Another New Puma Test - 500W 320RPM - 13 min Video

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knoxie   10 MW

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Another New Puma Test - 500W 320RPM - 13 min Video

Post by knoxie » Sep 12 2007 8:37pm

Hello

Well I have been busy, the next one of the batch has had a test, I am very pleased with it indeed, its late so I cant stop, just grab a bag of popcorn and a cup of tea and have a look, Riding a BMX one handed and filming at the same time is not for the faint hearted :lol: check out the noise from my shoes when I realize that I only can brake with one hand! ha ha.

Hope you like, its on google video, its too big for youtube, sorry!

As soon as it clears US customs Ill post the Link!

Knoxie

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Post by ChopperMan » Sep 13 2007 3:30am

Hi Knoxie,

I found your video this morning http://video.google.co.uk/videoplay?doc ... 9257521339 sorry couldn't wait for your to get up from your late night and post the link :D

Very informative! The hub looks slightly larger? Is it a new body/chassis the motor sits in?

Am I right in saying that the older Puma's had a nylon ring gear? If so, has the change from a nylon ring gear to metal increased noise?

I purchased my Puma from Mark in early August. I still haven't tried mine out as I'm building a new chopper frame, another few weeks and I'll post full specs and speed distance etc.

Thanks for taking to time to record your experiments, they have influenced my buying decisions immensely.

Cheers,

Ian

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Post by knoxie » Sep 13 2007 4:22am

Hello Ian

Not a problem, I was up really late messing about and didn't get to bed till 2.30! nice strong cup of coffee and I am good now.

No problems, thanks for posting the link, I hope people enjoy it, I tried to make it more of a build and swap video than an on board video test.

The older Pumas are still ok and yes they do have an all metal ring gear, its just not quite as substantial as this one, however it works fine, all of the motors have nylon planetary gears, the main drive reduction gear from the rotor body is steel, you cant easily see this as its hidden behind the free wheel clutch body.

You wont be disappointed with the Puma, the only problem with one I had was an old one where the rotor and shaft started slipping, simply mig welded it from the top and it was all ok again, that was a different motor from a different factory.

I still use a stamped BMC motor they are fine, however the new BMX motors are better quality wise and employ the single strand wire which seems kinder to the Xlyte controllers when running high voltages.

If Mark lets me I will take the controller apart for an inspection, I can run this lot at 72V however I will have to cut the lead down to help with the amps, on this motor it was too long for this test, it would have gone better if I could have clipped it down.

I may still test the other motor as well just for laughs, I then will have to get them back to Mark as I as sure they have good homes to go to, they are all ok however the 500W 320 RPM motor is the one that I would go for.

Good luck with your build and if you need any help just post up on here.

Cheers

Knoxie

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knoxie   10 MW

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Post by knoxie » Sep 13 2007 4:45am

Hello

Here is the GPS run animation, you can see that's a good average over those hills, it will free rev at 23mph on the flat! (20 inch wheel) and still climb hills at 19mph, pretty good going at a measly 37V, still it was pulling 1.2KW at times so it should do!

Check below for the animation


http://knoxie.ath.cx/PUMA-500W-37V-320- ... 0-RPM.html

Cheers

Knoxie

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Post by BiGH » Sep 13 2007 5:04am

awesome as always Knoxieman! i love your videos!!!!

500w puma based bike is already forumlating in my mind... using a flat bar road bike, ultra light components, motor etc. :)
Bike / Motor: Electric specalized rock hopper with Crystalyte 504 / 26"
Batt: Yesa 72v (36v*2) (getting 6.7ah) LiFEPO4 in a Topeak bag. OR 1x eMTB 48v 20ah pack (straps to frame) -depending on range requirements.
Controller: Unmodified 48a digital with 4110 Fets
Current Prob: Bike is in parts getting painted / drying / testing replacement BMS
Trail of Dead Parts:Avanti Frame, 408 motor *melted*, 35a controller - i broke by trying to mod it 2nd controller - blew it up.
My Ride

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Post by knoxie » Sep 13 2007 5:27am

Hi M8

Yes its the best motor so far, 500W is its official rating! from the factory, thats twice the spec of the motors that we already abusing, I think this one will be good for 1.6-2KW with care! nice eh.

