Chaos 48v 1600w scooter upgrade / mods log

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Tj1990   10 mW

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Chaos 48v 1600w scooter upgrade / mods log

Post by Tj1990 » Jul 09 2018 2:27pm

Hi

Bought this scooter broke (chaos 1600w 48v) and i was told it needed new controller (but after testing with a multi metre it was just the throttle) and it's working now 😀But before I start upgrades such as lipos and better controller ect, Im having problems with motor getting very hot within a mile or so (58c) I've dropped the motor sprocket from 13t to 10t and still gets to 50c+ quickly I'm not sure if this is normal temps for 1600w boma motor. I'm using original sla batts, the gearing at the minute is 10 -54, any help would be much appreciated.


I've done afew things to the scooter since I've had it like fitted speedo, lights, motor temp gauge, battery % read out, volt metre, mtb rear brake calliper ,re wired everything and water proofed battery bay.

Will upload some pics asap

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fechter   100 GW

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Re: Chaos 48v 1600w scooter upgrade / mods log

Post by fechter » Jul 09 2018 2:39pm

See if you can post a picture of the scooter. Is the motor brushed or brushless?

Any idea what your top speed is with the present setup? Gearing lower will help with the motor heating but there might be some other problem. Most typical things are low tire pressure or dragging brakes.
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Tj1990   10 mW

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Re: Chaos 48v 1600w scooter upgrade / mods log

Post by Tj1990 » Jul 09 2018 2:58pm

Hi fechter

can upload pics tomorrow.

The motor is brushless but has no info on it and the scooter rolls freely with no resistance from brakes, tyre pressure is good. I'm currently getting 27mph on level ground.

Thanks for the reply
Todd

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Re: Chaos 48v 1600w scooter upgrade / mods log

Post by Tj1990 » Jul 10 2018 7:12am

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Sorry about picture quality I had to resize them to upload to here.

Tj1990   10 mW

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Re: Chaos 48v 1600w scooter upgrade / mods log

Post by Tj1990 » Jul 17 2018 8:16am

Temperary (cheap) fan cooling system that's working for now but abit noisy lol, I had afew broken mini drones about so I took a motor and propeller from 1 and a big plastic bottle abit of tinkering and it works and runs on 2 AA batts 😀. It's keeping my motor bellow 40c at the moment.

Ill look into a better solution for cooling, but for now this is working

Tj1990   10 mW

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Re: Chaos 48v 1600w scooter upgrade / mods log

Post by Tj1990 » Jul 17 2018 8:17am

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fechter   100 GW

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Re: Chaos 48v 1600w scooter upgrade / mods log

Post by fechter » Jul 17 2018 9:35am

Nice.

27mph is pretty fast and takes a lot of power to fight wind resistance, so your motor heating seems reasonable. The fan is the right idea but there may be better ways to implement. If the motor is brushless, most of the heat will be coming off the sides of the housing, so anything that gets air moving along the sides will help. The motor cover/rear fender does not look like it will help with air flow.

If you want to blow air through the motor end holes, a centrifugal type blower will be much more effective than an axial fan. With old style brushed motors, this was much more effective than cooling the outside housing since the copper was not in contact with the housing. With a brushless inrunner motor, you might do well by just blowing air over the outside of the motor, but if you can get a lot of air moving through the stator, it will be even better.

40C isn't bad at all. I would start to worry around 60C.
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Re: Chaos 48v 1600w scooter upgrade / mods log

Post by Tj1990 » Jul 17 2018 1:47pm

Thanks for the advise

I think I'm going to try some kind of heat sink material to go around the motor and different fan to blow through the side plate, i was thinking of attaching a rubber pipe/ pipes to a centrifugal fan going to the vent holes on the motor side plate but that's just an idea lol

I'm ordering 4 4s lipos soon, I'll use it 12s at 1st then add the extra battery when I get a better controller, I'm guessing motor temperature is going to be a issue with more volts/ Amps but we will see

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fechter   100 GW

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Re: Chaos 48v 1600w scooter upgrade / mods log

Post by fechter » Jul 17 2018 1:57pm

Here's a picture of my old brushed motor with flow through cooling. On the opposite side it just has 8 holes that look like yours.
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The blower was a 24v centrifugal blower which can move a lot of air though a fairly small hole. A small dc-dc converter powered the blower.
blowerAssembly.JPG
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Cooling fins on the outside of your motor will help a lot, especially if you get some good air flow. For external fins, you can use a more common axial fan instead of a blower.
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Tj1990   10 mW

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Re: Chaos 48v 1600w scooter upgrade / mods log

Post by Tj1990 » Jul 17 2018 3:20pm

Very nice mate

That looks similar to what I was thinking, I already have a dc-dc converter that I bought for my other scooter but never used I just need to get the other bits: centrafugal blower, rubber hoses and some kind of threaded pluming nipple so I can just put threads on the vent holes to fit for the pipes.

Then I'll fit heat sink with a fan if temps gets too high on 16s.

Thanks for your input fechter, much appreciated

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Re: Chaos 48v 1600w scooter upgrade / mods log

Post by fechter » Jul 18 2018 8:33am

I used some short pieces of copper pipe and just used epoxy to stick them on for the hose nipples (what I had in the junk box at the time).

You want to maintain the largest diameter that's practical in the hose and fittings. When the blower is running, you want to be able to feel a good breeze coming out of the exhaust end.
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Re: Chaos 48v 1600w scooter upgrade / mods log

Post by Tj1990 » Jul 18 2018 2:34pm

Thanks for the advice mate, I can only feel a slight breeze with my drone cooler lol but that will change when the new 12v blower arrives in the next few days 😀.

