My Sun Trip Bike, Back to Back Tandem Trike with Rowing Generator, Pedals, +Solar

Limezy said:
Now, I only have to find a way to display meteo forecast (wind and sun) on Google Earth ;)

There is a "clouds" layer available in Google Earth (left sidebar: Layers > Weather > Clouds). It appears to update regularly but I have no idea what kind of time delay it has. I looked around for additional weather data and found a few single-country specific KML/KMZ links but nothing that looked terribly useful.

Here's an elevation profile of the straight line connecting Lyon and Tehran. It looks like the most of the hill climbing still lies ahead.


Lyon-Tehran-elevation-profile.jpg
 
solarEbike said:
That rowing action is going to come in handy on the Black Sea. Deploying inflatable pontoons in 3, 2, 1...

I'm mildly annoyed that Justin and Anne Sophie have already used the "rowed"/road pun. Probably just as well I guess.
 
It seems like the plan is to camp out each evening in a field, park, etc. I wonder if Justin and Anne Sophie realize that they are camped right next to two homes that have two rather large solar arrays. :^)

(Actually, the building with the larger array in the lower left appears to be a work building of some kind - perhaps for a farm?

SunTrip_6-22_evening.jpg
 
I've recorded a video fly-through of their route so far.

[youtube]qtuCOC0ztkY[/youtube]

It starts in Le Bourget-du-Lac, near Chambéry, halfway between Lyon and Chamonix and continues through France, Switzerland and Italy to their last known location today, June 22. The recorded route includes the challenging ride coming into Chamonix described by JLE. Total distance is about 430 miles (700 km) according to the Spot device but the long update interval (5 or 10 minutes) means the track doesn't follow actual roads very well. It assumes straight lines between updates which also includes some longer intervals where the scheduled update failed due to weather, poor sky visibility, satellite network downtime, etc.

If you're not getting the full screen, 1080p glory and you have the bandwidth for it, try watching it on YouTube instead. Depending on your device, you may be able to speed up or slow down playback if the speed is not to your liking.

I think I've figured out Raf's strategy: follow [strike]an arc of the Great Circle[/strike] a straight line from Lyon to Guangzhou.


Raf-straight-line-clouds.jpg


I've added lines connecting Lyon-Guangzhou and Lyon-Tehran to the KMZ file I provided earlier. You can re-download it if you want to see them yourself.


Great-circle-arcs.jpg
 
Limezy said:
Hi Justin,
Thanks for this great insight !
This solar race is really crazy, the only thing I regret is the lack of information we get from the runners !

There is a private wechat group that the organizers setup so that all of us can stay in touch during the limited time when you're not either on the bike or handling basic logistics of finding accommodation, food, basic repairs etc. It would be neat if some of this was public since you'd get more of an insider view on people's challenges and decisions etc. Personally I'd love to share a lot more if only it was easier to hit our 200km average daily goal before 9pm!


I believe it has a great impact on the overall performances. At your high travelling speeds, a small mistake of 4-5 hours can lead to hundreds of kilometers losts on competitors ! Also, the road choosen has to be the result of a very complex mix : less kilometers, more sun, less vertical drop, big and flat road vs small but harsh path, risk taken on the mechanics... Please tell us more !

Oh, it's easy. I recently posted this picture on the wechat forum. You just need to avoid shadows ! ;)

Solar Cycle Routing.jpg


No but seriously, your questions here are super on point and front and center on everyone's mind and I'll share my own take on a lot of these details when I have a chance. What I've learned is that for sure the most important strategy for covering ground like those at the front is just to be on the bike for as many hours as possible between 7am - 9pm when you are allowed to ride. If you're able to ride (with or without the solar assist helping, and regardless of where the sun is at) for like 12 of those 14 hours, then even with an average speed of like 20-25 kph you'd be doing super well. In a race like this It is almost never a good strategy to stop and wait for the battery to be charged or the weather to improve, just keep rolling at every chance that you can, and take advantage of the sun when it's there.

If you don't get packed up from camping and breakfast until like 9-10am, and you take a couple 30-40 minute shopping breaks or side detours during the day (ie, me and AnSo!), then there's almost no chance to make the kind of mileage of those at the front.
 
justin_le said:
What I've learned is that for sure the most important strategy for covering ground like those at the front is just to be on the bike for as many hours as possible between 7am - 9pm when you are allowed to ride....
If you don't get packed up from camping and breakfast until like 9-10am, and you take a couple 30-40 minute shopping breaks or side detours during the day (ie, me and AnSo!), then there's almost no chance to make the kind of mileage of those at the front.

You are right, Justin
A video makes by another Suntriper (Gregory Lewyllie) showing what you must do on your Solar bike to win the suntrip. :lol:
[youtube]kmEtpSKEbCI[/youtube]

solarEbike said:
Here's an easier way: just download this KMZ file I created with all the live KML links and open in Google Earth.

