Wind and Solar vs Coal, Gasoline, Nuclear

General Discussion about electric vehicles.
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ZeroEm   10 mW

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Re: Wind and Solar vs Coal, Gasoline, Nuclear

Post by ZeroEm » Jun 11 2019 8:57pm

They have not moved all the way yet, here is a link to the story that has a link to watch the new clip I seen.

https://flipboard.com/@BBCNews/the-sola ... c6/bbc.com
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TheBeastie   1 MW

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Re: Wind and Solar vs Coal, Gasoline, Nuclear

Post by TheBeastie » Jun 12 2019 3:25am

Tesla cells require nickel, commonly refined at around 100tonnes co2/tonne of nickel, on the inside and the outside, that's why its called NCA Tesla cells (Nickel Cobalt Aluminium), but don't forget the outside is always coated with nickel as well.
https://www.wsj.com/video/the-secret-to ... 15603.html

A low emissions nickel mine is under 60 tonnes of co2/tonnes of nickel, which would utilize hydro-electricity etc, so good and proud of they openly publish their EPA results on the internet https://endless-sphere.com/forums/downl ... &mode=view
^Ultimately this is rare.

So it's easy to see how a Tesla battery "pre-emits" 15tons of co2 before its ever even been driven, which is around 10 years equivalent of combustion driving, 20 years for an efficient LPG car.
I drive an LPG car which is about 83 g of CO2/km
100,000km x 0.000082 = 8.2 tonnes of co2.
Lithium batteries are only efficient after they are made, measuring efficiency after the fact is an IQ test fail being perpetrated on the general public.

But there are other secrets to the so-called "green/clean battery" EV and Tesla/battery homes. This just out from Bloomberg, who are normally extreme pro-renewables in news reports.

Saving the Planet With Electric Cars Means Strangling This Desert
Mining lithium and copper to supply the battery boom and fight climate change is wrecking a fragile ecosystem in Chile. June 11, 2019, 8:00 PM

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/features ... his-desert
Don't get me wrong, I still want to see battery cars take over, I just don't want people to think they are green/clean in any shape or form, because that's just evil lies/fraud. Powerwalls if you can get on the grid is also an environmental scam, IMO, it's just displacing CO2 elsewhere.
People are going to buy battery cars anyway, the fact that absolutely no one gives a crap that African kids digging up cobalt and govs willing to subsidize batteries is proof that EV lovers have nothing to worry about.
https://youtu.be/FwutXVTWkrw
^Every mainstream media outlet has taken a shot and made their own video report on this and no one cares, I find that quite fascinating in its self.

One thing EV/PowerWall/battery lovers might be a tiny bit happy about is that while Chile's fragile ecosystem goes down the crapper to mine all the Lithium to make the batteries possible, you might be happy to know that Australia actually provides more Lithium than Chile.
Image
In fact, Australia provides more of just about every type of metal, this is one of the reasons why Australia typically has high emissions, so it can refine all those metals so that everyone can feel clean and green overseas.
The problem with Australian lithium mines is they are a completely different method of mining.
Its the mining methods where you require a good old fashioned giant hole in the ground. And ironically for Australia, it's a place where there are a lot of trees/wildlife, not a dry dead area.
https://www.smh.com.au/business/the-eco ... 507cb.html
Image

There is, of course, one metal that Australia doesn't come through on and that's cobalt, that's why all those Africa DRC kids are on CNN https://youtu.be/FwutXVTWkrw
Nothing cheaper than kids working in a mine.
Image
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Ya, hahaha what a joke :lol:
This is one of the reasons why broadcast is finished and only for backwards people. 5G/cable/fibre will crush old media over time, as old broadcast media is incapable of not abusing their power, just like the fake Trump Mueller report/scandal, CNN lost over 30% of their viewers when it came out it was all baloney.

Over time people will learn to fact check things via the internet themselves instead of believing those who just want power, mainstream media is a micro-version of the North Korea state, and starting to collapse.

Anyone can just look at today's latest NASA snapshot of the Arctic during the peak of summer, and see that the Arctic still a nice solid block of ice, except of course around the edges where Greenland is etc where its melted during the summer, this is where Greenpeace etc go to film and tell you the world is doomed because of CO2, while still bitterly fighting to stop nuclear power-stations being built.
https://go.nasa.gov/2IzHCuj
snapshot.jpg
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On another subject.

