Razor A5 LUX E-Scooter 60v (30mph)

Lightweight / Folding / Portable EVs - seats optional
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broman   1 mW

1 mW
Posts: 10
Joined: Sep 16 2018 7:00pm

Razor A5 LUX E-Scooter 60v (30mph)

Post by broman » Sep 16 2018 7:47pm

Hi, long time follower first time poster.

I just turned a Razor into an electric scooter. Right now it's using a 60v 4AH battery pack from Walmart for $60 and a $200 scooter kit from L-Faster. The kit is an 8in 45mm 48v wheel and a 60v controller (100v capacitors) and throttle with LED readout with cruise control and regenerative braking (not hooked up). The scooter can do 54kph which is over 30mph however I am not stupid enough to ride it that fast, I've only gotten to about 30kph which was plenty fast for me. Anyway, the idea behind the build was to make everything as internal as possible and retain the functionality of the original scooter. After it's all said and done, it weighs 17lbs with the battery (battery is 4lbs).

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I'm thinking about changing out the batteries for something that I can fly with (under 100wh per battery). I was thinking 2 24v Kobalt batteries are the next best thing in terms of price and performance.

I had a couple issues with this build that I'm working on, First it's very difficult to 3D print a enclosure for this battery, it's designed to slide in top down which means printing a huge ugly battery enclosure. I also have an error on my LCD screen it's E-07 (my kit came with no documentation), when I really gun the throttle on the scooter the motor makes noises and rapidly slows down (like braking), my guess is the motor isn't able to handle the extra voltage or that because it doesn't have a hall sensor it simply loses place?

So a few questions...

Assuming that the power tool batteries have BMS's in them, is it possible to charge them in series/parallel safely?
Could I use a 48v Charger?
Would 24v Kobalt batteries be a good choice for my application?
Any other battery alternative that would be safe for travel but isn't ridiculously expensive?

ApacheXMD   100 mW

100 mW
Posts: 37
Joined: Nov 05 2008 8:21pm

Re: Razor A5 LUX E-Scooter 60v (30mph)

Post by ApacheXMD » Sep 20 2018 11:39pm

Nice scooter! 30mph is crazy for the little urethane tires but I like it!

Here's my A5 conversion using two 18v Makita batteries in series:
viewtopic.php?f=35&t=75484

You *could* use a "48v" charger if you're careful. Meaning both packs need to in good health and at the same charge state every single time. And the 48v charger would need to have the correct final voltage of both packs. The Kobalt packs are probably 6S packs, so two of those would be 12s, so you're looking at something like 50.4V at full charge. If you're unfamiliar with li-ion bulk charging I'd do more research before attempting charging the packs in series. It would be easier to just get two Kobalt chargers.

The motor controller is likely hitting its upper rpm limit when it starts to bog at high speed. There's probably not much you can do short of swapping to a different controller like one made for Rc cars/planes, etc.

Please think about using regen braking as well, because that stomp brake can't be all that effective at 30kph, much less at 54!

But keep in mind that if you use regen you may need a torque arm or something to keep the axle from spinning or coming loose. It may not be an issue but at least keep an eye on the axle nuts keep them tight!

broman   1 mW

1 mW
Posts: 10
Joined: Sep 16 2018 7:00pm

Re: Razor A5 LUX E-Scooter 60v (30mph)

Post by broman » Oct 02 2018 7:05am

Im too scared to do 30 but its capable. I have gotten to 20 on very smooth road. Unfortunately it doesnt have amazing torque, it easily gets overwhelmed because the controller is designed to use with a hall sensor it'll jam up.

I wonder if i could add regen braking to the fender brake with a switch.

We were 3d printing a case for the battery but have since given up on that.

I think ill switch to my makita batteries or buy some kobalt 20v batteries so that i can put this thing on an airplane. Gotta keep it under 100 watt hours, im currently at 240wh. Hense why we gave up in printing a case for the 60v.

broman   1 mW

1 mW
Posts: 10
Joined: Sep 16 2018 7:00pm

Re: Razor A5 LUX E-Scooter 60v (30mph)

Post by broman » Oct 02 2018 7:06am

ApacheXMD wrote:
Sep 20 2018 11:39pm
Nice scooter! 30mph is crazy for the little urethane tires but I like it!

Here's my A5 conversion using two 18v Makita batteries in series:
viewtopic.php?f=35&t=75484

You *could* use a "48v" charger if you're careful. Meaning both packs need to in good health and at the same charge state every single time. And the 48v charger would need to have the correct final voltage of both packs. The Kobalt packs are probably 6S packs, so two of those would be 12s, so you're looking at something like 50.4V at full charge. If you're unfamiliar with li-ion bulk charging I'd do more research before attempting charging the packs in series. It would be easier to just get two Kobalt chargers.

