An idea for creating our own tire database

General Discussion about electric bicycles.
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thunderstorm80   1 kW

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An idea for creating our own tire database

Post by thunderstorm80 » Jul 04 2017 6:37am

Hi,
During my persuit for a good tire for my e-bike, which would be flat-proof but also wide enough, I come into many opinions and speculations.
I am now mostly debated between the Marathon plus tour which is truly flatless but is quite narrow (28x1.75inch), requiring you to go to high pressures, vs the Big apple 28x2.35 which is much more comfortable and seems more smart for the much higher weight load (160-170Kg for a heavy loaded touring bike including the rider, motors and battery) - but it's puncture resistance experience is debated.

I thought - Why not create a database here, where everyone can add their own tires and/or add their own numbers regarding existing tire.
We can create a table for each tire where the addeable entries would be:
- Kilometers between punctures
- Rear/Front tire and what was the weight load on it
- Riding conditions (Road, Gravel, Off road or a combinations of those)
- Average temperature and quality of the roads where you live
- Geometry: What was the actual tire width and it's diameter and which rim you used
- Replaced after how many Kilometers

What do you think?
This can be very useful, to all of us!

Chefkeith   10 mW

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Re: An idea for creating our own tire database

Post by Chefkeith » Jul 05 2017 2:41am

Sounds awesome, as I too am in the market for a new set.

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MadRhino   100 GW

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Re: An idea for creating our own tire database

Post by MadRhino » Jul 05 2017 8:19pm

The problem with tires, is that none are good for everyone. One that you like, may be absolute crap for another rider who has a different bike, a different riding style, or just ride it on a different rim at a different PSI.

A Big Apple is a good example. I would not ride one if it was free, while many are willing to order them online, pay shipping and wait a week or two to have them. Tires are made to satisfy various requirements, and every rider has his own preferences or priorities. Some value grip, other value lifespan, weight, puncture protection, rolling resistance, noise, etc...
Make it fool-proof, and I will make a better fool.
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The Toecutter   10 kW

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Re: An idea for creating our own tire database

Post by The Toecutter » Jul 15 2017 2:46pm

For those of us to whom rolling resistance is a concern, I came across the following pdf:

http://www.biketechreview.com/tires_old ... g_rev9.pdf

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The Toecutter   10 kW

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Re: An idea for creating our own tire database

Post by The Toecutter » May 22 2019 4:50pm

Also, on the subject of this topic, the following link is VERY useful:

https://www.bicyclerollingresistance.com/

markz   100 GW

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Re: An idea for creating our own tire database

Post by markz » May 22 2019 6:48pm

Yeah a flatless tire would be great, just got a flat today and yet another thorn-proof tube is garbaged as the valve broke.

Since we are e-biking, then motorcycle rims, motorcycle tubes and motorcycle tires could be an alternative for some, while motorcycle tires and tubes may fight on a bicycle rim. The catalogue at the motorcycle stealership had lots of tires available, everything from D.O.T. to non D.O.T. rated.

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amberwolf   100 GW

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Re: An idea for creating our own tire database

Post by amberwolf » May 22 2019 8:02pm

markz wrote:
May 22 2019 6:48pm
yet another thorn-proof tube is garbaged as the valve broke.
Use them for liners.

Remove teh valve stem, slit the tube along the inner circumference, and place it on the outside of the tube you're actually using. Essentially more than doubles your tube thickness.

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The Toecutter   10 kW

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Re: An idea for creating our own tire database

Post by The Toecutter » May 22 2019 8:09pm

markz wrote:
May 22 2019 6:48pm
Yeah a flatless tire would be great, just got a flat today and yet another thorn-proof tube is garbaged as the valve broke.

Since we are e-biking, then motorcycle rims, motorcycle tubes and motorcycle tires could be an alternative for some, while motorcycle tires and tubes may fight on a bicycle rim. The catalogue at the motorcycle stealership had lots of tires available, everything from D.O.T. to non D.O.T. rated.
Are you aware of any low rolling resistance D.O.T. compliant motorcycle tires? So far my search for such a thing has come up with nothing. I need a CRR value below 0.008 in order to be able to pedal a bike using such monstrosities with the motor disabled. The closest thing I've found are certain models of the Schwalbe Energizer series tires for solar race cars, which aren't obtainable in the U.S.

