Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

fechter said:
Rix said:
So if one was to say the effective range of the SurRon is between 20 and 50 miles, that would be an accurate statement.

That sounds about right to me. If I ride on the street mostly full throttle I can get somewhere between 25-30 miles range. If I kept the speed down to under 15mph, I'm sure it would go a lot further, but that's usually no fun.

I think that's how Jay managed to do it, even though I can't fathom how he had the discipline to not wack the throttle.
 
My fastace suspension is sucking. Bottoms out now. I'm a total newb at it. What are the recommended settings for someone around 190lbs? Seems like I am getting way too much sag. If I pump the top chamber to 75 psi, I only get two inches of travel. I have rebound set up to middle and the bottom right to the middle between hard and soft.
 
dirkdiggler said:
My fastace suspension is sucking. Bottoms out now. I'm a total newb at it. What are the recommended settings for someone around 190lbs? Seems like I am getting way too much sag. If I pump the top chamber to 75 psi, I only get two inches of travel. I have rebound set up to middle and the bottom right to the middle between hard and soft.

do you have the suspension manual ..
https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=28&t=89902&p=1369141#p1369141
 
dirkdiggler said:
Yeah, read through that. Not much info or recommended settings.

where did you get the bike, any warranty on the fork ?? maybe its leaking..
(i would probably start saving up for a coil sprung fork:(

maybe pm rix, motomoto, or aebikes they have/had the fastace air fork..
https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=28&t=89902&start=700#p1369264
 
Thanks for the link! Exactly what I was looking for. I will start at those settings. Motomoto recommended 70psi on the bottom and 40 up top.
 
3DTOPO said:
pipeking said:
3DTOPO said:
Well as you point out the primary is a belt drive and I have had absolutely no problems with it and all I ride is off-road.

As to why dirt bikes have chains, I suppose it's for a number of reasons. Chains can handle mud much better and can be a couple percent more efficient than belt-drives. One of the primary benefits of going with belt drive is it is much quieter, but I am sure that isn't a concern on IC bikes since you can't hear the chain over the engine.

Uh well, I have. Had problems with my primary drive getting packed with mud and whining... you think a belt is quiet? wait til the pulley gets packed with mud.

Did you see the photo Adam put up of the wear on his primary drive gears from dirt? I did. He upgraded to a primary chain drive because he is doing proper off road stuff...

Na honestly as the dirt bike guys, they don't use belt drive on any motocrosser

Belt snaps when your miles from home, your walking. Chain, and you just use your spare link (always got one, taped to bars)

You raise some good points. It wouldn't be very difficult to carry a spare belt but would be a huge PITA to change on the trail compared to putting a new masterlink on (which I also carry with me).

I did get my Sur Ron early enough last Spring to ride under wet conditions, and while the ground was wet, it was never sloppy muddy. For where I live that is about as muddy as it gets and I never had a problem with the primary belt.

That said, if the primary belt did fail on me now - that would be a potentially very long walk home! I haven't been carrying a spare belt with me, and I am guessing that one would be even more a PITA to change on the trail. For that reason, I think I will consider converting the primary to chain too. Do you know where it is available? As a bonus, it might run a couple percent more efficient too.

I know that Adam from AE Bikes (AEBrennan I think he is on here) got one, I think I will be looking to change too. I know its going to be noisier but I looked into the drive gears today with a torch and mine are looking quite pitted up and worn already. I did a ride through a bunch of early spring melt hills and loaded my tail end with mud, the wheel was spinning so much to keep my speed going it was awesome fun with huge rooster tails but the mud in the primary drive was a major concern...

I also have range fatigue.. I want to extend the range a bit and have been wondering if a smaller, say 48V battery in a back pack could be plugged in as a piggy back? something like this: https://www.trademe.co.nz/sports/cycling/other/listing-1812224097.htm?rsqid=2a2c48c4d753403999e456e1b1621bd5

or similar? but something that can be easily carried or even piggy backed onto the bike somewhere ..

will they be upgrading the battery maybe for better range?
 
fechter said:
Rix said:
So if one was to say the effective range of the SurRon is between 20 and 50 miles, that would be an accurate statement.

That sounds about right to me. If I ride on the street mostly full throttle I can get somewhere between 25-30 miles range. If I kept the speed down to under 15mph, I'm sure it would go a lot further, but that's usually no fun.

30 miles is like 48 Km, theres no way I could get 48km out of mine riding full throttle on the road. Maybe 35km (21miles)

Do you think maybe my battery or motor could be a little suss?
 
pipeking said:
fechter said:
Rix said:
So if one was to say the effective range of the SurRon is between 20 and 50 miles, that would be an accurate statement.

That sounds about right to me. If I ride on the street mostly full throttle I can get somewhere between 25-30 miles range. If I kept the speed down to under 15mph, I'm sure it would go a lot further, but that's usually no fun.

30 miles is like 48 Km, theres no way I could get 48km out of mine riding full throttle on the road. Maybe 35km (21miles)

Do you think maybe my battery or motor could be a little suss?

Personally, I think for going near full throttle your claim is much more realistic than 48km.

Edit: if it is pulling 3KW at 56km/h (35mph) - If I read the dyno data posted by motomoto correct, that would mean you would get 37.5km (23.3 miles) from the 2kw/h battery at that speed (running it down to 0% charge). Also, that is the power measured at the wheel, so I suppose that doesn't take into account power lost from converting electrons into motion.
 
pipeking said:
or rider weight?

