GCinDC's Giant DH Comp

Show off your E-bike creation here.
User avatar
rui_fujino   1 kW

1 kW
Posts: 377
Joined: Aug 14 2010 2:10am
Location: UK/Japan

Re: GCinDC's Giant DH Comp

Post by rui_fujino » Mar 21 2013 2:58pm

I think this is THE most popular topic on Ebike today!
At least we can watch and support your new build again!

downside:
new controller nd batteries nd all the effort...

on good side:
rear end of your bike seems alive! so maybe you only need front end of frame replaced?
gopro case might have survived?
front fork might be fine if you take that to service... :oops:
MORE timelapse video!

gd luck!
Project 1: Apollo slant hard tail MTB 52v lifepo4, conhismotor, 52T-11T gearing 39.6mph top speed (with pedal)
Project 2: Diamondback s:10 Full suspension 20s2p (83.5v 10ah Lipo), 35kg, HS3540 sensored (MethTek), 12FET lyen controller, Bulk 600w balance charger.
Top speed 45mph(72.4km/h)
Project 3: DOPPELGANGER d2 Visceral
Project 5 Specialized Epic20s2p (83.5v 10ah Lipo), 30kg,HS3540 sensored (MethTek), 12FET lyen @ 50A
Top speed 45mph(72.4km/h)
EV miles: 3000miles (2015/06/26)

User avatar
flyinmonkie   10 kW

10 kW
Posts: 753
Joined: Oct 08 2008 2:13am
Location: NZ

Re: GCinDC's Giant DH Comp

Post by flyinmonkie » Mar 21 2013 4:12pm

Glad you and the bulk of you possessions are ok. Sad to see the bike go. It looks like it was a very hot, but very localized fire. It always amazes me how fire works.

Hope you got the smoothie cleaned up,that looked harder than the garage. ;)

Clay

User avatar
full-throttle   10 MW

10 MW
Posts: 2013
Joined: May 07 2009 8:21pm
Location: N-E Victoria, AUS

Re: GCinDC's Giant DH Comp

Post by full-throttle » Mar 21 2013 4:15pm

Oh no.. :(

That sucks man

I'd like to help. Is your paypal same as the email?

PS was it a strawberry smoothie?

litespeed   100 kW

100 kW
Posts: 1372
Joined: Aug 11 2010 4:42pm
Location: St. Peters, Missouri

Re: GCinDC's Giant DH Comp

Post by litespeed » Mar 21 2013 5:29pm

Didn't offer any of us smoothies.....

Bummer on the bike. I'd check on the insurance payout also. Pay in for years and then we are brainwashed into never using it, how smart is that?

Positive side is "new bike stuff!"

Tom
I'm married so you know I'm no stranger to pain!

User avatar
knoxie   10 MW

10 MW
Posts: 2431
Joined: Jan 03 2007 5:54pm
Location: UK
Contact:

Re: GCinDC's Giant DH Comp

Post by knoxie » Mar 21 2013 6:34pm

:(

Oh man didnt expect to see this Buddy?? so sorry man that really does suck balls...but I want to know how the flip nothing else burned? it must have smouldered maybe? a few things positive to take from this, I think the motor and the forks are totally OK to use again considering how you ride not sure about the frame it depends on how hot it got, to be safe you probably have to write it off.

I cant believe it didnt do worse? losing the bike is nothing to loosing your house, someone up there was looking after you Greg :D and they did give you warnings, its an odd coincidence Greg but last Friday I parked my bike up at home and left it in the garage over the weekend, the pack was almost flat, I came back to the bike on Monday and saw the controller was still on :cry: I forgot to unplug the pack for sure all cells were down below 2V per cell, however this pack is 3 years old and did have a few cells that were not up to the mark and like you I had been thinking of getting new cells, this totally forced my hand, I sat the batteries in clear space on the concrete garage floor and got straight on the HK for some new ones, a day later the new cells had arrived.

