Raged Cube Reaction 29er Cyclocross BBS02 Build Thread

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Re: Raged Cube Reaction 29er Cyclocross BBS02 Build Thread

Post by Raged » Aug 31 2015 3:19am

Lurkin wrote:- expensive labour to produce anything
- freight

solve those two ftw.

Good to see you are back at it! I wondered how long it would take you to end up disassembling the BBS02. Paul from Em3ev can probably get anything you require.. good effort on the controller! Wondered what they were like under the potting goo.
Yeah but a fully assembled ebike for $500(retail) or $400 in bulk... extra $100 to ship here and $100+ profit per bike? Surely thats a business case for a simple commuter.

That BBS controller teardown proves that its simply not cost effective to replace the FETS on a BBS02 compared to buying a new controller. I drank the whole 1L of wild turkey disassembling it... It was great. Ewan at eMax is getting all upgraded controllers with upgraded FET's moving forward, so these issues should be a thing of the past soon enough.

I'm still trying to do rehab on hand and right knee, so minimising my non-assisted riding to under 100km/day. Should be back to full strength in a few months hopefully... then do a few 150-200km rides with some assist. Hills are still fuking me though, so wont go back to mountains/single track for a while =(
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Re: Raged Cube Reaction 29er Cyclocross BBS02 Build Thread

Post by Raged » Feb 04 2016 4:02am

A short update as requested in the other thread on how I mounted my throttle.



The bikes been going well for the last few months. It's a solid commuter that doesnt draw any attention (other than the fact I've got big fat tires on a dropbar)
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Re: Raged Cube Reaction 29er Cyclocross BBS02 Build Thread

Post by greg_p » Mar 14 2016 12:01pm

I also owned a 2015 cube reaction gtc 29' and it's also a dream to go maountain biking with it... so light (10kg with pedals) that each pedal you push seems to throw you forward. Instead of you I have a suspended fork which is 1.8, so in a no-motor config, you should be not far from 9kg...

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Re: Raged Cube Reaction 29er Cyclocross BBS02 Build Thread

Post by gsa103 » Mar 15 2016 10:46am

Quick question on the build, as I'm considering a similar build.

How is the chain ring clearance, and what size chainring would you recommend? My current 29er has a 68mm BB, and I'm wondering what the distance from the BB to chainring is for the BBS02.

Great looking bike BTW.

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Re: Raged Cube Reaction 29er Cyclocross BBS02 Build Thread

Post by Raged » Apr 04 2016 3:33am

gsa103 wrote:Quick question on the build, as I'm considering a similar build.

How is the chain ring clearance, and what size chainring would you recommend? My current 29er has a 68mm BB, and I'm wondering what the distance from the BB to chainring is for the BBS02.

Great looking bike BTW.
Sorry for late reply... I've updated first post with the question and pics. I run a BBS 48t chainring which is the biggest I can get without fouling the chainstay. Sorta hard to measure the BB to chainring at the moment, but next time I'm maintaining the bike, I'll flip it over and measure.
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Re: Raged Cube Reaction 29er Cyclocross BBS02 Build Thread

Post by KINNINVIEKID » Apr 04 2016 4:53am

Measurements are all here
Image

If you cant see the whole pic then right click and view in a new tab
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Re: Raged Cube Reaction 29er Cyclocross BBS02 Build Thread

Post by Lurkin » Apr 04 2016 5:06am

Yes... the bottle cage mounts are insufficient for lateral force with batteries. I found the same issue with dolphin packs. Wait till you've seen one after an accident including lateral force. It will happily rip the bidon mounts right out of the frame.
Trick is to make a sweeter in between mount which perfectly matches both frame and bottle. This will provide lateral support. Better still is a hose clamp or similar right round the frame connecting to a an internal frame within the 'bottle'.

