I'm considering buying a Chevy Volt

General Discussion about electric vehicles.
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Doctorbass   100 GW

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I'm considering buying a Chevy Volt

Post by Doctorbass » Jan 09 2014 1:49am

I have that idea since few month now and everyday i use my old 2000 Acura integra i think... why i am still using a 100% gas powered car!!

Why not a Leaf ? ( only 160km range and too complicate to wait for recharge for long trip.... not enough level 3 charge station here yet !
Why not a Tesla... lol.. a question of budget and priority guys!
Why not DIY electric car ?.. well i tought about that too guys ... but if i build an EV i would build something very very nice for me... i could not build just a 5 or 10k$ car and hope to get all the confort, safety and options than i can get with a Volt or i wold need to spend more than a volt cost and would only get it finished in couples of yerars... so no guys t's not for me now, but probably in couples of years.

Actually this seem to be the car that have the most advantages for me and over the next years than a chevrelet Volt for me... . I never been a big GM or Ford fan but the Volt is impressing me alot with the technnology it use and the options it have for the price!

Now the question is should i buy a brand new 2014 or a used 2013, 2012 or even 2011... well it depend on my budget as well.. and i have priority too . our house need some work and me and my wife and me will certainly get some child one day... so i have to preserve some economy for that...

Dont forget that cars here cost more than in the US and that these cars are rare to get here... our GM dealers

I like the principle of the volt with teh 100% electric propulsion system helped with a gas generator. most of the time i'm traveling less than 40km a day and make alot of short distance wich is perfect for the electric range. when i go to Montreal or close to the Ontario etc i can travel up to 625km with afull tank wich is what i need. the average milleage people do with a Volt when they know how to use it with their brain, they get as low as 2 or 3L /100km wich is very good.


My old Integra is beginging to rust and have some holes on the body the door lock are freezing at cold temp, the windows rattle, the color changed from beautifull red to pink and i'm tired of changing balljoint, bearing, rusted disk brake, oil pressure sensor, repairing the brake line and gas line etc...

It is now not a very sexy car as it was in the 1990-2000 lol... even.. my dog hwesitate to get in ! it no more feflect the type of person i'm now...

I need to change my car !!

Our gouvernment give a 8000$ rebate until 2017 so the price of a brand new can become as low as 31000$ + the economy in fuel wich is also a kind of rebate...

Any Volt owners here or in your familly, friend, any comments?

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Re: I'm considering buying a Chevy Volt

Post by Frank » Jan 09 2014 8:05am

Doc,

A friend leases a Volt and loves it. His comute is about 60 km (38 miles) and the only time he used gas is on trips. The car uses some more that winter is here but I don't know how much more. I will ask him, winter has been pretty cold so far here in Maine (pas comme au Quebec mais...). [WHITE SMILING FACE]
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Re: I'm considering buying a Chevy Volt

Post by Punx0r » Jan 09 2014 8:22am

What is your motivation? If it's because you want a new car, or just love EVs then the Volt (or Leaf) make sense.

If it's to be green, then the best thing to do is fix your Accura and keep using it :)

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Re: I'm considering buying a Chevy Volt

Post by Ykick » Jan 09 2014 8:27am

My co-worker bought an early Volt and drove it about 40k miles IIRC. A year or so after the Volt he also bought a Tesla S (lucky guy, eh?) and the the Volt sits more than ever, LOL....

I do know cold weather electric range drops down from upper 30 miles to mid 20's. But, he's totally into it and he's had to perform literally NO maintenance except perhaps an oil change and wiper blades?

Lemme know any specific questions and I can try to get you an answer?
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Re: I'm considering buying a Chevy Volt

Post by The fingers » Jan 09 2014 10:35am

No first hand Volt experience, but from what I've heard the people that have them like them. I currently have three Ford Fusions (two of which are hybrids) in the fleet and they're really popular after the initial turn key experience. I like the looks of the Volt, hope you can get a good deal. :mrgreen:
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Re: I'm considering buying a Chevy Volt