I always have charged my batteries off the bike for this reason on a fire proof blanket under a smoke alarm, I only ever charge the batteries on the table in a brick garage and only when I am within earshot of the alarm, I know a lot of folks dont like the batteries sitting on the rack on the back of the bike but my main reason for doing it is so I can take them off for charging and safe storage, so what if the handling sucks a little.

I have always worried a little about the metal tray surrounding the batteries on your bike buddy and have worried about the pack or the wires being cut or damaged by the edges of it, its very hard to know for sure what has happened here as the evidence is all but destroyed :oops: I have been using the same charger for many months now with no problems what so ever however I dont trust anything when it comes to anyones charger and always charge off the bike.

One of the things I was going to do was to fit a baby alarm in the garage when I am out of earshot of the smoke alarm, I am now going to get one its funny how these things tend to force your hand.

I am so sorry about this buddy and in the spirit of Jay will be sending you a little gift from us here to help along with the new bike/batteries, jeez the amount you put in to this hobby and for all of the entertainment you create with your videos you deserve it, If i lived just down the road I would be there every night helping you clean up and get back to normal too 8)

Take care Greg and if there is anything else I can do to help you just let me know.

Knoxie
Electric KMX 72V Lipo, USPD drive unit. BMX 72V, Puma BMC,
Raleigh 26 inch MTB Puma 50V Turnigy 25C Lipo 10AH, Trek MTB, X5 48V NIMH. Electric BMX
http://tinyurl.com/4vrmc8 http://tinyurl.com/3umm4n

User avatar
knoxie   10 MW

10 MW
Posts: 2431
Joined: Jan 03 2007 5:54pm
Location: UK
Contact:

Re: GCinDC's Giant DH Comp

Post by knoxie » Mar 21 2013 6:49pm

Hi Greg

Just sent you $200 towards your new bike / build / batteries :D hope it helps, your videos in entertainment for me are worth that and more, so if anyone else has enjoyed Gregs videos and input on this forum please chip in, Greg doesnt post up his email address but if you message me I will pass it on so you can help.

If it helps put a smile back on your face then its worth it. :D
Electric KMX 72V Lipo, USPD drive unit. BMX 72V, Puma BMC,
Raleigh 26 inch MTB Puma 50V Turnigy 25C Lipo 10AH, Trek MTB, X5 48V NIMH. Electric BMX
http://tinyurl.com/4vrmc8 http://tinyurl.com/3umm4n

User avatar
GCinDC   10 GW

10 GW
Posts: 4245
Joined: Jan 23 2009 11:19am
Location: Washington, DC

Re: GCinDC's Giant DH Comp

Post by GCinDC » Mar 21 2013 7:48pm

thanks for all the kind thoughts guys! i'm touched. it warms my heart to know how much support i have around the world from you all.

but hold on with the paypal. let's see what happens with insurance. i talked to my agent and she recommended a cleanup service and a guy's coming out tomorrow am to give an estimate. i know y'all think my garage is not the cleanest and most organized, and the truth is that it's sometimes unnavigable! :mrgreen: but these folks clean everything and charge insurance, and that would be well worth the deductible.

my only concern is that they're going to say the fire was caused by an uninsured motor vehicle and then will refuse to pay. or come up with other reasons.

so anyway, let's see what happens. please don't send any money. seriously. that's a very nice thought.

kids are finally down, so i think i'll go out and take some more pics, see if we can find out WTF happened...
Youtube channel, 2013 Highlights vid. Ebike Nerdcast.
Giant DH Comp: 20s lipo (11.6Ah), hs3540, Adaptto Mini-E, 900W BMSBattery charger.
GT I-Drive (sold), 20s lipo, 9C, 72V 45A 12FET.

