10S custom skate ESC: testers wanted!

Lightweight / Folding / Portable EVs - seats optional
Njakts   1 W

1 W
Posts: 58
Joined: Oct 06 2015 10:53am

Re: 10S custom skate ESC: testers wanted!

Post by Njakts » Oct 25 2015 3:04am

Any chance I can order just the pcb + parts and do rest of the job myself?

User avatar
chaka   1 kW

1 kW
Posts: 303
Joined: Jul 02 2015 2:42pm
Location: New Mexico

Re: 10S custom skate ESC: testers wanted!

Post by chaka » Oct 25 2015 9:43am

Njakts wrote:Any chance I can order just the pcb + parts and do rest of the job myself?
You can! It will cost around $85 in smd components and $39 for PCB's. Another $50 to $500 for a hot air soldering station and $50 to $80 in solder paste and stencils.

Definitely doable but not cost effective, more of a learning experience. You need to buy in bulk to get the build cost down.

nzak   1 µW

1 µW
Posts: 2
Joined: Sep 01 2015 9:22pm

Re: 10S custom skate ESC: testers wanted!

Post by nzak » Oct 25 2015 7:19pm

Njakts wrote:Any chance I can order just the pcb + parts and do rest of the job myself?
You can have 3 boards made for $39 through oshpark if you are in the US. The gerbers for the boards are on vedder's github. You could also use a cheap toaster oven or frying pan in place of the hot air station.

That being said, if you are asking this question, you are probably best off buying a professionally assembled board from chaka. It is fairly easy to make mistakes in assembly, and the difference in the cost of parts alone is almost negligible.
Last edited by nzak on Nov 07 2015 11:15am, edited 1 time in total.

jacobbloy   100 W

100 W
Posts: 237
Joined: Feb 12 2013 4:45pm

Re: 10S custom skate ESC: testers wanted!

Post by jacobbloy » Oct 25 2015 8:37pm

If you want the satisfaction of soldering it your self, I would got to macrofab in the us they charge $150 to print and assemble the whole vesc no wires tho. But I would get then to just assemble the mcu and drv, maybe fets. then you can solder every thing els your self by hand, or reflow these componants in a frying pan or toaster oven, and hand solder the rest, you can buy a reflow controller for $60 off ebay or a whole toaster over with the controller for $160.

User avatar
sl33py   10 kW

10 kW
Posts: 686
Joined: Apr 24 2015 5:21pm
Location: Seattle, WA

Re: 10S custom skate ESC: testers wanted!

Post by sl33py » Oct 28 2015 1:57pm

vedder wrote:Regarding 4.10: I think they are fine, but I have _not_ tested them myself since my boards haven't arrived yet. I think I will get 10 pieces some time this week, but I'm not sure.
The changes from 4.8 to 4.10 are:
* The current shunt traces are moved again in an attempt to get less offset.
* A hardware SPI port is routed to the comm header to support high speed communication for e.g. precise robotics applications.

I'm quite sure that the shunt traces won't cause any issues, but the spi port forced me to move some ADC pins and other pins around. This means that the firmware is not compatible between the boards as before (e.g. the 4.7 fw mostly works on 4.8 an vice versa). It could also cause issues with the ADC configuration since not all combinations of inputs, ADCs and configurations are possible, but I don't think this will be an issue. The analog sampling on the VESC is quite complicated because all three ADCs are used in both regular and injected mode simultaneously synchronized to two different timers to sample currents and voltages at two different places in the PWM cycle. DMA is also used heavily.
Hey Vedder - itching to pull the trigger on some 4.10 PCB's! Any word on testing and any issues?

scoobiext   1 mW

1 mW
Posts: 11
Joined: Dec 11 2014 2:35am

Re: 10S custom skate ESC: testers wanted!

Post by scoobiext » Oct 29 2015 11:24am

After finally managing to complete and test ride my first e-skateboard, I just wanted to say a big thank you to all of you involved in the VESC. It is a fantastic piece of engineering and the level of refinement achieved even at V4.8 is awesome. The usability of the control of the VESC is really impressive and the design, interfaces, software etc. makes it a superb fit for e-skateboards. Stoked that its open source and community developed also!

I have probably clocked up about 10 km now and am still impressed at how well the board and in particular the VESC goes. I have had an issue with occasional cogging on up hill starts and a few instances where my board suddenly surges really hard at about 20 km/h (under light control input) and has thrown me of at least twice (I managed to stay on the last time). I'm fiddling with a few of the VESC settings, start up boost, and speed and position control gain settings to try and smooth out theseissues. Every thing else is so far working flawlessly.

Thanks again for all the great work.

User avatar
chaka   1 kW

1 kW
Posts: 303
Joined: Jul 02 2015 2:42pm
Location: New Mexico

Re: 10S custom skate ESC: testers wanted!

