90's though for your loop key's. You just simply need to break the connection.

It also would support regen but regen should only get about 5-10% back which isn't a whole lot but would still gain the regen back.

The only problem for me was I would always lose my XT90 loop key and can't turn on my board lol so with that said make sure you make extras that way you can have one on your keys or something in-case you do lose it.
DIYElectricSkateboard.com Electric Skateboard Kits

User avatar
madin88
10 MW
10 MW
Posts: 2330
Joined: May 27, 2013 2:02 am
Location: Austria

Re: Anti spark XT90 connectors

Post by madin88 » May 24, 2015 11:50 am

the 5.6ohm resistor will blow early if you use high voltage and large controllers. the Jeti antispark system with NTC resisitor are the optimal choice for this purpose.

i did some testings. here is the thread:
https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewto ... 25#p951858
- Votec V-FR frame / MXUS 3T / 17" Mitas MC11 / Adaptto Max-E / 20s12p 25R -> approved as L1e moped and fully road legal in EU :)
- Vector white / MXUS 4T / 24" Hookworms / Adaptto Max-E / 22s11p 25R
- KTM Hardtail Pedelec / eZee V2 6T / 27,5" / Kelly KBSX @ 1,5kW / Torque PAS / CA-V3 / 13s4p Sanyo GA in Shark case

Hummina Shadeeba
1 MW
1 MW
Posts: 1587
Joined: Apr 25, 2014 10:26 pm

Re: Anti spark XT90 connectors

Post by Hummina Shadeeba » May 24, 2015 12:56 pm

CSN wrote:Does using an anti spark switch mitigate the need for anti spark connectors?
My grammar alarm is going off. The anti-spark will "replace" the need for anti-spark connectors. They will mitigate the spark problem.

markz
10 GW
10 GW
Posts: 4753
Joined: Jan 09, 2014 11:38 pm
Location: Alberta Canada

Re: Anti spark XT90 connectors

Post by markz » Jun 18, 2015 2:24 pm

I guess for me its time to upgrade my battery bus wire to XT90's with anti-spark.
Good news is, I am just putting in an order to HobbyKing.

5.6 ohms might mean 560 ohms or 5600 ohms, 56k, 560k, 5.6M, 56M, 560M all I remember from electronics class is their is a color coding on resistors, each color corresponds to a number and one color corresponds to wattage. If its 5.6 ohms, that is the equivellant of the resistance of wire itself, of course depending on its guage, length etc. I know nothing about Anti-Spark or Precharge, but I can only assume that its 560 ohms.

Now on surface mount components, its just a number and I forget how to read those. So all I can assume is whats used on the XT's are most likely surface mount for size considerations.

But I dont really know. Just going from my Nortel Networks and Solectron days on the assembly line.

User avatar
madin88
10 MW
10 MW
Posts: 2330
Joined: May 27, 2013 2:02 am
Location: Austria

Re: Anti spark XT90 connectors

Post by madin88 » Jun 19, 2015 2:11 am

markz, its has 5,6 ohm. I have measured it ;)
it may work up to 50 or 60V well with small to medium controllers. at higher voltage and or in combination with large controllers the resistor will blow sooner or later.
IMO a 30-50ohm ntc resistor together with 1-3 sec waiting time on the precharge ring would be optimal.
- Votec V-FR frame / MXUS 3T / 17" Mitas MC11 / Adaptto Max-E / 20s12p 25R -> approved as L1e moped and fully road legal in EU :)
- Vector white / MXUS 4T / 24" Hookworms / Adaptto Max-E / 22s11p 25R
- KTM Hardtail Pedelec / eZee V2 6T / 27,5" / Kelly KBSX @ 1,5kW / Torque PAS / CA-V3 / 13s4p Sanyo GA in Shark case

User avatar
smeagol222
100 W
100 W
Posts: 130
Joined: Dec 17, 2015 7:36 am
Location: Toronto, Canada

Re: Anti spark XT90 connectors

Post by smeagol222 » Mar 16, 2017 10:40 am

I've been looking everywhere nobody can give me a straight answer as to what the max watts this connector can handle

Apparently it can do 90amp continuous, but at what voltage? I have a 72v project 65amp continuous, 90amp peak using 6 gauge wire, trying to figure out if things are going to melt
First project small E-scooter upgrade 1.5kw/3kw 48v 45a https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewt ... 12&t=86228
Current project medium E-scooter upgrade 4kw/7kw 72v 90a https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewt ... 10&t=85164

User avatar
spinningmagnets
100 GW
100 GW
Posts: 10723
Joined: Dec 21, 2007 10:27 pm
Location: Ft Riley, NE Kansas

Re: Anti spark XT90 connectors

Post by spinningmagnets » Mar 16, 2017 11:57 am

All watts are not the same. 100V at 50A is 5000W, and 100A at 50V is also 5000W, but...the 100A system will run much hotter. There is also the amp=draw profile to consider...do you draw 3000W for a few seconds, and then cruise along at 200W for several minutes to allow everything to cool down? or...do you apply 3000W continuously?