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Re: Raged Cube Reaction 29er Cyclocross BBS02 Build Thread

Post by Raged » Apr 05 2016 2:07pm

Lurkin wrote:Yes... the bottle cage mounts are insufficient for lateral force with batteries. I found the same issue with dolphin packs. Wait till you've seen one after an accident including lateral force. It will happily rip the bidon mounts right out of the frame.
Trick is to make a sweeter in between mount which perfectly matches both frame and bottle. This will provide lateral support. Better still is a hose clamp or similar right round the frame connecting to a an internal frame within the 'bottle'.
I cut 2 slots in the steel base and threaded the hose clamp through and around the frame. I only have 2 hoseclamps on the downtube as the battery pack is pretty flat on this build. On my older 14S3P pack I put an extra hoseclamp around the seat stem in case of sideways movement. The annoying thing is the fact I spent so much time and cash trying to make the bottle mount design work... and ended back at square one with some $3 hoseclamps.
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Re: Raged Cube Reaction 29er Cyclocross BBS02 Build Thread

Post by Raged » Apr 14 2016 5:27am

Small update... I changed the shoes to some more road friendly Continental TravelContact 28" tires ( 700c, 28" and 29er share the same wheel, just diameter changes) pumped up to 55psi and it's improved battery range to do the trip to work and back on full power on 1 charge. 30km with 5.8Ah of battery with a bit to spare compared to my MTB Schwalbe Rapid Rob's.

With the tires pumped that hard, the ride quality has definitely tanked compared to 40psi in the 29er, but the efficiency... It's sorta worth it.

One failure so far. the presta valve on my Schwalbe 29er tube failed (didnt know valves could fail) and the crank is starting to creak again (BBS mid drive common issue). Might need to pull it out and add more plumbers tape/gaffa tape on the drive side,
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Re: Raged Cube Reaction 29er Cyclocross BBS02 Build Thread

Post by Lurkin » Apr 14 2016 5:53am

Note Schwalbe valves unscrew. Check it is not loose/ the valves are replaceable on mine.

If your crank is creaking from movement then your lockring is not tight enough, and you should tighten it asap before it destroys the edge of the BB threads. The shape of the crank spindle is coned at the non drive side, its designed to tighten up and wedge in there on that side with the lockring supporting the other. I.e. you plumbers tape 'should' be doing nothing.

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Re: Raged Cube Reaction 29er Cyclocross BBS02 Build Thread

Post by ScooterMan101 » Apr 28 2016 1:03am

Nice Job on the thumb throttle on a drop bar mount.

Have you tried to mount it on the right side ?

If you come up with any improvements on it please let us know, ( I want less spring tension on mine )


How did you brake your other 29er frame ? that could be bad in regards to your body if that happens at speed.
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Re: Raged Cube Reaction 29er Cyclocross BBS02 Build Thread

Post by Raged » Apr 28 2016 11:57am

ScooterMan101 wrote:Nice Job on the thumb throttle on a drop bar mount.

Have you tried to mount it on the right side ?

If you come up with any improvements on it please let us know, ( I want less spring tension on mine )

How did you brake your other 29er frame ? that could be bad in regards to your body if that happens at speed.
I dont see why you cant mount it on the right. Just get a different throttle (right hand throttle) and mount it the same way. My right hand is for front brake, so I like keeping it clear in case of emergency =) As for the spring tension, that's just related to the spring inside the throttle. I found the standard throttle on the BBS02 kit as well as the em3ev kits to be quite good ( soft enough you can hold it down all day ). I ordered a few spare throttles from ebay and the spring is significantly harder, so they're in a box somewhere in the garage =/

In regards to the other frame, check out the initial build and accompanying video in the thread... It's not for the faint hearted =)

Build update... I did a semi-teardown to find the cause of the creaking on advice from Lurkin. There were a few things...
1. The body of the BBS02 was touching the rear chainstay when it was tightened up, so I filed a bit of the BBS02 aluminium off to give it a bit of clearance. On jumps I can assume there's a slight bit of flex and that's what's caused the BBS02 to loosen a bit... I dont really know, but I prefer some gap between the BBS02 and the chainstay anyway.
2. I needed 1 strip of electrical tape on the drive side shaft to make sure it sit snug in the BSA 68mm BB slot when tightened up from the other side. Without it, it just seemed a bit too loose.
3. Added locktite to the Schwalbe screw on valve and it seems to hold air for now ( good as a spare since I've already put on a new tube ).