The motor controller is likely hitting its upper rpm limit when it starts to bog at high speed. There's probably not much you can do short of swapping to a different controller like one made for Rc cars/planes, etc.

Please think about using regen braking as well, because that stomp brake can't be all that effective at 30kph, much less at 54!

But keep in mind that if you use regen you may need a torque arm or something to keep the axle from spinning or coming loose. It may not be an issue but at least keep an eye on the axle nuts keep them tight!
How is your scooter holding up?

ApacheXMD   100 mW

100 mW
Posts: 37
Joined: Nov 05 2008 8:21pm

Re: Razor A5 LUX E-Scooter 60v (30mph)

Post by ApacheXMD » Oct 02 2018 10:05pm

Mine has held up great! I probably put on 300 miles on it. Only issues I had were related to the 3d printed battery clip I made. The solid A5 lux chassis is pretty harsh on the attached clip, and it caused cracks on a few occasions. Nothing I couldn't fix but the vibrations and rattling caused me to swap everything to a new scooter. I won't bog your thread down with my scooter details (gotta update my thread) but it has been reborn and will soon be running 3 Makita packs in series.

But for your scooter I would definately keep an eye out for vibration induced failure. That includes your battery mounts and wiring (solder joints like to fail with vibrations)

I can't imagine relying solely on the friction brake even at 25 or 30kph. Get the regen figured out to help you out.

Flying with a diy electric scooter will probably get a lot of questions even if you're under the 100wh. I was once denied checking an electric chainsaw :(

broman   1 mW

1 mW
Posts: 10
Joined: Sep 16 2018 7:00pm

Re: Razor A5 LUX E-Scooter 60v (30mph)

Post by broman » Oct 03 2018 1:27am

ApacheXMD wrote:
Oct 02 2018 10:05pm
Mine has held up great! I probably put on 300 miles on it. Only issues I had were related to the 3d printed battery clip I made. The solid A5 lux chassis is pretty harsh on the attached clip, and it caused cracks on a few occasions. Nothing I couldn't fix but the vibrations and rattling caused me to swap everything to a new scooter. I won't bog your thread down with my scooter details (gotta update my thread) but it has been reborn and will soon be running 3 Makita packs in series.

But for your scooter I would definately keep an eye out for vibration induced failure. That includes your battery mounts and wiring (solder joints like to fail with vibrations)

I can't imagine relying solely on the friction brake even at 25 or 30kph. Get the regen figured out to help you out.

Flying with a diy electric scooter will probably get a lot of questions even if you're under the 100wh. I was once denied checking an electric chainsaw :(

I noticed this scooter is really rough. Have you thought about strapping your batteries in? The reason you might have breaks is due to the clips holding them in, they may not be up to the task due to the vibration. If you hold them in with perhaps velcro straps, or 3D print some sort of retainer you'd probably be better off.

My friction brake works great, tested it in SF doing 25kph, man there are so many electric scooters now.

ApacheXMD   100 mW

100 mW
Posts: 37
Joined: Nov 05 2008 8:21pm

Re: Razor A5 LUX E-Scooter 60v (30mph)

Post by ApacheXMD » Oct 03 2018 3:03pm

Yeah thought about it, but went a different direction.
I bought a few of the Makita battery USB phone charger things and modified them to use as battery clips. The injection molded plastic is way more vibration resistant than a 3d printed part.

To facilitate charging multiple packs I bought a dual bay Makita charger on ebay for cheap. So that along with the single I had, I can charge 3 batteries simultaneously. Makes battery swaps easy.

broman   1 mW

1 mW
Posts: 10
Joined: Sep 16 2018 7:00pm

Re: Razor A5 LUX E-Scooter 60v (30mph)

Post by broman » Oct 05 2018 5:45pm

Have you thought about leaving the packs on and charging them on the scooter?

broman   1 mW

1 mW
Posts: 10
Joined: Sep 16 2018 7:00pm

Re: Razor A5 LUX E-Scooter 60v (30mph)

Post by broman » Oct 06 2018 11:19am

New Pix
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ApacheXMD   100 mW

100 mW
Posts: 37
Joined: Nov 05 2008 8:21pm

Re: Razor A5 LUX E-Scooter 60v (30mph)

Post by ApacheXMD » Oct 06 2018 11:54pm

broman wrote:
Oct 05 2018 5:45pm
Have you thought about leaving the packs on and charging them on the scooter?
No, the purpose of my build was to commute to work where we use Makita tools. There I can charge up my batteries using the readily available Makita chargers. So having removable batteries was key for my charger.

Got any videos of your scooter running?

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