E-S Stealth Electric Bike Owners

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Theodore Voltaire   1 MW

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Re: E-S Stealth Electric Bike Owners

Post by Theodore Voltaire » Aug 13 2015 2:44pm

[quote="efMX Trials Electric Freeride"]TV,
the top of the fork legs need to be even on both sides..
the front axle end nuts are a second security for not losing your front wheel..
http://www.dnmshock.com/upload_files/fork-manual.pdf





Alright, so what's the procedure for tightening the axle? Axle end cap first I assume, then the pinch bolts in the lower leg? I noticed once the pinch bolts are tight, you can't turn the end caps.

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efMX Trials Electric Freeride   100 kW

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Re: E-S Stealth Electric Bike Owners

Post by efMX Trials Electric Freeride » Aug 13 2015 3:06pm

front wheel installation for DNM usd8 :
1.Apply a light coat of water-proof grease to the axle..
2.Fit the wheel into place between the fork legs. The brake disc should sit on the left
side..
3.Guide brake disc into the brake caliper so the disc fits between the brake pads..
4.Insert the axle.. Tap the axle into place with a rubber mallet if needed..
5.Install the axle cap bolts..
6.Tighten the axle cap bolts to specification with an 8 mm hex socket..
Torque (N-m) 27 - 29
Torque (ft-lbs.) 20 - 22
7.Hold the front brake and compress the forks by pushing on the handlebar a few
times to seat the axle. Tighten the axle clamp bolts evenly to specification with a 5
mm hex socket..
Torque (N-m) 8 - 9
Torque (ft-lbs.) 6 - 7
Theodore Voltaire wrote: Alright, so what's the procedure for tightening the axle? Axle end cap first I assume, then the pinch bolts in the lower leg? I noticed once the pinch bolts are tight, you can't turn the end caps.
some ride & sk8 videos:
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http://www.youtube.com/natas666damien
i have nothing for sale.. :)

Theodore Voltaire   1 MW

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Re: E-S Stealth Electric Bike Owners

Post by Theodore Voltaire » Aug 13 2015 3:23pm

Thanks efMX. That's what I do, except I always install the caliper last. Seems easier that way.

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Cowardlyduck   100 MW

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Re: E-S Stealth Electric Bike Owners

Post by Cowardlyduck » Aug 14 2015 8:19pm

I don't want to go too off topic in this thread, but just an update for those who were interested. My Leaf Motor arrived for my Fighter yesterday.
I originally asked for (and was told I would get) 165mm shoulders, 250mm total axle length, and 16mm nuts.
They only delivered on the shoulders at 165mm...everything else is as stock, so ~220mm total length, and 14mm nuts. I'm really not too fussed though as the most important attribute I wanted changed was the shoulders, and they delivered on that...at no extra charge, so I'm happy with it anyway, and it will still work better than the HS40 axle IMO.
It also looks like it will fit another old E-Bike I'm in the process of repairing so it won't go to waste if my HS4080 ends up being the reliable option for my Fighter. :)
The original stock 10g spokes from my Fighters HS4065 also (just) fit the spoke holes in this motor, so hopefully the length works also. :)
I'll let the pics tell the rest of the story. :)

Image
Image
Image
As you can see...weight is about right as anticipated...although I wasn't sure if your meant to weigh with the wires...they take it up to 7.3Kg.
Image
Looks like my original torque blocks were actually meant for a 14mm axle (is that what the X5 motor's have?)...so no changes needed. :)
Image
And before anyone goes circling the drop-out anomaly above, be aware, we added a small amount of metal (via welder) to the inside of the dropout to repair some of the wear. I'm just yet to grind it back.
Image

So all in all, the Leaf Motor makes a good fit for the Fighter...time will tell if it's a good fit power wise, but considering it's about equal in torque with the HS35xx motor's the Fighters originally came with I would say it will be. :)

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kiwiev   10 kW

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Re: E-S Stealth Electric Bike Owners

Post by kiwiev » Aug 14 2015 10:11pm

Looks good CD :D :D :D :D

I have that 10 speed rear cassette if you are interested.

Cheers Kiwi

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Cowardlyduck   100 MW

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Re: E-S Stealth Electric Bike Owners

Post by Cowardlyduck » Aug 14 2015 10:33pm

kiwiev wrote:Looks good CD :D :D :D :D

I have that 10 speed rear cassette if you are interested.