Trackman417   10 kW

10 kW
Posts: 838
Joined: May 05 2011 9:25am
Location: Bergen County, New Jersey

Re: GCinDC's Giant DH Comp

Post by Trackman417 » Mar 21 2013 8:01pm

GCinDC wrote:thanks for all the kind thoughts guys! i'm touched. it warms my heart to know how much support i have around the world from you all.

but hold on with the paypal. let's see what happens with insurance. i talked to my agent and she recommended a cleanup service and a guy's coming out tomorrow am to give an estimate. i know y'all think my garage is not the cleanest and most organized, and the truth is that it's sometimes unnavigable! :mrgreen: but these folks clean everything and charge insurance, and that would be well worth the deductible.

my only concern is that they're going to say the fire was caused by an uninsured motor vehicle and then will refuse to pay. or come up with other reasons.

so anyway, let's see what happens. please don't send any money. seriously. that's a very nice thought.

kids are finally down, so i think i'll go out and take some more pics, see if we can find out WTF happened...
Please do. Did they say anything about covering the bike? That would be a pretty awesome bonus. :mrgreen: .
You don't have a back up bike anymore, right?
K2 Sidewinder
H4065 36 mph
20s2p 10aH lipo battery pack
If it didn't kill you, it just built your character.
You know your bike is powerful when even you, the builder, can't control it.
Customer 00001 at our very own Bigmooses online store http://mtg-technologies.com/zencart/ Great guy, great products.

User avatar
GCinDC   10 GW

10 GW
Posts: 4245
Joined: Jan 23 2009 11:19am
Location: Washington, DC

Re: GCinDC's Giant DH Comp

Post by GCinDC » Mar 21 2013 8:43pm

tough to say. some bottom packs were way puffed, and stretched the metal box...

Image

Image

Image

Image

pulling out one of the 4s booster packs:
Image

the stuff that fell to the floor, more less how as it lay:
Image

Image

Image

Image

the psu:
Image

Image

Image

controller wiring:
Image

a vid of the cell removal up soon..
Youtube channel, 2013 Highlights vid. Ebike Nerdcast.
Giant DH Comp: 20s lipo (11.6Ah), hs3540, Adaptto Mini-E, 900W BMSBattery charger.
GT I-Drive (sold), 20s lipo, 9C, 72V 45A 12FET.

User avatar
pendragon8000   1 MW

1 MW
Posts: 1740
Joined: Sep 28 2012 3:29am
Location: Adelaide, Australia

Re: GCinDC's Giant DH Comp

Post by pendragon8000 » Mar 21 2013 9:01pm

Greg, I was devostated when I saw those pics. Lucky your OK and it was just your bike. Good to see you still have a sense of humor about the fenders :) all the best to you and getting back on the road.
8)HYENA high power ebike kits
My builds
scott 29er + Hyena kit, mon-goose to MON-STER 6KW, Free Agent RC Mid Drive, videos

my bike goes so fast 'cos it charges the battery while I pedal

User avatar
GCinDC   10 GW

10 GW
Posts: 4245
Joined: Jan 23 2009 11:19am
Location: Washington, DC

Re: GCinDC's Giant DH Comp

Post by GCinDC » Mar 21 2013 9:55pm

Youtube channel, 2013 Highlights vid. Ebike Nerdcast.
Giant DH Comp: 20s lipo (11.6Ah), hs3540, Adaptto Mini-E, 900W BMSBattery charger.
GT I-Drive (sold), 20s lipo, 9C, 72V 45A 12FET.

melodious   100 kW

100 kW
Posts: 1154
Joined: Aug 26 2011 8:57am
Location: East Coast, U.S.A.

Re: GCinDC's Giant DH Comp

Post by melodious » Mar 21 2013 10:09pm

Are lithium fires hot enough to weaken your aluminum frame :?: I bet you take a good brush to that frame and rid yourself of all the dead shite in the middle, you'd have a lot of useable bicycle leftover.

As far as causes, we can fairly assume that it pretty much began when you took a pic of that 0.00V #6 cell. Proceeded to bulk charge minus a few V's to compensate for the baddie. Turned the bike upside down to inspect/repair your front gear ring, which could have caused a short or disconnect. You left your bike charged unattended. Those are a few off the top of my head. I sound like a negative Nancy now lol. Anyways, live and learn, no one was hurt. Hell, if your quick enough you might even keep the wife from stumbling on the crime scene :wink: .

