My 2nd build 5kw hub motor

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Wishes   1 kW

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My 2nd build 5kw hub motor

Post by Wishes » Mar 13 2014 6:52pm

This is my second build. I started opposite of most people. My first ebike build was mid drive GNG kit installed on a Kona Stinky Deluxe. The build was awesome, but it has got converted to a Snow Ebike. See my other build thread in my signature for details on that build.

I started by hunting down and locating a frame from a GT-S210 Ebike. They were made by a Canadian company that went bankrupt a few years back. Why that frame? For 2 reasons. 1. it is a solid frame, full suspension (although the rear suspension is nothing like on my DH bike). 2nd is it has a very good battery placement. This second point is important, as I struggled to fit any large amount of AH on my DH frame. And for on road usage, large capacity battery pack is handy. Not so important for off road applications.

Here is a picture of the frame itself, before i removed all the original parts. It came with a second battery box that you see sitting on the rear rack. But I will be using only 1 in the center frame. It is going to get a new DH front fork and new handle bars. And all the other accessories removed.

Image

For the hub motor kit, I went with CNE bikes. I've bought a few of their hub kits for friends and customers in the past and i have had good experiences with their stuff so far. The motor and controller just came in today. OMG it is a monster. It is on a 21' rim but huge tires. The thing looks bigger than the stock 26' hub motor the bike came with.

Image

And the controller!!! Is the largest controller I've seen. I have a few Infineon controllers from Lyen here, a 75v and a 132v controller. And this thing is at least twice the size of those. It is rated for 75v at 60 amps. For roughly 4500 watts.

Image

I will try and get started on the build tonight.
Equality is about providing everyone with equal opportunities, it is not about guaranteeing equal results.

1st Build GNG Mid-Drive Kona http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewto ... 28&t=52029
2nd Build, Stong GT-S210 modified with 5kw hub motor http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewto ... =7&t=58056

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Wishes   1 kW

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Location: Montreal, QC

Re: My 2nd build 5kw hub motor

Post by Wishes » Apr 30 2014 2:33pm

Well I got the frame modified finally. We cut out the back end and redid it completely. More solid and actually fits the wheel now. I will not be able to install a disc brake. The way they made the exit for the cable, the disc will tear it to shreds as it rotates. So i'm looking for some good V brakes for the back wheel and I have a 203mm hydraulic disc brake for the front.

Now for the electronics.

Image
Equality is about providing everyone with equal opportunities, it is not about guaranteeing equal results.

1st Build GNG Mid-Drive Kona http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewto ... 28&t=52029
2nd Build, Stong GT-S210 modified with 5kw hub motor http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewto ... =7&t=58056

RC_guy   10 W

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Re: My 2nd build 5kw hub motor

Post by RC_guy » May 01 2014 11:03pm

Holly $&%%*#$$IT,
I want more pictures!
Get one with more detail of your rear dropout.

That is going to be FUN!!!

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Wishes   1 kW

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Location: Montreal, QC

Re: My 2nd build 5kw hub motor

Post by Wishes » May 01 2014 11:47pm

RC_guy wrote:Holly $&%%*#$$IT,
I want more pictures!
Get one with more detail of your rear dropout.

That is going to be FUN!!!

Image

Image
Equality is about providing everyone with equal opportunities, it is not about guaranteeing equal results.

1st Build GNG Mid-Drive Kona http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewto ... 28&t=52029
2nd Build, Stong GT-S210 modified with 5kw hub motor http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewto ... =7&t=58056

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Wishes   1 kW

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Location: Montreal, QC

Re: My 2nd build 5kw hub motor

Post by Wishes » May 01 2014 11:54pm

This brick of a controller does not come with a nice CA connector. I considered shipping it out to get one installed so I opened it up to have a look,

Image

Its all sealed.

I wanted to be able to monitor my AMP usage and my total battery voltage. So I found this little gadget on amazon and installed the shunt it needed inside my battery box. With a simple connection of the 4s type balance connector to the back of the meter, I get real time AMP and voltage usage.

Image

Image
Equality is about providing everyone with equal opportunities, it is not about guaranteeing equal results.

1st Build GNG Mid-Drive Kona http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewto ... 28&t=52029
2nd Build, Stong GT-S210 modified with 5kw hub motor http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewto ... =7&t=58056

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dogman dan   100 GW

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Re: My 2nd build 5kw hub motor

Post by dogman dan » May 02 2014 6:15am

Flipping marvelous! I knew this one was going to be good.

I don't see a rear brake yet. Just regen?

cwah   10 GW

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Re: My 2nd build 5kw hub motor

Post by cwah » May 02 2014 6:32am

Wishes wrote:This brick of a controller does not come with a nice CA connector. I considered shipping it out to get one installed so I opened it up to have a look,

Image

Its all sealed.

I wanted to be able to monitor my AMP usage and my total battery voltage. So I found this little gadget on amazon and installed the shunt it needed inside my battery box. With a simple connection of the 4s type balance connector to the back of the meter, I get real time AMP and voltage usage.

Image

Image
What did you use to seal your controller? isn't it an issue to seal it as heat would be trapped inside?
Help me find my stolen electric brompton: http://bit.ly/1a0vbBC and Bosch Sinus B3 http://bit.ly/1eV0WQz

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Wishes   1 kW

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Re: My 2nd build 5kw hub motor

Post by Wishes » May 02 2014 9:20am

It came that way. It wasn't I who sealed it up. As for retaining heat, I share the same concern when I saw this. I guess we will find out soon enough, it is almost ready to go do my first test drives.