Post by arkmundi » Jan 09 2014 10:50am

Why not the Chevrolet Spark EV ?
Considering a hybrid car, which on is best for my drive?
The 2014 Fuel Economy Guide has just been published at fueleconomy.gov. Anyone buying a new car would do well to read. The top 10:
2014 Chevrolet Spark EV Combined 119 City 128/Highway 109 All-electric, Auto (A1)
2014 Honda Fit EV Combined 118 City 132/Highway 105 All-electric, Auto (A1)
2014 Fiat 500e Combined 116 City 122/Highway 108 All-electric, Auto (A1)
2014 smart fortwo EV cabriolet Combined 107 City 122/Highway 93 All-electric, Auto (A1)
2014 smart fortwo EV coupe Combined 107 City 122/Highway 93 All-electric, Auto (A1)
2014 Ford Focus Electric Combined 105 City 110/Highway 99 All-electric, Auto (AV)
2014 Toyota RAV4 EV Combined 76 City 78/Highway 74 All-electric, Auto (AV)
2014 Chevrolet Volt Combined 62 City 63/Highway 61 Plug-in Hybrid, Auto (AV)
2014 Ford Fusion Energi Combined 58 City 63/Highway 54 Plug-in Hybrid, Auto (AV)
2014 Toyota Prius Plug-in Hybrid Combined 58 City 59/Highway 56 Plug-in Hybrid, Auto (AV)

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Re: I'm considering buying a Chevy Volt

Post by www.recumbents.com » Jan 09 2014 12:34pm

I want one too.

My parents bought one and they love it. They live in a small-ish city and never have to buy gas. They just plug it into the regular 20A wall outlet in the garage and it recharges overnight. It's a hatchback which is rare in a US built car so you can put a lot of junk in the back too.

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Re: I'm considering buying a Chevy Volt

Post by Trilska » Jan 09 2014 1:41pm

Have you looked in to the BMW i3 with the rangextender? Similary priced (similary priced in Sweden) as the Opel Ampera (Volt in an Opel uniform).

Plus it is almost 500kg lighter (composite monocoque anyone?) and double the pure electric range.
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Re: I'm considering buying a Chevy Volt

Post by Arlo1 » Jan 09 2014 3:56pm

I hate gm.
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Re: I'm considering buying a Chevy Volt

Post by Frank » Jan 09 2014 4:11pm

Doc,

My friend says his summertime mileage was 162 mpUSg which has dropped to 130 or so. 7300 miles for 56 gallons (US) gas.
Frank

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Re: I'm considering buying a Chevy Volt

Post by footloose » Jan 09 2014 6:08pm

Doctorbass wrote:... even.. my dog hwesitate to get in !
When your dog starts telling you "hey, I'm not riding in that heap"... it's time.

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Re: I'm considering buying a Chevy Volt

Post by liveforphysics » Jan 09 2014 6:20pm

Accord plug-in-hybrid is pretty damn impressive from a drive/performance perspective, and it's Honda rather than GarbageMotors. I realize they made it with a stupidly small battery pack though, which is unfortunate, but if your normal use cycle is inside it's small pack's range offering, I think you would enjoy it most of the hybrid/plug-in stuff available right now. It also skips the transmission losses when it's running on the gasoline engine, which is a very clever design.

That said, the Volt's electric motor is a damn sexy design and runs well, and the LG chem pack is also pretty damn nice. It's just unfortunate the rest of it is a GM.

GM:

Garbage Motors
General Maintenance
Generally Miserable
Grossley Misconceived

If you work on cars much, you will know the earned those nick-names from one shit design after another. That said, I've heard mostly all good things about the Volt and people seem to enjoy it a lot. :-)
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Re: I'm considering buying a Chevy Volt

Post by Ykick » Jan 09 2014 6:56pm

Just talked to coworker and he now has 60k miles on his Volt and only replaced a pair of tires.

I'm not a GM fan either but it's a unique design that might be ideal for certain situations.
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Re: I'm considering buying a Chevy Volt

Post by Arlo1 » Jan 09 2014 6:57pm

Yup as far as cars go Honda are usaly the easiest to work on and usaly engineered to last longer then the rest.
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Re: I'm considering buying a Chevy Volt

Post by Arlo1 » Jan 09 2014 7:01pm

I also refuse to support a company who is selling gasoline fuled cars and seeing gm buy up the trollies and destroy them to make more money selling gasoline cars is a real sore spot to me then there is the EV1. Will not buy another car that uses and engine. Only electric for me here on out! The volt is a lie they call it an electric but. That's a sales gimic/trick in wording for gov grant money pure bullshit!
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Re: I'm considering buying a Chevy Volt

Post by liveforphysics » Jan 09 2014 8:39pm

Arlo brings up a good point, and I agree. I don't ever seem myself buying something with a gas engine again either, it's simply not the path forward.

