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Re: AVOID EUNORAU on Aliexpress

Posted: May 02 2019 7:46pm
by tomjasz
jangles wrote:
May 02 2019 9:46am
If I wanted a smart azzed comment from you I'd have asked for a clown act .

Re: AVOID EUNORAU on Aliexpress

Posted: Jun 25 2019 9:21pm
by furcifer
So just an update on this fiasco.

Several weeks ago a saw the chargeback reappear on my credit card. I received a reply letter from the credit card company saying they were reversing the chargeback and I had 2 weeks to reply with evidence or the case would be considered resolved. They also included the vendor's response.

The vendor's response was downright slanderous, he accused me of being a malicious buyer and claimed I drowned the motor, then wanted it for free and refused to provide any video evidence.

So I prepared a 10 page report on what actually transpired. I included the BBSHD specs, the accusatory email, the refusal to help while the claim was active, the offer from Aliexpress to refund the $113US, the video I uploaded to Youtube and detailed account of the 20 customer service chats that promised a lot but went nowhere. I said at a minimum I should be refunded the $113 they promised in February, but at this point I'm not willing to pay anything. Between the hassle and lack of warranty, as well as all the work, and the outright lies I wanted all my money back.

Yesterday the charges were again taken off my credit card. :mrgreen:

Long story short, if you're going to buy on Aliexpress use your credit card. Keep a detailed record of any correspondence, take screen shots and don't just give up if you have a problem. I'm pretty sure they deliberately give you the run around. Customer service seemed aware of the fact that return shipping wasn't an option. They know full well that some things are on a one way trip. All I wanted was a controller to fix the problem myself.

Re: AVOID EUNORAU on Aliexpress

Posted: Jun 26 2019 8:58pm
by tomjasz
I’m sorry, but anyone buying from these resellers when there are numerous USA resellers that provide support... well you get what you pay for. BTW it wouldn’t be the first time someone “drowned” a motor and tried to claim warranty service.

Re: AVOID EUNORAU on Aliexpress

Posted: Jun 26 2019 11:39pm
by furcifer
tomjasz wrote:
Jun 26 2019 8:58pm
I’m sorry, but anyone buying from these resellers when there are numerous USA resellers that provide support... well you get what you pay for. BTW it wouldn’t be the first time someone “drowned” a motor and tried to claim warranty service.
Well I'm not in the US. Between the mark-up, the expedited shipping and the potential for duty being tacked on, it could have run a few hundred bucks more.

And BTW, what you said any vendor could say, Chinese or American. Having the buffer like Amazon or Aliexpress between you and them tends to work better in my experience. It didn't in this case.

It seem neither here nor there, the real problem is Bafang. They don't support their products and they don't seem to support vendors very well. IMO Bafang should have expedited a new controller out to me the next day, even if it were drowned. The number of shitty controllers far exceeds the number of motors that have ever been drowned in the first week of ownership (in the Winter).

But it does seem that Bafang has a better relationship with US vendors. Which is counterintuitive, I would think one of the bigger vendors on Aliexpress would. Apparently not.

Re: AVOID EUNORAU on Aliexpress

Posted: Jun 27 2019 11:33am
by tomjasz
furcifer wrote:
Jun 26 2019 11:39pm

Well I'm not in the US. Between the mark-up, the expedited shipping and the potential for duty being tacked on, it could have run a few hundred bucks more.

And BTW, what you said any vendor could say, Chinese or American. Having the buffer like Amazon or Aliexpress between you and them tends to work better in my experience. It didn't in this case.

It seem neither here nor there, the real problem is Bafang. They don't support their products and they don't seem to support vendors very well. IMO Bafang should have expedited a new controller out to me the next day, even if it were drowned. The number of shitty controllers far exceeds the number of motors that have ever been drowned in the first week of ownership (in the Winter).

But it does seem that Bafang has a better relationship with US vendors. Which is counterintuitive, I would think one of the bigger vendors on Aliexpress would. Apparently not.
My apologies. I didn't catch your location.

Bafang sucks. They don't support resellers, much less end users. Even Luna the self-proclaimed largest reseller doesn't get the support you and I would like. Changing firmware to through an overvolt error code when using a 52V battery is their latest boondoggle. I remember only to well when a poster here trashed Luna for sending the wrong controller replacement. Bafang had changed the BBS02 to BBS02B and never said a word to ANY reseller.
Getting parts to support BBSxx users is a total nightmare. Again Bafang locks out smaller shops. Money is what talks. And yet Luna buying a container of motors has a crap selection.

