Road Trip to Tularosa, Visit Wineboy

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dogman dan   100 GW

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Road Trip to Tularosa, Visit Wineboy

Post by dogman dan » Apr 18 2014 3:04pm

Wineboy told me he needed a few spare spokes for a hubmotor. I had some, and he lives only 74 miles from my house, why mail them when you could ride there? Here is the bike loaded with every battery I own, 45 ah of 14s RC lico from Hobby king. But 20 ah of it is almost 4 years old, saggy, and that section is only good for 13 ah. Plus I don't charge to quite 100%. No telling how much it really has, in real world usable capacity. This trip proved it is almost exactly 2000wh, for all 45 ah of it.

Good excuse to show off my spring front yard. I have no front lawn per se, but the front is various native wildflowers, native grass, and a few xeric shrubs. Water thrifty, I water weekly in the spring, but cut it off to once every 30 days in summer.

To the far left of the frame, you can just see San Augustine Pass, the way I get around that rather steep hill. Great rock climbing, I was all over that stuff for many years.
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The route, on Map My ride, including the grades. ON MMR, if you map out long routes, it lies about the grades. the pass maxes out near the top at 8%, not 5%. But most of the pass is about 5-6% 74 miles according to MMR, but it maps a short cut rather than the route I actually rode. 79.6 miles according to my CA, which is calibrated well. Some of that extra miles was turning back to pick stuff from the roadside. You never have too many good chain hooks, found three of them. What I didn't expect was porn CD's. Three of them too. On the way back, I found Ray Ban sunglasses, in the case, in perfect shape. I guess about $100 worth of freebies along the road. 8)
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Another route map, my finger pointing to Wineboys house. I live in Las Cruces.
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This sign is about right, I did not use map my ride before the trip. But this sign showed me that the distance to Tularosa I was expecting from an official hwy dpt map was very wrong. I was expecting a 63 mile ride to Wineboys house. Then I pass this sign 7 miles from home, Ru Roh. Am I strong enough for 73 miles?
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The view from halfway up the pass, about where it steepens to 8%
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Looking back down to my house. The pass just a bit more than 1000 feet higher than my house. About 1800 feet above the town
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dogman dan   100 GW

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Re: Road Trip to Tularosa, Visit Wineboy

Post by dogman dan » Apr 18 2014 3:04pm

Top of the pass historical sign. BTW, this hill is where I tested hubmotors on a 110F day, measuring the heat inside the hub, and seeing which of a few types did best on a brutal day. Asphalt surface temps on a day like that are about 150F. You smell your tires melting. Today it's much nicer, about 80F for the high. Ideal riding weather. Very light wind, but from behind. :D
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Looking down the other side, towards White Sands Missile Range. This is where they test small stuff, Surface to air missiles like sams. They tested the patriot and THAAD more recently.
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Back in the 40's they shot off the V2's brought back in the war, then started working on a lot of SAM's. The viet nam era one was this one, the Nike. In the 40-50's all kind of weird stuff also went on out there. The worlds record height parachute jump, from a balloon, that record only recently broken. Also the monkeys of some kind, sent up in a balloon. When they came down in Roswell, a whole industry was born there by folks that mistook a monkey in a space suit for aliens.
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The Organ Needles, where I used to get my Danger Dan thrills when younger. My real nickname has always been Danger Dan. The original first climbs of most of the peaks were the Germans in Von Brauns group from WWII. The guys that built the V2 rocket. Then they went to Huntsville to be closer to Cape Kennedy.
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Looking towards the big empty. Did I mention the first 60 miles of this ride is through flaming desert of death? No water, No plugs, thank god for cell phones if you break down out there. We had cars do it plenty over the years, without the phone. Much bigger PITA to break down out there then. Sooner or later though, the military police will come and call you a nice expensive tow. Nobody stopping out there goes un noticed for that long. You can't leave your car out there, smack in the middle of missile tests. The road is cleared and roadblocked for tests all the time.
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Looking back from the same spot, half way down the east side of the pass.
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Still the same spot, looking more south towards the organ needles. They are trying to make the Organs a National Park. I always did think the rock climbing threre was world class. Harder than Yosemite in a way, because the rock is not as solid as Yosemite. I had a rock the size of a refrigerator come off in my hand once. We both fell together. And then there is a cactus growing in every crack. Ever do a pull up by holding a cactus?
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The two big wild west murders around here are the Fountain murder and the Pat Garret murder. Pat Garret came out of retirement, (He retired to Las Cruces after he shot Billy the Kid) to investigate the Fountains killing. Fountain was about to arrest all the rustlers in Tularosa and Alamogordo. So he vanished. Pat Garret was hunting Oliver Lee for that killing, and next thing you know, he turns up dead. Pat Garret was murdered aobut a mile from my house. The real wild west stuff happend right in my backyard.
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Looking back to the Organs again from the fountain murder site.
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dogman dan   100 GW