Il add some pics when I've done all the pipe work, just got to figure out where it's all gunna go lol

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Re: Chaos 48v 1600w scooter upgrade / mods log

Post by fechter » Jul 19 2018 9:56am

You really want it to feel like a hair dryer on high. On my scooter, the blower fit in the battery compartment which also helped keep dirt and rain away from the intake.
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Re: Chaos 48v 1600w scooter upgrade / mods log

Post by drc » Jul 30 2018 4:40pm

Looking good Todd, keep up the good work. im running 10-54 on my Chaos 48v scooter and it gets warm but not to hot that you cant touch it. Im a fat sod and this gearing worked out fine for me so i would say don't worry about it. To help air flow remove the motor end case and pull out the wire mesh and enlarge the holes this might help a bit but i cant see you having any issues with it as it is. IMO

My advice is to ditch the SLAs and go LIPO you will be shocked on the difference. its a plug and play solution. i take it your aiming for 16/ 20s? so why not buy 3 x 4s 16000mah multistar packs for now as you can wire these up to the stock controller with no issue! then when you have a new controller you can by more 4s packs and then you can over volt the boma motor as much as you like. Then when you are ready or have killed the Boma you can get an new motor.
these seem to be good and come recommended to me...................https://alienpowersystem.com/shop/brush ... 0kv-6000w/


Im told it can take many more volts and amps (im going to run 82v up to 80Amps with mine (EG please correct the Amps if i'm wrong), gives up to 2.5/3 times as much torque as the 1600w boma motor and is smaller too ! so if it can move my fat ass to 45-50mph which will be frightening im sure this would do you well?

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Re: Chaos 48v 1600w scooter upgrade / mods log

Post by Tj1990 » Jul 31 2018 3:45pm

Thanks Dan

My motor gets that hot I can't touch it lol it recently got to 60c+

My plan is to get the motor to run at a reasonable temp before I put the lipos in, I'm fitting a blower type fan with rubber tubing going into the side of the motor casing (waiting for parts still) hopefully this will help.

Il be running 12s by the end of next month, ordering 3 4s 16000mah multistars 😀

I see afew people on here using them alien motors with great results so I think thats what I'll be upgrading to when my motor dies.

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Re: Chaos 48v 1600w scooter upgrade / mods log

Post by Ree95 » Jan 10 2019 2:28pm

Hi can you help I've got the chaos sport 48v 1000w which stopped working, when the charger is plugged in the battery level goes up to full straight away when it's taken off goes back down to low battery and the scooter don't move all lights come on, thankyou

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Re: Chaos 48v 1600w scooter upgrade / mods log

Post by amberwolf » Jan 10 2019 3:39pm

Sounds like the battery needs to be replaced. It's probably SLA in there right now, and those dont' last long (especially if left discharged for any length of time). You can just replace them with new SLA of the same type, or you can go thru like in this thread and others and replace with Lithium of one type or another, which will give better performance and last longer, but will probably be more expensive to start with.


If it's already lithium, then the BMS in the battery has probably shut off the input to protect you from a fire due to damaged or defective cells. You would have to open the battery and measure the voltage of each cell or cell group in that case, and list them in your post, from most negative to most positive, so we can help you figure out if it is possible to repair, or worth it, or better to get a new battery.

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Re: Chaos 48v 1600w scooter upgrade / mods log

Post by Ree95 » Jan 10 2019 4:38pm

Okay thankyou for the help, will do that and then hopefully someone will know, thankyou

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Re: Chaos 48v 1600w scooter upgrade / mods log

Post by Ree95 » Jan 10 2019 6:48pm

Battries are okay, it could only be the controller now or the throttle, motor is okay

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Re: Chaos 48v 1600w scooter upgrade / mods log

Post by amberwolf » Jan 10 2019 8:28pm

When you say "the batteries are ok", exactly what tests were done to verify this? Are the batteries SLA or lithium? What voltages are they at without the charger connected, and what voltages are they at while it is?

I ask because the symptoms you give would be a battery issue, if the battery was discharged during a ride, then the system stopped working during the ride, then the charger won't actually charge the batteries after the ride.

If the problem you are having is not what is described above, you should give an exact step by step description of what happened and when, and any behavior that was different from previous behavior, leading up to the problem.

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fechter   100 GW

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Re: Chaos 48v 1600w scooter upgrade / mods log

Post by fechter » Jan 11 2019 12:44am

What can happen is the batteries come up to a good voltage and stay there with no load OK but as soon as you hit the throttle, the voltage drops so much it causes the controller to cut off and reset. So it might look like the batteries are OK with no load but they can be bad under load.

Try to find a voltmeter you can measure the battery voltage with while giving it some throttle.
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Re: Chaos 48v 1600w scooter upgrade / mods log

Post by Ree95 » Jan 11 2019 3:07pm

Yeah it seems like that as when I twist the throttle the battery level does go down then when I lose it the level goes back up so seems it's the battery but I'll get a voltage meter in the next few days to make sure

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Re: Chaos 48v 1600w scooter upgrade / mods log

Post by fechter » Jan 11 2019 4:12pm

Do you know what kind of batteries they are?

With lead-acid batteries, you might improve them by doing an extended charge, like several days.
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Re: Chaos 48v 1600w scooter upgrade / mods log

Post by Ree95 » Jan 11 2019 5:00pm

Yeah lead acid batteries, (6-DZM-12) so just keep the scooter on charge for how long? Thanks

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Re: Chaos 48v 1600w scooter upgrade / mods log

Post by Ree95 » Jan 12 2019 11:12am

I've left it on now, the battery shows full now when charger is taken out, before when I pressed the brake and the light came on the level went down then when I loosed the brake it went back up, it stops full now but if I push it and twist the throttle it seems to go down and then back up, can't do anything really untill I get a multimeter, any suggestions what I can do in the mean time? Thanks

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