Electric Surf Board

Boats, Jet Skis, Kayaks etc., including hovercrafts

Re: Electric Surf Board

Postby Jezza » Thu May 11, 2017 10:25 am

dirkdiggler wrote:Not too impressive on the water, but looks like a working concept. The motor looks like a 6364 size, could be bigger.
They have a few pictures on a website, don't speak or read Spanish so don't know if there are any other details to be found.
https://www.behance.net/gallery/43562273/RAYBOARD-ELECTRIC-SURFBOARD


That's a lot of effort put into a bad design.

There's a reason the Jetsurf is flat underneath:
- easier to get on the plane and faster top speed.
- better turning (also helped by better rails)
- more stable

Even the older stand-up 550/650 jetski's had a relatively flat hull.
Last edited by Jezza on Thu May 11, 2017 11:00 am, edited 1 time in total. View post history.
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Re: Electric Surf Board

Postby Bazaki » Fri May 12, 2017 2:34 am

Hey Guys,

No secrets here anymore.

Months I have thought to set up my own company with an electric jet surf, so I could not really share my details.
But I'm doing other things lately and the jetsurf is just standing here. So I want to share all details now.

I found out the exact details of the Lampuga jetsurf.

Lehner motor 7040/6 about 1000 euro
MHZ jetdrive 64mm about 650 euro
Mgm compro ESC ( 25063 ) I think it was their industrial ESC not the hobby esc. about 1000 euro
14s lipo

I bought the same motor and jet drive, very expensive. and bought the cheap flier waterproof 420a esc.
First I bought the swordfish 300a + but gave only 50% throttle, never worked well.

Here is the old video:



The board is a surfboard with too much rocker and the board is too small. Also I had some water leaking in.

Now I made a plexi glass box, so I can test it at home under water and everything is 100% waterproof, even the lid that is on top. Works perfectly dry.
Watercooling is running good, and I use 14s lipo, the motor runs 320rpm kv unloaded and with load 280 rpm kv. So that is about 15.000 rpm for the jet.

It is not as with an ebike, with this you need 11kw continiously, so the efficienty needs to be as high as possible, everything needs to match perfectly.

At 55kv it takes about 200A and everything stays pretty cold, but somehow I burned 2x a Flier 420A esc. I'm also not sure why the esc broke, it was running fine under load, cut off throttle and it didn't work. Now I wanted to invest in the mgm compro but cost about 1000 euro.

I also found a company that can make me custom board, so the next step is a board about 80cm width and almost flat, no rocker line.



This box can fit inside and out a custom board, so easy to install and no leaking. So you don't have to work inside a board or make the board waterproof.

Maybe I will sell this whole set up if anyone is interessted.
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Re: Electric Surf Board

Postby Gege2000 » Mon May 15, 2017 12:58 pm

msk8 wrote:Hi fellow efoil builders, here an update on my design thoughts and prototyping progress. Here a list of the components I will be using: https://www.dropbox.com/s/d31ti8819uahm ... .xlsx?dl=0. Looking forward to hearing your thoughts.


Hi msk8, you are doing an awesome job, thank you for your vids, can't wait to see the results! :D :D :D
It's maybe possible to make a closed circuit with a little tank and a radiator for the water of the ESC, it will be more simple than tubes in the mast.

Have you think about the voltage? What is the pitch of the propeller? I think you must be able to go at 25km/h to be good. Have you made little calculations (with the sliding in the water, and so on)?

Best regards,
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Re: Electric Surf Board

Postby mr.electric » Tue May 16, 2017 2:35 am

This is really bad ass. I want one.
-Fat Sand Bike with 9c and 29ah pack

-Giants mascot scooter
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Re: Electric Surf Board

Postby Frizzo » Mon May 22, 2017 10:56 am

Bazaki wrote:Hey Guys,

No secrets here anymore.

Months I have thought to set up my own company with an electric jet surf, so I could not really share my details.
But I'm doing other things lately and the jetsurf is just standing here. So I want to share all details now.

I found out the exact details of the Lampuga jetsurf.

Lehner motor 7040/6 about 1000 euro
MHZ jetdrive 64mm about 650 euro
Mgm compro ESC ( 25063 ) I think it was their industrial ESC not the hobby esc. about 1000 euro
14s lipo

I bought the same motor and jet drive, very expensive. and bought the cheap flier waterproof 420a esc.
First I bought the swordfish 300a + but gave only 50% throttle, never worked well.

Here is the old video:



The board is a surfboard with too much rocker and the board is too small. Also I had some water leaking in.