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Re: Road Trip to Tularosa, Visit Wineboy

Post by dogman dan » Apr 18 2014 3:05pm

Still the big empty, looking east towards White Sands National Monument, and Alamogordo. No surprise they never found the bodies of Albert Fountain, and his young boy. Yeah, search this place, back when it was horse and wagon.
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Finally 2/3 of the way across the big empty. The first section of battery is nearly done. The organs and home look very small now.
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Looking towards the white sands, the reason it's called white sands. There is a monster of a dune field out there, about 60 miles long north to south. The National Park allows you to drive into it about 5 miles.
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The dunes try to cover the highway, and it allows you a chance to touch the sand for free. Really is white sand. They shoot movies out here all the time, one of the old Tarzan movies for example. My favorite movie shot here is Bite the Bullet. Mostly shot in the woods near Chama, but the big desert scene was shot here. A few miles further is the park entrance, Water there, but they won't allow an electric bike to plug in there. :evil:
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After reaching Alamogordo 60 miles from my house, blessed relief. Fast food, and some free range plugs. I found one in the Washington park. Near the big picknick shade pavilion is where I look for plugs, and sure enough a hot one there for the weddings that need to plug in a DJ. Wineboy has another favorite of his, in a county govt building that is not in use at this time, but the power is still on. Our tax dollars, public spaces. Fair game.

Riding on, the historical sign for Tularosa where Wineboy lives. His family dates to the period on the sign. I was born in New Mexico, but my family is newcomers, Mom was an El Paso girl, and her parents ( my grandparents) came west in the 1890's era. Dad came west after WWII. Real old time (eruopean) New Mexicans came here in the 1600's. The real ancestors came here about 10,000 years ago. Mammoth hunters.
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The big mountain behind the sign is were I'm headed tomorrow, at the western base is rock art that cannot be dated. Some might be Apache, but most it thought to be from before the Apache migrated south. 800-1200 ad, Chaco Canyon and Mesa Verde era.
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dogman dan   100 GW

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Re: Road Trip to Tularosa, Visit Wineboy

Post by dogman dan » Apr 18 2014 3:05pm

The next morning, after an endless bullshit session the night before, time to refresh the beer supply. Wineboy riding my bike Bouncing Betty. Me riding his commuter. FINALLY, I get to ride the famous Yes kit motor. My My My, I suddenly see why Wes loves these things so much. I was quite surprised how nice the take off was, for a faster winding. This motor is one turn faster than the typical 9 continent or Muxus. Worth noting though, Wineboy chucked the stock kit controller, and is running a small but peppy Lyens on it. He says it runs better for sure. 12s, 44v lipo for the battery. The bikes are nearly perfectly matched in speed, with my slightly slower winding 5304 motor catching up by running on 14s 48v.
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The ride we are on today is a shortie, only 45 miles. But too far for Wineboys 12s 15 ah. So a quick stop to swap out to one of my 14s 10 ah packs. Nearly there, the Sierra Blanca peak in the background of the picture. This is the other place I got Danger Dan thrills 20 years ago. A ski area on the other side of the peak provided much fun. When it got too safe, I took to hiking the ridge to the left of the peak, and skiing in the avalanche chutes on the far side of the ridge. All day ski in, for 10 min of sheer terror skiing slopes as steep as snow will stick too. All on skinny telemark skis. I carried a locator beeper so they could find my body. If the slope slid, I'd never be dug out alive. Rescue would first have to be the next day, at the very soonest. Or longer, the many times I was in there solo. Nobody could ski good enough to go with me, or be crazy enough to want to. Lots of memories every time I see Sierra Blanca.
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Arriving at the Three Rivers State Park, I have no range anxiety but Wineboy has some. It was a 22 mile ride straight into a stiff wind to get there, and both his battery and my loaner are about used up. No worries, there is always some RV folks using the electric camp sites. Friendly folks for the most part, and easy to borrow anything from. Chat them up for a quick charge.

