Thanks to Chris at Lectric Cycles

Hello forum members - just wanted to shout out a public thanks to the folks at Lectric Cycles and especially Chris who spent a few hours on the phone answering my questions and getting a new bike outfitted with some extras and shipped out the very same day.

I’ve been electric biking for a few years and other than my home made stuff with lead acid batteries in past years, then bought a mid drive Giant which I loved. In 2010, I bought my first production mountain bike called a Liberty Mountain Bike which I rode for years. Part of my current fleet is a few Pedego bikes, a Prodeco Outlaw 1200 and a Mariner 500. I finally decided I would get a mid-drive system so I started looking around and calling a few of the more popular dealers, I tried for 3 days to reach the folks at Luna Cycle and all I got was mail box full and recording and no return call - maybe their on vacation?

Anyhow, on my first call to Lectric Cycles, Chris spent nearly an hour with me explain some of the options on their system. While I had planned to get a motor and install myself on my old 90’s Cannonade mountain bike, after talking to Chris and adding up all the options and difficulties of brackets needed for the battery and to make the motor work on my bike, I discovered for another $800 I could buy a brand new Turn-key 750 watt mid-motor bike from Letric Cycles and have a modern bike so that’s the route I went. I ended up with the e-rad Mid drive on a giant chassis, with a 48v 11.6 ah battery - color display - kickstand and a Cycle Satiator charger.

I included a “Stock” images and some specs of my bike which is in transit - I’ll post a few images and some thoughts when she arrives.

Thanks Mike Mas
http://www.rotory.com

Product Description

Giant Stance 2 assembled with e-RAD Mid Drive Conversion Kit

350 or 750w e-RAD Mid Drive Motor
Motor power runs through 9 speed Cassette for superior climbing ability and top speed
Top speed up to 30mph+ (depending on motor/gearing combination)
5 Levels of Pedal Assist
Throttle available in all modes
Advanced Backlit LCD Display with Speed, Trip Meter, Battery Level, Assist Level, Temperature and Motor Power Output (Watts)
Downtube Mounted Lithium Battery Included.
2A Charger Included
Battery locks onto mount and can be removed without disconnecting any wires
1 year warranty on motor/battery from Lectric Cycles

Fork RockShox 30 Gold TK Solo Air w/ lockout, OverDrive steerer, 120mm travel
Shock RockShox Monarch R
Rear Derailleur Shimano Alivio
Brakes Shimano M355, Hydraulic disc, [F] 180 [R] 160
Brake Levers Shimano M355, Hydraulic disc
Cassette Shimano HG200 11x34, 9-speed
Chain KMC X9
Crankset e-RAD 170mm

Hello Forum Members - I recently acquired a Mid-Drive Giant Stance Mountain bike from the folks at Lectric Cycle and wanted to share it with other forum members or in fact anyone interested in an aggressive powered Mountain Bike that offers super on-road cruising of 30+ mph, yet strong enough and powerful enough for Off-Road terrain and the ability to tackle some pretty serious hills.



I started Way Back - when we used to mount small starter motors on 2 & 3 wheel bikes with full-size 12v lead batteries. A decade ago, I purchased my first “pre-built” mid-motor Giant, which I rode and enjoyed for 4-5 years. Later, I bought one the first electric mountain bikes offered called a “Liberty”, it was an aluminum full-suspension 500 watt hub drive bike with nickel batteries. My present fleet includes a a 500 watt geared Pedego and a Prodeco Tech 1200 watt Outlaw. Living here in North Georgia, none of these bikes have the power to negotiate my hills so I started looking at mid-drive bikes so I could take advantage of the 9-speed transmission which provides good performance on both off-road and on paved roads.

My Original Intentions - Was to build my own e-bike, after spending some time researching high-end mountain bikes then adding the cost of the motor drive, a good battery, charger and some options like a; gear sensor, improved display, etc. I pretty much had about $3K of cost. I decided to place an order with Luna Cycle for the drive unit but I must have caught then at a bad time, because for 4 days, I got not one real person, just answering services or “mail-box full” messages, so I decided to look elsewhere.