What about a used LEAF from an insurance auction or cosmetically damaged or something that you could get into for ~$10k? Then keep the teggie for when you need to go over ~80miles or whatever.
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Re: I'm considering buying a Chevy Volt

Post by bee » Jan 09 2014 9:02pm

I have been using a smart with the car2go service and love how easy the car is to drive in congested city traffic. I have been thinking of getting the electric smart car for this reason. With the current $8000 rebate it's a great deal.
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Re: I'm considering buying a Chevy Volt

Post by yopappamon » Jan 09 2014 9:32pm

Doc, are in a cold climate? I've heard the Mitsubishi Miev allows you to program pre heating or cooling while still on the charger. Anyone know if the volt or others have a similar feature.
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Re: I'm considering buying a Chevy Volt

Post by Scott » Jan 09 2014 11:39pm

I would also recommend a LEAF my parents got one. It does look goofy, but its a pretty cool car and has decent acceleration.

One time I was running out of power because I drove around 60 miles on the highway and still had 50 miles to get back home. I went to charge at an 80kw fast charger when the LEAF was at 2% charge. I walked across the street, ate a $1 cheeseburger from Burger King, went back to the car, and it was at 70%!!!

If there are any fast chargers near where you need to go just a few times a year I would not worry about the range. Or like Luke said keep your current car and get a used LEAF.
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Re: I'm considering buying a Chevy Volt

Post by dnmun » Jan 10 2014 12:36am

if someone else is interested in a volt at an insurance auction, there is a 2013 Volt at the Rancho Cucamonga Coparts yard, 5k, with some slight rear damage where the car was rear ended and rode up over the car behind so that the right rear wheel and axle is broken but no other serious damage. the rear hatch glass is not even damaged and just some of the body is rolled under with the bumper as the car from behind went under it. the rear tailpipe on the left side and muffler not even bent. but it will take access to parts and there are not many Volts in the junkyards yet.

it might go for less than $5k. no way to know in advance with an auction.

i once saw a 2010 prius with minor body damage go for $4k because it was one of the first cars up in that online auction and the guys who were bidding did not get logged on before it sold to the guy who sniped it.

but i did see a 2000 honda insight with 150k miles, 5 speed, only visible damage is broken lower window on the rear hatch. and some bumper damage. it is in the toronto coparts auction next week too, for the loonies. i bet it will go for less than $1k.

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Re: I'm considering buying a Chevy Volt

Post by Doctorbass » Jan 10 2014 1:10am

I appreciate alot your opinion guys. :wink:

Teh leaf have a look just like a versa wich is not so sexy car.. but yes it's real 100% electric as well. once we will get enough Chademo charger here it will be time to get a 100% electric car but now... there is only ONE Chademo charger in Quebec province... all the rest are 30a level 2 wich require many hours of charge just to travel hundreds of km wich is not acceptable.

I love 100% electric car as well.. but if i have to do a 2000km trip like i do 2-3 times a year, i dont want to have to spend like 20 hours of charging for 20hour of driving lol...

Dont forget we have 4 seasons here and the outdoor temp is also demanding alot of battery power with the cold and snow on the road... We by far dont have the same climat conditions tha in California .. here in summer weget between 20 and 30 degree C wich is similar... but it's only 4 month a year! :lol: California is an area where level 3 charger is very popular but its' actually not the case here.

If the could offer a more sexy car than the leaf that is also at a great price i might be interested but from now there is no car like that. I think the Volt just ismore close to a model S with the options and luxury style interior and i like that., well more than a Nissan Versa style car!! or Miev.


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Re: I'm considering buying a Chevy Volt

Post by Doctorbass » Jan 10 2014 1:26am

There is dnmum that send me a pretty interesting link about some test did on a 2011 volt battery pack.

If you read carefully you will discover that over the milleage the Volt have good battery capacity conservation,,,, but i was really surprized to see how the power capability that the battery can deliver drop fast over the milleage !!!


according to what i see, the battery lost nearly 13% of max power it can deliver between 8000 miles to 23000 miles on the odo !! :shock: it started with about 115kW at 8000 miles and droped to 100kW at 23000 miles. This was calculated with the battery internal resistance degradation.


http://www.inl.gov/technicalpublication ... 806453.pdf


I dont know what to think about that... for sure if they would have kept the A123 battery brand they would not have so high degradation... :?

I just hope that it is not linear!! because at 62000 miles ( 100000km) that car battery max acheivable power will drop to 63kW !! (it had about 115kW power at 8000 miles) that's a big power drop from the battery!...

i'm not su sure of what to think about that...

These LG chem are LiMnO2 if i remember correctly?