BP's latest energy report is out for 2019.

There is no "renewable" energy revolution. The fastest growing fuel in 2018 was natural gas and by itself it experienced more growth than all "renewables" combined. Coal and oil also grew last year. Here we compare the 2018 vs the 2019 BP reports:
https://twitter.com/luisbaram/status/11 ... 4508935168

Image

If you look at the co2 difference between coal and gas, its less of a change over than swapping a can of Coca-Cola for a Fanta, if you wanted to lower your kilojoules. This is the best wind/solar based renewables can do.
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/D6wVruoVUAAmGIp.jpg

South Australia with its 2,142MW of wind-farm capacity, most of the time just burning the crap out of gas, while having the most expensive electricity in the entire world. South Australia only needs 1500MW of power on average.
https://www.electricitymap.org/?wind=fa ... emote=true
https://anero.id/energy/wind-energy
South Australia frequently emits 16x times MORE co2 than nuclear based France.

If we were comparing these two states as if they were car emissions technology (Tesla vs a Ford), then South Australia would be considered a complete joke. Germany is basically exactly the same.

Image
Last edited by TheBeastie on Jun 14 2019 7:07am, edited 12 times in total.
Speed Kills Range, 10mph = 46 miles range, 20mph = 20 miles, 30mph = 8 miles rangehttps://goo.gl/1JNL53
Over Charging Kills ur battery bit.ly/1hzWKl4
Consider PAS as your only throttle https://goo.gl/Kg1F8F
Fuel-Cell is the ultimate battery coupled with 4th-gen Nuclear
https://goo.gl/TcKtHs https://goo.gl/ZhFFot https://goo.gl/gfa215
10 Square Miles of solar panels = 0.12GW average power! https://goo.gl/Ub1S39

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Re: Wind and Solar vs Coal, Gasoline, Nuclear

Post by Hillhater » Jun 12 2019 8:35am

As they used to say in the north of England...
..” Trouble ‘t’ mill”...
Inevitable really !..
German news site iwr.de here reports that the expansion of wind energy in Germany has “come the a stop” as the government has scaled back subsidies and enacted stricter permitting laws.

“As in April 2019, only nine new wind turbines went into operation nationwide in May,” IWR reported. “The year 2019 threatens to be a disaster for the wind industry in Germany.”

The IWR reported further: “In the first five months of 2019, only around 60 new onshore wind turbines went into operation nationwide. This is the result of an IWR evaluation of data from the market master data register of the Federal Network Agency (BNetzA).”
“A catastrophe” for wind power
At Twitter, green energy activist Prof. Volker Quaschning called the collapse a “catastrophe”, tweeting that the expansion of wind power “collapsed completely”. He added that “it will be impossible to meet the CO2 reduction targets” and that 40,000 jobs in the wind industry are “on the brink”....
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Re: Wind and Solar vs Coal, Gasoline, Nuclear

Post by cricketo » Jun 12 2019 9:35am

Two Montana coal plants closing this year, the latest to go offline nationwide
"Fuel constitutes the bulk of our operating cost, and our repeated efforts to negotiate lower fuel prices with Westmoreland Rosebud Mining, the plant's sole and only historically permitted fuel supplier, have been rebuffed." Lebsack said in the statement. "Rather than working with us to keep Units 1 and 2 open, Westmoreland is proposing to increase the units' fuel cost going forward."
https://www.oregonlive.com/politics/201 ... nwide.html

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Re: Wind and Solar vs Coal, Gasoline, Nuclear

Post by billvon » Jun 12 2019 11:00am

Some bad news this morning:

=================
Scorching weather kicks off wildfire season
JUN 9, 2019
CBS News
A heatwave in the western US marked an early start to the wildfire season. Evacuations are already underway in some communities.
==================



And some good news:

====================
More water+wind+solar capacity than coal

FERC’s monthly Energy Infrastructure Update reveals that renewable electricity generation capacity online exceeded coal capacity for the first time in April.

JUNE 10, 2019 JOHN WEAVER

It was projected that this past April, and possibly even May, that we’d see renewable electricity sources temporarily out-generate coal across the whole of the United States. Last year, we saw CO2-free generation from renewables beat CO2-free generation from nuclear for the first five months of 2018. A bit over a month ago we saw California run for over an hour on clean electricity. And if we hop across the pond we’ve seen the UK run coal-free for 18 days straight and Germany run on 47% renewables through the end of May.