I always enjoy your thread updates as you provide nice entertainment via video and pics. But your leave yourself open to criticism. I'll have a stab at you: Your messy, you make shortcuts, and you take a lot of risks. I think your next build should emphasize the opposite of this one: clean/secure wire harness, safety LVC/HVC circuitry, a cut-off timer on your charging system, etc. I think that is your next step.

Jeez. I wish you got that fire on film. It would have been glorious! :mrgreen:
Surly Ogre rigid 29er, rear 10T MAC @ 50V 25AH & 40A: 30mph road/gravel/hill machine
42" dual diagonal Eskateboard @6s & 90mm wheels
Next: eMTB @10-12s & 8"-12" pneumatic wheels; Got Strapped? d-(',')z

User avatar
full-throttle   10 MW

10 MW
Posts: 2013
Joined: May 07 2009 8:21pm
Location: N-E Victoria, AUS

Re: GCinDC's Giant DH Comp

Post by full-throttle » Mar 21 2013 10:11pm

Looks very sad.. Needs something like Street Spirit for soundtrack.

Hope the insurance works out for you!

Meantime I'll ask knoxie for your paypal

User avatar
Ypedal   100 GW

100 GW
Posts: 12523
Joined: Dec 27 2006 12:55pm
Location: Moncton NB, Canada
Contact:

Re: GCinDC's Giant DH Comp

Post by Ypedal » Mar 21 2013 10:15pm

holy crap !!!!!!!!! :shock:

that sucks so bad... but it could have been so much worse........

dont inhale that black dust man, gloves and particulate mask.... you can fix your bike, hard to fix broken lungs. :wink:

but wow....

that frame is toast.... for sure.
ES site status page:
http://www.ypedal.com/ES/ES.htm
----------------
http://www.ypedal.com

User avatar
neptronix   100 GW

100 GW
Posts: 13962
Joined: Jun 15 2010 5:56pm
Location: California refugee living in Utah, USA
Contact:

Re: GCinDC's Giant DH Comp

Post by neptronix » Mar 21 2013 11:50pm

Owch..
Do you think the dud cell was partly to blame? how bad was the dud - do you remember?

Maybe a cargo bike full of lifepo4 is in your future..
Efficiency is everything :bolt:

My first major build: 1.6kW 8T MAC motor on a Trek 4500.
The new all-arounder: Leafmotor 1500w @ 4kW on a Turner O2 full suspension.
The monster scooter: 20" eZee on a Cannondale Semi Recumbent.
Whipper-snapper: ? on a lightweight BikeE Semi Recumbent

User avatar
hjns   100 kW

100 kW
Posts: 1273
Joined: Aug 20 2011 11:05pm
Location: Basel, Switzerland

Re: GCinDC's Giant DH Comp

Post by hjns » Mar 22 2013 3:30am

oh man, I feel for you! My condolence for your burned bike.

Very much looking forwards to what you are going to build after cleaning up....
Henk


All men dream: but not equally. Those who dream by night in the dusty recesses of their minds wake in the day to find that it was vanity: but the dreamers of the day are dangerous men, for they may act their dreams with open eyes, to make it possible. T.E. Lawrence

User avatar
dan974   1 kW

1 kW
Posts: 414
Joined: Jun 12 2012 1:36am
Location: Reunion Island

Re: GCinDC's Giant DH Comp

Post by dan974 » Mar 22 2013 4:44am

I have no words in english Greg...I firstly feel scared of it and next, whooo you avoid the worst, Life is make of Ups and downs, hope you get up soon on a new bike, what about making an endless-sphere inssurance for fire, paypal system, the main contributors of the E sphere need reconnoitring...