Yeesss, thanks for this great job solarEbike. Do you know if there is also possibility to have weather forecast on google earth?
 
I suppose it was always on the cards... Team Grin have left the southern route to go further south. Looks like they won't be seeing any other riders for a long time.

Who'd have thought Justin would follow everyone else? Nobody.

Just them and their adventure, I like their style.
 
Snickers said:
justin_le said:
What I've learned is that for sure the most important strategy for covering ground like those at the front is just to be on the bike for as many hours as possible between 7am - 9pm when you are allowed to ride....
If you don't get packed up from camping and breakfast until like 9-10am, and you take a couple 30-40 minute shopping breaks or side detours during the day (ie, me and AnSo!), then there's almost no chance to make the kind of mileage of those at the front.

You are right, Justin
A video makes by another Suntriper (Gregory Lewyllie) showing what you must do on your Solar bike to win the suntrip. :lol:
[youtube]kmEtpSKEbCI[/youtube]

solarEbike said:
Here's an easier way: just download this KMZ file I created with all the live KML links and open in Google Earth.

Yeesss, thanks for this great job solarEbike.
 
Snickers said:
Do you know if there is also possibility to have weather forecast on google earth?

You're the second person to ask so I'll dive in a little deeper. My ideal weather forecast on Google Earth for solar bike touring would be something I could configure to show maybe 2, 4, 6, 12, 24, 48 and 72 hour sun/clouds/rain conditions and high/low temps depending on distance from my current location. To my knowledge, no such thing exists.

Google Earth used to have several weather options, including radar but they stopped working over time and a couple of years ago they dropped them entirely. My guess is that if Google couldn't find a way to license this kind of content then this is not an easy problem to solve. Or it just wasn't a priority for Google.

View attachment 2


The remaining "Clouds" layer is not a forecast but seems to show current conditions? It has decent coverage for the area we're interested in and is kind of neat for visualizing which riders are currently experiencing sunny conditions vs. overcast/rainy.

View attachment 1


Beyond that, the options are limited. A couple hours of searching various words for weather, KML, KMZ, GIS, Google Earth, etc. have yielded a few finds like this radar image for Slovenia. It looks like Youssef and Mohamed are about to get wet.

Slovenia radar.jpg


I've added 3 of these weather radar images to my KMZ file if you want to re-download They're turned off by default so you'll need to enable them yourself. If anyone finds other Google Earth resources, I can add them as well.
 
usertogo said:
Its a rather strange style... Participate in a race without even the intention to get to the goal? That's not really participating... Maybe the organizers were happy enough to oblige because it is another starting fee without even the cost of the return shipping of the vehicle (which is probably taken care of by a sponsor anyway). The truth is I am quite disappointed that they aren’t able to arrange their schedule to really run the distance!

Hang on. This is a 'race' and the goal of a race is to win, correct?
But the vast majority of the riders have no intention of winning, so are they participating?

Grin has committed their schedule (and big $$$) from beginning of April until end of July in a mammoth effort to create something the world has never seen, and ride it for weeks across lands they've never seen, speaking tongues they don't have. And you're dissapointed??

Flying home to get hitched is a far better ending than crossing a line.

Anyway, winners are grinners!!
 
Just over 1000kms! :mrgreen: woohoo! Where's guiness book when you need them? Maybe they'll be in iran??

They have company too!
In that video, Justin did say there were 3 teams taking the southern-most route.
 
I would be interested in the daily harvest of solar energy and the daily usage of energy for the motor drive,
 
usertogo said:
The truth is I am quite disappointed that they aren’t able to arrange their schedule to really run the distance!

I am mildly disappointed. But in the words of Steven Wright, "You can't have everything. Where would you put it?"
 
usertogo said:
Its a rather strange style... Participate in a race without even the intention to get to the goal? That's not really participating...
I beg to differ. I've done several relay triathlons where I did not cross the finish line; I would do the bike segment while two other team members did the swim and run. We were all participating.

Likewise, I've done local rides where there is a 50 mile option and a 100 mile option - often with different end points. Again, everyone was participating.
 
Team racing is old and venerable.....
How Cars—and Drivers—Survive the Brutal 24 Hours of Le Mans
Snip....The Human Element:
As impressive as the machines are, the humans piloting and preparing them arguably face the greater endurance challenge. All the teams at Le Mans field three drivers per car which, evenly spread out, is eight hours per driver of extreme g-forces and attention. Because Taylor is on a team with a gentleman driver–essentially a semi-professional–he’ll probably do closer to nine hours total, in stints that last 90 minutes to two hours......snip
https://www.wired.com/story/24-hours-le-mans-logistics/
 
@Solarbike, thanks again for your efforts making our following of the race way better than with the official tools :mrgreen:

usertogo said:
Its a rather strange style... Participate in a race without even the intention to get to the goal? That's not really participating [...] The truth is I am quite disappointed that they aren’t able to arrange their schedule to really run the distance!