As we pull in, the place is pretty empty, the snowbirds have flown the coop for the year apparently. So we go ask the camp Nazi that takes the fees for the state park. $5.00 per vehicle, but he gives us a break and lets both bikes in for one pay. Nice and polite, please sir is there an electric outlet we could borrow for a bit,,,,, NO. Well, how about we pay the fee($18) to rent the RV spot?,,,, NO. We're bikes, not RV's. WTF? The state govt doesn't want to sell $.25 of electricity for $18.00?

And now you see why I call these state chotas the camp Nazi. Whatever. :roll: I know I can make it back, if I have to I'll tow Wineboy. It will be downwind going home.

So nevermind, off to see the rock art. Pretty cool stuff, if you like the native American stuff. I do like it a lot. I have tons of pottery pieces from my own backyard that date to 800 AD.
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After viewing the art, we hang out a bit and have a bite of lunch. Wineboy scopes out the RV sites, and the plugs are still on. The camp Nazi can't see them from his little troll hole and gift shop down the hill. Soon Wineboy is charing up. :mrgreen: I was quite willing to support the state park system, but NOOO, they won't let you. :lol: :lol: Wineboy gets his charge for free instead. :mrgreen:

FWIW, I had no problem whatsoever renting RV camp spots with electricity when I took my ride to the State Park at the lake. Some camp guards are Nazis, Some are like Schindler.

Later that day, waiting for the charcoal to fire up for steaks, 2700 wh worth of RC lico is charging on Wineboys porch. No problem finding a place to charge an EV in Tularosa, or if in Las Cruces, look me up. We won't even want to charge you 18 bucks.
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Next day, this morning, 76 miles ride home. Into the wind all the way. Left very early in the dark to beat some of the wind, and recharged at the park in Alamogordo. Now home is 60 miles away, uphill, upwind. Range anxiety for sure. I figured out how to sit on the cargo deck, and do a superman position tuck. No problem, made it home with 5 ah to spare. But by the time I get there the wind is really blowing good. Good thing I left early. Going back over the pass, a fun moment overtaking a road biker. He sees me catching up in his helmet mirror, and starts sprinting up the big hill. Too funny, to see him racing me, with 2000w of grunt he has no clue about. Blew by him of course, he's looking at me as usual. WTF? Poor guy, he's going to go home and look on line for steroids I bet.

Total miles ridden about 205 in three days. 8) No problems of any kind, except the camp Nazi.

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wineboyrider   100 MW

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Re: Road Trip to Tularosa, Visit Wineboy

Post by wineboyrider » Apr 18 2014 3:10pm

Dogman with Wineboy's bike....
[img]
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ES IS SAVED! THANK YOU JUSTIN.

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Re: Road Trip to Tularosa, Visit Wineboy

Post by oldwahoo54 » Apr 18 2014 7:34pm

Nice trip. My girlfriend and I have been vacationing in northern NM the last few years, but when she goes out on her own, she prefers more southern areas. She stayed in Las Cruces one time. We like the southwestern art, jewelry, and pottery.

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Re: Road Trip to Tularosa, Visit Wineboy

Post by footloose » Apr 18 2014 11:12pm

Thank you for this post.
I'm jealous as heck.
Ride in New Mexico in early spring? It doesn't get much better.
And your front yard flowers look great ;-)

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Re: Road Trip to Tularosa, Visit Wineboy

Post by DAND214 » Apr 18 2014 11:36pm

That was great trip/story, Danger Dan.

