10kW stand-up scooter with air suspension

Lightweight / Folding / Portable EVs - seats optional
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Emoto   10 kW

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Re: Stand-up scooter "VOSTOK 1"

Post by Emoto » Dec 15 2018 4:48am

Thanks for the effort and detail on this build ... your a crazy man with that mill :D= This is ART!! ,
If i missed it What is the magnet width/ hight. 70mm im guessing.
And please keep stating your max batt/phase amps + temps = very interesting, id love to find a 100mm magnet / stator motor that can take 6'' tyres but i dont think they exist.

alex_2d   1 W

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Re: Stand-up scooter "VOSTOK 1"

Post by alex_2d » Dec 15 2018 4:50am

It's a stator's time :)
It was just pathetic to watch..
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Washed, something altered and painted with high-temperature paint
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Still, I succumbed to the desire to shove the radiator everywhere :-D
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By this point, the nucгlar controller has a weakening of the field. Given this, to maintain the current maximum speed and raise the torque, I decided to make 8 turns in the winding
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And just looking at this picture, I realized that the tire tread is not in the right direction. Decided to leave it out =)
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Here's what it looks like in action

Last edited by alex_2d on Dec 15 2018 5:39am, edited 1 time in total.

alex_2d   1 W

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Re: Stand-up scooter "VOSTOK 1"

Post by alex_2d » Dec 15 2018 5:09am

Thanks :)
Emoto wrote:
Dec 15 2018 4:48am
If i missed it What is the magnet width/ hight. 70mm im guessing.
Almost ;) Magnets 60х3мм
Emoto wrote:
Dec 15 2018 4:48am
And please keep stating your max batt/phase amps + temps = very interesting
Sure =) In the last video max batt - 55A (4160 watts), phase amps - 110. In this mode, the motor is heated to 110 degrees for 15 minutes. Continuous load without overheating - 30A batt (2200w)

alex_2d   1 W

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Re: Stand-up scooter "VOSTOK 1"

Post by alex_2d » Dec 15 2018 5:26am

Rummaging through the wilds, I bent the rear brake disc :(
To avoid this in the future, decided to make a new, thicker. For these purposes, a good fit was found at the dump old saw :)
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I didn't expect the braking efficiency to increase so much! Now the wheel is easily locked by pressing one finger!

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icherouveim   100 W

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Re: Stand-up scooter "VOSTOK 1"

Post by icherouveim » Dec 15 2018 5:47am

This is a great upgrade but how did you manage to make it so much wider without to change the axle?

Did you put some glue between the motor and the covers in order to prevent air leakage?

Whete did you make the hole for the air valve ? as you said only some mm left outside of the motor!

LeftieBiker   1 kW

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Re: Stand-up scooter "VOSTOK 1"

Post by LeftieBiker » Dec 15 2018 6:15am

And just looking at this picture, I realized that the tire tread is not in the right direction. Decided to leave it out =)
You may get better traction in dirt this way, but with less traction on wet pavement.

alex_2d   1 W

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Re: Stand-up scooter "VOSTOK 1"

Post by alex_2d » Dec 15 2018 6:32am

icherouveim wrote:
Dec 15 2018 5:47am
This is a great upgrade but how did you manage to make it so much wider without to change the axle?
it's easy =)
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icherouveim wrote:
Dec 15 2018 5:47am
Did you put some glue between the motor and the covers in order to prevent air leakage?
Rubber rings to prevent oil leakage. Resilient sealant to prevent air leakage :)
9-1.jpg
icherouveim wrote:
Dec 15 2018 5:47am
Whete did you make the hole for the air valve ?
it's easy to ^_^
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alex_2d   1 W

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Re: Stand-up scooter "VOSTOK 1"

Post by alex_2d » Dec 15 2018 6:46am

A little bit about the nucular controller.
I studied the proposals for the controllers. Several even bought. But none could satisfy my needs... Accidentally finding a nucular controller, I was very surprised!! it was 11 out of 10 !!! Deciding to participate in the beta-test, I have never regretted. I had the opportunity to test on myself how the developers optimize the software and add new features. With each new firmware my scooter was getting better. It's really amazing when you can reduce the temperature of the motor by a few degrees by simply inserting a micro SD card =) or raise the maximum speed by 20% :)
And the ability to configure any parameter at all, is simply priceless.
After a year of use, I can say with confidence - that this is the best of all controller(imho).
If remove the emotion, the facts are:
1. at the moment, almost all the functions requested by users are implemented (including me).
2. For all the time there was no failure due to the fault of the controller.
3. The motor evenly produces excellent torque throughout the range of speed, without any jerks.