Now I made a plexi glass box, so I can test it at home under water and everything is 100% waterproof, even the lid that is on top. Works perfectly dry.
Watercooling is running good, and I use 14s lipo, the motor runs 320rpm kv unloaded and with load 280 rpm kv. So that is about 15.000 rpm for the jet.

It is not as with an ebike, with this you need 11kw continiously, so the efficienty needs to be as high as possible, everything needs to match perfectly.

At 55kv it takes about 200A and everything stays pretty cold, but somehow I burned 2x a Flier 420A esc. I'm also not sure why the esc broke, it was running fine under load, cut off throttle and it didn't work. Now I wanted to invest in the mgm compro but cost about 1000 euro.

I also found a company that can make me custom board, so the next step is a board about 80cm width and almost flat, no rocker line.



This box can fit inside and out a custom board, so easy to install and no leaking. So you don't have to work inside a board or make the board waterproof.

Maybe I will sell this whole set up if anyone is interessted.


Hi Everyone 1st of all. :)

Bazaki, for how many minutes can you surf with your configuration? I´m looking to build a surfjet with the same configuration and am wondering what I need for like 20 min of fun :)
Ps. What is about the 3D printed version of the jet pump? How much thrust can you generate from one of those?
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Re: Electric Surf Board

Postby fabianpusch » Tue May 23, 2017 10:47 am

Hi at all

I have nearly the same setup.
As battery I have used a 16S4P 38140SE Headway configuration and at the moment I am using a 16S1P LiPo from Kokam with crazy 53Ah. The Headway setup was really stable lets say idiot safe but a little heavy.
Cruising time about 25-30 minutes. It is a 48 Ah configuration. Now with the Kokam it should be around 35-40 minutes.
As motor I use also a Lehner and I use the MGM Compro the so called industrial version.
I can post the specs of the controller.

By the way, I am using an Emus BMS with the small cell modules.

The board is fully made of carbon.
If someone is interested, the Headway cells will ne sold for a cheap prize.

Have a nice evening
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Re: Electric Surf Board

Postby hardwiring » Wed May 24, 2017 6:12 pm

Jezza wrote:Looking at eFr3ak numbers from when he submitted his component list:

Performance:
Max Power: 9.8 kW (205 A @ 46.7 V)
Max Speed: ca. 44 km/h (probably higher as max throttle was never applied for a longer time than 2s)
Max RPM (prop) : 6800 rpm
Planning speed: ca. 20-25 km/h
Power @ planning speed: ca. 3.2 kW

One can get a rough idea of what may work. For an efficient foil, you can generate lift at around 4-8mph depending on rider weight.
With the same components you could then guesstimate that to generate lift you need around 1.6kW of power.

The most frustrating part of this build is picking the correct gearbox!! They are insanely expensive and not very easy to find within the required specs.

Through my browsing and research I have come some other solutions with less powerful motors (more for just cruising):

The scubajet: https://shop.scubajet.com/
Vorta power system: http://www.vortapowersystems.com/Vorta- ... motor.html
Electrafin: https://www.currentdrives.com/products/electrafin
Epropulsion Lagoon: http://www.epropulsion.com/lagoon


We need an efoil thread... it's made an old lurker like me come over from the darkside (that skateboard forum) and join, hi from the UK BTW
The things I am researching so far....
Is a gearbox essential?
Will starting with a foamy then structuring wood as required, finally glassing the cojones out it be a viable option for a usable board?
Should I wait a year and see whats inside the lift and jetfoiler boards?
Will this rash go away on its own?
Will 12s be sufficient?
Who will copyright FESC?
Will I finish this Emountain board or move to the sea before I finish?

BTW @msk8 you are my hero, keep us informed when that motor arrives, thanks for your work and sharing, my printer is slaving away night and day ATM and soon I hope to be following your lead
My signature........

esk8 80% complete but cruising around ...... Electric ATB 60% waiting on parts


Informative motor piece 'Fishing and electric trolling of the late 80's 'http://newportvessels.com/freshwater-saltwater-electric-trolling-motors/
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Re: Electric Surf Board

Postby yoyoman » Wed May 24, 2017 7:23 pm

I second having a separate e-foil board.
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Re: Electric Surf Board

Postby Jezza » Thu May 25, 2017 6:28 am

hardwiring wrote:We need an efoil thread... it's made an old lurker like me come over from the darkside (that skateboard forum) and join, hi from the UK BTW
The things I am researching so far....
Is a gearbox essential?
Will starting with a foamy then structuring wood as required, finally glassing the cojones out it be a viable option for a usable board?
Should I wait a year and see whats inside the lift and jetfoiler boards?
Will this rash go away on its own?
Will 12s be sufficient?
Who will copyright FESC?
Will I finish this Emountain board or move to the sea before I finish?