I have a Lyen controller with a CA just waiting to be installed on it. So if it burns, it burns.

Wishes
Equality is about providing everyone with equal opportunities, it is not about guaranteeing equal results.

1st Build GNG Mid-Drive Kona http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewto ... 28&t=52029
2nd Build, Stong GT-S210 modified with 5kw hub motor http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewto ... =7&t=58056

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dogman dan   100 GW

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Re: My 2nd build 5kw hub motor

Post by dogman dan » May 02 2014 1:45pm

The fets would get hottest, and presumably are heat sinked to the box like normal.

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TMaster   1 kW

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Re: My 2nd build 5kw hub motor

Post by TMaster » May 03 2014 11:45am

I run KoolStop pads on the front wheel of my E-bike. They are the best and don't wear your rim out. I use a Avid V-brake type caliper with the V-brake or V-brake 2 dual compound pads. Wet and dry use.
http://www.koolstop.com/english/rim_pads.html
Specialized HR - 75 lb's
A123 26650M1 23S4P(75.9V Nominal) 7500W Peak
Infineon Lyen 12 Fet/45amp controller heavily modded pushing 110 Amps peak
Yescom Motor with upgraged phase wires (Golden Motor/9C replica)

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Wishes   1 kW

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Location: Montreal, QC

Re: My 2nd build 5kw hub motor

Post by Wishes » May 04 2014 6:37am

TMaster wrote:I run KoolStop pads on the front wheel of my E-bike. They are the best and don't wear your rim out. I use a Avid V-brake type caliper with the V-brake or V-brake 2 dual compound pads. Wet and dry use.
http://www.koolstop.com/english/rim_pads.html
Thanks for the suggestion and link, I think I will try these out.

Wishes
Equality is about providing everyone with equal opportunities, it is not about guaranteeing equal results.

1st Build GNG Mid-Drive Kona http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewto ... 28&t=52029
2nd Build, Stong GT-S210 modified with 5kw hub motor http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewto ... =7&t=58056

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Wishes   1 kW

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Posts: 383
Joined: Jun 16 2013 9:29am
Location: Montreal, QC

Re: My 2nd build 5kw hub motor

Post by Wishes » May 04 2014 6:53am

I took the bike out yesterday for it's first rides. My first tests were with this odd stock controller they shipped it with. And I am having a very odd problem.

Thankfully I had the AMP\Volt meter set up on my battery pack, so I was able to see the AMP usage. First thing I noticed is this was suppose to be a 60 AMP controller. The most I saw drawn from my battery was 38 amps. But not knowing this controller at all, I was not completely surprised by that. I figured it was just another piece of equipment not respecting the specs provided. Wouldn't be the first time with products I order from china. Part of the risks lol.

But my issue was not only the total amp it drew, but how it did it. It had very little torque from a dead stop. And when I would WOT from a dead stop, the amp it drew would start low, around 15 amps, and as the motor rpm increases, the amp would increase. I've never seen this behavior before, but my building experience is limited to mid drives and cheap cne or golden motor 1000 watt kits. And I've never seen a ramp up of the amps with rpm like that.

Now after double checking everything and unable to figure out why it was doing this, I decided it must be related to this odd controller so I swapped it out and installed a Lyen controller I had along with a CA. The only Lyen one I had not used is a 134v controller. So I hooked it up with 24s lipo and combined it with the CA.

I got the exact same behavior out of the motor with the Lyen controller and CA. I was getting only 1700 watts of power from a dead stop and then it would ramp up as the motor picked up speed. This controller and CA settings were set to 50 amps.

I did notice something else with my test rides doing WOT short runs up and down my street. There was a good hour delay from my initial test rides to when I removed the stock controller so I did not notice this. But with the Lyen controller, After just a few WOT rides up and down my street, which is not that long, the controller was boiling hot. Hotter than i've ever seen a Lyen controller get. And the top speed this motor was hitting on 100v was only around 55 kph. It should have been much more. The motor itself is not hot at all. And since i'm not even drawing anything close to the 50 amp limit of the lyen controller. I am in a bit of a loss as to why there is all this heat generation. Obviously something is wrong, the motor is not working like it should and the controller is not performing like it should.

Since I'm getting very similar behavior with 2 different controllers, i am suspecting something wrong with the motor.

Any suggestions or ideas would be appreciated.

Wishes
Equality is about providing everyone with equal opportunities, it is not about guaranteeing equal results.

1st Build GNG Mid-Drive Kona http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewto ... 28&t=52029
2nd Build, Stong GT-S210 modified with 5kw hub motor http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewto ... =7&t=58056

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Tommy L   100 kW

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Re: My 2nd build 5kw hub motor

Post by Tommy L » Jan 18 2015 6:08pm

What happened to this awesome build thread?
Please update! :) :) :) Grin!
http://www.rawvelocity.com

- 4th Hoolagan FS Mtn 9C-2810 with 128v nom 9.2ah A123 40S40P(1.2Kw) - Lyen 18Fet 4115 - 77.8kph :)
http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewto ... =4&t=39480

- 3rd Catrike 700 Bionx PL350 Velo build
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rYdnkaAhVtI

- 2nd 150lbs Pusher Trailer
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q1qTc4sjORY

- 1st Sears NS mtn bike - Rigid 10a drill 800rpm - 2 12v AGM - 1000 watt inverter - 600w dimmer for throttle, wicked torque!

48.2mph/77.8kph Club

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