One day - While Googling “Mid-Drive” bike kits, I came up with the name; Lectric Cycle. Wow I hit the jackpot, these guys not only offer mid-drive kits, they also offer mid-drive “Turn-Key” fully built bikes. Its not like they have one or two of these bikes, they have a full corral of not less than 10 bikes ranging in price from just $1695 to $4795. I then began a 2-day Google crusade to find out everything I could about the Lectric Cycle company. On my first call, I was fortunate to find Chris Head, the sales director, who in a professional manner answered all my questions. In the next few days, I discussed a number of different options on different bikes with Chris and my past loyalty to my earlier mid-motor Giant helped me make a decision of the Giant Trance. While Giant did have some frame issues with this bike, they have since addressed the problem.



The Bottom Line - If I would have bought a good mountain bike, then shopped the motor drive, then added the options I wanted, I would have only been within $300-400 from what I paid Lectric Cycle for my fully built bike. So instead of spending weeks on accumulating a barrage of “chicken parts” and hope everything fit and worked, I ordered the bike i wanted and in just 5 days I was out riding the hills on my Lectric Cycle Giant.

The Bike - While Lectric Cycle offers 1000 watt bikes as well - the Giant Stance and many of their other mountain bikes come standard with e-RAD’s modified Bafang 350 watt mid-drive system. I ordered the larger 750 watt drive which surges over 1000 watts. I also opted for just a few extras such as; their slim down tube 48V 14 ah battery, an upgraded color display and yes call me a wimp if you like, but I put a damn “Kickstand” on the bike, so I don’t have to look for a bush/tree or big rock when I want to climb off the bike.



Power - The e-RAD Giant Trance has amazing power that is 2-3 times of that of the Prodeco Tech Outlaw 1200 watt hub system. I judge my bikes power with only my steep asse driveway, if a bike gets up the drive, then it passed my first requirement. The e-RAD Trance steams right up it in any gear from 1st to 4th gear with no pedaling. My Prodeco Tech Outlaw 1200 will not climb my driveway even if I pedal.

Building Regrets? - Not one - Coming from a 40+ year career of designing and building RC Helicopters and electric Drones, http://www.rotory.com I don’t need to twist anymore wrench's or allen keys. In fact, it just was not worth the task of getting all the stuff here, hoping it all works, dealing with removing parts and the time to install it all for the money saved.

On a Short List - The Giant Trance comes with a 4.7” suspension system thanks to its; RockShox 30 Gold w/ air lockout on the fork and a RockShox Monarch R on the rear. The drivetrain is Shimano Alivio 9 speed with a e-Rad 170mm crankset. The wheels are alloy double wall with stainless spokes and the tires are; Maxis Ardent 27.5 x 2.25.



Dislikes - Regretfully, my only dislike was the left hand thumb throttle and a two second delay for the power to come on. For the same reason they don’t have left foot throttle on cars or a left hand throttle on a motorcycle, there should be no such thing on an ebike either. Anyhow. this problem was quickly remedied with the addition of a twist throttle on the right. The only real issue I had was a 2-second delay on the throttle and a 2 mph minimum speed for engagement. While the purpose of this safety feature is to prevent new owners from accidentally engaging the throttle and having the bike injure someone, I feel there should be some type of disable mode for the more experienced riders. If you happen to stop on a steep incline, it’s difficult at best to get going again since your now confronted with pedaling the bike to 2+ mph uphill before you have assistance from the motor. Fortunately, when I mentioned the problem to Lectric Cycles, they sent me a programming cable and the feature was disabled and I’m good to go.





Likes - There ain’t to much not to like - I mean Fed-X pulls up to the door and in an hour, you’re out there riding with technology that took 10 years to achieve. Another plus is ordering the bike, if you want a custom ratio, spring seat, rear battery bracket, AB switch, etc. they do it. When I placed the order, they took a stock bike and modified it to my liking's and it went out the same day!