Cheers Kiwi
Thanks!
Like most of these hub motor's it's got a freewheel side plate. I can swap over the 7speed freewheel from my old HS4065 to get up and running. :)

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Re: E-S Stealth Electric Bike Owners

Post by voicecoils » Aug 14 2015 11:12pm

Hope the bike gets recovered QMS!!
Samd wrote:In fact when the coils can't make the extra power into magnetic field, it's forced to make it into radically more heat. A cooling system can carry it away to stop the motor burning out, but you don't get a chance for that extra kinetic energy out of the back end of the bike.
Thanks for picking up the torch Sam & explaining saturation from a few more angles. It's a cornerstone topic for hotrodding & with the easy availability of 10kW+ controllers now there's plenty of opportunity to bump against that fundamental limit on many hub motors.

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Re: E-S Stealth Electric Bike Owners

Post by Hyena » Aug 14 2015 11:57pm

That sucks about the theft QMS!
What did the police have to say about it ?
I will keep my eye out for it on the off chance it winds up in my neck of the woods. It's certainly not subtle so unless it ends up on a large private property it's going to get noticed.
Maybe fitting a GPS tracker your demo bikes might be a good move in future ? It's sad we have to even talk about it but unfortunately you're not the first person who's had a bike pinched during or after a test ride.

CD, that's good in a way they sent you a 14mm axle, atleast it's a straight drop in for your torque plates. And yes, the bombers X5 motor uses 14mm axle.
And before anyone goes circling the drop-out anomaly above, be aware, we added a small amount of metal (via welder)
Ah, too late :P Just to clarify, did you only weld one side ? The photo isnt totally clear, I've circled what looks to be the welded side and drawn an arrow to what looks like the unwelded side. Is that right ?
CD-drop.jpg
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Cowardlyduck   100 MW

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Re: E-S Stealth Electric Bike Owners

Post by Cowardlyduck » Aug 15 2015 12:15am

:lol: :lol: :lol: Jay, predictable as always.

Yeah, only one side really needed the fix up, and you've correctly figured out which. I couldn't slide the motor right into the drop-out in that shot because of it so need to grind it back till I can.

I'm guessing you can see something wrong? What now? :roll:

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Samd   1.21 GW

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Re: E-S Stealth Electric Bike Owners

Post by Samd » Aug 15 2015 4:39am

Ummm.
http://ballaratebikes.com/

ImageImageImage
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Re: E-S Stealth Electric Bike Owners

Post by Jestronix » Aug 15 2015 6:15am

DunkenKBliths wrote:
QMS wrote:URGENT URGENT URGENT DEMO BIKE JUST STOLEN#

Just posted on Twitter...with picture...I have a few thousand followers...so hopefully it might get picked up !

This is obviously too late, as hyena mentioned there are some pretty cheap GPS loggers these days, easy to mount with all the other gizmos, most wouldn't know it's there, just rock around to their place with the cops or the local footy team.

People mount them to their drones Incase they fly off.

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Re: E-S Stealth Electric Bike Owners

Post by Samd » Aug 15 2015 7:22am

Would be keen on a recommendation for these. I know some use a very coarse location and some are quite accurate but need an active sim card.
http://ballaratebikes.com/

ImageImageImage
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Rix   100 GW

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Re: E-S Stealth Electric Bike Owners

Post by Rix » Aug 15 2015 10:49am

Cowardlyduck wrote::lol: :lol: :lol: Jay, predictable as always.

I'm guessing you can see something wrong? What now? :roll:

Cheers
No trying to be a smart a$$, but you went from a motor with a 40+mm wide stator to a motor with a 35mm wide stator, this will translate into about 10% less thrust acceleration, but you will probably gain 1-2 Km/H top speed. I think you are going to be disappointed performance wise. I know I would. That said, the bigger axle and your swingarm repair is definitely a step in the right direction and those issues will probably be resolved.

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Re: E-S Stealth Electric Bike Owners

Post by Cowardlyduck » Aug 15 2015 9:16pm

Rix wrote:No trying to be a smart a$$, but you went from a motor with a 40+mm wide stator to a motor with a 35mm wide stator, this will translate into about 10% less thrust acceleration, but you will probably gain 1-2 Km/H top speed.
How do you figure that? I think I know why you are thinking that, but curious as to why you claim it?