Higher volts can have a spark jump through the air a farther distance, and the XT90 has been used with apparent success in 24S system (a nominal 88V, peak 100V fully charged). Voltage shouldn't be an issue, so...lets focus on the amps.

Try them out on your user-profile, and if they get too hot to touch, I would recommend upgrading to a larger connector. The AS150's seem to be well-regarded (Anti Spark, 150A).

Regardless of what the web-catalog might say, I would not use these at 90A continuous, and...I actually use them, and like them.

User avatar
smeagol222
100 W
100 W
Posts: 130
Joined: Dec 17, 2015 7:36 am
Location: Toronto, Canada

Re: Anti spark XT90 connectors

Post by smeagol222 » Mar 16, 2017 12:15 pm

spinningmagnets wrote:All watts are not the same. 100V at 50A is 5000W, and 100A at 50V is also 5000W, but...the 100A system will run much hotter. There is also the amp=draw profile to consider...do you draw 3000W for a few seconds, and then cruise along at 300W for several minutes to allow everything to cool down? or...do you apply 3000W continuously?

Higher volts can have a spark jump through the air a farther distance, and the XT90 has been used with apparent success in 24S system (a nominal 88V, peak 100V fully charged). Voltage shouldn't be an issue, so...lets focus on the amps.

Try them out on your user-profile, and if they get too hot to touch, I would recommend upgrading to a larger connector. The AS150's seem to be well-regarded (Anti Spark, 150A).

Regardless of what the web-catalog might say, I would not use these at 90A continuous, and...I actually use them, and like them.
Ahhh okay now I'm starting to understand -thanks for clearing things up. Yes my controller only does the peak 90a for 10sec max, the back down to cruising speed. I have a temperature gauge and Cycle analyst and will conduct some tests.
Image

I contacted hobbyking and they also said voltage at these levels dont matter and XT90 with 6 awg should be fine with my batterybloc modular setup- have a bunch of series XT90 adaptors (parallel ones for balance charging). Only thing they said is it would have a hard time soldering 6 awg to XT90's
First project small E-scooter upgrade 1.5kw/3kw 48v 45a https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewt ... 12&t=86228
Current project medium E-scooter upgrade 4kw/7kw 72v 90a https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewt ... 10&t=85164

User avatar
Ianhill
100 kW
100 kW
Posts: 1117
Joined: Sep 25, 2015 5:55 pm
Location: Wales UK

Re: Anti spark XT90 connectors

Post by Ianhill » Mar 16, 2017 6:02 pm

My xt90 anti sparks at 16s, the precharge resistor is not charging the caps in the time it takes to pair two connectors, the controller is a 48-72v 1500w sunwin.
I used to have a little trouble at 12s same controller but never had it with my first controller I've not worked out the value of the caps on both boards but the sunwin has the nost capacitance no doubt.
I've resorted to using a precharge switch now out of a three way rocker switch and a resistor, middle for off down to precharge then up for run.

User avatar
smeagol222
100 W
100 W
Posts: 130
Joined: Dec 17, 2015 7:36 am
Location: Toronto, Canada

Re: Anti spark XT90 connectors

Post by smeagol222 » Mar 16, 2017 6:23 pm

Ah okay- for my build I'm not relying on the connectors to do precharging. Ended up picking one of these up after someone mentioned it on another thread
http://www.zeva.com.au/Products/datashe ... erV1-3.pdf
First project small E-scooter upgrade 1.5kw/3kw 48v 45a https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewt ... 12&t=86228
Current project medium E-scooter upgrade 4kw/7kw 72v 90a https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewt ... 10&t=85164

User avatar
Ianhill
100 kW
100 kW
Posts: 1117
Joined: Sep 25, 2015 5:55 pm
Location: Wales UK

Re: Anti spark XT90 connectors

Post by Ianhill » Mar 16, 2017 7:10 pm

Very nice, it's skinning the cat in a simular way to myself but in one unit,

I should have mentioned I've been using a 12v 80amp starter relay as the contactor in my system I've run it at 16s and 60amp, it's making and breaking underload but it's wise to only use it as a safety measure and shutdown under as little load condition as possible.

