"ScootBike"Build.

Show off your E-bike creation here.
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allen_okc
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Re: "ScootBike"Build.

Post by allen_okc » Mar 01, 2012 8:57 am

Hey Brentis, it looks like your going down the same road i went down...

:D your project looks awesome - are you thinking about going to something bigger???

8) like a street legal road scooter or motorcycle...

anyway nice work...
For Everything There Is A First Time...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LcViBm2 ... ktUXLVwSng

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Brentis
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Re: "ScootBike"Build.

Post by Brentis » Mar 01, 2012 9:44 am

Thanks Allen.

The current plan, is to leave "Simplicity" as is, as my Lady' bike.
In my area, flat'ish, it will do 40kph for 30+km(25mph/20+mile). Lil' pedaling.
The a123 pack is plug/play, has winter resistance :) ,
Stone reliable, long lasting.
Great commuter /friend/ spare bike.

The ScootBike will be a on-road Ebike, off-road Moped/Race bike. :wink:
I intend to experiment with lipo on this build.
I plan for a 80kph+ top speed. 60kph avg. (50mph/38mph) in off-road mode.
Hit the switch & you have a 500w Legal Ebike mode.
I will then likely sell Scootbike to fund my next build.

A conversion of a Stink Bike.
Honda Bobber.jpg
Honda Bobber.jpg (145.43 KiB) Viewed 980 times
Almost exactly what you did.
Battery&drive unit where ICE had resided.
70's Honda 750's are a dime a dozen round here.
I will build a cafe racer. My style. :wink:
I realize that They got me.
To have proper power. Few build restrictions.
The easiest route is to convert the Stink bike.

*edit*
This is one of my dream stink bikes.
A conversion of a toast motor example would be sweeeet.
Ducati MHe 900e.jpg
Ducati MHe 900e.jpg (42.32 KiB) Viewed 980 times
Last edited by Brentis on Mar 19, 2012 9:18 am, edited 1 time in total.

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allen_okc
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Re: "ScootBike"Build.

Post by allen_okc » Mar 01, 2012 11:11 am

good choice brother - i like it...
For Everything There Is A First Time...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LcViBm2 ... ktUXLVwSng

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Brentis
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Re: "ScootBike"Build.

Post by Brentis » Mar 30, 2012 12:36 pm

Got some parts with this months modest ebike budget.
$50 as pic'd. I gotta get me a job. :roll:
Bright side...
Now I can build the pinching drops. yeah
I should have this bike running on my 16s5p 26650 cellman pack next month with its original controller/throttle.
It ran 50+kph on the 200lbs Scooter. I hope I can get 60kph tucked on the @ least 1/2 weight ScootBike.
More to come.
Pinching dropout time..JPG
Pinching dropout time..JPG (80.82 KiB) Viewed 871 times

I have been pondering Lipo use for an age @ this point.
Had this cracked open & went to dreamin.
OG battery Box.JPG
Notice the Canadian compliance sticker on top of the Batt.Box(circled).
All legal, I swear Officer. As I flip the hidden 3spd switch.
OG battery Box.JPG (81.95 KiB) Viewed 871 times

Each compartment offers 150mm x 100mm x 100mm. + a lil wiggle room.
12 of these would fit with room to spare, in the original battery case.
HK.6s4ah.25c..jpg
HK.6s4ah.25c..jpg (205.46 KiB) Viewed 871 times
http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/stor ... _Pack.html

Running 18s4p 66.6v+ 16ah pack. Just over the coveted 1kwh. :)
Would give me approx 65-70kph. Comfortably over the coveted 40mph. :D
I found the 10" scooter hub to run roughly 1.1 kph per volt under load on flat/no wind.
Trusting the original scooters instruments was foolhardy. It indicated 65kph. In reality it was more like 55-50kph as batt. sag.
I have read but not retained the knowledge on how to calculate the kv, maybe one of the master brains can help?
I could also run 24s3p for 88.8v & closer to a 80kph top speed :twisted: (accounting for added wind resistance)

Time to do the math.