BTW @msk8 you are my hero, keep us informed when that motor arrives, thanks for your work and sharing, my printer is slaving away night and day ATM and soon I hope to be following your lead


I'll get an E-Foil thread created shortly.
- The need for a gearbox comes down to motor kV and what size prop/impeller you want to run. A slower kV motor and smaller prop (with kort nozzle) or jet system can run direct. A higher kV will need gearing so that you can make use of the power efficiently.
- The problem with a foamy is that it needs a solid core to attach the hydrofoil. An old windsurfer would be the cheapest option and they are readily available on ebay.
- If you really want to optimise the component list, then you can wait I guess. But whats the fun in waiting...
- Rash? don't stick things where they shouldn't be ;)
- 12s will be enough.
- FESC...wonder what else would be needed that a boat ESC doesn't offer.
- Move to the sea before anything else! The sea is the best place!
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Re: Electric Surf Board

Postby Jezza » Thu May 25, 2017 7:07 am

Hi All
I have now made a new thread for E-foils. It can be found here:

viewtopic.php?f=39&t=88524
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Re: Electric Surf Board

Postby Bazaki » Thu Jun 08, 2017 1:31 pm

viewtopic.php?f=9&t=88790&p=1294823#p1294823


If someone wants a good jet drive for a surfboard, Im selling mine
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Re: Electric Surf Board

Postby ropower86 » Sun Jun 18, 2017 1:03 pm

Frizzo wrote:
Bazaki wrote:Hey Guys,

No secrets here anymore.

Months I have thought to set up my own company with an electric jet surf, so I could not really share my details.
But I'm doing other things lately and the jetsurf is just standing here. So I want to share all details now.

I found out the exact details of the Lampuga jetsurf.

Lehner motor 7040/6 about 1000 euro
MHZ jetdrive 64mm about 650 euro
Mgm compro ESC ( 25063 ) I think it was their industrial ESC not the hobby esc. about 1000 euro
14s lipo

I bought the same motor and jet drive, very expensive. and bought the cheap flier waterproof 420a esc.
First I bought the swordfish 300a + but gave only 50% throttle, never worked well.

Here is the old video:



The board is a surfboard with too much rocker and the board is too small. Also I had some water leaking in.

Now I made a plexi glass box, so I can test it at home under water and everything is 100% waterproof, even the lid that is on top. Works perfectly dry.
Watercooling is running good, and I use 14s lipo, the motor runs 320rpm kv unloaded and with load 280 rpm kv. So that is about 15.000 rpm for the jet.

It is not as with an ebike, with this you need 11kw continiously, so the efficienty needs to be as high as possible, everything needs to match perfectly.

At 55kv it takes about 200A and everything stays pretty cold, but somehow I burned 2x a Flier 420A esc. I'm also not sure why the esc broke, it was running fine under load, cut off throttle and it didn't work. Now I wanted to invest in the mgm compro but cost about 1000 euro.

I also found a company that can make me custom board, so the next step is a board about 80cm width and almost flat, no rocker line.



This box can fit inside and out a custom board, so easy to install and no leaking. So you don't have to work inside a board or make the board waterproof.

Maybe I will sell this whole set up if anyone is interessted.


Hi Everyone 1st of all. :)

Bazaki, for how many minutes can you surf with your configuration? I´m looking to build a surfjet with the same configuration and am wondering what I need for like 20 min of fun :)
Ps. What is about the 3D printed version of the jet pump? How much thrust can you generate from one of those?



I believe I know why your 420a ESC stop working. How many rides did you make before the ESC stop working? Were you going full throttle all the rides on the board? What were the consistent amps going full throttle?
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Re: Electric Surf Board

Postby ropower86 » Sun Jun 18, 2017 1:32 pm

Bazaki wrote:https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=88790&p=1294823#p1294823


If someone wants a good jet drive for a surfboard, Im selling mine


How much are you letting go for?
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Re: Electric Surf Board

Postby Bazaki » Sun Jun 18, 2017 2:40 pm

325 euro for the jet free shipping.

The motor was running fine letting go of throttle and controller died.
At least, some kind of timing error.

And i also think why, battery wires were pretty long and motor/esc wires were very short.

I found this.
https://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthr ... orkarounds

I think this is important for us to consider.
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Re: Electric Surf Board

Postby ropower86 » Mon Jun 19, 2017 12:11 am

Yes, it is something to consider. I just burned out a 400a ESC in a different scenario and I just got it this past Wednesday but the thing is we need to know all the little things that can affect the valuable parts. It's devastating to see an expensive ESC, brushless motor, or battery to catch on fire or stop working, the thrive is for longevity!
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Re: Electric Surf Board

Postby ropower86 » Mon Jun 19, 2017 1:42 pm

Bazaki, I let my buddy know about the jet pump, he wanted to buy one for the longest. What do you think about this motor KDE 295Kv brushless motor for a jet board I know its a little bit smaller than those actual motor but It packs a powerful punch.