They nick named me Dangerous Dan.
I to did some stupid or dangerous things when I was younger.

What tires are you running on Betty? All that wieght and heat makes me wounder.

Dan

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Re: Road Trip to Tularosa, Visit Wineboy

Post by dnmun » Apr 18 2014 11:43pm

i drive across big sky like that in wyoming too. broken down out in the middle of the Red Desert in wyoming, bummer.

the electric plug nazis, sumbitches. i had the same thing happen at my grocery warehouse store i love because it is so cheap.

i had worked out how to park my ZENN car in the empty bike stall and ran my cord over to the electric plug they used for the shopping cart pusher mules. i even talked to the manager a while back and got his ok, and now he puts a card on my window. "no juice for you", "liability" lameass excuse.

but i just finished the last of my ping pack recycle rebuild mega pack.

it is 24S and about 79Ah wide, almost all old ping pack pouches from your pack and and wineboys, and a half dozen, almost, other packs i bot from everybody over the last 4 years or so.

so this should be about 43 miles for me, and added to the SLA range i have now, should get me to about 60 mile max.

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dogman dan   100 GW

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Re: Road Trip to Tularosa, Visit Wineboy

Post by dogman dan » Apr 19 2014 7:52am

Yep, I've been saying you should ask first always before you plug in. But now that I'm riding farther from home, I'm turning more to the just steal it before anybody notices point of view. The problem is, 37 ah of pack takes awhile to charge, so a 30 min sneak charge doesn't do much. I have 600w with two 5 amps chargers. I can get 1200wh in two hours. To fill though, that last bit takes forever with a large pack.

I was counting on the invariably friendly guy in the RV, but this time two RV's in the park were not plugged in. Had we been really desperate, I'd have tried to get one to fire up his generator for me. It turned out that we would both have made it home with no charge. That tailwind home did not stop like the weather forecast predicted. So we got 12 wh/mi going home.

FWIW, I found another free range plug near the Holloman Base entrance, and pulled 30 min from it on the way out of town. :twisted: It was at a gone out of business sandwich shop.

I'm going more and more to the don't ask don't tell attitude. Nobody is watching an empty building.

Tires. I run the cheap Innova brand tires. The beach cruiser whitewalls. The tire is always the same, but the brand name changes at wallmart from time to time. I have since found out I'm paying too much for them, but most places, even on line, they sell around 20-25 bucks.

They have a fat balloon shape good for when a truck runs me into the gravel, and a rear one lasts me about 2000 miles, fronts about 3000 miles. On a trip like this, I carry a spare tire in addition to patches and stuff. I run them hard, at about 60 psi.

Part of the decision process was to rely on something I can find in just about any town's walmart. So if the shit hits the fan, I can get brake pads, tires, etc anywhere.

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dogman dan   100 GW

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Re: Road Trip to Tularosa, Visit Wineboy

Post by dogman dan » Apr 19 2014 8:04am

Oh, and yes, the legs definitely hurt today. They felt fine yesterday. My health is definitely improving, this is the first time I have been physically able to pedal long enough to get sore legs since the west nile ruined me 3 years ago.

Soon as I can do a 5 day trip and be ok after it, it means I could go back to working a regular job. Right now, I am real glad I don't have to leave the bed today.

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Re: Road Trip to Tularosa, Visit Wineboy

Post by Joseph C. » Apr 19 2014 8:12am

Some great pictures there. You'd definitely know you're American completely liberal didn't even bother to close the browser window. :P
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Re: Road Trip to Tularosa, Visit Wineboy

Post by dnmun » Apr 19 2014 10:16am

you are stronger than you think if you did that trip. man, it was epic. way cool.

what i wanna know is, did wineboy pedal just a little when you towed him?????????? hehe

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Re: Road Trip to Tularosa, Visit Wineboy

Post by beast775 » Apr 19 2014 10:44am

Great post dogman :D ,excellent trip for sure.
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I spent all my money on bicycles women and beer the rest i just wasted.