I've been encouraging users to email the buggers hoping a few hundred emails would let them know we're out here. We like the product, but how about some support?

As to drowning, I suggest buyers use some black high quality RTV. Fill the gaps around the wires coming out of the motor as well as working some into the seams between motor components. Boeshield or ACF50 treatment of all connectors helps too!

Re: AVOID EUNORAU on Aliexpress

Posted: Jun 27 2019 7:36pm
by furcifer
tomjasz wrote:
Jun 27 2019 11:33am
furcifer wrote:
Jun 26 2019 11:39pm

Well I'm not in the US. Between the mark-up, the expedited shipping and the potential for duty being tacked on, it could have run a few hundred bucks more.

And BTW, what you said any vendor could say, Chinese or American. Having the buffer like Amazon or Aliexpress between you and them tends to work better in my experience. It didn't in this case.

It seem neither here nor there, the real problem is Bafang. They don't support their products and they don't seem to support vendors very well. IMO Bafang should have expedited a new controller out to me the next day, even if it were drowned. The number of shitty controllers far exceeds the number of motors that have ever been drowned in the first week of ownership (in the Winter).

But it does seem that Bafang has a better relationship with US vendors. Which is counterintuitive, I would think one of the bigger vendors on Aliexpress would. Apparently not.
My apologies. I didn't catch your location.

Bafang sucks. They don't support resellers, much less end users. Even Luna the self-proclaimed largest reseller doesn't get the support you and I would like. Changing firmware to through an overvolt error code when using a 52V battery is their latest boondoggle. I remember only to well when a poster here trashed Luna for sending the wrong controller replacement. Bafang had changed the BBS02 to BBS02B and never said a word to ANY reseller.
Getting parts to support BBSxx users is a total nightmare. Again Bafang locks out smaller shops. Money is what talks. And yet Luna buying a container of motors has a crap selection.

I've been encouraging users to email the buggers hoping a few hundred emails would let them know we're out here. We like the product, but how about some support?

As to drowning, I suggest buyers use some black high quality RTV. Fill the gaps around the wires coming out of the motor as well as working some into the seams between motor components. Boeshield or ACF50 treatment of all connectors helps too!
Yah, it could be the model. My impression from the Bafang website is they want to get into that "legal" <1000W market, especially the proprietary mid-drives. I have a feeling if a company can deliver a good integrated mid-drive motor that can meet standards in the NA and EU markets they stand to make a lot of money. Discrete, not too heavy, reliable and under $1000 with a battery is something I can see selling much like mopeds did back in the 70's. I know Wal-Mart carries a few of the smaller Bafang hub motors on some bikes. So that's why I get the impression they may not give a crap about the BBSHD. It's the product I want but not necessarily something Wal-Mart wants.

As for the drowning, yah. I strongly suggest anyone that buys a BBSHD take the controller off when they get it and just silicone the crap out of it. I've made a cork gasket and closed it up and I've had no problems since. If any moisture gets in I think it sits in the lowest point, seeps past the potting, and goes right to the mosfets.

Re: AVOID EUNORAU on Aliexpress

Posted: Aug 25 2019 12:26am
by furcifer
More follow up.

I received a text message from Eunorau yesterday. The sender claims to be the aftersales manager for the company. He inquired about the dispute I had filed in February. I told him it was resolved. He asked if they could do anything to make up for the inconvenience and I told him it was a bit late and that I didn't appreciate the accusations or how it was handled.

He said he had looked at the messages and apologized for how it was handled. Went so far as to say he would fire the person that had first handled the case.

Anyhow, he asked me again if there was anything he could do. He then assured me that if at any point I had a problem with the motor he would send me any parts I required as long as I owned it. I thanked him and that was it.

I don't know how genuine this was. It happens to be right about the time the chargeback with the credit company should have expired. The company had 45 days I believe to respond and I think that's just about up. One of the last things I mentioned to the credit card company was that Eunorau was not honoring the warranty, which was the main reason for justifying the full purchase amount be refunded.

tl;dr - I was contacted by Eunorau and they apologized for the inconvenience and assured me it would be made right.

Re: AVOID EUNORAU on Aliexpress

Posted: Aug 25 2019 12:04pm
by tomjasz
furcifer wrote:
Aug 25 2019 12:26am
More follow up.

I received a text message from Eunorau yesterday.

Who was it? Bruce? Kevin? Or?

Thanks!

Re: AVOID EUNORAU on Aliexpress

Posted: Aug 25 2019 1:31pm
by furcifer
tomjasz wrote:
Aug 25 2019 12:04pm
Who was it? Bruce? Kevin? Or?