Here's a video from the regenerative braking test. At 2:23, you can clearly see how it works.

alex_2d   1 W

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Re: Stand-up scooter "VOSTOK 1"

Post by alex_2d » Dec 15 2018 7:55am

With increasing power, increased average speed and errors made in the design of the front suspension became a serious problem

It was impossible to postpone and I began to make the front suspension 2.0
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And suddenly there was a surprise. I broke the display case without going outside....
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I ask'd the controller developers of the 3D-model display and adapted her to CNC. For couple of days it turned out here is such a pleasant thing.
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Now, if I fall on the display, it will do damage:-D

alex_2d   1 W

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Re: Stand-up scooter "VOSTOK 1"

Post by alex_2d » Dec 15 2018 8:35am

While I was engaged in an upgrade and repair, the parcel with spare parts for the cooling system came:
1.jpeg
The working principle of the cooling system is simple. Hot oil is pumped out of motor and enters the first heat exchanger on rear wall of the deck. Then through the hoses to second heat exchanger on front of the deck, after the pump. From the pump to third heat exchanger, then to the expansion tank. Created by pumping hot oil vacuum, sucks the cold oil from expansion tank. All heat exchangers are connected to the deck via thermal paste.
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Incredibly difficult had to drill a hole in the axis of the motor for oil circulation. It took 3 hours.
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Taking the opportunity, once again rewound the motor. Back to 7 turns. Tested the drying mode of the windings at the nucular controller. It was very convenient!!!
10.jpeg



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icherouveim   100 W

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Re: Stand-up scooter "VOSTOK 1"

Post by icherouveim » Dec 15 2018 9:06am

Come on!!! How many times did you have to rewound the motor?? It seems you had lot of free time to do this.

Does the cooling system work? Can you increase the power now?

In one of your videos there is a woman that goes faster than you. I thought you are the only crazy rider in this city!! This little thing can overpass a car!!

alex_2d   1 W

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Re: Stand-up scooter "VOSTOK 1"

Post by alex_2d » Dec 15 2018 9:51am

icherouveim wrote:
Dec 15 2018 9:06am
Come on!!! How many times did you have to rewound the motor?? It seems you had lot of free time to do this.
Just 4 times =) Last time it took 5 hours. And yes, after I got divorced, I had a lot more time :-D
icherouveim wrote:
Dec 15 2018 9:06am
Does the cooling system work? Can you increase the power now?
Hell yeah! I've increased the power to 5,200 watts. That's the most my battery can do..
max batt - 70A , phase - 150A. It was hard to get the cooling system to work as it needed to. Many changes were made to the initial design. But in the end, my battery can not now overheat the motor. When the cooling system is turned on, at a constant load of 45A batt, the temperature is stabilized at 60-65 degrees.
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Last edited by alex_2d on Dec 16 2018 2:42am, edited 1 time in total.

alex_2d   1 W

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Re: Stand-up scooter "VOSTOK 1"

Post by alex_2d » Dec 15 2018 10:05am

About the new front suspension. It's fantastic! The new suspension geometry returns the wheel to the driving line when it hits an obstacle. It is possible to comfortably control the scooter with one hand. I even tried to go without hands =) Perfect handling at any speed on any road !



Some beautiful photos:
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icherouveim   100 W

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Re: Stand-up scooter "VOSTOK 1"

Post by icherouveim » Dec 15 2018 10:23am

This is one of the most interesting projects I've seen in ES because you've tried to balance everything in this project. Power, Handling, Comfort, Breaking power, Cooling system for continues high power and good autonomy. Now you just need a second one for company.
BTW I'm sorry about your divorce, normally Russian wives are good.

TilmanBaumann   100 W

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Re: 5200W stand-up scooter with air suspension

Post by TilmanBaumann » Dec 15 2018 1:17pm

Russian husbands aren't always. ;)

alex_2d   1 W

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Re: 5200W stand-up scooter with air suspension

Post by alex_2d » Dec 15 2018 1:27pm

Dude, out of everything written above, you decided to comment on that? Really? :lol:

TilmanBaumann   100 W

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Re: 5200W stand-up scooter with air suspension

Post by TilmanBaumann » Dec 15 2018 1:41pm

Hehe, yea sorry man. I felt like mocking this careless sexist comment.

I'm on the floor by your build. I actually decided to go through it again this evening with some more time. So much information and nerd porn.

I'm sure you must have considered building and selling those? Sorry, no pressure. But I'm sure not just me would love to pay for such obsessive engineering...

How is the steering geometry actually? Can you lean in to steer and drive one handed? (Remember my Plankalkül Idea)
I have this vision of pretty much surfing the street.
I guess with slightly more extreme angles your steering is pretty much already that.

Ianhill   1 MW

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Re: 5200W stand-up scooter with air suspension

Post by Ianhill » Dec 15 2018 3:33pm

Alex 2d :bigthumb:
You are the best scooter creator I've ever come across that is a work of art !, I don't like flat rear tyres to much they do not turn the best but the heatsink and the frame is just a stunner, what's the handle bar setup threaded fork ? An oversized tapered headtube with dual longer throw fox float air shock front and back would be like magic carpet ride, be high up mind stand close on 8ft probs.

I've only just seen the thread I'll read this one when I got time can't wait.

alex_2d   1 W

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Re: 5200W stand-up scooter with air suspension

Post by alex_2d » Dec 16 2018 3:16pm

TilmanBaumann wrote:
Dec 15 2018 1:41pm
Hehe, yea sorry man.

