Madness. Why such slow penetration for hybrid?

General Discussion about electric vehicles.
Punx0r
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Re: Madness. Why such slow penetration for hybrid?

Post by Punx0r » Dec 11, 2017 11:30 am

lol "hate".

Says the man with an obvious penchant for overly-aggressive responses to a perceived challenge...

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Re: Madness. Why such slow penetration for hybrid?

Post by Punx0r » Dec 11, 2017 5:27 pm

So what is your assertion then, Dauntless? That coal is enjoying a renaissance because a handful of mines in one U.S. state have resumed production as evidence of some politician or other who is going to "save" democracy and take back a country for the people by destroying the tyrants at the U.S. EPA who "hate freedom" and have gotten far too big for their boots.

No one cares about local partisan politics. AGW is a global issue. Coal and ICE are in decline, renewables and EVs are on the way in. You can shout at the moon all you want, it won't change anything. A sustainable bent is increasingly the social norm, green is nearly cool, conspicuous polluting is increasingly seen as unacceptable. People care what's in their food, their water and nowadays, their air. Clean air is not a left-wing conspiracy.

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Re: Madness. Why such slow penetration for hybrid?

Post by billvon » Dec 11, 2017 5:49 pm

Punx0r wrote:
Dec 11, 2017 5:27 pm
That coal is enjoying a renaissance because a handful of mines in one U.S. state have resumed production as evidence of some politician or other who is going to "save" democracy and take back a country for the people by destroying the tyrants at the U.S. EPA who "hate freedom" and have gotten far too big for their boots.
Any time you have a president saying anything good about an industry it will cause a bump in the industry he's touting. Reagan's candy choices, for example, sold a lot of jelly beans while he was president.

But in the case of coal it's a tiny spike on an industry that's been in decline for the past 10 years, for half a dozen reasons. Even if you got rid of every environmental rule in the country, and returned us to the days of burning rivers and fatal smogs, you would still have the economic reasons that are driving people to natural gas and renewables over coal.

So while support for a coal 'renaissance' is currently very politically correct, there's not much to it.
Last edited by billvon on Dec 12, 2017 11:23 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Madness. Why such slow penetration for hybrid?

Post by billvon » Dec 11, 2017 5:49 pm

Deleted - duplicate
Last edited by billvon on Dec 12, 2017 11:24 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Madness. Why such slow penetration for hybrid?

Post by solera ebiker » Dec 12, 2017 9:12 am

Chalo wrote:
Dec 10, 2017 3:47 am
Things are looking up because it won't be long before human-driven cars are no longer allowed on public roads.

At that point, it won't matter any more what fuel they run on, which means they'll pretty much all be electric for normal city use, because that's most economical and sensible.

Your comments will remain indefinitely on archive.org as an insignificant but decisive testament as to what a colossally stupid set of ideas you bought into. Perhaps one day, academics will dig them up and laugh at you along with today's leadership with puzzlement at how backwards y'all were.

The only thing of consequence, that will be dug, is coal. Drilled, oil and gas. Listen, nobody listens to you guys, you had your run, its over. If we did, then we wouldn't be getting ready to drill ANWR. We, as a nation, are getting out of every dumbass agreement that hurts us Americans. You don't like us, but we like ourselves. So, really thats all that matters. We, the people will decide, not the clowns who have been, and some who are still in office, or the EU, or any other world dummies who think we are all one.

Eat your corn flakes, and I love your hat, is it real fur?

It truly is refreshing to read the pontifical nonsense. Gotta run, but first, I'll remote start my SUV, get it nice and toasty before I head to the mall and read the latest on gas guzzler RV's.

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Willard M. Romney

Failed candidate to continue the ruse.

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Re: Madness. Why such slow penetration for hybrid?

Post by solera ebiker » Dec 12, 2017 9:29 am

billvon wrote:
Dec 11, 2017 5:49 pm
Punx0r wrote:
Dec 11, 2017 5:27 pm
That coal is enjoying a renaissance because a handful of mines in one U.S. state have resumed production as evidence of some politician or other who is going to "save" democracy and take back a country for the people by destroying the tyrants at the U.S. EPA who "hate freedom" and have gotten far too big for their boots.
Any time you have a president saying anything good about an industry it will cause a bump in the industry he's touting. Reagan's candy choices, for example, sold a lot of jelly beans while he was president.

But in the case of coal it's a tiny spike on an industry that's been in decline for the past 10 years, for half a dozen reasons. Even if you got rid of every environmental rule in the country, and returned us to the days of burning rivers and fatal smogs, you would still have the economic reasons that are driving people to natural gas and renewables over coal.

So while support for a coal 'renaissance' is currently very politically correct, there's not much to it.



No one cares about local partisan politics. AGW is a global issue. Coal and ICE are in decline, renewables and EVs are on the way in. You can shout at the moon all you want, it won't change anything. A sustainable bent is increasingly the social norm, green is nearly cool, conspicuous polluting is increasingly seen as unacceptable. People care what's in their food, their water and nowadays, their air. Clean air is not a left-wing conspiracy.
[/quote]

Billy, they are burning more nat gas, the other fossil fuel. Its pure economics really. Maybe you missed that article! We drilled so deep into mother earth, that we uncovered another 150 years worth of nat gas. After we burn through that, we will burn more coal again. You should be proud of our American ingenuity, after all it was old white guy from Oklahoma who figured out that marvel of engineering.

