ASI Acclerated Systems controllers BAC2000 review

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Re: ASI Acclerated Systems controllers BAC2000 review

Post by nickjs » May 02 2017 2:33am

Hi guys , I have a bac2000 that has been sitting on my shelf for a few months gathering dust because for the life of me I cannot get it to connect to my pc ! Really want to get this running

Can you offer any advice?

I'm running windows ten .

Thanks !
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Re: ASI Acclerated Systems controllers BAC2000 review

Post by nickjs » May 02 2017 2:40am

I have connected the key in cable ( pin 9 I think ) straight to the power .

I'm getting the rx and tx lights blinking on the software but the 'connected ' light never stays on :cry:

I've tried all the ports , I've deleted the USB driver and re-installed

I've deleted the software and re-installed ( I have access to version 1.5.0 and 1.5.4 )

Can anyone send me a later version of the software to try ?

It appears to have a rs485 and a rs232 connection on the controller but no blue tooth as far as I'm aware .

I got hold of this controller from jozzer at Jozztek, I think he's had it for over a year . He said it was working fine before he sent it to me .

Any help would be amazing ! Thanks guys
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Re: ASI Acclerated Systems controllers BAC2000 review

Post by nickjs » May 02 2017 3:17am

I have tried connecting via the rs485 , but not the rs232 yet as I don't have a lead.
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Re: ASI Acclerated Systems controllers BAC2000 review

Post by mrbill » May 02 2017 9:41am

nickjs wrote:Hi guys , I have a bac2000 that has been sitting on my shelf for a few months gathering dust because for the life of me I cannot get it to connect to my pc ! Really want to get this running

Can you offer any advice?

I'm running windows ten .

Thanks !
Hi nickjs:

I used the attached hook-up schematic that Justin L-E posted some time ago in the first ASI thread. Please note that the schematic has a couple of errors:

1) TTL TX should be attached to Pin 3 of the 16-pin molex.
2) The 80k pull-up resistor should be connected to Pin 4 of the 16-pin molex, NOT Pin 5.

In other words, these two connections should be shifted one pin DOWN. I noted this in writing on the document but I was unable to alter the diagram.

To get you started I have also attached a parameter file that works for my Edge1500 DD hub motor and a 48-volt (nominal) system enabling variable regenerative braking using a CA3. You should go through the tuning process for your specific motor to get the best performance, and you may wish to change some of the other parameters to suit your application.
BAC2000_CA3_Schematic.pdf
BAC2000 external wiring schematic
(2.27 MiB) Downloaded 141 times
Edge1500.kv11.5_GoldRush.xml
BAC2000 parameter file for Edge1500 @ 48v
(26.75 KiB) Downloaded 103 times
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Re: ASI Acclerated Systems controllers BAC2000 review

Post by nickjs » May 02 2017 1:47pm

Thanks mrbill, I appreciate that , how does the variable regen work ? Do you need to twist a separate throttle? Have you got your variable regen working well ? That is a feature I'm very interested in ! More details please .

I think the problem with connecting to the pc maybe something to do with my rs485- USB lead, I checked and this lead can only take a baud rate of 300 , and I think bacdoor uses 115200 baud .

I've ordered one with ftdi chip ( which is apparently what ASI uses according to their knowledge base ) with baud rate up to 115200 bps . I am hoping that will fix it and I'll finally get it working !

thanks again for the diagram that will come in very handy ! :)
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Re: ASI Acclerated Systems controllers BAC2000 review

Post by mrbill » May 02 2017 6:16pm

nickjs wrote:Thanks mrbill, I appreciate that , how does the variable regen work ? Do you need to twist a separate throttle? Have you got your variable regen working well ? That is a feature I'm very interested in ! More details please .

I think the problem with connecting to the pc maybe something to do with my rs485- USB lead, I checked and this lead can only take a baud rate of 300 , and I think bacdoor uses 115200 baud .