Post by chaka » Oct 29 2015 12:06pm

Version 4.10 is confirmed, finished testing the first batch last night. I am placing an order for 50 PCB's if anyone is interested.

User avatar
sl33py   10 kW

10 kW
Posts: 686
Joined: Apr 24 2015 5:21pm
Location: Seattle, WA

Re: 10S custom skate ESC: testers wanted!

Post by sl33py » Oct 29 2015 12:46pm

chaka wrote:Version 4.10 is confirmed, finished testing the first batch last night. I am placing an order for 50 PCB's if anyone is interested.
I know Vedder is busy, but you've discussed with him? This is confirmed fixing the issues he mentioned which required some trace re-routing and improvements? Just trying to make sure it's the current stable platform as i know firmwares will likely split and want to keep it simple moving forward.

User avatar
chaka   1 kW

1 kW
Posts: 303
Joined: Jul 02 2015 2:42pm
Location: New Mexico

Re: 10S custom skate ESC: testers wanted!

Post by chaka » Oct 29 2015 2:41pm

I will be doing some high speed runs tonight to check if the offset is still an issue. I have not heard back from Vedder, I don't think he has built v 4.10 yet.

User avatar
chaka   1 kW

1 kW
Posts: 303
Joined: Jul 02 2015 2:42pm
Location: New Mexico

Re: 10S custom skate ESC: testers wanted!

Post by chaka » Oct 31 2015 5:22am

I made my oshpark V4.10 VESC file public today for anyone wanting to build one of their own. https://oshpark.com/shared_projects/NNzfrwPG

It can be a very rewarding project for those willing to do it. They look good in purple too!

Image

erwincoumans   100 W

100 W
Posts: 141
Joined: Apr 02 2015 11:25pm

Re: 10S custom skate ESC: testers wanted!

Post by erwincoumans » Oct 31 2015 12:40pm

chaka wrote:I made my oshpark V4.10 VESC file public today for anyone wanting to build one of their own.
That is convenient. I didn't realize that the VESC is 4 layer, I thought it was just 2.

It would be great to have such a public link to order ready-assembled VESC in small batches (ignoring the high price for now). Right now it is very complicated to order assembled VESCs, because the number of configuration settings is totally overwhelming. So currently it seems easier to hand-assemble and SMD solder yourself than going to the configuration pages of various assembly houses in the USA or China.

User avatar
chaka   1 kW

1 kW
Posts: 303
Joined: Jul 02 2015 2:42pm
Location: New Mexico

Re: 10S custom skate ESC: testers wanted!

Post by chaka » Oct 31 2015 4:04pm

Accorrding to Benjamin the VESC has always been a 4 layer pcb. OshPark's upload system was not unpacking the zip file properly and leading people to believe it was only a 2 layer board. I had to rename a few file extensions and merge the drill files before everything checked out in the preview. I was holding off on sharing this link until I was sure the boards worked. They do!

Have to hand it to Vedder on the quality of this hardware. The default current control settings are a little tame with a max current of 60 amps, once I increased this to 80 amps that sweet acceleration returned!

Really enjoy the customization that is possible, right angle micro jst connectors for wiiceiver users who need a thin form factor or heatsinks and 0.5mOhm shunts for high output systems. I think we are going to have a lot of fun with this.

Image

Hummina Shadeeba   1 MW

1 MW
Posts: 1943
Joined: Apr 25 2014 10:26pm

Re: 10S custom skate ESC: testers wanted!

Post by Hummina Shadeeba » Oct 31 2015 10:31pm

It says 12s on your site Chaka is that safe? Planning to buy batteries. If I use one receiver for two esc does it need a spliter or something?

User avatar
chaka   1 kW

1 kW
Posts: 303
Joined: Jul 02 2015 2:42pm
Location: New Mexico

Re: 10S custom skate ESC: testers wanted!

Post by chaka » Oct 31 2015 10:46pm

12s is the limit, you need to have a low kv motor or you could damage the VESC. I think 12s allows for a max rpm of 200kv.

This is the limit so care needs to be taken when establishing motor parameters. The VESC turns our boards into a performance machine and as such gives us the ability to drive our hardware beyond its limits.

You can split the signal or run them in tandem using the CANBUS.

User avatar
boisrondevens   100 W

100 W
Posts: 211
Joined: Jul 11 2011 11:30am
Location: Canada
Contact:

Re: 10S custom skate ESC: testers wanted!

Post by boisrondevens » Nov 02 2015 5:56pm

Can i use two esc on the same motor?

Hummina Shadeeba   1 MW

1 MW
Posts: 1943
Joined: Apr 25 2014 10:26pm

Re: 10S custom skate ESC: testers wanted!

Post by Hummina Shadeeba » Nov 02 2015 8:40pm

thats a new question! Definite, possible, probably,..but why would u want to do something like that?