6s4ah packs.
12 x $45(after wait for screen discount) = $540.
+
Methods LVC/HVC boards. http://www.methtek.com/2011/11/12/lvchv ... boards-10/
Im a bit of a lazy, but a safety guy as well.(live in a basement apartment)
Plug & play charging/battery medic once in awhile is what I like.
4 x $50 =$200
+
Charger. http://www.bmsbattery.com/alloy-shell/1 ... arger.html
1 x $170 = $170

$910 + shipping.
Maybe another $200 for connectors/wiring/Batt.medics/misc.
Around $1100 + shipping to roll & charge 1kwh Plug & play,mostly safe pack.
(I understand the dangers inherent with this chemistry) :wink:

Next I will do the math on a equivalent a123 26650 pack.
First I eat soup. Lunchtime.

Stay tuned...
:mrgreen:

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grindz145
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Re: "ScootBike"Build.

Post by grindz145 » Mar 30, 2012 11:27 pm

I can't believe how awesome that is turning out!

It looks really hanebrink like:

Image

That thing begs for some ice tires :mrgreen:

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Brentis
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Re: "ScootBike"Build.

Post by Brentis » Apr 13, 2012 3:45 pm

grindz145 wrote:I can't believe how awesome that is turning out!

It looks really hanebrink like:

Image

That thing begs for some ice tires :mrgreen:
Love the Hanebrink. Perfect design for an all purpose eBike really.
Just come up a bit sort on the funds for one. :)
I see the resemblance with ScootBike. I think I look a bit sportier/Kooler.
Would burn a bag of puppies for that front end though. :twisted:


Updates...

rear swingarm..JPG
rear swingarm..JPG (68.51 KiB) Viewed 885 times
Spacing, alignment issues..JPG
Blue line is alignment. Red is straight chain line. Silver line is where I need to stretch to.
Spacing, alignment issues..JPG (64.03 KiB) Viewed 885 times
185mm under natural tension..JPG
Notice that the dropouts natural bend in.
185mm under natural tension..JPG (61.91 KiB) Viewed 885 times
210mm stretched..JPG
Under 210mm stretch, dropouts point straight out like it should be.
Maybe this was meant to be.
210mm stretched..JPG (62.18 KiB) Viewed 885 times
I have the drops. stretched out to 210mm with a 36" clamp, reversed for spread mode.
If I leave it like this for a while will it eventually conform? Do I need Heat? Any other methods you can suggest?
Move over..JPG
Move over..JPG (62.67 KiB) Viewed 885 times
Need 20mm+ stretch..JPG
I could potentially have the flat, machined into thicker axle part.
Probably too expensive. Plus I think the stretching method will work out for me.
Need 20mm+ stretch..JPG (78.16 KiB) Viewed 885 times
Clamping Dropouts. Inspired by Dogman. :wink:
Proposed bolt hole pattern on angle iron clamping dropouts.
Any thoughts, criticisms, opinions welcome & wanted.
I get one shot @ drilling this out. :?
I plan on clamping the angle to the drop., then hand drill/tap holes through both.
Bad Idea? Better ideas? Help.
Outside drop..JPG
My thumb is covering the other proposed bolt hole.
Outside drop..JPG (47.92 KiB) Viewed 885 times
Inside the drop..JPG
Inside the drop..JPG (47.86 KiB) Viewed 885 times
Hows that for clamping surface. More meat than a T-bone steak..JPG
Hows that for clamping surface. More meat than a T-bone steak..JPG (54.63 KiB) Viewed 885 times
A second angle or piece of flat, then bolts/clamps to the first.
Accommodations for wheelbase adjustment.

Out of time for now. Any thoughts?

Stay tuned... :mrgreen:

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Hobbit
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Re: "ScootBike"Build.

Post by Hobbit » Apr 14, 2012 6:56 am

Brentis wrote:
grindz145 wrote:I can't believe how awesome that is turning out!