It’s important to note that while all Bafang motors look alike, they are not created equal. Just a few of the benefits of the Lectric Cycle drive is a special forged axle. Another plus is; bikes like my Giant Trance has a 92 mm bracket - to my knowledge, Lectric Cycle is the only company that makes a special application for that size so you’re not modifying another drive. Another plus is the gear sensor and its supporting firmware. When I drove the “Other Guys” Bafang mid motor with the gear sensor it felt like I was shifting a farm tractor with the awful clunk every time I shifted. When you shift the Lectric Cycle shifter, their propriety custom firmware shifts so smooth you barely hear or feel it. This is accomplished by carefully programming the controller to quickly reduce, shut off then carefully ramp up the throttle all in just a fraction of a second. This makes a major difference on steep inclines. The Lectric Cycle system almost feels like a shift on a automatic car transmission. “They got this shift thing figured out!” Also, with each kit or bike, your provided a tool set to install or remove the motor.

In Conclusion - Congrats to Lectric Cycle on their “Turn Key” e-RAD Mid-Motor ebikes. I’m happy with the performance and quality of my Giant Trance conversion. I especially liked dealing with the folks at Lectric Cycle, Chris, Mitch and Dan. I never felt rushed and they called me with a fix when I had my throttle issue. My next venture is a One-KW Mid Fatty, I’ll keep you guys posted!

Many thanks to the Forum Members and Administrators of this great Forum!

Regards - Mike Mas
http://www.rotory.com

Further Information on Lectric Cycles e-RAD: http://www.lectriccycles.com/mid-drive-electric-bicycles/
Phone: 702-444-7474

Further Information Giant Bikes: https://www.giant-bicycles.com/_pdf/bikes/united_states/giantbicycles-84049-stance.27.5.2.pdf

If I may be so cynical, this reads like a sponsored review to me for a couple reasons. Just that little too intimate knowledge of the company under review, and buying this less than a month after trashing two competitors in his previous threads. (BBS wont work with CA, and the other brand, forgot what it was, overheating and not having any power)

Maybe I'm wrong., if I had problems with a Nissan and a Toyota, then found a Mitsubishi that worked, I'd be gushing with praise too.

Apologies if you are genuine, Mike, but I'm taking this with a grain of salt.

Never met these guys at all - in fact never even told them I was doing a review - I just like to support people who have an interest in their customers and support their product. My field of work is media production so that might have a tone in my article - thanks for the reply!

Mike

Then ride it for a few months and post an objective review. :wink:

For now, you sound like this add belongs in the "For Sale New" section. :|

Ok I'll be sure to comply with your rigid posting requirements - if you don't like it just move on.

Its just a bike with a motor, believe it or not this will not land on Mars or do lunar exploration - Chill out!

Sunder said:

amberwolf said:

May I merge this with your first thread on the topic, and put them in the Reviews section?

Click to expand...

If I may be so cynical, this reads like a sponsored review to me for a couple reasons. Just that little too intimate knowledge of the company under review, and buying this less than a month after trashing two competitors in his previous threads. (BBS wont work with CA, and the other brand, forgot what it was, overheating and not having any power)

Maybe I'm wrong., if I had problems with a Nissan and a Toyota, then found a Mitsubishi that worked, I'd be gushing with praise too.

Apologies if you are genuine, Mike, but I'm taking this with a grain of salt.

Click to expand...

We need to be careful here, and in general, of confusing new owner enthusiasm for sponsored advertising. A friend posted here about his new experiences with his new electric car (Ford Focus), and was summarily banned without recourse (and in that case it was incredibly unlikely that he was commercially sponsored, and I know he wasn't). It was a totally inappropriate response to his enthusiastic new owner review posting, and we lost him forever as a contributing member. Anyone with a short history on ES is viewed as a shill first when it may not be the case at all. Let's not repeat this mistake.