The Federal Energy Regulatory Commission (FERC) has released the Energy Infrastructure Update for April of 2019 (pdf), which reveals that the sum of capacity online of renewable electricity sources – hydro, wind, solar, biomass, and geothermal – totaled 21.56%, while coal continued its downward trend falling to 21.55%.
======================
--bill von

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ZeroEm   10 mW

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Re: Wind and Solar vs Coal, Gasoline, Nuclear

Post by ZeroEm » Jun 12 2019 2:29pm

CPS San Antonio, TX as of last year does not burn coal anymore, Nuclear, Natural Gas wind and Solar. Do not know if the coal mine is still open or not.
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Re: Wind and Solar vs Coal, Gasoline, Nuclear

Post by wturber » Jun 12 2019 6:57pm

ZeroEm wrote:
Jun 12 2019 2:29pm
CPS San Antonio, TX as of last year does not burn coal anymore, Nuclear, Natural Gas wind and Solar. Do not know if the coal mine is still open or not.
Are you sure? What about JK Spruce?
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Re: Wind and Solar vs Coal, Gasoline, Nuclear

Post by ZeroEm » Jun 12 2019 8:54pm

Seeing what I can find out. Do you know that it is still running? CPS had a community get together and I asked them why it was still operating and they assured me that it was shut down so your saying my government lied to me and I would be so gullible as not to check and verify.
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Re: Wind and Solar vs Coal, Gasoline, Nuclear

Post by ZeroEm » Jun 12 2019 9:13pm

You are right J.K. Spruce 1 and 2 are still polluting our air and my EV is a coal burner. I did not realize that they just put Spruce 2 online 2010. I will start fact checking before posting.
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Re: Wind and Solar vs Coal, Gasoline, Nuclear

Post by wturber » Jun 12 2019 11:06pm

ZeroEm wrote:
Jun 12 2019 9:13pm
You are right J.K. Spruce 1 and 2 are still polluting our air and my EV is a coal burner. I did not realize that they just put Spruce 2 online 2010. I will start fact checking before posting.
It's probably a cleaner burning plant than the one they retired.

Nobody knows everything or even close to it. That's why we have communities. :wink:
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Iron Horse 3.0 hardtail - 48V / 1000W / 470rpm generic Chinese DD Hub motor (ebay)
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Re: Wind and Solar vs Coal, Gasoline, Nuclear

Post by Punx0r » Jun 13 2019 5:11am

Doing something useful with abandoned, flooded coal mines: geothermal heat for nearby homes: https://www.edie.net/news/8/Welsh-coal- ... 9-4m-fund/

"The Coal Authority recently assessed there could be more than two million gigawatt hours of low-carbon heat in the UK’s mines."

https://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/93010 ... rgy-scheme

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ZeroEm   10 mW

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Re: Wind and Solar vs Coal, Gasoline, Nuclear

Post by ZeroEm » Jun 13 2019 2:20pm

I like learning and thank you wturber. I would have never even bothered to check. learned a lot yesterday, looking into the Power plants. Learned that we don't use Texas coal and do not make very much solar, wind power. Quite eye opening.

Been searching ES for a thread about using EVs to power a home during a black out. Would like to use some of that coal power in my E-car and E-bikes batteries to run my fridge when the extra thousands of people that moved to town try to use the limited power we have and the lights go out.

I have been buying small stepup and stepdown and inverters to change voltages.
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Re: Wind and Solar vs Coal, Gasoline, Nuclear

Post by billvon » Jun 13 2019 2:26pm

ZeroEm wrote:
Jun 13 2019 2:20pm
Been searching ES for a thread about using EVs to power a home during a black out. Would like to use some of that coal power in my E-car and E-bikes batteries to run my fridge when the extra thousands of people that moved to town try to use the limited power we have and the lights go out.
Few ways to do that.

Easiest is to use the 12V the car has available. Most cars have a DC/DC that will give you about 1000 watts on the 12V line. You can use that to power small loads in the house.

Most efficient is to use the 200-400 volts that the traction battery provides. This is, of course, much more dangerous both to your health and your car's warranty since those connections are VERY well protected. There are a fair number of high voltage inverters out there that you can use for this. This will give you tens of kilowatts.