Well based on my math in the post above; it seems physically impossible for the bike to do 48km at 56km/h mph - regardless of the rider. 32km is much closer fit.
 
pipeking said:
fechter said:
Rix said:
So if one was to say the effective range of the SurRon is between 20 and 50 miles, that would be an accurate statement.

That sounds about right to me. If I ride on the street mostly full throttle I can get somewhere between 25-30 miles range. If I kept the speed down to under 15mph, I'm sure it would go a lot further, but that's usually no fun.

30 miles is like 48 Km, theres no way I could get 48km out of mine riding full throttle on the road. Maybe 35km (21miles)

Do you think maybe my battery or motor could be a little suss?

I don't think your battery or motor has any issues. And yah, you are not going to get 48Km at full throttle, but I bet you can do better than that in ECO mode and speed restricted to 30Km/h. Thats how Hyena got the range he did. Limiting speed and eco mode.
 
Tire pressure will make some difference. I've done a couple of over 20mi rides at mostly full throttle and still had like 30% remaining on the gauge. My tires are a bit smoother than the stock knobbies too.
 
fechter said:
Tire pressure will make some difference. I've done a couple of over 20mi rides at mostly full throttle and still had like 30% remaining on the gauge. My tires are a bit smoother than the stock knobbies too.

30% sounds like quite a bit of battery left, but at that rate, you had another ~3 miles before it would go into forced EP mode for a bit until it hit forced cripple-home mode. :wink:
 
I'll have to try running it until it hits the forced EP mode and see what I get.

My sons were home for a visit over the weekend and I let them have a test ride. Talk about an EV grin. One who rides a regular motorcycle said it was the most fun he's had on two wheels for years. The other one came back and his face was all red. All he could say was it's pretty cool.
 
fechter said:
I'll have to try running it until it hits the forced EP mode and see what I get.

My sons were home for a visit over the weekend and I let them have a test ride. Talk about an EV grin. One who rides a regular motorcycle said it was the most fun he's had on two wheels for years. The other one came back and his face was all red. All he could say was it's pretty cool.

Now you have to get two really expensive X-mas gifts for them!
 
I didn't really care for the stickers that came with the bike, so didn't install them. I came up with an alternative of my own.

View attachment 1

Now the battery looks like something that belongs to the Cat P-5000 power loader from Aliens.

The yellow is highly reflective and really adds visibility at night.

I also added rear-view mirrors, which are a bit hard to see in the picture. These are cheap eBay one but seem to work quite well and came with clamps that go on the handlebars. They have ball joints on both ends of the stalk so should make them harder to bend/break.

So now it has or at least appears to have most of the required safety equipment for street use.

Img_0930.jpg
 
macribs said:
Is that a license plate under the seat fechter, street legal now?

Yes, street legal. Or at least close enough that the cops shouldn't bother me. Under CA law, it's classified as a moped which is limited to 30mph max speed. In EP mode, it does this. My EP/Sport mode switch is now disguised as the headlight dimmer switch.
 
fechter said:
I didn't really care for the stickers that came with the bike, so didn't install them. I came up with an alternative of my own.

Img_0927.jpg

Now the battery looks like something that belongs to the Cat P-5000 power loader from Aliens.

The yellow is highly reflective and really adds visibility at night.

I also added rear-view mirrors, which are a bit hard to see in the picture. These are cheap eBay one but seem to work quite well and came with clamps that go on the handlebars. They have ball joints on both ends of the stalk so should make them harder to bend/break.

So now it has or at least appears to have most of the required safety equipment for street use.

Img_0930.jpg

awesome thats classic cat p-5000

so has anyone worked out how to extend the range battery wise yet??

We had some guys keen to invest thousands in these bikes, the deal breaker seems to be the range... they were going to use them for a bike tour business in Queenstown.

I thought we could get better range out of the sine wave controller (with regen) but still yet to see one of those, so its hard to say. Now I hear they aren't as reliable either, with a few failures already apparently.

Shame, but it is a fun little toy :mrgreen:
 
pipeking said:
so has anyone worked out how to extend the range battery wise yet??

We had some guys keen to invest thousands in these bikes, the deal breaker seems to be the range... they were going to use them for a bike tour business in Queenstown.

I thought we could get better range out of the sine wave controller (with regen) but still yet to see one of those, so its hard to say. Now I hear they aren't as reliable either, with a few failures already apparently.

Shame, but it is a fun little toy :mrgreen:

The physics is pretty straightforward. Slower speed or bigger battery are your two main options. Since the battery can be quickly swapped out, you can do a fast "recharge" with a spare pack. Limiting the speed is easy enough but not so fun. Street tires with high pressure will also help (if on pavement). The efficiency gain from a sine wave controller is pretty small. Tires will make more difference.
 
Just need to find some electric trolly lines and throw a fishing pole in the air! instant range extender
1200px-Portland_Streetcar_B-Loop_car_on_Broadway_Bridge_%282016%29.jpg
 
Allex said:
You can re-cell the packs with better cells, Sanyo GA cells have same performance as stock Panasonic PF but you get 37Ah instead of 32
how difficult to swap the cells ? are they all spot welded ?
 
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