The closest thing to a "flatless" bicycle tire out there that I am aware of is the Schwalbe Marathon Plus. I have a Marathon Plus Tour 26x1.5" on the rear wheel of my KMX trike and it has never gotten flat in more than 4,000 miles of use and its tread wear is barely noticeable. The Schwalbe Marathon Supreme 26x2" that I replaced has more than 10,000 miles on it, and it has never gotten flat once, and the tread is still good(it has poor traction in the rain and was replaced for that reason, because having to get out of the velomobile in traffic to pull it up an incline in the rain because the tire wouldn't grip got old fast). Up front, I use a set of 20x1.5" Schwalbe Marathon Greenguards and they've never gotten punctured either. I just replaced a set of Greenguards at 4,000 miles of use because while there was no actual wear in the tread pattern, there were cuts/gashes down to the greenguard layer.

The roads I've ridden on are littered with broken bottles, broken glass and metal shards from car wrecks, rocks, sticks, potholes, and everything else, and are not at all kind to normal bicycle tires.

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neptronix   100 GW

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Re: An idea for creating our own tire database

Post by neptronix » May 22 2019 8:10pm

If you wanna play with some motorcycle/scooter tires, check this thread where i did some sciences(tm)
https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewt ... =2&t=97992
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markz   100 GW

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Re: An idea for creating our own tire database

Post by markz » May 23 2019 1:27pm

AW - Yeah I use them for liners. Liners along with a Schwalbe Marathon tires would be decent protection for bicycle wheel sets.

Toes - The thing that is great about Schwalbe is that they put a rating system for their tires. There are even E-Bike rated bicycle tires. Well the point I guess I was trying to convey was that flipping through the catalogue at the motorcycle store, their are pages and pages full of various tires either D.O.T. or not.

A sleak tread for less rolling resistance, tpi for strength and durability (tread thickness), sidewall thickness, weight, unsprung weight on a motor that weighs X amount, trying to move around on a single track at speed vs cruising along in a casual manner.

----

I am just waiting for my battery to charge, but here are the categories for each type of rider.

Weight for some is not a big issue, in not trying to shave grams or 100's of grams, to me its a foolish game but many true Lycras are into it. Surprisingly enough its still a popular sport, and I do like to watch it, well the high-lites that is.

e-biking:
Not saying those that shave a motor down isn't a thing, its just specialized, and people have done it (Justin, a CR or two, probably even Net and Ypedal) and it does matter (unsprung weight) Having too heavy a hub motor, carrying up stairs, doing S turns on a single track, even transport whether on bicycle rack on vehicle or train transport.

Others prefer a certain look whether a small hub to hide behind the freewheel/cassette or Brake rotor.

Weekenders minimal assist for exercise on a setup to force them to pedal whether it be to under power the motor or pedal assist or both.

Casual user riding sat/sun with the 9C 1000W users.

This is where the tires we seek come into play:
1) Commuter riding every "good day" with a 1500W Leaf.
2) Everyday rider like me and lots of others on here.
3) Everyday commuter, "good days, in the winter and rain)
4) Motorcycle looking ebike which I would call "Enduro" which tends to be HP, atleast 1500W Leafs up to 5000W QS/MXUS and beyond.
5) High powered peeps, say 50kph/32mph
6) High High powered peeps that love to go 100 on a bicycle frame, I dont got the balls nor the nut sack to do that.
Addendum:
Frequent trails riders
Back country riders
Long distance riders

Me:
I prefer pathways, safe roads (residential and bike lanes, 50kph/30mph areas), easy trails
Used to love riding down steep hills and river riding before e-biking. I was biking down ski hills in the early 90's before it became a thing, also cut up old skool skis (thin skis, non parabolic skis) to make mini skis, Squid ski's out of snowboards way back in the day when they first came out. Squids were people that would always have their feet together, show off mentality type of skiing like under the chair lift, not practical for any skiing. Too expensive to ski these days.



Tires/Rims/Parts

Here is a website, based in 'Frisco - https://www.treatland.tv/new-puch-peuge ... s-s/88.htm

An article by Spinning Magnets
https://www.electricbike.com/moped-rims ... hubmotors/

One aspect I'd like to have is a tire with a thick sidewall, for some reason I get slits and I think its the V-brake pads, because its part of my routine to check the rim edges when replacing a tube. Heck one time, I had a front tire go flat, and rode 10km on it, and a block away from home the rim collapsed. :lol:

Ok ramble over :oops:


amberwolf wrote:
May 22 2019 8:02pm
.
The Toecutter wrote:
May 22 2019 8:09pm
.

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