Owner's feedback about Leaf "Agilis" folding ebike

In an earlier post I promised to post my thoughts and experiences of with my new Leaf (see: http://www.leafbike.com/products/electric-bicycle/20-inch-folding-electric-bike/new-20-inch-1000w-folding-electric-bike-957.html).

I ordered an upgraded lithium batt from (a 12ah, 46v to a 20ah 46v batt).

I received the bike on time but the cardboard box was damaged. Part of the seat was sticking out of the side of the box.

There were no written instructions of any kind with the bike.

During my first 10-mile test drive the bike had a flat. As I bought new tires costing $76 per tire the local bike-shop tech kidded me about the typical poor quality OEM tires from China.

During my first test drive, with the new tires inflated to 30lbs, the bike would not go the touted 40mph; instead it maxed at 31mph on a flat recently paved road.

During my first real test drive to town and back, a total of 25 miles, averaging 25mph, the batt indicator hovered close to Empty as I reached home. In other words, it doesn't appear that the OEM 12ah, 46v batt would get me to town and back.

The batt and the charger appear to be working correctly.


About the advertised Cruise Control: I can now understand why Peter avoided answering my question—asking if his road-tester tested the Cruise Control. Despite dozens of (broken English) emails trying to get the CC to work (per Peter's email Instructions below) including cutting the plug and soldering wires to by-pass the plug.

From Kerry to Peter's about Cruise Control:
----- Original Message -----
From: Kerry
To: Leaf Motor
Sent: Tuesday, October 01, 2013 6:51 AM
Subject: Re: Reply to Cruise Control instructions - 9-30-13 1250 hrs

Hi Peter,

The plugs have been cut off and the wires soldered per your instructions and I'm still not able to get the Cruise Control to work.

Suggestion please.

Thanks Peter,

Kerry

From Peter to Kerry about Cruise Control:

Kerry,

“That's because crusie function was interfered by electron.
Had better not to use this cruise function.We recommend these function that is for good sales.
But for any controller,less function,less issue.
Best Regards
Peter
Leaf Motor”


Bottom line: Although I like having the ebike I don't think the Agilis is ready for prime time. In Peter's favor, he most always responded quickly even though it was always a struggle to comprehend his broken written English. The twist control throttle is extremely sensitive when trying to start slowly. It's not the kind of bike one can take their hands off of the handle bars at any time. If you watch the demo video http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NzwmAkMHKPE you’ll see at the very end of the video the female test-driver swerve and almost lose control. For me it's quite scary to go as fast as it allows, even minor bumps in the road require constant awareness.

Much thanks to all for your support.

With aloha,

Kerry

That's too funny, claiming 40 mph. Downhill with the wind at your back maybe. Not impossible of course, but very unlikely with a hubmotor running 48v.

Pretty darn quick winding though, to get to 30 mph. I'd call that very good. To stretch your range, slowing to 20 mph should do it, or find a place for about 30min of charging.

The other reason I recommend 15 ah size batteries, is it's still tolerable to carry, but you get that extra 3-4 miles.

Hi dogman,

Re: "The other reason I recommend 15 ah size batteries, is it's still tolerable to carry, but you get that extra 3-4 miles." I upgraded to 20ah batt (for the 1000 watt motor) but still don't get the advertised range. I think you're right about staying under 25 mph for more range.

Dear Kerrith,

I am really interested in the "Agilis" Leaf bike, but could not find sufficient user reports. The leaf bike agilis seems ideal due to power and suspension and disc brakes, my only concern is the quality of the Bike itself e.g. frame and forks.

So far, are you happy with the build quality of the frame and fork and handlebar? could not seem to find the brand that produces these bikes.

Thanks in advance.

We may need to go back to basic bicycle understanding. Little wheels, mean less stability than large wheels. Rear Hub motor with heavy battery on rear rack means unstable bike. I have two 48V 12Ah conversions. Both NOW with the battery where it belongs, in the "V" which you don't have with the folding bike. One with 24" rear hubmotor and other with 26" rear hubmotor. I used the 24" for a year with the battery on the rear rack. Then I built the 26" with the battery in the "V". It took me 10 seconds to realize what a POS a bike is with the battery on a rear rack. I immediately took the battery off the 24" rack and put it in the "V". Both bikes go exactly the same speed of 30MPH on the flat. Both will go 25 miles on a charge ON THE FLAT. There is no magic, unless you have a "100mpg Carburetor from your grandfather." Whether it is a boat, car, aircraft or bicycle, everything is a compromise. A folding bike is one of the worst compromises you can make for stability. To put it in the boat, car, or aircraft, it works out well, but it is still a POS as a bike.