User avatar
GCinDC   10 GW

10 GW
Posts: 4245
Joined: Jan 23 2009 11:19am
Location: Washington, DC

Re: GCinDC's Giant DH Comp

Post by GCinDC » Mar 22 2013 5:34am

melodious wrote:As far as causes, we can fairly assume that it pretty much began when you took a pic of that 0.00V #6 cell.
There is no #6 cell. i charged 5s8p and 4s2p at the same time, so no #6.

could the runt cell have been stressed by constantly being paralleled with a stronger 25c pack cells, and thereby effectively getting overcharged each time the pack is paralleled?
melodious wrote:Proceeded to bulk charge minus a few V's to compensate for the baddie. Turned the bike upside down to inspect/repair your front gear ring, which could have caused a short or disconnect.
i take battery out when i flip it.
melodious wrote:You left your bike charged unattended.
it would have caught fire anyway. just done less damage. i loved my new bag, but if i could have seen the packs, maybe i would have noticed something different. i do not plan on attending future charges either, fwiw, whatever other safeguards i adopt.
melodious wrote:Hell, if your quick enough you might even keep the wife from stumbling on the crime scene :wink:
i'm not sure how i would explain all soot in the garage then, which will take many, many man hours to clean off every single thing, including the bike that she will not be commuting on today because it would ruin her clothes!
melodious wrote:I always enjoy your thread updates as you provide nice entertainment via video and pics.
glad to hear it.
melodious wrote:But your leave yourself open to criticism. I'll have a stab at you: Your messy, you make shortcuts, and you take a lot of risks.
you are right. i'll be the first to admit it. i'm not sure what in particular you're referring to, and there are too many ways to respond, like the frustration of designing for an ever-changing platform (building for 20s, then wanting 24s..), arguing the functional values of electrical tape vs. shrink tube... but i don't have enough time now, and that is always the case with me and the bike. never enough time... i mainly enjoy riding the build, but i have learned a lot over the years, often by making mistakes.
melodious wrote: I think your next build should emphasize the opposite of this one: clean/secure wire harness, safety LVC/HVC circuitry, a cut-off timer on your charging system, etc. I think that is your next step.
good ideas. thanks.

ps. i'll explain more about the conditions of the cells later.
Youtube channel, 2013 Highlights vid. Ebike Nerdcast.
Giant DH Comp: 20s lipo (11.6Ah), hs3540, Adaptto Mini-E, 900W BMSBattery charger.
GT I-Drive (sold), 20s lipo, 9C, 72V 45A 12FET.

dnmun   100 GW

100 GW
Posts: 16190
Joined: Jun 09 2008 1:32pm
Location: portland, or and loveland, co

Re: GCinDC's Giant DH Comp

Post by dnmun » Mar 22 2013 10:20am

someone with experience welding the aluminum may be able to tell you how much damage was done to the frame by the heat and can clean the frame for you too.

you would expect much of the heat to be conducted away because it is aluminum so it may not have any spot that was overheated enuff to damage the tubing. the top tube was in the flame from the cells but the 2x4 along the edge of the bench was also so you can see that the flames were hot enuff to ignite the wood but when the flames died out after all the electrolyte was consumed, then the wood soaked up the heat so it cooled and the fire went out again. so it may have lasted about 20-30 minutes.

the charger has a plastic case and that melted enuff to expose the shunt inside?

User avatar
GCinDC   10 GW

10 GW
Posts: 4245
Joined: Jan 23 2009 11:19am
Location: Washington, DC

Re: GCinDC's Giant DH Comp

Post by GCinDC » Mar 22 2013 10:28am

yeah, i think that frame will see action again. it's amazing how localized it was!

my neighbor's usually up late and takes smoke breaks in the garage, and can usually see in the garage. he's seen a lot of crazy crap going on, so maybe he thought it was a Frankenstein experiment.. the creation of a new being... or something being teleported..

the big mystery to me is still why it stopped!
Youtube channel, 2013 Highlights vid. Ebike Nerdcast.
Giant DH Comp: 20s lipo (11.6Ah), hs3540, Adaptto Mini-E, 900W BMSBattery charger.
GT I-Drive (sold), 20s lipo, 9C, 72V 45A 12FET.