I've ordered one with ftdi chip ( which is apparently what ASI uses according to their knowledge base ) with baud rate up to 115200 bps . I am hoping that will fix it and I'll finally get it working !

thanks again for the diagram that will come in very handy ! :)
I wrote earlier in this thread:
The BAC2000 is capable of variable regeneration, and the CA3 sends the BAC2000 the proper throttle voltage signals so that the latter knows when the throttle voltage is controlling propulsion or engine braking. (Propulsion between 1.0 and 3.5 volts; braking between 0.8 and 0.1 volts.) The throttle on my handlebars does double duty: a normal throttle when driving, and a variable regeneration lever when the CA3 e-brake circuit is closed. The system works like a charm.
The .xml parameter file I posted is configured for this throttle behavior. You will need to set up your CA3 so that the throttle is attached to the CA3, and the CA3 sends its throttle signal to the BAC2000, per the wiring diagram I posted above.

In addition to variable regen, I can limit speed on the CA3, using the AuxD 2-button switch with roughly 4 kph increments between 12 kph up to my maximum speed so that I can set a speed on long descents and not be required to hold the throttle in one position for long periods of time or vary it precisely over changing terrain while regenerating. Works especially nicely when the downgrade varies as the CA3 varies the amount of regeneration to hold a set speed.
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Re: ASI Acclerated Systems controllers BAC2000 review

Post by ElectricGod » May 03 2017 2:15pm

I didn't see where you mentioned what USB to rs232 cable that you have. I personally have 7 different ones and 2 computers with physical RS232 ports on them. NONE of them worked with the BAC2000. I had to get a specific cable that ASI uses and then I connect no problem. Buy this cable and that should get you going. I bought it from this ebay seller, but they are currently out of stock. Just get this cable and you are good to go.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/142170488046?_t ... EBIDX%3AIT

You only need 3 wires out of the RS232 cable...RX (org), TX (yel) and GND (blk). I have my wires labled by what they connect to on the ASI controller...not by what they really are. Orange is actually TX on the cable and yellow is actually RX, but since you plug the opposite function into the controller, I just labeled them with what they connect to. On the controller you need 3 wires. RX (gry/blk), TX (yel/blk) and black (gnd). These are pins 3, 13 and 14. So yellow from the cable connects to yel/blk on the controller, orange connects to grey/black on the controller and black to black. I didn't need to load any drivers on windows 8.1. In device manager, the RS232 port changes about half the time between com3 and com6...go figure. Be sure to select the correct COM port in BacDoor. Other than this cable and connecting it correctly, you obviously need power and enable. Connect the white wire (pin 9) to batt+ to enable the controller. Once you get that going and you can successfully connect to the controller, then worry about connecting a motor and throttle. With this controller you don't even need to connect the right colors for halls and phases together. It will "learn" that stuff later. Still...just because all the other controllers out there need the correct pairing up front to run a motor, I connected them color for color. I suggest bench testing the controller and motor before ever mounting anything to a frame. It's so much easier to fiddle with things when it's all just laying on your desk. Later, you will also need red (+5v, pin 8 ), blue (throttle, pin 7) and black (gnd, pin 15) to connect up a throttle. I wouldn't bother with brakes right now. In fact just disable that stuff in the controller. It will only get in the way for the up front motor setup.

I've bundled up my wires based on what I need and what I don't need. I never use e-brakes to disable the controller. That's what letting off the throttle is for. If I'm too stupid to not let off the throttle while braking, well that's my problem and not the controllers job to compensate for my idiocy. LOL. This set of pics is the wires I need to run the controller. This is RS232, throttle, halls and pin 4 ( another +5v wire)

Image

This set is the wires I will likely never use.

Image

If you don't have the correct pinout, I got this direct from tech support. The online doc found on the ASI site was wrong.

Image
Image
Image
Last edited by ElectricGod on Oct 01 2017 9:42pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: ASI Acclerated Systems controllers BAC2000 review

Post by Martin-ASI » May 05 2017 12:11pm

nickjs wrote:Hi guys , I have a bac2000 that has been sitting on my shelf for a few months gathering dust because for the life of me I cannot get it to connect to my pc ! Really want to get this running

Can you offer any advice?

I'm running windows ten .

Thanks !

Hey nickjs

if you PM me, I'll see what I can do to get you going.

Martin

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Re: ASI Acclerated Systems controllers BAC2000 review

Post by amberwolf » May 06 2017 1:14am

If you post the assistance publicly instead of by PM, it would help a lot more people. That's what this forum is all about.

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Re: ASI Acclerated Systems controllers BAC2000 review

Post by nickjs » May 07 2017 11:35am

I ordered a USB rs485 cable from eBay that apparently uses the ftdi chip , but it still won't connect !