Thanks for the informative posting on your new bike, and the nice photos. The bike doesn't look dirty enough yet . It does read a bit like an advertisement, so you might want to state in the first post that you have no ties with the manufacturer, etc, or whatever is the case to clear the air from the start. But it also looks like a new buyer doing his homework, and making a conscious tradeoff to buy something pre-made, which is not what most members of this forum do. I'd be especially interested in what you modify and find lacking in their "prepackaged" system. It looks like the motor is mounted a bit low due to the way the frame downtube goes, is that a problem for ground clearance in dirt riding? How does the chainline work out - in what gear is the chain exactly straight? How do those tires work out on pavement and other riding conditions? What about actual range? Did I miss the specs on the battery? Is it 52V or 48V? What kind of speeds do you see in various conditions? Do those hydraulic brakes have the legally required e-cutout switches for a commercially sold product (Federal requirement)? If you are in California it would also have to have the necessary California required Ebike class stickers. You said the crank was E-Rad, isn't that Bafang, part of the BBSHD? Do they really make a new axle for the BBSHD or is that lore left over from their early BBS02 mods, where that kind of thing was needed? There are lots of folks mounting standard BBSHD's on all widths of bikes with simple shims, so some of the statements reflect a less than thorough research on what others are actually doing. What about the motor mounting? It looks like they use a rubber pad between the motor and the frame. If the motor is not supported well enough it may be more likely to come loose, rubber will protect the downtube but may not support the motor firmly enough to prevent loosening? Have you had to retighten it, and how many miles do you have on it??

Thanks again for your postings.

Thanks for the reply's guys - as I mentioned I was posed to buy a mid-drive system from Luna but caught them at a bad time (maybe vacation - it is July right) anyhow, I did not know the guys at Lectric Cycle and there was not one penny discounted and they had no knowledge I had planned to do a Overview on the bike.

Regarding my bikes appearance, I just figured it would make pretty pictures if I shot it before it had a mud bath. The overview was not intended to be an In depth review, it was more aimed to let guys know this is another option other than buying hundreds of "Chicken Parts" and striping a bike down to mount a motor on it. As I mentioned, there was only around $300 difference from me building it myself verses letting Lectric Cycle build it. Rest assured there's a much higher profit margin in their line of bikes, they are going to buy the bikes and motors and accessories a hell of better price than we'll ever see.

In answer to a few of the questions; yes it will go 30+ mph sustained, it will climb my steep driveway when other bikes such as the Pedeco Tech 1200 watt Outlaw that I paid $3000 for would fall on its face. Yes, Lectric Cycle does make their own shafts, there is plenty of video's of their contracted machine shop making the parts, if I understand correctly, their forged axles are the strongest of any made for the Bafang drives. In addition, they make a custom 92 mm length for the Giant bikes so instead of shimming, and jury rigging it fits the application. Their "Gear Sensor" and its associated firmware is hands down the best in the industry - I can honesty say it shifts like an automatic. I thought I did mention the battery.

Anyhow getting back to the bike, as I mentioned the throttle being placed on the wrong (left) side. The main reason the throttle is on the left is because the "keeper Shifter" is on the right and it gets pretty busy. Anyhow, here's a simple placement that allows the brake to be easily accessible as well as the shift pedals. The thumb throttle is easy to reach and the gear shift indicator is still in easy view.

Enjoy - Mike

Lectric sells good products, just horribly over priced for the DIY bike builders.
Nice bike!

Maybe I'm not looking at the right places, but you do the math - Like I said, I was going to build from scratch but I don't like talking to answering machine and getting no call backs. Myself, I would rather pay a bit more if the owner is there for me. Hell if you can't talk to someone when your buying a bike, they sure as hell ain't gonna help you if something is broke!

Go out and find a nice bike then add the motor, battery, and the goodies - then compare what you come up with and you'll see its pretty damn close. Just a bike is close to $2K. Compare your list to one of their bikes for $3000 and you'll see its damn close. I mean I'm not expecting anyone to build a bike for me for free!