In both cases the car has to be on.
--bill von

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Re: Wind and Solar vs Coal, Gasoline, Nuclear

Post by Hillhater » Jun 13 2019 6:40pm

ZeroEm wrote:
Jun 13 2019 2:20pm
I learned a lot yesterday, looking into the Power plants. Learned that we don't use Texas coal and do not make very much solar, wind power.
...... Would like to use some of that coal power in my E-car and E-bikes batteries to run my fridge when the extra thousands of people that moved to town try to use the limited power we have and the lights go out.
????
Why would Tx have “limited Power” ?....
.. according to the EIA...
.......Texas produces more electricity than any other state, generating almost twice as much as Florida, the second-highest electricity-producing state.....
.....Texas wind turbines have produced more electricity than both of the state's nuclear power plants since 2014. ...
Something doesnt add up ?
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ZeroEm   10 mW

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Re: Wind and Solar vs Coal, Gasoline, Nuclear

Post by ZeroEm » Jun 13 2019 9:54pm

Plenty of volts, grid needs updated. we had high winds last week and a lot of people were with out power for three days. over tree limbs hitting power lines. they don't keep them cut back.
I called CPS 9 months ago over a transformer that supplied power to my house, people next door had bigger feed lines run to the house and the cable that carries the weight of the line was not tied off. All the weight was hanging on the bolts of the transformer.
I never seen them come out to fix it. sold the house and moved.
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ZeroEm   10 mW

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Re: Wind and Solar vs Coal, Gasoline, Nuclear

Post by ZeroEm » Jun 13 2019 10:06pm

Don't get me wrong not down on Texas, just don't know how some of the people get in office. I wished we would do more wind and solar and sell the excess. San Antonio had some ideas to ease the strain on the grid, they will put solar on your roof and give you a reduction on your bill for using your roof. If enough people did that across the city it might make a difference but one brown then the solar is shut off. Don't think I would be good with that. I would need to be 20 to 40yrs younger to go solar to recover the cost.
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ZeroEm   10 mW

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Re: Wind and Solar vs Coal, Gasoline, Nuclear

Post by ZeroEm » Jun 13 2019 10:31pm

billvon » Jun 13 2019 2:26pm
ZeroEm wrote: ↑
Jun 13 2019 2:20pm
Been searching ES for a thread about using EVs to power a home during a black out. Would like to use some of that coal power in my E-car and E-bikes batteries to run my fridge when the extra thousands of people that moved to town try to use the limited power we have and the lights go out.
Few ways to do that.

Easiest is to use the 12V the car has available. Most cars have a DC/DC that will give you about 1000 watts on the 12V line. You can use that to power small loads in the house.

Most efficient is to use the 200-400 volts that the traction battery provides. This is, of course, much more dangerous both to your health and your car's warranty since those connections are VERY well protected. There are a fair number of high voltage inverters out there that you can use for this. This will give you tens of kilowatts.

In both cases the car has to be on.
--bill von]
Thinking just fridge if they power will be off more than half an hour. I need to do more research, think my leaf will do 75 amps 12v so if I make sure the 12V battery has enough CCA for the startup (with car on) it should do 120vac 6 amps ok. But no markings on the battery (could put a optima red in) and my inverter is a modified sinewave 2K - 4K not sure about using it for appliances.
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Re: Wind and Solar vs Coal, Gasoline, Nuclear

Post by Hillhater » Jun 13 2019 10:51pm

ZeroEm wrote:
Jun 13 2019 9:54pm
Plenty of volts, grid needs updated. .....
Really ?, in 2013, Texas invested us$7.0 Bn in upgrades to the electricity transmission (grid) system ?
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ZeroEm   10 mW

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Re: Wind and Solar vs Coal, Gasoline, Nuclear

Post by ZeroEm » Jun 13 2019 11:41pm

Don't know of any problems getting power to the city but we have black outs every year and getting worse. I need to research where they spent the money. This city is growing fast and putting in new lines. I'm sure West Texas needed a lot more power to support all the drilling. But Texas is busy moving from coal to Natural gas. Power plants are not cheap. Not counting new technology.
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Re: Wind and Solar vs Coal, Gasoline, Nuclear

Post by Hillhater » Jun 14 2019 7:29am

The $7 bn was purely transmission lines and equipment,... no generation capacity expenditure.
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