I believe the problem here is to call the Suntrip a "race". Of course, a few dozen of inners are racing to be the first to cross the "finish" line, but it's much more than that. I would rather call it an "organized adventure sponsoring a new kind of mobility".
Some want to finish first. Others just want to finish in time (which is already quite an outstanding achievement). Others want to participate. I'm perfectly fine with that. Even if Justin will never cross the finish line, I'm pretty sure he will remain as one of the recognized figures of this 2018 edition, for his inventivity, sense of humor, technical support to all others...

usertogo said:
Maybe the organizers were happy enough to oblige because it is another starting fee without even the cost of the return shipping of the vehicle (which is probably taken care of by a sponsor anyway).

I'm pretty sure it's really far from that. First of all, I don't know the starting fee but considering how some runners are on a budget I'd guess it's quite low. Secondly, it doesn't look like Suntrip spirit at all.

The Suntrip, and the whole solar e-bike (even plain e-bikes) industry have a lot to gain from Justin's being one of the current runners. I'm pretty sure those 5000km+ he will do on his solar bike will eventually end up with new products / ideas such as his Solar CA, etc...

justin_le said:
No but seriously, your questions here are super on point and front and center on everyone's mind and I'll share my own take on a lot of these details when I have a chance.

@Justin could you please tell us more about your "south" option ? I have to admit that Raf's route looks easier (less mountains), more straight (less km lost), and I dont' get the point to go from south like Stephane and Eric, appart from having a bit more sun (which was not the case these last days...). Would be really interested to have your insight !
 
Snickers said:
You are right, Justin
A video makes by another Suntriper (Gregory Lewyllie) showing what you must do on your Solar bike to win the suntrip. :lol:

Yeah, Greg' did a great job on that video! There's a bit of a conflict since the Suntrip organizers want racers to explore and interact with locals on the way, but even to stay caught up with the middle of the pack requires a dedication to staying on the road. Minimal distractions that keep you from rolling forwards.



usertogo said:
Its a rather strange style... Participate in a race without even the intention to get to the goal? That's not really participating...
The truth is I am quite disappointed that they aren’t able to arrange their schedule to really run the distance!

I'm honestly disappointed too that the scheduling worked this way since I'd love nothing more than to ride it all the way into China, but we (me and AnSo) already had our wedding planned at the start of August and that's not something easily rearranged.

HOWEVER, my most sincere hope is that we can find a team to take over the vehicle once we're done our leg and who will then continue to ride and row it right to the finish line. That would be so great. I held off posting this publicly until we we sure that the machine was robust and viable and I think we're at that stage now. So usertogo, if you are really game to see it finish and can arrange your schedule for end of July to Sept, the option is there to help make it run the distance! ;)

The only complication is that we'll be leaving it in or around Tehran which has a more complicated Visa situation (esp for Americans, Canadians, and UK citizens). But if there is anyone reading this who could seriously consider making that arrangement or knows someone who'd love the experience, ideally as a 2 person team, then please get in touch with us. Maybe you wanted to do the Suntrip but couldn't get June/July free, but can have August off? I can be hopeful!

We have a flight booked from Tehran on July 22nd. The route through Turkey and Iran is not the most efficient since you'll then need to head north to avoid countries with trickier political situations, but it should be quite spectacular.
 
justin_le said:
The route through Turkey and Iran is not the most efficient since you'll then need to head north to avoid countries with trickier political situations, but it should be quite spectacular.

So why would two award candidates such as Eric and Stephane take that route ?
 
Limezy said:
So why would two award candidates such as Eric and Stephane take that route ?

Mr and Mrs Grin are heading on a different route to Eric and Stephane. If you zoom in on the map you'll see. God knows which turns who takes? Did the riders submit planned routes?? Can we see them??

I can't wait to get back to my big 'puta and proper google earth to see the terrain. Thanks for all that work Solarebike :D
 
Limezy said:
@Justin could you please tell us more about your "south" option ?

For me it was an progression from this

Justin: "Hey Anne-Sophie, I really want to this Suntrip solar ebike ride on a tandem bike with you next summer. We'll be riding mostly through eastern Europe and Russia.."
Anne-Sophie: "Meh, maybe I'll do just the first week in France with you and then hang out with my family"

To this

Justin: "Hey Anne-Sophie, I really want to do this Suntrip solar ebike ride on a tandem with you. We'll ride through southern europe, down through the Balkans, then travel across turkey and finally into Persia.."
Anne-Sophie: "I'm in!!"