Thanks!
I didn't ask at the time because I didn't think it could be confirmed anyways. His English seemed different from Kevin's so I'm pretty sure it wasn't him. The picture on Whatsapp is of a younger gentleman in his early 20's.

I've texted him back about his name so I'll post it here when I know.

eta: he goes by GM. I saw that on Whatsapp but thought maybe it was for General Manager

I hope it's legitimate. I took a look at their feedback over the last 6 months and it's pretty good. The one negative I saw was someone got a BBSHD recently and it won't work with a 52V battery. This has nothing to do with Eunorau, Bafang made the change out of nowhere and didn't tell suppliers. If he had an Amberwolf it wouldn't have been an issue. :lol:

If the problem is really a result of Bafang making it hard for anyone to sell their product, which it seems to be, I'd hate to besmirch someone else.

Re: AVOID EUNORAU on Aliexpress

Posted: Aug 25 2019 10:42pm
by tomjasz
Kevin has always responded to issues. A fella named “Bruce” tends to be short, terse, and rude.

Re: AVOID EUNORAU on Aliexpress

Posted: Aug 26 2019 10:27am
by furcifer
tomjasz wrote:
Aug 25 2019 10:42pm
Kevin has always responded to issues. A fella named “Bruce” tends to be short, terse, and rude.
That may be the case. Kevin's name appears on the messages but I wouldn't be surprised if more than 1 person has access to the account.

When the motor arrived a little banged up I contacted them immediately. Then when I put it together I noticed the chainring was a little bent so I contacted them again. Whoever responded then was professional, they offered to send another chainring which I declined because I had no intention of using it very long anyways. A week later when the controller blew it was suddenly my fault and we can't help you.

Maybe I was over zealous in contacting them with every issue I came across. I did so because documenting things accurately when they happen is important if and when a problem arises. Unfortunately this can come off as being a whingy customer, which I also get.

For whatever reason, because I was honest and admitted it was a damp Winter day with a little rain, whoever was talking messages didn't want to help me. Then they wanted video of it not working, which seemed odd. I'm trying to explain that I don't want to plug it back in and possibly damage the battery, the motor or the display in order to show them an electrical device that's "off". Thankfully nothing else was damaged when I finally made the video but it was the last time it turned on with that controller. I have a feeling that if I had taken it apart right away I might have been able to repair the controller. Instead I burned a whole though the PCB doing what they told me to do.

Anyhow, it was an unusual set of circumstances and things may have got lost in translation. With this recent follow up I'm satisfied that it was probably isolated and not necessarily representative of how the company does business in general.

Re: AVOID EUNORAU on Aliexpress

Posted: Aug 26 2019 2:11pm
by espresso
Well I had a pretty horrible experience with the company, so I wouldn't be buying anything in a hurry from them.

Re: AVOID EUNORAU on Aliexpress

Posted: Aug 27 2019 2:58am
by tomjasz
“Maybe I was over zealous in contacting them with every issue I came across. I did so because documenting things accurately when they happen is important if and when a problem arises. Unfortunately this can come off as being a whingy customer, which I also get.”

I’m sorry you were treated this way. I’m 100% in support of your complaints. Sadly we give these guys business rather than pay a few dollars more with a USA based reseller. Typically my employer charges a few dollars more but supports all sales, answers phones, and emails with a solid warranty. I buy China direct for personal purchases, but expect a lower price means less support. As always, YMMV.

Re: AVOID EUNORAU on Aliexpress

Posted: Aug 27 2019 11:30am
by furcifer
tomjasz wrote:
Aug 27 2019 2:58am
“Maybe I was over zealous in contacting them with every issue I came across. I did so because documenting things accurately when they happen is important if and when a problem arises. Unfortunately this can come off as being a whingy customer, which I also get.”

I’m sorry you were treated this way. I’m 100% in support of your complaints. Sadly we give these guys business rather than pay a few dollars more with a USA based reseller. Typically my employer charges a few dollars more but supports all sales, answers phones, and emails with a solid warranty. I buy China direct for personal purchases, but expect a lower price means less support. As always, YMMV.
I wouldn't do it again with a big ticket item. There isn't much to be saved, if at all, and the language barrier makes it difficult to communicate technical things.
I haven't bought much off Aliexpress since then. A lot of what I'm looking for is usually available on Amazon, and sometimes Prime. I've got to buy a Lekkie soon and I'll find someone in NA for sure.