Because in general they are not doing "just fine."Dauntless wrote:But if the people are doing just fine without it at the moment, why the rush to get electricity to them that they have no idea that they need?
In places like Africa solar is making big inroads. The #1 market for off-grid solar systems is currently sub-Saharan Africa. Since in general a small amount of power (enough to run lights, a fan, a few device chargers and a well pump) makes a huge difference, the smaller, low-cost systems are working there.Meanwhile, there may be no grid, but those backward areas often have all sorts of electricity. Some of it solar or wind, some of it their own personal gas generators.
Who said anything about savages? Oh, wait, YOU did. It's only easy for YOU to think of them as savages. The rest of us see them as what they are, people who are doing just fine without living in the suburbs, no matter how much it surprises you that the whole world doesn't look like your neighborhood.billvon wrote:Because in general they are not doing "just fine."
It's easy to think of people without electricity as ignorant savages who don't know what the rest of the world is like. Most aren't like that, and they still need to be able to see at night, run refrigerators to keep vaccines cold, run pumps for water and charge cellphones and other electronics.
I never claimed that. I just support RE as generally a good idea, even if it costs a little more. You might think fossil fuels are cheap, but once subsidies for them end they'll get more expensive. Then when carbon taxing kicks in to offset the external cost, they'll get really expensive. Perhaps then you'll be railing against your local government for the blackouts caused by crippling coal prices and failing to invest in RE.Hillhater wrote:And i thought your belief was that Utilities changing to RE sources will make Utility power cheaper over the next 20 yrs ?
How much more would you pay for a home with 10 yr old solar system installed ?
The simple fact that industry doesent pay the same price, effectively means they are being subsidised by the higher tax payers.
Your anti-science global warming denialism has, somehow, sunk to a new low.TheBeastie wrote:The fact with this is why can't we now point the finger at solar panel manufacture everytime see a global warming temperature increase claim/chart than co2? Especially considering the fact that increase co2 ppm levels past a certain point doesn't increase its greenhouse effect anymore due to the fact co2 only absorbs a certain spectrum of the suns energy. Its like sticking your arm in a bucket of water after a while the bucket can't get any warmer.
I've lived with them, and no, I don't think they are savages.Dauntless wrote:Who said anything about savages? Oh, wait, YOU did. It's only easy for YOU to think of them as savages.
Who said they "want to live in the suburbs?" They just want to be able to see at night. Charge their phones, Have a fan when it's hot. Just like you do.The rest of us see them as what they are, people who are doing just fine without living in the suburbs
Yes, i admit i should have said "not a significant GHG"billvon wrote:CO2 is the second strongest greenhouse gas in the Earth's atmosphere. (The strongest is water vapor.)Hillhater wrote:Puxnor... Co2 is not a GHG !!....
It is the second strongest greenhouse gas, and contributes about 20% (and rising) of the greenhouse effect. That seems significant.Hillhater wrote:Yes, i admit i should have said "not a significant GHG"
What significant effect is missing?The Wiki info is correct in as far as it goes, but that is far from the full picture of the processes .
Everyone is "qualified" to comment.Punx0r wrote:With those patently rediculous beliefs you are not qualified to comment. No wonder you oppose RE in favour of continuing to burn fossil fuels. You are beyond reason and beyond help. No doubt you will continue to deny reality even after it has played out around you.
And more to the point, they want to be able to cook, read (scool kids learning), and keep warm......without having to constantly cut down trees to burn and slowly kill each other with the smoke and fumes from open fires inside the homes.billvon wrote: Who said they "want to live in the suburbs?" They just want to be able to see at night. Charge their phones, Have a fan when it's hot. Just like you do.
Dang, just the article on Social Science affecting Climate Change to fit in here. Right up your alley, the way you two discuss. Climate change is in the second half. Don't worry, it's short.Punx0r wrote:You just discredited yourself.billvon wrote:I've lived with them, and no, I don't think they are savages.
Yeah thats interesting stuff.Hillhater wrote:Another useful site to view and analyse Australias power generation and demand is..
http://anero.id/energy/solar-energy Just pick a generation source from the drop down menues.
Also a good review of the weeks power consumption with explanations here..
https://papundits.wordpress.com/2017/11 ... mber-2017/
Agreed.liveforphysics wrote:All modern PV cell lines and lithium cell lines are fully closed loop with all mfg gasses and solvents, because to not be means you're not going to be cost competitive anymore.
That is an idealistic view which is not supported by the available data...liveforphysics wrote:All modern PV cell lines and lithium cell lines are fully closed loop with all mfg gasses and solvents, because to not be means you're not going to be cost competitive anymore.
China has already seen a backlash. Panel manufacturer Jinko Solar, for example, has faced protests and legal action since one of its plants, in the eastern province of Zhejiang, was accused of dumping toxic waste into a nearby river