I have to admit that Raf's route looks easier (less mountains), more straight (less km lost), and I dont' get the point to go from south like Stephane and Eric, appart from having a bit more sun (which was not the case these last days...).

I think Raf nailed it for sure on this one. Plus he's got one of the most optimized bike setups for the journey, super efficient 27% panels, combination of front and rear panels for much lower air drag than those of us with solar roofs, and he's a crazy strong competitor. Being able to ride few km more directly is definitely an advantage over hypothetically having more sun, especially if you have a bike setup that can be ridden quite handily even without electric assist.

For us going south out of Switzerland was about the next countries we get to pass through and because that's be best way to go truly south through Turkey. There are 3 other teams that are doing this as well, that includes the two French Viguier brothers who are just behind us (or maybe they've just passed us in Zagreb, since I'm now on the computer all morning instead of riding :shock: ), the Moroccan tandem with Youssef and Mohamed, and finally Waiwon Ching of eZee bike who didn't get a tracker and isn't really participating in the formal event (using charger at night etc).

You'll see the other teams who went south now heading more northerly well we'll be branching downwards.
Turkey Teams.jpg
 
Enjoy the incredible adventures my friend!
 
liveforphysics said:
Enjoy the incredible adventures my friend!

Thanks Luke! That we have been and will continue for the next 4 weeks, and will hopefully serve as encouragement for you're antarctic solar powered trip.

We're about 65km out of Zagreb in Croatia now, cloudy weather, stopped for a brief rest on the side of the road and then a local coffee shop owner came out to offer us a table, free drinks, snackfood, and unlimited wifi. :D So here I am.

Anyways for those curious about strategy, outside of riding as many hours as possible from 7am - 9pm, there's sooo many minor optimizations that are always on the back of one's mind.

Morning / Evening vs Noon Sun
When there are trees or building around, you can spend large amounts of time riding through shadows during the time when the sun lower on the horizon, while in the couple hours around Noon the sun is mostly directly overhead. So it makes full sense to be riding all the time around noon when the sun is above since you'll get the same solar input when moving or stopped. But in the evenings and mornings, you can get 3-4 times more average solar energy if you stop and point the panels right at the sun, compared to riding when they'll frequently be shaded or not optimally aligned. It's best to keep riding regardless, but if you ARE going to stop and do a solar recharge, it's best to time that for lower sun elevation and keep rolling when the sun is straight above.

East/West and North/South
This trip is mostly going eastwards, with the sun going east to west. So we only get to take advantage of the panel tilting when we are travelling in a northern or southern direction. The difference that this makes can be huge; when we were in Slovenia the other day we were still getting 350-400 watts in the evening when the road was either NE or SE, but when it was straight east, we'd only have about 200 watts. So if you have an option in the route plan, you'd want to do roads that contain a northern/southern travel direction in mornings or evenings, with the straight eastern roads around noon, if otherwise the distances are the same.

Actual route planning
Actually having a route plan with live maps and is a necessity to avoid all kinds of inefficient roads and navigation choices. This was the topic of great discussion amongst the various participants during the first days riding through france, and every imaginable navigation app seemed in play. As mentioned Google cycle routing is terrible for sending you down almost non-existant pathways. What would be most ideal is a route planner that selects the large roadways and highways that you're legally allowed to bike on, rather than the more scenic or low-traffic paths that are on most cycle touring suggestions.

We settled with Komoot after trying a few options.
https://www.komoot.com/
Anne-Sophie prepares trips in advance which we load on both our phones and a tablet, downloaded for offline viewing as well, and then during the ride we're frequently evaluating and sometimes changing this in response to road conditions as we roll. Usually the person in the front has the map in a high level of zoom to see all the imminent details with roundabouts, intersections etc., while the person rowing has the map zoomed much further out to look at the big picture. That's where we decide to override the suggested route if there's a more major roadway that still allows bicycles, it influences us whether it's worth tilting the solar roof for better sun exposure based on the average direction for the next many km or not, and it also lets us see the big picture elevation profile so that we can budget the battery accordingly.

Tandem setups have a big advantage here, I imagine if I was riding solo that I'd be very frequently stopping to double check route decisions and loosing some time that way, but in a tandem with a copilot there's no need to stop for this.
 
Justin, at Recumbent Cycle Con which is put on my Recumbent and Tandem Magazine, we has a presentation by Azub where we saw some pretty terrible road conditions in some of the area's you are going to be traveling in. Are the Solar Panels working out as well as you thought they would? Are there improvements you would make to the setup?

I think its great that you are sharing your great adventure with everyone.

Looking forward to your safe return!

Your buddy in Illinois,

Jason
 
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