It looks really hanebrink like:

Image

That thing begs for some ice tires :mrgreen:
Love the Hanebrink. Perfect design for an all purpose eBike really.
Just come up a bit sort on the funds for one. :)
I see the resemblance with ScootBike. I think I look a bit sportier/Kooler.
Would burn a bag of puppies for that front end though. :twisted:


Updates...

rear swingarm..JPG
Spacing, alignment issues..JPG
185mm under natural tension..JPG
210mm stretched..JPG
I have the drops. stretched out to 210mm with a 36" clamp, reversed for spread mode.
If I leave it like this for a while will it eventually conform? Do I need Heat? Any other methods you can suggest?
Move over..JPG
Need 20mm+ stretch..JPG
Clamping Dropouts. Inspired by Dogman. :wink:
Proposed bolt hole pattern on angle iron clamping dropouts.
Any thoughts, criticisms, opinions welcome & wanted.
I get one shot @ drilling this out. :?
I plan on clamping the angle to the drop., then hand drill/tap holes through both.
Bad Idea? Better ideas? Help.
Outside drop..JPG
Inside the drop..JPG
Hows that for clamping surface. More meat than a T-bone steak..JPG
A second angle or piece of flat, then bolts/clamps to the first.
Accommodations for wheelbase adjustment.

Out of time for now. Any thoughts?

Stay tuned... :mrgreen:
Holy mother of god, brentis. That's no dropout! It's a space station! Awesomest!
Kannada!! Tetsuo!!

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boppinbob
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Re: "ScootBike"Build.

Post by boppinbob » Apr 14, 2012 8:39 am

I get one shot @ drilling this out.
Brentis don't have a heart attack if you mess up the one shot you'll always be able to weld new dropouts to the swing arm.
Project bike-Genesis v2100, Crystalyte HS 3540 with 72v40A controller and four 5s8Ah zippy lipos in series.

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Re: "ScootBike"Build.

Post by sflorlando » Apr 14, 2012 10:36 am

Forgive me if you already mentioned it.

But what type of motor is on this?

thanks

Ken

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Brentis
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Re: "ScootBike"Build.

Post by Brentis » Apr 14, 2012 12:40 pm

[quote]Forgive me if you already mentioned it.

But what type of motor is on this?

thanks

Ken[/quote]




This motor is of unknown brand/manufacturer.
I bought & removed it from a Chinese scooter style Ebike,
Purchased from Princess Auto. They sold a few hundred of the
Baja 500e. Coast to coast Canada. See top of thread for pick.
It was a surplus item for PA & had a critical charger issue.
It would charge batteries sla to a melting pool of goo. I've seen it, very dangerous.
In Ontario it is limited to 500w 32kph & must be pedal able.
It had a simple connector to unlimit it. 50+kph.
Until I open it I am guessing, but it is a 10" motorcycle tire rim attached.
So I would say the stator to be 8"+.
This motor is very wide though. I am betting on 50 mm stator.
This is definitaly not a bicycle/sub $1000 scooter motor.
It ran cool @ 50+ on 48v in a 400lbs gross scoot.

I should really crack that thing open soon.

Written on an iPhone & my Patience just ran out. More later
:mrgreen:

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Re: "ScootBike"Build.

Post by sflorlando » Apr 14, 2012 3:40 pm

thanks. Im rebuilding a moped and looking for a new motor.

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Brentis
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Re: "ScootBike"Build.

Post by Brentis » Apr 14, 2012 4:43 pm

sflorlando wrote:thanks. Im rebuilding a moped and looking for a new motor.

Thats Kool. What moped? What sort of speeds/range?

If I had to buy another scooter motor I would be tempted to try the Golden Motor version out.
Its rated for 2000-3000w & only $250. Pretty good bang for the buck.
Maybe ask John in Cr for a source for his High eff. motors. Certainly a step up from what I got.
*edit* Also consider Kelly mid to high priced. POWERFUL.
From there maybe a Cromotor or Enertrac
Startin to talk bigger $'s @ that point though.

eScooting is a different experience.
Higher speeds, no more fake pedaling.
Just near silent glide.
Good luck.
:mrgreen:
Last edited by Brentis on Apr 14, 2012 5:21 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Brentis
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Re: "ScootBike"Build.

Post by Brentis » Apr 14, 2012 5:19 pm

boppinbob wrote:
I get one shot @ drilling this out.
Brentis don't have a heart attack if you mess up the one shot you'll always be able to weld new dropouts to the swing arm.

True enough. Just want to get it right the first time.
Eventually I would like to weld up a full custom swingarm.
Wont be for months or year/s, unable to weld in my current living situation.
Just as well though, I want to say I converted this steed with hand tools.
:mrgreen:

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Re: "ScootBike"Build.