Of course I understand a lot of guys want to build there bike too so that's fine.


Thanks

Mike

6 builds, I'm glad you're happy. I find the outrageous claims and high prices a put off. There are dealers we builders can talk to for much better prices. Again, you're happy and it's a nice bike! All that counts.

Your dead wrong on buying an item based on just price. A product with good service and someone who is there when you need them is more important to me than just getting a bargain basement price.

Like I said, do the math - find yourself a good mountain bike and add up the additions and your within a $200-300 dollars from what I paid. Your comments on being too expensive dose not apply in this case.

Here's another turn key bike from Cabela's - its pretty much stripped down 7 speed, 10 amp battery, no suspension, cable brakes, and its within $500 of what I paid. Most important, I have someone I can talk to if there is a problem. Let me think - who's more talented . . . . The guys at Lectric Cycle with years of experience or a Cabela's salesman.

Is this starting to make any sense to you now?

to the OP relax.

Just to clear the air . . . I just wanted to clarify myself because I keep getting comments I paid too much because I bought my bike from Lectric Cycle.

To disprove these comments, I went to Luna’s site and priced out a 750 watt mid drive system that is equipped even less than mine and it came to $1265 + $30 shipping. Unlike my drive, the Luna system does not offer an advanced gear sensor firmware that will match Lectric Cycles shifting, it does not have a special hardened shaft, nor do they offer a 92 mm bracket for a Giant which allows the chain to be straight on in 5th gear. Regardless, the package came to $1295.

The Giant Stance 27.5 -2 retails for $2699 - The very best price I could find was $1500.

As we add up the motor drive from Luna which is $1295 then add the bike; $1500 + $130 shipping, that totals $2925. I only paid Lectric Cycle $3195 for a fully built bike delivered.

If I deduct the shipping, It comes to only $170 difference than if I bought all the parts from Luna and bought the bike myself. Lets not forget; Lectric Cycles built the entire bike. This clearly shows that when buying any Turn Key bike from Lectric Cycle, the mid drive system is no more expensive than Luna yet offers more advantages.

Many Thanks - Mike

IdleUp said:

...the Luna system does not offer an advanced gear sensor firmware that will match Lectric Cycles shifting...
Many Thanks - Mike

Click to expand...

And you know this how?

When I saw that seat I almost peed myself!

I went and checked out one of these pretty recently (Giant Stance). Very, very attractive price for a full suspension bike. My plan was identical except with lower power again.

Until I worked out the price difference in the bike primarily resides in the rear suspension, which relies on deleting a pivot point in favour of flexing the frame instead, which has resulted in broken stays for some. Probably fine for a commuter, but it was enough to put me off totally.

Lurkin said:

I went and checked out one of these pretty recently (Giant Stance). Very, very attractive price for a full suspension bike. My plan was identical except with lower power again.

Until I worked out the price difference in the bike primarily resides in the rear suspension, which relies on deleting a pivot point in favour of flexing the frame instead, which has resulted in broken stays for some. Probably fine for a commuter, but it was enough to put me off totally.

Click to expand...

Lurkin thanks for the reply - word is Giant fixed the frame problem for 2016 - as I mentioned, I owned Giants mid powered bike so I figured I would stay with them.

As for Rockwalk's "Goofy" comment on the seat, its clear to see he's never driven a gas power dirt bike, Wake up man - theses bikes are doing 20-40 mph on jumps dude, skinny seats on English racers are a thing of the past!

Bottom line for me was did I want to pay an extra $500 for the Lectric Cycles BBS02? Answer a BIG NO THANKS. So keep up with your advertising, doesn't seem to be convincing anyone. Also, Luna Cycles has always responded to my many emails within one day.

It looks like eRad has reduced their pricing a lot since Luna changed the market landscape, so we can thank Luna for the better pricing.

I've heard that Bafang has fixed the problems with the shafts and all motors come with the fast shifting input connections, so I'm not convinced that eRad motors are different from other vendors anymore. Early on it was the case, but things have changed.