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dogman dan   100 GW

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Re: Road Trip to Tularosa, Visit Wineboy

Post by dogman dan » Apr 19 2014 11:06am

I didn't have to tow Wineboy. With the charge he got, maybe 100wh worth, we came home with close to 400wh to spare.

He pedaled a lot, especially the upwind trip out. I noticed he pedaled less coming home. I think it was a new personal best distance for him, 45 miles. His routine trip to Alamogordo is 32 miles round trip.

I'm pretty surprised how good I feel today, but I get tired fast today. It's all about pacing with my illness. Any kind of work for money is still too fast a pace for me. But on the ebike, I can burn ATP and convert it back from ADP at the same rate. That easy pace, I last all day. But any kind of normal work effort, I burn my ATP, then instead of converting ADP back to ATP, I burn the ADP. Burn the ADP, and then your mitochondria stop working, and you get sick for a week till your body slowly makes brand new ATP. When I do normal paced things, It's just like I climb Everest, or compete in an ironman. Even just plain walking will knock me out. But riding the ebike is less effort than walking. That's the key.

By riding farther and farther, at minimum effort, I'm slowly training my body to make more ATP again. That's the original damage I got from the brain virus, inability to make enough ATP anymore. But thanks to the ebike, I am gaining on it. I can gradually make enough ATP to have a normal suppy in my cells. Then it's a matter of not burning it up at the sprinting pace of most workplaces. Long as I rest enough to have some energy before a trip, I can have enough ATP to get through the three days. Next goal, 4 days. Yesterday I could definitely feel it that my pace just had to slow down. I did not pedal more than 25% of that 74 miles to home yesterday. I'd pedal 15 min, ride 45 till I converted that ADP back to ATP, then have another 15 min of energy.

What would be great, is if you could take ATP, but there is no such therapy. In a way, I'd prefer it if my problem was diabetes. Same diet, but the ability to supply what I need artificially.

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Re: Road Trip to Tularosa, Visit Wineboy

Post by Drunkskunk » Apr 19 2014 11:14am

Great ride man, and those are some epic pics. I remember that highway from a trip out west. I got some great pics of my jeep on the dunes of Whitesands
Buy the ticket, take the ride.
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Re: Road Trip to Tularosa, Visit Wineboy

Post by Joseph C. » Apr 19 2014 11:39am

That's very interesting Dogman.

If I understand this correctly - what you saying is that you are fine if you stay in the aerobic respiration zone but one you switch to an anaerobic metabolism you become fatigued?

You say your inability to replenish ATP is the cause. Perhaps the bottleneck is one level below the production of ATP and with the constituent parts?

Perhaps I'm completely overstepping the mark here and you have already discounted/tested for these but there are several key compounds that are used in the production of ATP that you could be deficient in.

Assuming you are not deficient in Magnesium which is perhaps the most obvious one it could also be Creatine phosphate and Coenzyme Q10. There's one more that I can't think of but you could research that. LEF.org has got some interesting articles and is one of the few places where they actually bother to put in references although they do verge on the unproven at times.

D-Ribose is the one I forgot. Anyway hope it helps.

Edit: Here is the very article.

http://www.lef.org/protocols/lifestyle_ ... troduction

and perhaps more importantly the recommendations that you could do some research on:
http://www.lef.org/protocols/lifestyle_ ... m#exercise and http://www.lef.org/protocols/lifestyle_ ... #AnchorSug
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Re: Road Trip to Tularosa, Visit Wineboy

Post by gogo » Apr 19 2014 12:14pm

Did those Raybans have dark lenses in them? Because I lost a pair like that on that road not too long ago …

Nice write-up and pics. I used to do motorcycle trips by moonlight when I lived in Phoenix, and made it over to Las Cruces once. It was so empty of other traffic at night that I was able to turn my lights off during full moon. I saw a tarantula spider by its moon-shadow on the road and stopped to watch it for a few minutes. The desert can be interesting if you know what to look for.
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Re: Road Trip to Tularosa, Visit Wineboy

Post by drew12345 » Apr 19 2014 12:34pm

Thanks for sharing that awesome adventure.