Post by sflorlando » Apr 14, 2012 6:22 pm

thanks...well without emberrasing myself too much

Here is my build.

https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewto ... 10&t=38407

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boppinbob
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Re: "ScootBike"Build.

Post by boppinbob » Apr 15, 2012 7:20 am

True enough. Just want to get it right the first time.
Eventually I would like to weld up a full custom swingarm.
Wont be for months or year/s, unable to weld in my current living situation.
Just as well though, I want to say I converted this steed with hand tools.
I know what you mean. Although I am capable of welding, fabricating, milling, and turning. (machinist by trade) I don't have the room for my own equipment or the desire. Because of my trade I do have an army of acquaintances who will do the small odd job if asked nicely though, I would not classify a custom swing arm as a small odd job. Props on the awesome job you have pulled off so far on the kitchen build scoot. Where there is a will there is a way.
Project bike-Genesis v2100, Crystalyte HS 3540 with 72v40A controller and four 5s8Ah zippy lipos in series.

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Brentis
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Re: "ScootBike"Build.

Post by Brentis » Apr 17, 2012 12:22 pm

Updates/pics.
ScootBike front 3rd.JPG
ScootBike front 3rd.JPG (63.93 KiB) Viewed 748 times
ScootBike Side.JPG
Now with Strong handlebar installed.
Very racy position. Crouched over the battery cage.
Notice the steerer extends through clamping handlebars. A potential mount for camera or...
ScootBike Side.JPG (63.19 KiB) Viewed 748 times
ScootBike Rear 3rd.JPG
Notice the OG motor controller zip tied inside swingarm.
ScootBike Rear 3rd.JPG (65.21 KiB) Viewed 748 times
ScootBike Swingarm vs. motor spacing..JPG
The spreading method I attempted was successful. I gained 8mm. The rest I can spread by hand @ install.
The important part is that the clamping drops surface starts @, & runs the length of the axle flat.
Lots of meat on meat action.
ScootBike Swingarm vs. motor spacing..JPG (57.63 KiB) Viewed 748 times
ScootBike Dual handle bar setup..JPG
ScootBike Dual handle bar setup..JPG (64.31 KiB) Viewed 748 times
ScootBike Dual handle bar setup.2.JPG
The travel bar offer a much more comfortable position.
Easy to remove for racing. Maybe set up secondary controls. Lots of room for accessories. see crude light & camera dash.
Red circles show tangs with bolt threads for old bodywork/ new lights & camera board.
ScootBike Dual handle bar setup.2.JPG (68.73 KiB) Viewed 748 times
Stay tuned...

:mrgreen:

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Brentis
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Re: "ScootBike"Build.

Post by Brentis » Apr 19, 2012 5:04 pm

Updates...

I have stripped the bike down to components for paint & to drill out the clamping dropouts
Some pics for ya's.

Ready for paint..JPG
Ready for paint..JPG (57.99 KiB) Viewed 716 times
9lbs. frame.JPG
9lbs. frame.JPG (58.16 KiB) Viewed 716 times
5lbs swingarm.JPG
5lbs swingarm.JPG (61.06 KiB) Viewed 716 times
26lbs. Front end..JPG
26lbs. Front end..JPG (61.75 KiB) Viewed 716 times
Who reads code.JPG
The serial number laser etched in to the hub has 4 groups of code.
The last 2 (circled) read 504 48v.
Red circle* 50mm stator/4 turns. I hope.
Blue circle* 48volts.
I need to procure a freewheel tool, before I can open it up to be certain.
Who reads code.JPG (85.69 KiB) Viewed 716 times
Stay tuned...

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boppinbob
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Re: "ScootBike"Build.

Post by boppinbob » Apr 19, 2012 5:13 pm

Brentis, That means you could probably run a 60v30a pretty safely right?
Project bike-Genesis v2100, Crystalyte HS 3540 with 72v40A controller and four 5s8Ah zippy lipos in series.

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Brentis
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Re: "ScootBike"Build.