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Re: I'm considering buying a Chevy Volt

Post by MitchJi » Jan 10 2014 3:09am

Hi Doc,

Maybe you might want to consider buying a wrecked Tesla at an auction, similar to what Luke's friend did with a Leaf:
A friend of mine got a Leaf for 5,500 that just needed a new door, glass, fender, hood, and front and rear bumper covers and paint but was otherwise straight and operates well. I think it was under $2500 in parts including new glass and a very cheap paint job. $8,000 and time for a Leaf to commute with is pretty rad.
This is the thread:
http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewto ... 34&t=55907

dnmun posted the following (in multiple posts) in response to Luke's post:
dnmun wrote:i am a member of copart auto resellers who have an online auction of vehicles totalled by the insurance companies. there is a 2013 model S in Van Nuys you might be interested in bidding on. it is close enuff that you can go to the lot and examine the vehicle close up but the damage is not dramatic so the car may go for over $15-25k.

i cannot link you to the pictures but if you wanna you can pursue it yourself. they may allow you to create a trial membership but if you get interested i would recommend you pursue becoming a member so you can follow and bid on them as they are brought up for auction. there are currently 6 prepared for auction, one tomorrow, but the one in Van Nuys has the least damage so it may be more manageable.

you can get the id from this address, see if there is some way to get onto their site to view it if you are interested. i am willing to help if you are unfamiliar with realtime online auctions but i do not have enuff cash available to bid on it myself. it could go for less than $10k too since they are not something many of the body shop and rebuilder guys might bid on because of their lack of knowledge of the technology which you could handle easily. 1170 miles.

and there is a Leaf in LA with front end damage, but both headlight pods are unscratched, just front bumper surround smashed off, and nose of the hood is pushed back and the driver's air bag blew. 437 miles.

http://member.copart.com/c2/search.html ... d=34157753

and another Leaf in Martinez with damage front and back, right light pod gone, but no windows broken and it might be possible to pull out the rear corner. but it was totaled, 29k miles.

http://member.copart.com/c2/search.html ... d=30012003

i did see a tesla roadster up for auction in NY too, another case of just having the front bumper surround torn off and hood pushed back to make it totalled by the insurance company. totally straight otherwise. i bet it sells for $4k.

no mechanical problems on most of the teslas i saw at copart. worst was wheels ripped off, and some body damage on right side, but no damage to battery or motor in rear. i think that model S in Van Nuys will draw bigger bids since it is so clean, except the airbags are expensive to replace. i could live with duck tape over it myself. but all of them had drivetrain and batteries intact. all new 2012-2013 cars. why would you build something from scratch when they are available? except it is hard to get to be a member of coparts if you are not in the auto reselling business. except in oregon. one state that allows private citizens to bid.

i saw a 2007 civic hybrid with 87k miles at our local yard so i am gonna go look at it. right sideswiped, front fender to rear door, so it did not set off the airbag. if i can straighten the A pillar and find a used door and fender for a 2007, which is pretty common, i could be adding a civic hybrid to my stable this week. gonna bid to about $2800 i think.

the biggest expense in these small front end fender benders is blowing the airbag and the megabucks for the light pods so since there is a gas nissan with the same body which is identical to the Leaf there may be access to more body parts than electrical parts and from looking at the auctions, there are none that went to auction because of electrical problems.
Best Wishes!

Mitch


The best quality batteries and lowest priced batteries for DIY EV's are tier 1 OEM Quality Cells from salvaged (wrecked) EV packs. Three examples are Chevy Volt and Nissan Leaf and Tesla Model 3 packs.

Nissan Leaf Module specs are here
Chevy Volt Pack Info - Salvage 16kwh Packs Under $2k here

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Re: I'm considering buying a Chevy Volt

Post by liveforphysics » Jan 10 2014 3:13am

That initial drop is allegedly non-linear.
I wouldn't be surprised if it's a firmware cell ageing estimation error in the BMS (either that or they are managing the pack wrong somehow). That has been hard for everyone to get dialed without under or over-shooting it because its such a complex impedance to characterize as it ages through various processes (mechanical ion diffusion/saturation gets wonky).

For example, it may be back to 100kW next summer again when the pack cycles warm again vs freezing in winter or whatever. I would be super sad if they were really ageing that quickly IMHO.
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Re: I'm considering buying a Chevy Volt

Post by dogman dan » Jan 10 2014 6:00am

2-3 times a year sounds like you could rent a car to do those trips territory. Or, have an affordable to keep gas car around, that you rarely actually drive. Find one not rusted, then it won't rust as much if you rarely use it. You'd drive it monthly or so, to keep it's moving parts juicy. Minimum insurance on the gas car to keep the cost down. No insuring it for dents and windshields.

But a Volt might work fine, if you employ the Ford and GM owners strategy. Trade in at 100,000 miles, let some other sucker have the problems that come at 120,000. With the GM you want to get it new, or very close to new in mileage.

Different from the Toyota and Honda owners strategy, finally get another car at 250,000 miles.

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