User avatar
Ypedal   100 GW

100 GW
Posts: 12523
Joined: Dec 27 2006 12:55pm
Location: Moncton NB, Canada
Contact:

Re: GCinDC's Giant DH Comp

Post by Ypedal » Mar 22 2013 10:35am

how air tight is your garage ?, could the intense fire have consumed all the oxygen in the room and snuffed itself out maybe ?
ES site status page:
http://www.ypedal.com/ES/ES.htm
----------------
http://www.ypedal.com

etriker   100 kW

100 kW
Posts: 1078
Joined: May 27 2012 8:21am
Location: Florida USA

Re: GCinDC's Giant DH Comp

Post by etriker » Mar 22 2013 11:23am

GCinDC wrote:yeah, i think that frame will see action again. it's amazing how localized it was!

my neighbor's usually up late and takes smoke breaks in the garage, and can usually see in the garage. he's seen a lot of crazy crap going on, so maybe he thought it was a Frankenstein experiment.. the creation of a new being... or something being teleported..

the big mystery to me is still why it stopped!
The big guy upstairs got your back ?

dnmun   100 GW

100 GW
Posts: 16190
Joined: Jun 09 2008 1:32pm
Location: portland, or and loveland, co

Re: GCinDC's Giant DH Comp

Post by dnmun » Mar 22 2013 11:34am

the reason the flames died down is because the electrolyte was all consumed by the fire so there was nothing left to burn.

i find that when i put the ping pouches in the wood stove, they will burn the electrolyte by squirting it out the seams until it is all gone and then the cell will not really make more heat.

then it is just a big carbon and aluminum and copper heat sink. still hot but not capable of burning more. your plastic bag did continue burning though.

maybe the next project should be some kind of fire arresting hood and nomex shroud with a pump and water source to spray onto the fire as it burns.

use a small 120V pump with a spray nozzle under the hood. several 5 gallon buckets of water to supply the pump and a NO thermal switch set to go off at about 50o C.

then it would be able to cool the fire and keep it contained until the electrolyte is consumed and the heat would be soaked up by the water spray.

you wanna have the pump on a separate circuit from the charger so if the charger burns and shorts out then it would not disable power to the pump. on that circuit you would also put the smoke alarm with external speaker or even tie it back to the smoke alarms in the house. that would require a separate wire from the garage back to the house and attached to the alarms in the house. but it could be tiny. 24G would be enuff.

you have that 12G service from the service panel in the house so you could convert it from 120V to 240v and use one phase for the charger on a GFCI and the pump could be on the other phase. don't use a coupled 240V breaker though. leave the phases separated at the service panel. then install the GFCI in the box in your garage and the other phase could be a GFCI too. most likely required by code there in DC anyway.

etriker   100 kW

100 kW
Posts: 1078
Joined: May 27 2012 8:21am
Location: Florida USA

Re: GCinDC's Giant DH Comp

Post by etriker » Mar 22 2013 11:55am

neptronix wrote:Owch..
Do you think the dud cell was partly to blame? how bad was the dud - do you remember?

Maybe a cargo bike full of lifepo4 is in your future..
Right ? Easier to figure out how to build a cargo bike that will carry lots of lifepo4 than how to safely use cheap rc lipo. ?

Keep in mind when I bought these they came with a warning saying never charge them unattended.

http://www.batteryspace.com/LiFePO4-Pri ... t-PCM.aspx

User avatar
spinningmagnets   100 GW

100 GW
Posts: 11205
Joined: Dec 21 2007 10:27pm
Location: Ft Riley, NE Kansas

Re: GCinDC's Giant DH Comp

Post by spinningmagnets » Mar 22 2013 12:01pm

Very sorry to see such an obviously beloved project in ashes.

If you are planning another build soon, a man of your skills could make quite a splash by putting an extended swingarm on an existing frame (like Farfle) and mounting a non-hub just behind the seat-post. John-in-CRs mini-monster is a beast, and only 5 inches wide, 7 inches diameter.

Extra-thin laminations, high quality Japanese high-silicon steel, good copper mass, 93% efficient. edit: I shall call your next E-bike..."Phoenix"
FarfleSwingarm.jpg
FarfleSwingarm.jpg (53.76 KiB) Viewed 2862 times
Image
Last edited by spinningmagnets on Mar 23 2013 10:57am, edited 1 time in total.

Post Reply