Post by Brentis » Apr 19, 2012 5:25 pm

It would not flinch @ 60v30amp.
It took @ least 52v30amp for 20+kms distance, with zero heat issue(not above ambient), & that was pushin that heavy scooter frame around.
I'm planning more like 88.8v40+amps which it will probably still laugh at. In a bike weighing half as much.

*edit*
If it cant handle it gets aerated.
Holey mac.JPG
Holey mac.JPG (72.73 KiB) Viewed 710 times


Will keep ya'll posted.

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Re: "ScootBike"Build.

Post by sflorlando » Apr 20, 2012 6:38 am

awesome.

How much does the hub weigh.

Ken

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Brentis
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Re: "ScootBike"Build.

Post by Brentis » Apr 20, 2012 8:12 am

sflorlando wrote:awesome.

How much does the hub weigh.

Ken
With tire & drum brake installed 22lbs.
Shitty scale though,old and for humans/not sure of its accuracy @ such low weights
,so weight is approximate.
as pictured 22lbs.JPG
as pictured 22lbs.JPG (57.55 KiB) Viewed 948 times
:mrgreen:

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Brentis
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Re: "ScootBike"Build.

Post by Brentis » Apr 20, 2012 10:24 am

I have added some more, before pics, to the OP.
The pics are not mine, as I didnt photo the full bodied scoot before I stripped it.
This is exactly as mine started out .

Baja 500E electric bicycles :roll: where sold in quite a few retail outlets.
Canadian & American.
Here they were sold by both Canadian Tire($1000-$1200) & Princess Auto($599-$699).
In the States they were sold by Target, Kmart, Sears & Im sure others as well.
These bikes had a critical Charger issue. They would not shut off automatically.
If unattended & left charging to would charge the batteries to goo/short.
Very dangerous, happened to us in store. There were lawsuits in the States regarding this bike causing full out fires.
In my experience @ P.A. as inventory auditor I had to rectify large $ returns.
(For my peace of mind/we had a serious theft issue @ the time)
I found a very high failure rate on the chargers. 50% or higher where affected.
This killed the distribution of the model. I'd be shocked to find someone retailing them now.

Anyways the motor pounds :wink:
The fork is alright.
So lets make do.
:mrgreen:

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Re: "ScootBike"Build.

Post by sflorlando » Apr 20, 2012 12:53 pm

Cool..thanks for the pics...seems like our motors weigh about the same.

On my moped build Im having problems with getting the hall and phase wired correctly. After testing all of the color combinations I am not 100% sure I have it right. Even picking what I think is the best combo I can use the throttle and the wheel doesnt move. Spinning the wheel slightly and then the throttle can cause it to rotate correctly. Another weird thing is that when there is a load on the tire the moped vibrates like crazy. Pushing through the first 10 mph and then it stables out only to happen again when going slow. Im wondering if there is something different about the hall sensors on these scooter hub motors. Did you have to modify the hall sensor degrees in the controller?

Placed an order for the Lyen ebike tester. Hopefully it will help me figure out whats going on.

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Re: "ScootBike"Build.

Post by Brentis » Apr 20, 2012 3:25 pm

sflorlando wrote:Cool..thanks for the pics...seems like our motors weigh about the same.

On my moped build Im having problems with getting the hall and phase wired correctly. After testing all of the color combinations I am not 100% sure I have it right. Even picking what I think is the best combo I can use the throttle and the wheel doesnt move. Spinning the wheel slightly and then the throttle can cause it to rotate correctly. Another weird thing is that when there is a load on the tire the moped vibrates like crazy. Pushing through the first 10 mph and then it stables out only to happen again when going slow. Im wondering if there is something different about the hall sensors on these scooter hub motors. Did you have to modify the hall sensor degrees in the controller?

Placed an order for the Lyen ebike tester. Hopefully it will help me figure out whats going on.

I was going to suggest the Lyen tester. Nice move, will rule out any faults.
Sounds like a bad hall/phase combo to me. I haven't yet had to solve this problem, but there is a thread here about it somewhere.

I haven't modified anything on the OG components yet.
Except frame I guess :lol:

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Re: "ScootBike"Build.

Post by sflorlando » Apr 20, 2012 3:37 pm

Thanks for the info, sorry for the tangent. Now back to your awesome build!

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