User avatar
boisrondevens   100 W

100 W
Posts: 211
Joined: Jul 11 2011 11:30am
Location: Canada
Contact:

Re: 10S custom skate ESC: testers wanted!

Post by boisrondevens » Nov 02 2015 8:49pm

I'm using the vesc to drive a big revolt rv-120 pro for a ebike. and I would like to push more amps...

chuttney1   100 W

100 W
Posts: 243
Joined: Apr 03 2013 2:44pm
Location: Los Angeles, CA

Re: 10S custom skate ESC: testers wanted!

Post by chuttney1 » Nov 02 2015 11:12pm

boisrondevens wrote:Can i use two esc on the same motor?
Hummina Shadeeba wrote:thats a new question! Definite, possible, probably,..but why would u want to do something like that?
boisrondevens wrote:I'm using the vesc to drive a big revolt rv-120 pro for a ebike. and I would like to push more amps...
Only if the commutation of the electrical signal for each phase are in sync for both VESCs will it work, but I totally disagree trying to run two phases in one wire given the timing issue...

vedder   100 W

100 W
Posts: 249
Joined: Nov 05 2011 9:37pm

Re: 10S custom skate ESC: testers wanted!

Post by vedder » Nov 03 2015 4:21am

Recently I have been spending a lot of time on getting FOC running and currently I have both sensored (with pulse encoder) and sensorless FOC working. My code is inspired by this code:
https://github.com/madcowswe/Servo/blob ... ve/Servo.c
and the sensorless observer is the one described in this paper:
http://cas.ensmp.fr/~praly/Telechargeme ... stolfi.pdf
Oskar who wrote the Servo.c file helped me with getting started. Here is one of his videos:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7gK_3eZ16RI
I will upload something to youtube soon as well.

I will try to push the first implementation to github today if everything goes well. For now there is no auto detection of motor parameters, so that has to be done manually, something like this:
http://cache.freescale.com/files/microc ... df?pspll=1
I would measure the resistance in a different way though. I would run a certain current in the motor from the power supply and measure the voltage drop across one phase and divide that by the current, then divide that by two as described.

Regarding hw 4.10: I haven't tested it myself, but it is awesome that chaka has tested it already and has it working. I have done the FOC testing with v4.8 and the current offset seems to be less of an issue when using space vector modulation. I think FOC will work fine with 4.7 as well and 4.10 should be even better.
Can i use two esc on the same motor?
You can not connect them in parallel since there is PWM output and synchronizing it will be almost impossible. If they aren't in sync they ESCs will blow up for sure. What you can do, if the motor has many pole pairs, is to take the motor apart and connect different groups of pole pairs individually to different ESCs. There are even some motors available that have six wires that go to different groups of pole pairs.
Some of my projects: http://vedder.se
Support my open source ESC development with a small donation

lizard   100 mW

100 mW
Posts: 43
Joined: Oct 29 2014 6:38am
Location: Germany

Re: 10S custom skate ESC: testers wanted!

Post by lizard » Nov 03 2015 8:26am

Awesome.

User avatar
boisrondevens   100 W

100 W
Posts: 211
Joined: Jul 11 2011 11:30am
Location: Canada
Contact:

Re: 10S custom skate ESC: testers wanted!

Post by boisrondevens » Nov 03 2015 1:17pm

Thanks for the respond Vedder.
now your telling me that i can use a 6 phases motor with two controller?
also if a rewire a 3 phase motor that should work too right?

vedder   100 W

100 W
Posts: 249
Joined: Nov 05 2011 9:37pm

Re: 10S custom skate ESC: testers wanted!

Post by vedder » Nov 05 2015 7:18am

boisrondevens wrote:Thanks for the respond Vedder.
now your telling me that i can use a 6 phases motor with two controller?
also if a rewire a 3 phase motor that should work too right?
Yes, that should work (unless I misunderstand what a 6 phase motor is).
Some of my projects: http://vedder.se
Support my open source ESC development with a small donation

vedder   100 W

100 W
Posts: 249
Joined: Nov 05 2011 9:37pm

Re: 10S custom skate ESC: testers wanted!

Post by vedder » Nov 05 2015 2:32pm

Here is a video of the first FOC implementation. Enjoy :-)

Some of my projects: http://vedder.se
Support my open source ESC development with a small donation

User avatar
okp   100 kW

100 kW
Posts: 1153
Joined: Oct 26 2014 3:27pm
Location: Paris
Contact:

Re: 10S custom skate ESC: testers wanted!

Post by okp » Nov 05 2015 3:20pm

OMG ! Impressive !!!!!

Hummina Shadeeba   1 MW

1 MW
Posts: 1943
Joined: Apr 25 2014 10:26pm

Re: 10S custom skate ESC: testers wanted!

Post by Hummina Shadeeba » Nov 05 2015 3:31pm

Awesome!! Silence. Nice job.

Post Reply