Good to see a full suspension bike that isn't 4k+.

How much does it weigh? I see Giant doesn't publish weights.

There's little point arguing about the pricing. Some folks here want super cheap, others are willing to pay a bit more. That's a personal choice. It is of more value to see what one can get for what price. It is easy for a DIY project to get over 3K$. Most folks don't add up all the real costs on a project.

rockwalk said:

When I saw that seat I almost peed myself!

Click to expand...

Why? The riding position is totally different from a pMTB, putting all your weight on your pelvis: you need a soft seat! There is a reason that Enduro or MX bikes don't have leather covered platforms for seats.........

Alan, we can also thank Luna for charging $500 for a BBS02 vs Lectric's $995.

Just to set the record straight, I just came on here in friendly way to share few shots of my new bike and a few guys immediately started a whinning like babies because they got their feelings hurt because I didn't buy my stuff where they got theirs. It all started out when a few "Keyboard" experts kept saying I paid to much because I bought a bike from Lectric Cycle, I then went out and proved they were dead wrong. Facts are Facts - when you buy a complete mountain bike from Lectric Cycle, it is no more expensive and in fact “Cheaper” than Luna and the components (shifter, firmware, shafts, 92 mm bracket) are of better quality.

Read my lips - If a vendor can't pick up a phone or answer it in 3 days and the mail box is full on a business, "Big Red Flags" should be waiving in your face! Run or pedal as fast as you can to his competitor! BUZzzzzzzzz they just lost my business! Even Zoid with his goofy email comment admitted he can’t call and has to email Luna and wait an entire day to get an answer. I just don't get it - if they are selling all the product you guys say, then why can't they afford to hire someone to answer the phone or get off their duff and answer the phone themselves like other respectable companies do?

I got a great business idea - maybe its time for Luna to charge more for their stuff like Lectra so they can afford to hire a technical guy to answer questions. Come on guys, were not talking about buying a fuse here, this is thousands of dollars. This sounds more like an Ebay store to me. Try calling Lectric Cycle, you never get an answering service and there is no less than 3 guys there all the time to answer technical questions.

Ok, now that all the futile attempts on me paying to much have miserably failed . . . the only fault a few mountain experts have managed to find wrong; is my damn seat of all things! Since I’ve probably spent more time in the air on dirt bikes than most of you riding, let me get you “Up To Speed" - Mountain bikes are now going almost as fast as some dirt bikes off road and on jumps, your not riding an English racer dude aerodynamics has nothing to do with mountain bikes. Keep in mind at dirt Bike speeds, one mistake and that skinny seat will crush your nuts! So please get that skinny seat crap out of your damn heads - you're living in the past!

Is any of this starting to make sense now?

Best Regards - Mike

Paying $995 for something that really costs half as much elsewhere doesn't make sense to me and never will. Overspend at will; nobody cares. Just don't make it sound like you received the deal of the century. You're the only one whining because you didn't have anyone take your call immediately. Grow up.

Welcome IdleUp. That looks like a wonderful full suspension bike, and I think you will be very happy for a long time with a mid drive like that. I am seeing more 27.5 wheels off-road, and the 2.4-inch wide tires combined with the suspension should provide a plush ride.

This particular forum is mostly "install it myself" kit guys (as I suppose you have surmised by now), but...I believe there is a place in the world for turn-key ebikes, and there's nothing wrong with paying a little extra to get an ebike fast and complete.

Since you mention RC experience, I am going to assume you already have a digital multimeter. its is by far the first tool for diagnosing minor issues that can pop up on any ebike. I recommend buying a spare throttle from the same vendor. Its not that the throttle is the most often seen issue, its just that its the easiest part to swap-in and check, plus they are cheap. I recommend getting a small tube of di-electric silicone grease from an auto parts store, and dabbing all the connectors with it (the plugs and socket pins). Doing this adds a little extra water-proofing from moisture shorts.