Hi MustangP51,

I bought the Agilis solely based upon the specs of its frame and in that regard I am satisfied. From my point of view I could, if necessary, swap out most everything but the frame.

My sense is that they are trying to do a good job but that they are just breaking into the Am market and so their website specs are not accurate.

I have noticed lite rust on some parts but I suspect other bikes would be the same.

If you have some experience with e-bikes then the Agilis would work for you. For me it's just an emergency option in case of shipping (gasoline) strikes here in Hawaii.

The main dissatisfaction for me is the fact that they advertised Cruise Control and that Peter finally admitted that it doesn't work.

Gordo's comment about weight, the batt over the rear wheel and the rear wheel motor, is probably true, as to what causes the scary handling, but I don't know, not having driven any other folding bike. Just having the option of driving the bike in my car to distant places so as to do some touring is a very nice. I bought and tested a trailer and I can envision doing some overnight camping at some remote beaches on the island

I have yet to try driving at 20-25 mph (my first test drive was at 25-30mph) the full round 17 mile trip to town so I don't know how that will affect the batt range.

My big surprise was the torque when starting from stop using the twist throttle. It takes conscious muscle-grip control to start slowly; it's such a fast start that I don't dare let anyone even try test riding the bike.

The disc brakes work fine.

Note: Plan on buying new tires immediately.

Kerry

Thanks for the replies

You may find a $5 thumb throttle works better for you? They work better on a snow machine and ATV and I prefer the thumb throttle on my e-bike.

Hi Gordo,

After telling Peter (Agilis) about my difficulties starting slowly with the full twist throttle he sent me a thumb one for free; but after looking at it I don't think I would have any better control trying to start slowly from stop using my thumb. The torque of its 1000W motor can be uplifting, as in the front lifting up over my head. No doubt (at age 76) I've lost some of my muscle control and confidence.

Thanks for the suggestion,

Kerry

I purchased motor from them because they advertised 90% efficiency and 45mph speed with 1000W motor....

But thinking again it can't be true there's no way we can reach 45mph with 1000W only......

Is it just false advertising?

Hi cwah,

Yes-unless I received a faulty motor. "During my first test drive, with the new tires inflated to 30lbs, the bike would not go the touted 40mph; instead it maxed at 31mph on a flat recently paved road."

Also three months ago Peter acknowledged that they know the Cruise Control doesn't work and they haven't corrected their website.
He wrote:

• “That's because crusie function was interfered by electron.
  Had better not to use this cruise function.We recommend these function that is for good sales.
  But for any controller,less function,less issue.
  Best Regards
  Peter
  Leaf Motor”

Kerry

I purchased 3 motors from them. And I want to reach the 45mph advertised.

I'm currently asking them how they manage to reach this speed with a 26A controller on 48V.

I only purchased from them because they advertised 90% efficiency and 45mph speed. If I can't get this I'll ask for refund.

Hi cwah,

The advertised speed is 40 mph per:

• "Product Features: New 20 inch 48V 1000W Folding electric bicycle
  *. Max Speed: 40mph -- throttle control
  *. Travel Range: 25 miles per charge
  *. Electric Battery Pack: 48V 12AH, 5.3kg Lithium battery -- safe and lightest battery
  *. Driving Hub Motor: 48V 1000W brushless gearless -- quiet and powerful
  *. Cruise Speed Control -- Make your ride more relax and fun
  *. Regenerative Braking -- Energy saving, safe and smooth stopping experience
  *. With pedelec -- Pedal
  *. Work With LCD -- Display speed, battery gauge, mileage, set max speed...
  *. Carbon Steel Reinforced Frame -- light and strong
  *. Torque Arm to hold on 1000w motor and rear frame fork -- safe
  *. Weight: 29 kg only with battery

even so I've only been able to reach 35 mph, so yes, it is false advertising.

Kerry