KDE 295kv

SPECS

Material: Neodymium N45SH
Kv: 295 rpm/V
Maximum Current: 250+ A (2 sec)
Maximum Power: 12,750+ W (2 sec)
Continuous Current: 135+ A
Continuous Power: 6,875+ W
Maximum Efficiency: 92%
Optimized Voltage: 51.8V (14S)
Voltage Range: 44.4V (12S) - 59.2V (16S)
Io (@10V): 1.0 A
Rm (Winding Resistance): 0.029 Ω
Magnetic Poles: 8 (12S8P)
Bearings: Quad, 698ZZ/MR148ZZ
Mount Pattern: M4x30mm & M3x25mm
Shaft Diameter: 6mm (8mm internal)
Shaft Length: 41mm
Motor Diameter: 56mm
Motor Length: 74.5mm
Motor Weight: 645g (685g with Wires/Bullets)
Cooling System: High-Volume Centrifugal Fan
Motor Timing: 5° - 15°
ESC PWM Rate: 8-12 kHz
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Re: Electric Surf Board

Postby Bazaki » Mon Jun 19, 2017 3:39 pm

Hi,

I think it is a bit too small, you do need about 11kw to get a board on plane. Maybe a wider board and light person it is ok.

Kv and voltage is ok. But i think you need watercooling also
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Re: Electric Surf Board

Postby ropower86 » Mon Jun 19, 2017 4:30 pm

I won a bid on Ebay for this motor yesterday evening, thought I would not win it. But it is a $300 motor and it is made to take stress for 3d flying in a 700/800 helicopter, Figure that this could be a fit for the water but I got it for $132. Now, I'm realizing it is a bit smaller than my previous motor that I have on the board right now that is from a GreenWorks 40v digi-pro chainsaw. Ha Ha Ha, yes I am using a brushless chainsaw motor. Another thing, I blew $7000 on things that I thought could be fitted for the jet board build which I did not know anything about. I am around 190lbs so this might blow bubbles in the water ha ha ha! How long did it take you to get to the final stage? I will try to post pics on this forum once I learn how to.
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Re: Electric Surf Board

Postby Bazaki » Tue Jun 20, 2017 1:09 am

I also spend a whole lot of money to build an electric outboard that can get a boat in plane. Than i spend a lot for the electric surfboard. The final stage would have been a wider board with flat bottom, almost no rocker line. They dont exist i think so you need to have it custom build. Or maybe a wide formula surfboard
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Re: Electric Surf Board

Postby ropower86 » Sat Jun 24, 2017 3:43 pm

WoW! I know you have, So are you completing this project for your recreational use or to get in business with?
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Re: Electric Surf Board

Postby methods » Sun Jun 25, 2017 11:58 am

Yesterday the Kite Surfers were out.... one was (whats the name? Hydrofoil?) hovering a few feet over the water.

Years of single ski on the water, snow boarding on ice, slush, and powder, long boarding on rough roads... tells me that the ultimate design will not have the board right on the water. Board will float over the chop and wake. Minimize resistance in the water.. float over the disturbance.

Some of the gnarliest big wave surfers are starting to ride these boards... even saw an info-tisement for a powered board that hovers. Looks like it actually was working.

Chop is gnarly
Glassy water is hard to find
Over 20mph on chop is hell (for me)... I can water ski on chop... but it is about 10% as fun as water skiing on glass.

Same with big wave surfing... I have dropped in on >15' waves in the harshest chop and smoothest glass. The days on glass were pure magic... but there are like 3 a year. The chop days were uncrowded, happen often, and man... if I could have been 2-3 feet off the surface... it would have been amazing.

I bodyboard... so when I reach terminal velocity on a big wave the spray and drag are so gnarly that I have to run blind for seconds at a time. No vision, no air, just bombing it on memory and feel.

Glad you guys are going for it.
Go big.

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The current reasons I do not daily drive a pure EV:
* Lease mileage caps. I commute a minimum of 26,000 miles a year + weekends.
* I drive a minimum of 100 miles a day and can not trust that I can charge on location - so I need a 100+ mile range.
* I want to tinker... can I tinker on my Lease Car if I share the R&D?
* Weather - I need an enclosed vehicle. Motorcycle wont fly with a 5yo in the rain.
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