The Leaf motor is 10% more efficient than the HS40...so yeah, it might have 10% less torque, but will make 10% less heat at the same power level. Also keep in mind, I didn't buy this motor to break any thrust/acceleration records. As mentioned previously, I originally bought this motor to make a reliable slightly lighter and cheaper alternative to the HS4080 with similar performance.
So the Leaf motor at 7.2Kg, $260, and a 14mm axle VS the HS40xx at 8.4KG, $900, and 1/2" axle...so far I think I've succeeded. :mrgreen:

So I can see your not trying to be a smart a$$...your just completely missing the point.

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Rix   100 GW

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Re: E-S Stealth Electric Bike Owners

Post by Rix » Aug 15 2015 10:28pm

Cowardlyduck wrote:
Rix wrote:No trying to be a smart a$$, but you went from a motor with a 40+mm wide stator to a motor with a 35mm wide stator, this will translate into about 10% less thrust acceleration, but you will probably gain 1-2 Km/H top speed.
How do you figure that? I think I know why you are thinking that, but curious as to why you claim it?

The Leaf motor is 10% more efficient than the HS40...so yeah, it might have 10% less torque, but will make 10% less heat at the same power level. Also keep in mind, I didn't buy this motor to break any thrust/acceleration records. As mentioned previously, I originally bought this motor to make a reliable slightly lighter and cheaper alternative to the HS4080 with similar performance.
So the Leaf motor at 7.2Kg, $260, and a 14mm axle VS the HS40xx at 8.4KG, $900, and 1/2" axle...so far I think I've succeeded. :mrgreen:

So I can see your not trying to be a smart a$$...your just completely missing the point.

Cheers
Yah,I missed your point completely :shock: and didn't see it from your perspective of being more efficient, and economically cheaper. What I queued in on was "3540 performance" with the better axle. Okay, so now that I am tracking with you CD, this is the motor you will be running with the Mini, are you going to be sticking with 12S lipo? Still want to know what you get for top speed with OVS on 7. Got an ETA for when this will be up and running?

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Cowardlyduck   100 MW

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Re: E-S Stealth Electric Bike Owners

Post by Cowardlyduck » Aug 15 2015 10:49pm

Rix wrote:Yah,I missed your point completely :shock: and didn't see it from your perspective of being more efficient, and economically cheaper. What I queued in on was "3540 performance" with the better axle. Okay, so now that I am tracking with you CD, this is the motor you will be running with the Mini, are you going to be sticking with 12S lipo? Still want to know what you get for top speed with OVS on 7. Got an ETA for when this will be up and running?
Cool. :)
Well, everything is a bit up in the air atm.
Since it looks like my HS4080 will now live again with it's new axle and improved torque blocks, I'm think about using it on the Fighter mainly and potentially using the Leaf on another bike. That being said, I will be lacing the Leaf into the 24" rim from my old busted HS4065, so I will be able to swap it over to the Fighter if I want to. And I think I will do that for when I want to do longer rides as the increased efficiency and reduced weight could get me and extra 10km+ range. :)

As for my Adaptto...I got it back from warranty repairs from Russia the other week. I just got around to testing it last night and it's got the same original issue where it doesn't read or display power readings. :x
Adaptto told me they tested it twice before sending back, but I suspect their tests didn't include closely examining the display to see that it read/displayed power readings properly. It still runs motor's, but has no way of limiting itself, or showing how much power is used which is how it blew last time.
This time hopefully they can look at it before it blows so they will know how to fix it for good. :roll:
But considering I've already spend 1/4 of the total cost of the thing in posting it back (insured) to Russia for repairs, I'm not keen to repeat that without some sort of compensation from Adaptto which I will be seeking. We'll see how it goes. :|

So for now the ETA is some time in the next few weeks...with my old 18Fet Infineon as the controller and the original 16S LiFeP04 stock battery with over 500 cycles as my pack. At least it will be running. :)

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Rix   100 GW

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Re: E-S Stealth Electric Bike Owners

Post by Rix » Aug 15 2015 11:29pm

Bummer about the mini E. Good new about the bigger axle for the 4080 though. Who is machining the new axle for you?