But even at a lowly 37V in a 700C wheel this thing would tonk along.

Below is a picture of the gear assembly, like I said in the video some of the Pumas have welds on the back of the planetary gear, this can rub on the inner ring gear (it makes a dreadful noise) this only applies if you are hot swapping motors as I have been doing as the factory shim them to suit.

I just added more shims 2 in total extra to make it clear, you could of course grind the welds flat.

Torque arms are a must! this motor will snap cast drop outs and bend steel if you are not careful with it and if anyone does open the motor make sure that no debris get in, this will damage the gears, even a blob of solder!

Piccie Below.

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deecanio   10 MW

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Post by deecanio » Sep 13 2007 6:14am

Hi Knoxie,

stunning stuff - it looks like these new builds are the ones we have been waiting for :) very impressive indeed!!
blow the last test off and lets see what the 500w 320rpm can do at 72v !! :lol:

hehehe just kidding mate, do what you gotta do - i'm just itching to see what they can really do!!! i have a nice dual wall 20" rim here with the 320's name written all over it!!!!

by the way no rush in getting the kit back to Mark, i spoke to him this morning and he said to save some postage just send the 500w 320 and the controller straight to my house :lol: oooh and throw in your 2 flip tops as well :wink:

hope the 72v tests go as well as the 37v ones have - these are the baskets all my eggs are in 8)
i didn't realise you were testing trainer soles as brakes too!!!

Go knoxie, lets see if they really are the bees knees !!!


cheers


D

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Post by xyster » Sep 13 2007 6:22am

Great video, knoxie.

"The Pew-ma Mo'er" ... ha ha...are you aware how funny you talk? :wink:
Ebike: 5304/20", 72V 35A controller, 33AH 80V 20s15p (18650 sized cells) DIY lithium-ion pack
http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewto ... 47&start=0
Scooter: '06 Stealth s1000, 48V 30A, 4x10ah SLA
http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=148
Ebike: '06 Currie Mongoose, 32V 35A, 32V 22AH hybrid SLA/Li-ion pack
http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=1010

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deecanio   10 MW

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Post by deecanio » Sep 13 2007 6:42am

hehehe, that'll be english then brother xy :)


cheers


D

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knoxie   10 MW

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Post by knoxie » Sep 13 2007 7:29am

Hello

Ahem :lol: Talking Funny? Funny how?? Do I amuse you?

:lol: :wink:

Glad you all liked! erm yes I need to do some more messing about with the motors first and the controller, will do a test at 72V with crash helmet! ha ha, will have to watch the torque arm!!

I will keep you posted

Knoxie

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xyster   1 GW

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Post by xyster » Sep 13 2007 7:41am

knoxie wrote:Hello

Ahem :lol: Talking Funny? Funny how?? Do I amuse you?

:lol: :wink:
Yes you do. You skip the "t" in the middle of words as if it never existed, and pronounce the "u" like "ewe". The "Pee-u-ma Mower" instead of "Poo-ma Mo-tore" :D It's not a mower, it's a motor! How do you tell whether something is a mower or a motor if it's not obvious from the context of the sentence? And where'd you learn to talk like that anyway? Probably from Deecanio, eh? :wink:
Ebike: 5304/20", 72V 35A controller, 33AH 80V 20s15p (18650 sized cells) DIY lithium-ion pack
http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewto ... 47&start=0
Scooter: '06 Stealth s1000, 48V 30A, 4x10ah SLA
http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=148
Ebike: '06 Currie Mongoose, 32V 35A, 32V 22AH hybrid SLA/Li-ion pack
http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=1010

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deecanio   10 MW

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Post by deecanio » Sep 13 2007 7:49am

hehehe

gawd elp ya son if you ever come dawn sarf london way, you won't have a danny larue what the apple core is!!
i'll just nip up the apples and post this for ya might give ya boat race a joy ride gaffa?