I guess I'm going to need a genuine ftdi cable , just ordered a genuine cable I'll post if that works ......

Thanks all for the help so far
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Re: ASI Acclerated Systems controllers BAC2000 review

Post by Martin-ASI » May 07 2017 4:16pm

amberwolf wrote:If you post the assistance publicly instead of by PM, it would help a lot more people. That's what this forum is all about.
True amberwolf, however, being an ASi employee, I do have to be careful about what gets said.

Sometimes things that work, may be outside of documented specifications, and I have to take responsibility for mistakes that may harm the controller. If, hypothetically someone asks why they don't run at 100V, and insists that they will, and then tries it and it blows up, I can't have it come back to me saying that I suggested it publicly. (and I wouldn't, because they aren't designed to do that)

So, if it is an innocuous question, who's answer will be helpful for everyone, yes... it should (and will) be done in the open forum. (and it will help to pad the Q/A in my KB)

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Re: ASI Acclerated Systems controllers BAC2000 review

Post by ElectricGod » May 07 2017 6:48pm

Martin-ASI wrote:
amberwolf wrote:If you post the assistance publicly instead of by PM, it would help a lot more people. That's what this forum is all about.
True amberwolf, however, being an ASi employee, I do have to be careful about what gets said.

Sometimes things that work, may be outside of documented specifications, and I have to take responsibility for mistakes that may harm the controller. If, hypothetically someone asks why they don't run at 100V, and insists that they will, and then tries it and it blows up, I can't have it come back to me saying that I suggested it publicly. (and I wouldn't, because they aren't designed to do that)

So, if it is an innocuous question, who's answer will be helpful for everyone, yes... it should (and will) be done in the open forum. (and it will help to pad the Q/A in my KB)
Hi Martin,

You and I have communicated via email a good bit. This is the sort of place that promotes change. For example the overly limited voltage range (72 volts rather than 82 volts) in these controllers and a complete lack of speed control like the rest of the planet uses. I've offered to PAY for these changes and that fell flat and yet clearly these controllers NEED the maximum voltage set to 20S and actual speed control that tracks throttle position. And a basic vs advanced mode in the config app. Anyway, thanks for posting in this thread. Maybe by publicly exposing ASI's lack of desire to make what is a decent product that lacks some important functionality into an excellent one will create change. My only desire is to make these controllers excellent and to be able to use them to a much larger extent, but if ASI won't listen to it's customers, then I'm forced to find other solutions.

I really wanted to succeed with ASI, but that's seemingly unlikely.

In between time, I have a BAC2000 so as a minimum I'm going to help out folks use them. Feel free to post in this thread.

Cheers
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Re: ASI Acclerated Systems controllers BAC2000 review

Post by Martin-ASI » May 08 2017 12:30pm

FTDi cables are super cheaply made. I have gone through dozens of them. Ebay is not necessarily the best place to find them, as you can't be certain of their condition.

remember: Tx to Rx and Rx to Tx..

also.. sometimes, depending on power and possible ground loops, I found that a USB Isolator often becomes a solution to a bad connection.

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Re: ASI Acclerated Systems controllers BAC2000 review

Post by ElectricGod » May 08 2017 4:08pm

Martin-ASI wrote:FTDi cables are super cheaply made. I have gone through dozens of them. Ebay is not necessarily the best place to find them, as you can't be certain of their condition.

remember: Tx to Rx and Rx to Tx..

also.. sometimes, depending on power and possible ground loops, I found that a USB Isolator often becomes a solution to a bad connection.
True...except that this is the exact cable that you guys sell.
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Re: ASI Acclerated Systems controllers BAC2000 review

Post by nickjs » May 09 2017 6:27am

Hi guys ,

Just got a new genuine ftdi cable delivered today , but STILL no luck ! Damm thing still won't connect to the PC

Starting to loose the will !

I took the side cover off to see if the l.e.d was on . And it's flashing some warning codes

6 - 5. Hisocflbk
5 - 2. Hall sensor
5 - 6. Hall illegal sector
5 - 8 VdclowFLBK

The controller is sat on my desk not connected to the bike so the halls and phases are not connected right now
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Re: ASI Acclerated Systems controllers BAC2000 review

Post by nickjs » May 09 2017 6:30am

IMG_3593.JPG
IMG_3593.JPG (78.96 KiB) Viewed 2403 times
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Re: ASI Acclerated Systems controllers BAC2000 review

Post by Martin-ASI » May 09 2017 7:51am

What pins do you have it wired to? Can you show me your connections?