Time will tell if any of those things did much ( only 150km in since I rebuilt it ).
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Re: Raged Cube Reaction 29er Cyclocross BBS02 Build Thread

Post by 1KW » Apr 28 2016 8:37pm

how many miles total? Since you owned a 29er with suspension on the front also, what do you recommend a 29er mtb or 700c CX bike? I really want a full suspension xc 29er bike for the bbshd, but there so dang expensive even used....... cx bike can be had for cheap, but I think the fat tires of the mtb would leave it more comfortable?

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Re: Raged Cube Reaction 29er Cyclocross BBS02 Build Thread

Post by Raged » Apr 28 2016 11:44pm

1KW wrote:how many miles total? Since you owned a 29er with suspension on the front also, what do you recommend a 29er mtb or 700c CX bike? I really want a full suspension xc 29er bike for the bbshd, but there so dang expensive even used....... cx bike can be had for cheap, but I think the fat tires of the mtb would leave it more comfortable?
I recommend a 29er MTB because you can always go down in tire size with a MTB frame... but you cant go up in tire size with a CX frame.

Full Suspension 29ers are still a niche product ( Giant Anthem X, etc ) so you're always going to pay a premium compared to a 26 or 27.5 full sus setup.

With my full rigid setup, it's great for commuting but when I explore off paved roads, as expected, I am definitely slower on the rough stuff than when I had front suspension. I wouldnt say it is less fun (maybe a bit more technical with your arms/legs acting as suspension) just different. Tire pressure plays a massive role in comfort but it cant do everything... going through a path cris-crossed with tree roots on a rigid frame still sucks the fat one.

I've never tried suspension with a dropbar setup... not sure if it's advisable due to the way you lean forward a bit more and the suspension ergonomics... Need to google a bit more on that.
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Re: Raged Cube Reaction 29er Cyclocross BBS02 Build Thread

Post by Lurkin » Apr 29 2016 12:39am

Also need to be very careful as to the positioning of the BB and rear linkages. I dodged a serious bullet recently after rejecting the purchase of a custom MTB frame as the BB distance was going to force pointing the BB unit pointing directly downward due to the linkage position - nothing to do with clearance or BB sizing, literally from frame/linkage position.

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Re: Raged Cube Reaction 29er Cyclocross BBS02 Build Thread

Post by Raged » May 18 2016 8:56am

Here is a pic of where I had to shave the BBS02... I was slightly paranoid, however there is alot of metal meat there that can be shaved. I did take my time with it... alot of re-fitting and marking and slow filing.

Image

I've done about 150km and no more creaking!!! Maybe it was the strip of electrical tape on drive side... maybe the BBS unit has stopped hitting chainstay... maybe I just tightened the frock out of everything more...

I'll put another couple hundred km on it and report back.

P.S. the schwalbe tube still leaked slowly from the valve =(... I'm gonna give up on that $7.
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Re: Raged Cube Reaction 29er Cyclocross BBS02 Build Thread

Post by Raged » Jun 11 2016 7:27am

Update... 1500km since putting it back together and drivetrain still feels tight. Creaking seems to have been ironed out.

New upgrades... I splurged and got a Satori Suspension seatpost from cyclingdeal down in Melbourne today for $35. 2cm of suspension for my ass as my back was starting to hurt a bit ( yeah yeah.... something something over 40 shit goes downhill ). I only went there to pick up a 10 speed chain for my other bike, but it was cheap and I had to try it. I wound the preload down so it maintains height but is still nice and cushy on bad roads. Will see how it goes on the ride to work next week. It is about 500g compared to a bontranger carbon seat tube ( 220g ), but if it makes it more comfortable, I can spend more time in the saddle.
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Re: Raged Cube Reaction 29er Cyclocross BBS02 Build Thread