Cheers

D

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xyster   1 GW

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Post by xyster » Sep 13 2007 7:56am

:lol: Is that supposed to be John Wayne? He spoke funny too. Heck, I can hardly understand a good portion of the population from the South-Eastern and Eastern U.S.! I'm just kidding with you guys of course. The accents are great -- the diversity part of what makes humans cool. There is a small minority of native English speakers from some parts of Australia and the UK with such heavy accents, and pervasive and provincial colloquialisms, I can't understand much of what they say. Is it the same for you guys?

My family from New York City "pahks the cah" instead of parking the car. I hear that and immediately think, "you want to put a ding in your pet bird?". :lol:
Ebike: 5304/20", 72V 35A controller, 33AH 80V 20s15p (18650 sized cells) DIY lithium-ion pack
http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewto ... 47&start=0
Scooter: '06 Stealth s1000, 48V 30A, 4x10ah SLA
http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=148
Ebike: '06 Currie Mongoose, 32V 35A, 32V 22AH hybrid SLA/Li-ion pack
http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=1010

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deecanio   10 MW

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Post by deecanio » Sep 13 2007 8:09am

:) for sure, geordies (newcastle) brummies (birmingham) cockneys (london) have far and wide accents - you should try keeping up with a true scotsman too, i can't understand a bloody word they say :lol:
also the Irish have a good accent "do you like dags"??? hehe
Knoxie were you quoting goodfellas there? "like i'm a clown, here to amuse you?" tommy to henry, one of my fav movies!!
hehe


D

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Post by Jozzer » Sep 13 2007 8:30am

Nice work Knoxie. THis motor looks like it will be too fast to run 72v in a bigger wheel, do you have the lower RPM motor there to see how much more torqy it is? Still, it DOES mean that theres less need to get silly with the voltage, since at 48v in a 24/26incher it will probably be faster than 30MPH...
Mazda MX-5. 300KW power. Soliton 1 controller, 11" Kostov motor, 20KW/H Turnigy Lipo for 60-100 miles range. 120mph top speed.
Hudson Kindred Spirit 3 wheeler. Twin Agni setup, 300KG 80KW. 100mph top speed (maybe more, but no-one has the guts to try!)
Aprilia RS125, Agni motor, 600A 96v Kelly controller, 6kw/h pack
Dual Agni Ducati.
Countless ebikes and trikes..
http://www.Jozztek.com

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knoxie   10 MW

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Post by knoxie » Sep 13 2007 11:30am

Hi

Yes I have all 3 motors here, to be honest the 320RPM seemed as good torque wise! hmm it will be interesting to test all of them at 72V!

Will see how I get on,

Shiver me timbers, isnt it speak like a pirate day yet? .... me harties!

Knoxie

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Post by oatnet » Sep 13 2007 12:33pm

Welcome back Knoxie!

Hey, do you have any idea of a spoke/rim combination for mounting a puma into a 26" wheel?

My LBS has had my puma for a month or so, he supports a bunch of race teams and has been too booked by their deadlines to build mine :( so I am again thinking about giving it a go myself.

-JD

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Post by ChopperMan » Sep 13 2007 2:23pm

oatnet wrote: Hey, do you have any idea of a spoke/rim combination for mounting a puma into a 26" wheel?
-JD
Hi JD,

My LBS laced up my Puma using 192mm standard BMX spokes in a single cross pattern. The rim was a 47mm wide double walled 26". Rim and build cost £80 total. Took the guy 30 mins.

I'm using 3" fat Kenda Flame tyre, imported from Germany, which now means I have a diameter of 28.5" instead of 26! Should get 25mph at 36V.

Not sure how these spokes will stand up to off road abuse but my bike for cruising, not downhill! The guy at the LBS tells me they are high quality spokes and thought they would pull out of the rim before they break.

Cheers,

Ian
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knoxie   10 MW

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Post by knoxie » Sep 13 2007 3:31pm

oatnet wrote:Welcome back Knoxie!