Don't worry, man, I appreciate the joke :) I felt like mocking this obvious offtop :-D

I don't have a product to sell. What you see is 0.000..00034a version =) Raw sample at the testing stage.
TilmanBaumann wrote:
Dec 15 2018 1:41pm
Can you lean in to steer and drive one handed?
Yes, I tried to control one hand to a speed of 50 kmh, it is possible and quite comfortable, but only on a flat road. The fact that the acceleration of 0-50kmh in 4 seconds, the handle bar must be held with both hands.
TilmanBaumann wrote:
Dec 15 2018 1:41pm
How is the steering geometry actually?
It is easier to show =)
This is the first, failed version of the suspension with one shock:
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This is the second version with two shock:
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TilmanBaumann   100 W

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Re: 5200W stand-up scooter with air suspension

Post by TilmanBaumann » Dec 16 2018 3:21pm

I suppose if the angle is made even flatter, leaning in to surf around the corner is even more possible.
But I guess it messes with the off-road steering because it will resist steering input.

Don't worry, it is very obvious that a solid handlebar is required. But on a good road I think it could feel real nice to stand sideways with one hand on the steering column.
I sometimes do this with my Xiaomi m365, but it's really dangerous with the small wheel and high instability.

alex_2d   1 W

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Re: 5200W stand-up scooter with air suspension

Post by alex_2d » Dec 16 2018 4:14pm

TilmanBaumann wrote:
Dec 16 2018 3:21pm
I suppose if the angle is made even flatter, leaning in to surf around the corner is even more possible.
Here you are absolutely right! At an angle, you mean rake? Increasing the angle of the headtube will increase the trail. This will give the opportunity to surfing like Plankalkül =) But on the arm suspension it makes no sense to increase the rake. You can achieve the same effect by increasing the trail, moving the front wheel back.
The larger the trail, the harder it is to turn the handlebar at low speed. You have to move the entire weight of the scooter with rider when you turn the handlebar.
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TilmanBaumann wrote:
Dec 16 2018 3:21pm
But on a good road I think it could feel real nice to stand sideways with one hand on the steering column.
I specifically designed a wide deck that would put your feet in a row :) imho, that it is much more convenient to travel long distances. I always help myself in turns, shifts from one foot to the other

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armandd   10 W

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Re: 5200W stand-up scooter with air suspension

Post by armandd » Dec 16 2018 8:03pm

Wow, what an amazing build! :shock: :bigthumb: So this is how Russians build their stand-up scooter. Scary...

alex_2d   1 W

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Re: 5200W stand-up scooter with air suspension

Post by alex_2d » Dec 17 2018 5:54am

Ianhill wrote:
Dec 15 2018 3:33pm
I don't like flat rear tyres to much they do not turn the best
I too was afraid of poor handling because of the wide rear tires. But in practice, deterioration of the control I do not see. There are only advantages of increased traction.
Ianhill wrote:
Dec 15 2018 3:33pm
what's the handle bar setup threaded fork ?
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alex_2d   1 W

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Re: 5200W stand-up scooter with air suspension

Post by alex_2d » Dec 17 2018 9:59am

Ladies and gentlemen, I'm glad to welcome you back to our CNCporn club :-)
Today our guest will be a headlight 12'000lm
Led - 34v\3.5A
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Lens from a car headlight 3"
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A lot of duralumin plate and time
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Low beam
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High beam
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So shine headlights Smart Roadster
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Let the brightness of that light illuminate but not blind
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Cons - very warm and eats a lot :)

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icherouveim   100 W

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Re: Stand-up scooter "VOSTOK 1"

Post by icherouveim » Dec 17 2018 10:05am

alex_2d wrote:
Dec 15 2018 8:35am
While I was engaged in an upgrade and repair, the parcel with spare parts for the cooling system came:
1.jpeg
The working principle of the cooling system is simple. Hot oil is pumped out of motor and enters the first heat exchanger on rear wall of the deck. Then through the hoses to second heat exchanger on front of the deck, after the pump. From the pump to third heat exchanger, then to the expansion tank. Created by pumping hot oil vacuum, sucks the cold oil from expansion tank. All heat exchangers are connected to the deck via thermal paste.
2.jpeg3.jpeg4.jpeg5.jpeg6.jpeg
Incredibly difficult had to drill a hole in the axis of the motor for oil circulation. It took 3 hours.
7.jpeg8.jpeg9.jpeg
Taking the opportunity, once again rewound the motor. Back to 7 turns. Tested the drying mode of the windings at the nucular controller. It was very convenient!!!
10.jpeg


OK so let's go back to the topic.

I understand "almost" everything about your project except how the oil flows thru the motor.
As you've said you've drilled the right side of the axle and then what ? I lost it.
How the hot oil exits from the motor ?
If you have some time please show me.

Also did you think to use a computer radiator with the electric pump like some ebikers do to cool down the hub motors ?

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