And, wait for it, we are "exporting" fossil fuel to less fortunate parts of the world, so thay can live better lives. Now even greenies couldn't argue with that, could you. :lol:


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That sucker burns some real fuel.

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Re: Madness. Why such slow penetration for hybrid?

Post by billvon » Dec 12, 2017 11:24 am

Deleted - duplicate
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Re: Madness. Why such slow penetration for hybrid?

Post by solera ebiker » Dec 12, 2017 7:35 pm

Punx0r wrote:
Dec 11, 2017 11:30 am
lol "hate".

Says the man with an obvious penchant for overly-aggressive responses to a perceived challenge...

I ask just one simple question; how can you be so uninformed saying ice is in decline. Dude, lying is not the path here. The Artic and Antarctic ice caps are increasing, how is it you just lie so easily. You all were saying the typical the end is near with the drought in the west. Well, it took just one year to fill the reservoirs. Now you chickens don't mentiin it, why, because you can't muster the lie, and make it stick.

Look, no matter what you greenies think, your on the loser side. Fossil fuel, globally, increases month over month, and no matter what you all say in here, readijng from your feel good sources, doesn't amount to a hill of beans. But I do enjoy your intellectual superiority, its fun to read. :lol:


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Re: Madness. Why such slow penetration for hybrid?

Post by Punx0r » Dec 13, 2017 4:12 am

That comment was aimed at Dauntless, who seems to enjoy heated political arguments.

You present only bald, unsupported assertions and insults, no facts or sources. It's trolling more than anything. No one is impressed by your "in your face" attitude.

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Re: Madness. Why such slow penetration for hybrid?

Post by Chalo » Dec 13, 2017 4:21 am

solera ebiker wrote:
Dec 12, 2017 7:35 pm
Judge Roy Moore
1/2 hour to victory!
Noted
This is to express my gratitude to Justin of Grin Technologies for his extraordinary measures to save this forum for the benefit of all.

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Re: Madness. Why such slow penetration for hybrid?

Post by solera ebiker » Dec 13, 2017 2:13 pm

Chalo wrote:
Dec 13, 2017 4:21 am
solera ebiker wrote:
Dec 12, 2017 7:35 pm
Judge Roy Moore
1/2 hour to victory!
Noted
You should have made your statement on time. Buuuuzzzer, no goal!


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The train keeps rolling down the tracks......
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Re: Madness. Why such slow penetration for hybrid?

Post by neptronix » Dec 15, 2017 5:31 am

I am incredibly disappointed in the direction this thread went in.
I looked over 'solera ebiker's posts and just decided to nuke the guy. Nothing but inflammatory posts. A zero value member of the community. Actually, a negative value member of the community.

I left his posts because context would be lost without them.

Hopefully we can get back to a rational discussion here. Jesus... :roll:
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Re: Madness. Why such slow penetration for hybrid?

Post by Ecky » Dec 15, 2017 11:36 am

Glad you cleaned it up, thanks.

Thinking out loud here, one reason for limited adoption may have been price for lithium batteries? My limited knowledge on the topic suggests that NiMH, which was preferred until maybe 2011, can take high charge currents but has a whole host of other issues (self discharge, weight, voltage not correlated with SoC). In order to get the type of charge currents required to regen-brake small sedans and hatchbacks, lithium batteries needed to have significantly higher capacities, and had (have?) a higher cost-per-wh. A proportionately heavier vehicle would need a proportionally larger battery, while ICEs don't have the same cost scaling.

So, lithium chemistries are now becoming inexpensive enough for wide adoption. Batteries are larger-enough that it just makes sense to make the cars PEHVs, charging stations are starting to become more common...

Thoughts? What other factors might be larger contributors?

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Re: Madness. Why such slow penetration for hybrid?

Post by wturber » Dec 15, 2017 12:45 pm

neptronix wrote:
Dec 15, 2017 5:31 am

Hopefully we can get back to a rational discussion here. Jesus... :roll:
Folks need to learn not to feed the trolls. Yes, it is hard to resist the urge to respond, but ignoring them often works well.
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Re: Madness. Why such slow penetration for hybrid?

Post by Dauntless » Dec 16, 2017 1:14 am

Trolls as in plural in this case. They only got one of them. The others will continue to feed. If you don't respond they feel triumphant and just troll even more. The one probably has his more recognizable name to go back to. And so do trolls find their great fulfillment.

Si funny that the troll posts like a drunk getting thrown out of a bar and thinks that's alright, but tries desperately to find some fault with anyone else. Let alone me.
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Re: Madness. Why such slow penetration for hybrid?

Post by billvon » Dec 16, 2017 3:47 pm

Ecky wrote:
Dec 15, 2017 11:36 am
Batteries are larger-enough that it just makes sense to make the cars PEHVs, charging stations are starting to become more common...
In some areas. In San Diego there are now enough stations to make it possible to find a charger at least near wherever you are going to go. But in places like New York they are so rare as to be almost unusable.
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