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Re: Road Trip to Tularosa, Visit Wineboy

Post by Harold in CR » Apr 19 2014 2:46pm

Great thread Dogman (DD). :lol:
Thanks to Justin, the forum is open source and NON-commercialized.

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Re: Road Trip to Tularosa, Visit Wineboy

Post by wineboyrider » Apr 19 2014 5:19pm

dnmun wrote:you are stronger than you think if you did that trip. man, it was epic. way cool.

what i wanna know is, did wineboy pedal just a little when you towed him?????????? hehe
I was wanting to use my own battery over and back with my 12s 15ah lipo pack, but knew I couldn't so had to rely on Dogman's judgement of his borrowed 14s 10ah pack. I was pretty tired when I got back, but did pedal quite a bit over and just like Dogman said less on the way home. In fact, after Dogman had almost nothing on his pack I blasted the last 2 miles to the house..hehe.. :P
Had a blast and I want to visit Dogman in Las Cruces someday and actually, might be able too by the end of summer I am hoping to have about double the amount of lipo by then.
ES IS SAVED! THANK YOU JUSTIN.

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dogman dan   100 GW

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Re: Road Trip to Tularosa, Visit Wineboy

Post by dogman dan » Apr 19 2014 5:53pm

Right Joseph C, I have to stay aerobic, and with a low rate of producing new ATP, I can destroy what little I have quick if I burn the ADP in anerobic. It's very very hard to know when you switch to anerobic. You feel it when it was too late an hour ago. So the key is pacing so you minimize the impact if you do go anerobic.

Magnesium levels ok according to tests, and yes I do take Co Q 10, and it helps a lot. It won't work when I have pushed too far, but definitely makes a difference in recovery time. I have not tried the creatine. Thanks for the tip, surely it must help to have plenty of building materials for ATP. I also pop b vitamins.

The root cause is damage to my brain stem. Encephalitis from the west nile virus. I'm eating a diet that aims to help heal that damage eventually.

The Q 10 was one of the first things I tried, and though it helped I got zero real permanent improvement until I understood the problem better, and got on the low carb diet. Since then I am progressing, but it's slow growing a new brain. Some doctors say that gradated exercise makes CFS worse. It sure can if the exercise is paced too fast and you go anaerobic too much. Since mere walking can be too much, I think lots of doctor prescribed physical therapy is too fast paced for many patients. But the ebike is so easy, it's been perfect for me.

The other key to my recovery has been quitting work. Only when I stopped pounding myself into the ground working could I make any real recovery. Work on a time clock was always too fast pace, and always will be. Now I can pace myself every day, not just the weekends. I'm making progress, but anything going on can put me back to severe exhaustion. I was dragging my ass while the trees bloomed. They say allergies make CFS worse, and that is very true.

mabman   100 W

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Posts: 205
Joined: Dec 03 2008 11:39am
Location: Ft. Clatsop, OR

Re: Road Trip to Tularosa, Visit Wineboy

Post by mabman » Apr 19 2014 10:00pm

Thanks for the read and desert hit! Not alot of those vistas up here in the PNW.

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dogman dan   100 GW

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Joined: May 17 2008 12:53pm
Location: Las Cruces New Mexico USA

Re: Road Trip to Tularosa, Visit Wineboy

Post by dogman dan » Apr 20 2014 6:28am

Hopefully more riding to come this summer. I really want to go ride around in the mountains near Santa Fe. One bit of road at a time, over the last 5 years, I have ridden every inch of road from El Paso to Santa Fe. I still have some riding to go, to have ridden from the Texas state line to the Colorado state line.

dnmun   100 GW

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Joined: Jun 09 2008 1:32pm
Location: portland, or and loveland, co

Re: Road Trip to Tularosa, Visit Wineboy

Post by dnmun » Apr 20 2014 9:18am

just kidding wineboy.

there has to be a huge elevation gain driving to the colorado border from where you are. must be almost 5k' gain. Raton is the high end of that uplift.

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