Does the USB plug show the green / red lights flashing?

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Re: ASI Acclerated Systems controllers BAC2000 review

Post by methods » May 09 2017 8:00am

Nice topic!

Those are rad controllers and indeed the base of some ebikes.ca equipment. We purchased one at the last robotics startup I worked butt did not have much time to fiddle (we were looking for 2 degree step precision like a stepper motor)


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Re: ASI Acclerated Systems controllers BAC2000 review

Post by Voltron » May 09 2017 8:37am

Totally minor side comment, but you wrote this Electricgod,

"I never use e-brakes to disable the controller. That's what letting off the throttle is for. If I'm too stupid to not let off the throttle while braking, well that's my problem and not the controllers job to compensate for my idiocy."

... And that's what I thought too until my throttle shorted one day in heavy car traffic while I was lane splitting and jumped the bike to full power heading towards a red light at a 4 way intersection. Added a bar mount kill switch instead of brake cutoffs, holding the brake one handed while the motor rampaged and dodging cars while yanking a fist full of wiring harness out with the other was no fun.

I might have missed whether you have a kill switch too, mostly a PSA for those without one about the practicality of some cut off device reachable without letting go of the brakes...

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Re: ASI Acclerated Systems controllers BAC2000 review

Post by nickjs » May 09 2017 9:30am

Yes the green and red lights are flashing on the USB when I click ,

The first way I wired the Rx Tx the wrong way around because in the software only the Tx flashes and I got a small red flash from the USB ,

Changed the wires around and now the software shows Tx and Rx flashing and also the red and green light flashes on the USB

But it still won't connect :?
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Re: ASI Acclerated Systems controllers BAC2000 review

Post by nickjs » May 09 2017 9:44am

Here's som pics
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IMG_3613.JPG
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Re: ASI Acclerated Systems controllers BAC2000 review

Post by nickjs » May 09 2017 9:47am

Here is some more , bear in mind the crappy wiring connectors are only temporary to see if I can get this working :oops:
Attachments
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IMG_3615.JPG
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Re: ASI Acclerated Systems controllers BAC2000 review

Post by Martin-ASI » May 09 2017 1:55pm

I am having a hard time following the wires from the picture.

can you tell me the colour from the FTDi cable to the colour of the wire on the harness that you have it attached?

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Re: ASI Acclerated Systems controllers BAC2000 review

Post by Martin-ASI » May 10 2017 7:15am

Connecting a 485 to a BAC2000

Ftdi cable - BAC

Yellow - Grey
Orange - Yellow
Black - Black

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Re: ASI Acclerated Systems controllers BAC2000 review

Post by ElectricGod » May 10 2017 6:36pm

Voltron wrote:Totally minor side comment, but you wrote this Electricgod,

"I never use e-brakes to disable the controller. That's what letting off the throttle is for. If I'm too stupid to not let off the throttle while braking, well that's my problem and not the controllers job to compensate for my idiocy."

... And that's what I thought too until my throttle shorted one day in heavy car traffic while I was lane splitting and jumped the bike to full power heading towards a red light at a 4 way intersection. Added a bar mount kill switch instead of brake cutoffs, holding the brake one handed while the motor rampaged and dodging cars while yanking a fist full of wiring harness out with the other was no fun.

I might have missed whether you have a kill switch too, mostly a PSA for those without one about the practicality of some cut off device reachable without letting go of the brakes...
I was in a driving rain storm and had a similar issue happen to me. Water got into the hall and shorted the +v and signal lines. The motor wanted to run so I just turned off the controller via the key switch. Effectively the same thing as your kill switch. I then had full control of the scooter. Once the light turned green, I flipped on the switch and road the rest of the way home. As long as throttle was equal or higher than the resistance of the water, I had total control. It was 2 miles later when I pulled into my drive way, that I had to turn off the key again. I took the throttle apart and found that the legs on the hall were not covered in heat shrink. I was asking for a short no matter what! I pulled the hall out and heat shrunk the legs and wires. I've never had the problem since. I don't have a kill switch and probably never will. I do like the idea however. I always include extra switches and buttons in my builds for possible future use. One of these could easily be implemented for just this purpose...if I wanted.
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