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Re: E-S Stealth Electric Bike Owners

Post by Cowardlyduck » Aug 16 2015 5:37am

Rix wrote:Bummer about the mini E. Good new about the bigger axle for the 4080 though. Who is machining the new axle for you?
Sorry, I should have clarified.
By 'new' axle, I really meant the axle we salvaged from my old busted HS4065...what we've been discussing the last few pages. So it's all the same specs...just without the stripped threads my HS4080 had previously.
So it would have the same rotation issues as before, however we beefed it up with some welds on the axle and on the dropouts, and made the changes to the torque blocks as posted previously, so I'm hopeful this axle will last even though it's 1/2" cheese metal.

I ground back the weld on the dropouts, and wire brushed them to clean them up a bit. A nice new coat of paint and they look pretty good IMO. :)

Image
Image
Image
Image

Cheers
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Modified Stealth Fighter - Force air cooled motor @ 6KW, Adaptto Mini-E. 49AH, 52V 18650 - 2.5Kwhr
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kiwiev   10 kW

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Re: E-S Stealth Electric Bike Owners

Post by kiwiev » Aug 16 2015 6:00am

Looks good CD :D

Nice work :mrgreen:

Bummer about your controller

Cheers Kiwi

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Re: E-S Stealth Electric Bike Owners

Post by Jimboyr6 » Aug 16 2015 6:06am

Don't those welds have to be perfectly flat on inside of swing arm ?
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Re: E-S Stealth Electric Bike Owners

Post by Jimboyr6 » Aug 16 2015 6:18am

Just a little home made carbon shit guard,makes it easyer to clean especially when u get dog shit flick up onto the wires etc :shock:
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Cowardlyduck   100 MW

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Re: E-S Stealth Electric Bike Owners

Post by Cowardlyduck » Aug 16 2015 6:47am

Jimboyr6 wrote:Don't those welds have to be perfectly flat on inside of swing arm ?
It is pretty flat already...pic doesn't really show it.
Jimboyr6 wrote:Just a little home made carbon shit guard,makes it easyer to clean especially when u get dog shit flick up onto the wires etc :shock:
I like it. :)
I need to do something similar as the mess I get on the wires around here sucks. :)

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Samd   1.21 GW

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Re: E-S Stealth Electric Bike Owners

Post by Samd » Aug 16 2015 7:16am

Cd you've dropped 15% from your stator width and torque will be a similar drop.
Torque is proportional to stator width, assuming they are using the same parameters for copper fill and neodymium grade.
You can can feed it a bit more juice to compensate. You'll have to.
Net nett you'll be about the same kwh per km, just a less responsive motor.

Did it end up being $260? I thought that was the USD price, but thought postage was extra?
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Re: E-S Stealth Electric Bike Owners

Post by Allex » Aug 16 2015 8:31am

I think this is why mxus is more popular, it has nice torque thx to 45mm, but yeah it is about 1kg heavier. It was a lot better compared to bomber motor

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Re: E-S Stealth Electric Bike Owners

Post by Emmett » Aug 16 2015 10:18am

Theodore Voltaire wrote:Thanks efMX. That's what I do, except I always install the caliper last. Seems easier that way.
I'm not sure what you mean. Note that you don't have to remove the front brake caliper to remove and reinstall the front wheel. Loctite the caliper bolts in place when the caliper is aligned with the rotor. Then don't disturb it. Even when changing the pads, leave the caliper mount bolts alone.

With USD-8 fork:

- Get the upper fork caps level in the triples. Don't worry about the fully extended length of each fork being different. That's because the top-out stopper is in the left leg. All fine.
- When installing the front wheel, push the axle through from the brake side first, then lift the right side lug a little so the axle pops through into position. The tighten the end cap bolts lightly, then the pinch bolts. No need to go real tight on anything. The axle or caps will never come loose. It's very important that the axle is lightly lubed before installation, so it sits square/true in the fork lugs.
- Release the air pressure out of the right (damper) leg if not riding for a week or more. That greatly reduces the chance of air leaking past the piston seal into the the damper oil. I used a dremel grinder to make more clearance around the schrader valve for easy air filling.
- check that the bushing caps are tight on the bottom of each gold alum upper tube. DNM didn't do mine up very tight at the factory.
Last edited by Emmett on Aug 16 2015 9:12pm, edited 1 time in total.

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