Post by KINNINVIEKID » Jun 11 2016 8:11am

Raged wrote:. It is about 500g compared to a bontranger carbon seat tube ( 220g ), but if it makes it more comfortable, I can spend more time in the saddle.
If you want to lose the extra 280g just take a dump before you go for a ride :lol:
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Re: Raged Cube Reaction 29er Cyclocross BBS02 Build Thread

Post by Raged » Jun 11 2016 8:57pm

KINNINVIEKID wrote:
Raged wrote:. It is about 500g compared to a bontranger carbon seat tube ( 220g ), but if it makes it more comfortable, I can spend more time in the saddle.
If you want to lose the extra 280g just take a dump before you go for a ride :lol:
As an engineer... I strive to form my poo babies in the image of the Mona Lisa!! =) Weight saving and artistry in 1! Hahaha...
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Re: Raged Cube Reaction 29er Cyclocross BBS02 Build Thread

Post by KINNINVIEKID » Jun 12 2016 4:27am

Raged wrote:
KINNINVIEKID wrote:
Raged wrote:. It is about 500g compared to a bontranger carbon seat tube ( 220g ), but if it makes it more comfortable, I can spend more time in the saddle.
If you want to lose the extra 280g just take a dump before you go for a ride :lol:
As an engineer... I strive to form my poo babies in the image of the Mona Lisa!! =) Weight saving and artistry in 1! Hahaha...
LOVE IT.... :lol:
BBSHD on 2017 Marin Muirwoods
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Re: Raged Cube Reaction 29er Cyclocross BBS02 Build Thread

Post by Raged » Jul 10 2016 3:43am

Bit of an update while it's pouring down in Melbourne. Everything is still good so far and 3 of my fingers are pretty much back to normal since my crash (12 months flys by so fast). My little finger is still *flicking* at a certain range... eg. It moves to x point... then nothing... then flicks to the next point. No tendon damage, but just need to work on the control side of things. Scarring on left hand has dropped significantly (not raised puffy scars anymore) but still quite visible and not really nice to look at... I've had a few comments from people, but ... frock em.

The BBS02 has been solid since I put it back together. There's a bit of vibration which is due to my non-ideal chainline ( really need to drop to a lekkie to get the chainline going right ). In the interim, I've built a non powered rigid 29er out of spare parts and someone elses failed build project. Paid AUD $300 for a mostly complete 29er bike with deore 2x10 ( all new ) but they couldnt get their shit working right. Built it up and am cruising the streets on that if I'm not on the ebike. Turns out the guy used the 1mm spacer that comes with a 10 speed setup ( for fitting to a 9sp hub)... which you dont use on a hub designed for 10 speed... the 11t was slipping like a madman until I removed it.... Someone elses non google-fu is my benefit. The new rat bike came with a Mosso M5 fork which is a horrible peice of shit... even for a rigid fork... I have a carbon fork on the way while waiting for a deal on a good suspension fork. The Mosso M5 flexes like a bitch... do not buy. I've done a day of single track with the Marin 29er at lysterfield which felt great, and maybe a few more months before I am confident enough to do real jumps and feel my hand wont give way... or it might just be mental blockage.

I have to say... I'm so glad I had an ebike during the recovery phase. I know my range is about 25km on full thottle with the 5800mAh battery, so I use it sparingly and try to push through pedaling where I can. I've made it last 90km on 1 charge, so It means I've done the hard yards on the road to recovery. I'm only now starting to go non-ebike for known paths now (eg. Along the beach trails).... I still bring the ebike when I dont know where I'm going or dont know where I end up... Which is what a proper CX bike should be good with.

Knee and hip are still in recovery ( I landed on it during crash ) but no more physio. just need to work through the pain and drop a gear or 2 to spin.
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Re: Raged Cube Reaction 29er Cyclocross BBS02 Build Thread

Post by Tats » Aug 02 2016 11:08pm

That accident was scary man, glad you're on the mend. How do you find the bbs vs the Mac? I've got a dual susp bbs01 with Paul's 25a controller and it's great. My backup is a talon 29er with an old Dillinger 250w cute front hubbie and 15a sine wave controller. Was thinking of changing this to a rear Mac / 6 fet lyen I have spare and wondered how it compares to the bbs?