I would like to add a resistor and cap for a hold on charge for the coil to make it more efficent and a timed pre charge be easy enough just one of those things I threat to do, I normally switch on to start pre charge on the relay output, wait 10 seconds then switch the rocker to activate the relay so there's no spark and it then bypass the resistor, I know relays have spark sepression but at 6×working voltage it's not going to work and will wear out faster it's doing well coping with 60amp at 16s

I've run the same relays now for over 3 years been working they way through all my different builds they will be sadly missed when they go but as for reliability they not missed a beat.

markz
10 GW
10 GW
Posts: 4753
Joined: Jan 09, 2014 11:38 pm
Location: Alberta Canada

Re: Anti spark XT90 connectors

Post by markz » Mar 16, 2017 8:07 pm

smeagol222 wrote:Ah okay- for my build I'm not relying on the connectors to do precharging. Ended up picking one of these up after someone mentioned it on another thread
http://www.zeva.com.au/Products/datashe ... erV1-3.pdf
Price?

User avatar
Ianhill
100 kW
100 kW
Posts: 1117
Joined: Sep 25, 2015 5:55 pm
Location: Wales UK

Re: Anti spark XT90 connectors

Post by Ianhill » Mar 16, 2017 8:35 pm

markz wrote:
smeagol222 wrote:Ah okay- for my build I'm not relying on the connectors to do precharging. Ended up picking one of these up after someone mentioned it on another thread
http://www.zeva.com.au/Products/datashe ... erV1-3.pdf
Price?
The 1.2 version is $55 aus,
_IMG_000000_000000.jpg
Runs a 12v trigger, two versions 12-160v or 160v-320v nominal

The bad news is you still need the contactor to go with it but it could be used on a relay to after reading the specs, it would be as simple as one switch on then it will use a 48ohm pre charge till theres 5v differential across the contactor/relay then engage the main coil.

User avatar
smeagol222
100 W
100 W
Posts: 130
Joined: Dec 17, 2015 7:36 am
Location: Toronto, Canada

Re: Anti spark XT90 connectors

Post by smeagol222 » Mar 16, 2017 9:47 pm

I got the 1.3 version- and it was the same price
First project small E-scooter upgrade 1.5kw/3kw 48v 45a https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewt ... 12&t=86228
Current project medium E-scooter upgrade 4kw/7kw 72v 90a https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewt ... 10&t=85164

User avatar
Matador
10 kW
10 kW
Posts: 593
Joined: Jun 29, 2016 10:00 pm

Re: Anti spark XT90 connectors

Post by Matador » Mar 17, 2017 12:09 am

jackjetful wrote:5.6OHM seemed to be to less to charge the capacitors of the Kelly. I think they would charge up to fast; this could damage them. I also don't know how many watts the 5.6OHM Resistor has.
Certainly not enough Watt rating to forget the connector plugged less than halfway in... It would melt after a few minutes (exemple : https://electricbike.com/forum/forum/ma ... connectors) ....

Watch how this XT-90S really works....


The resistor in XT-90S is 5.6 Ohms.
Now suppose a 50 milliohm for ESR (equivalent series resistor) for the completly empty capacitor inside your controller (Rcap = 0.05 Ohm)
Suppose another 50 milliohms for internal resistance of a 14S 58.8V battery (Rbatt = 0.05 Ohm).

Series resistance add up : so less than halfway inserted, the XT-90S connector would yield a total resistance of Rt = 5.6 Ohms + 0.05 Ohms + 0.05 mOhm = 5.7 ohms

Now, plug in your 14S fully charged 58.8V battery less than halfway into the XT-90S connector...
Yes, the resuting current is much lower (for a millisecond or so during connector inserstion, but that's enough to charge to complet charge the cap), thus no spark....
In detail, : I= V/Rtot = 58.8V/5.7 ohms =10.3 amps --> NO SPARK (instead of 58.8V/0.1 Ohm = 588 A surge - big spark!!!)

But, how many watts through that XT-90S connector resistor ???

Voltage across the 5.6Ohm XT resistor is Vxt = Rxt/Rt x Vtotal = 5.6/5.7 * 58.8 = 57.8V
And since P = V x I = 57.8V * 14.3 A = 826.5 Watts !!!!! :shock: :shock: :shock:
So I assume it wont melt for just a millisecond (befor full neglectible resistance connection is made once fully inserted) .... But dont leave your connector just partially plugged in !!!! :
The resistor is certainly NOT rated for that many watts !!!
See calculation logic here :


Problem is, IF you forget the connector halfway in or less thant halfway in, IT WILL MELT.

Post Reply