Hey, do you have any idea of a spoke/rim combination for mounting a puma into a 26" wheel?

My LBS has had my puma for a month or so, he supports a bunch of race teams and has been too booked by their deadlines to build mine :( so I am again thinking about giving it a go myself.

-JD
Hi

Yes good to be back, I am not too sure on the lacing of the wheels to be honest, Mark is the best person to ask as he has a dedicated wheel man build his wheels.

Cheers

Knoxie

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Post by recumbent » Sep 13 2007 6:06pm

Love those videos Knoxie. The more we learn about these motors the better choices we can make.

My next project will be 48 volt based and maybe using a Puma motor. However, one issue is disc brakes, and mounting them to these motors would be a nice choice. My recumbent bike has front & rear discs.
Any chance in the near futur these Puma motors having disc brake plates available?

These motors are not available here in Canada yet that I know of, but shipping from England is no big deal either.

BTW, I have no problem understanding Knoxie's english at all, reminds me of a teacher I had in school.
Ebike in use:
LWB Recumbent bike, Sram i-9 internal gears.
Power: 58V, 16 amp/hr, lipo batteries.
max speed: 52 km/h (30 mph),
max range: 40 km's, incl stop&go few times, minimal pedaling.
New build: Delta recumbent trike

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Post by Jozzer » Sep 13 2007 6:34pm

Sounded quite normal to me Knoxie, those americans must have funny ears or something :lol:
For spoke lengths, use the calculator here... http://www.dtswiss.com/index.asp?fuseac ... pport.bike (click on spoke calculator). Enter rim size and hub dimensions to get the right spoke length.
I've given up getting wheels built for me, way to slow if you want to test lots of motors. Built the last three myself. Much easier than you'd think :lol: Takes me about 3 hours now (first took 7 hours).

Dont the new motors already have disk fittings? all the older ones i've had so far did...
Mazda MX-5. 300KW power. Soliton 1 controller, 11" Kostov motor, 20KW/H Turnigy Lipo for 60-100 miles range. 120mph top speed.
Hudson Kindred Spirit 3 wheeler. Twin Agni setup, 300KG 80KW. 100mph top speed (maybe more, but no-one has the guts to try!)
Aprilia RS125, Agni motor, 600A 96v Kelly controller, 6kw/h pack
Dual Agni Ducati.
Countless ebikes and trikes..
http://www.Jozztek.com

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Post by recumbent » Sep 13 2007 8:37pm

Jozzer wrote: Dont the new motors already have disk fittings? all the older ones i've had so far did...
:oops: Oops, just saw in the picture the six holes for disc mounting, my bad :roll: forgot to look before I spoke. Thanks for pointing that out.

BTW I get my motors spoked/laced, into a wheel for $25CD and get it the next day at my local bike shop. Our bike shop is Ebike friendly.

edit: to get # correct
Ebike in use:
LWB Recumbent bike, Sram i-9 internal gears.
Power: 58V, 16 amp/hr, lipo batteries.
max speed: 52 km/h (30 mph),
max range: 40 km's, incl stop&go few times, minimal pedaling.
New build: Delta recumbent trike

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Post by Geebee » Sep 14 2007 2:06am

Building a wheel is pretty easy and there is a basic guide at Sheldon Browns site, other than that it just takes common sense.
If you build it yourself you know how well it is built and you will probably do a better job as you will not be working against the clock.

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knoxie   10 MW

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Post by knoxie » Sep 14 2007 5:38am

Hi

Yes must have a go at making up a wheel some time! ha ha, I can true a wheel nice and easy, LBS dont seem keen to build them for some reason and tend to look down their noses at e-bikes for some reason?

Sheldons site is a great help for all bike related stuff, I always refer to that.

Cheers

Knoxie

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Post by dermot » Sep 14 2007 1:25pm

knoxie wrote:Hi

Shiver me timbers, isnt it speak like a pirate day yet? .... me harties!

Knoxie
Not quite yet, you scurvy knave:

http://www.talklikeapirate.com/

September 19th.

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