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Re: Raged Cube Reaction 29er Cyclocross BBS02 Build Thread

Post by Raged » Apr 21 2017 12:32am

Just an update after a few months. I've moved the battery from the box mid section for more stealth as I only need 2 bricks of Lipo to power the BBS02 (max 25-30amps compared to my 2.2kw MAC10T).

Power requirements of the BBS02 is maximum 30A draw for full power which a 1P zippy compact setup will happily do using the lipo combo of 5.8AH 14S battery at 25 C.

5.8*25/4 = 36.25Amps continuous so I wont stress the battery which is connected to a 30A BMS anyway. With the MAC10T I needed 2P for 40-60A pulls, thus larger battery space required and a bigger metal box in frame. I did run my MAC10T at 1P for a bit while testing and you could feel the battery sag =(.

Image

The lipo bricks and BMS fit in the front pannier easily with room to spare for the cables. So if you only need to go 30-50km or so, you could run the same simple battery setup which is 100% removable with a small motor (500-1kw) kit. Takes the headache out of building a box frame.

Also note that I've swapped my look 986 29er carbon fork to a 27.5 carbon fork ( also look 986 ) to drop the front a bit and change the geometry of the bike to be a bit more nimble. (less slack). The angle has changed about 2 degrees so it's less stable at 55km/h but more easy to turn.
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Re: Raged Cube Reaction 29er Cyclocross BBS02 Build Thread

Post by anth_85 » Sep 07 2017 7:17am

Raged wrote: 5.8*25/4 = 36.25Amps continuous so I wont stress the battery which is connected to a 30A BMS anyway. With the MAC10T I needed 2P for 40-60A pulls, thus larger battery space required and a bigger metal box in frame.
I'm currently (very slowly) building up a big 14s10p 18650 pack to go in the frame on a cyclocross bike similar to yours, the reason was never the distance, it was the current draw per cell, since I'm using reused laptop cells I didn't want to be pulling more than 1C regularlly. But I do really like your plan of using smaller lipos for shorter journeys. It makes the bike looks loads more stealthy and importantly a lot lighter. Those zippy 7c 5800amh packs would be ideal to run in parallel to give the 14S. According to this calculator http://www.electricbikerange.info/Elect ... range.html two packs in series would be 75% emptied on my commute one way, so I'd have to recharge and work for the return journey, or get 4 packs to get there and back.

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Re: Raged Cube Reaction 29er Cyclocross BBS02 Build Thread

Post by Raged » Sep 08 2017 4:49am

anth_85 wrote:
Raged wrote: 5.8*25/4 = 36.25Amps continuous so I wont stress the battery which is connected to a 30A BMS anyway. With the MAC10T I needed 2P for 40-60A pulls, thus larger battery space required and a bigger metal box in frame.
I'm currently (very slowly) building up a big 14s10p 18650 pack to go in the frame on a cyclocross bike similar to yours, the reason was never the distance, it was the current draw per cell, since I'm using reused laptop cells I didn't want to be pulling more than 1C regularlly. But I do really like your plan of using smaller lipos for shorter journeys. It makes the bike looks loads more stealthy and importantly a lot lighter. Those zippy 7c 5800amh packs would be ideal to run in parallel to give the 14S. According to this calculator http://www.electricbikerange.info/Elect ... range.html two packs in series would be 75% emptied on my commute one way, so I'd have to recharge and work for the return journey, or get 4 packs to get there and back.
You can fit 4 of the smaller 7s 4000mAh zippy batteries in a front pannier bag for 14S2P 8000mAh. My other front pannier bag is 15cm x 5cm x 12cm, so room to spare for padding and wires. I already had the 5800mAh, so used what I had on hand even though I could only cram in 14S1P.

These are slightly shorter, so easier to fit into the bags.
https://hobbyking.com/en_us/zippy-compa ... -pack.html
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