Controller to limit PAS to 25kmh, Throttle unlimited

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hias9   10 W

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Controller to limit PAS to 25kmh, Throttle unlimited

Post by hias9 » Feb 06 2019 12:47pm

Is there any controller (for lower power ebikes) which is capable of limiting speed to 25kmh when only PAS is active?
When the throttle is engaged, the speed should not be limited at all.

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amberwolf   100 GW

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Re: Controller to limit PAS to 25kmh, Throttle unlimited

Post by amberwolf » Feb 06 2019 6:40pm

If you're using a Cycle Analyst v3 to interpret PAS and Throttle for a controller, I believe it has this option.

I don't know what controllers have it built-in.

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Re: Controller to limit PAS to 25kmh, Throttle unlimited

Post by zeccato » Feb 07 2019 5:05pm

hias9 wrote:
Feb 06 2019 12:47pm
Is there any controller (for lower power ebikes) which is capable of limiting speed to 25kmh when only PAS is active?
When the throttle is engaged, the speed should not be limited at all.
(for lower power ebikes) I'm not sure, but I see that you adjust the power and speed: on an em3ev controller ( EB3 12 FET IRFB4110 ) I soldered the 3 pas wires directly into the board, and I adjusted the speed pas (30%, maybe about 22km/h) through the usb software.

The throttle remains at 100%, of which:
for the start as soft start I use the 3 positions button,
(if I use a lot of power, to protect the gears).
Full susp. folding 20 swxh r. (2011),. batt. 48v. 25A Life (2012), and 48 7,5A a123 (2018?). Controller programmable EB3 12 FET. Charger Balancer 14s: TP1430C. Mercury (rarely). Buzzer.https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source= ... 6dXxc9-lNW

hias9   10 W

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Re: Controller to limit PAS to 25kmh, Throttle unlimited

Post by hias9 » Feb 07 2019 7:21pm

I think by just limiting the power, the motor would still be assisting above 25kmh (for example when pedaling or downhill).
The idea is the following:
To be legal there is no motor assistance at all allowed above 25kmh (at least in Germany). So PAS should work in a street legal way. Throttle would be hidden and should not be affected by the speed limit :wink:

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Re: Controller to limit PAS to 25kmh, Throttle unlimited

Post by amberwolf » Feb 07 2019 7:35pm

BTW, even if the CA does not have a way to limit the speeds separately, you cna just wire it so the throttle doesn't go thru the CA, but goes directly to the controller, paralleled (via diodes) with the CA's throttle output. Then the CA can limit the PAS in whatever way you like, while the throttle just directly does what you do with it.

hias9   10 W

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Re: Controller to limit PAS to 25kmh, Throttle unlimited

Post by hias9 » Feb 07 2019 7:54pm

Nice idea. Thanks!
I would prefer to not use a CA display to keep it stealth, but it seems like there is no other way.

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Re: Controller to limit PAS to 25kmh, Throttle unlimited

Post by zeccato » Feb 07 2019 8:23pm

hias9 wrote:
Feb 07 2019 7:21pm
I think by just limiting the power, the motor would still be assisting above 25kmh (for example when pedaling or downhill).
The idea is the following:
To be legal there is no motor assistance at all allowed above 25kmh (at least in Germany). So PAS should work in a street legal way. Throttle would be hidden and should not be affected by the speed limit :wink:
I insist:
not all controllers are the same,
My speed is limiting, I've tried,
when it reaches 22kmh, the controller no longer delivers power (not assistance),
even when empty (without load),
informed: it seems that this controller
lowers too W. and V.
The Throttle is not be affected by the speed limit and W. of the pas.

When I discovered, i was satisfied,
because in my country, too, he's forcing the 25kmh* pas.

I haven't measured the W. at the start yet,
which depends on what's programmed in the total.

I had a programmable GM controller I think that maybe did not limit the speed.
Full susp. folding 20 swxh r. (2011),. batt. 48v. 25A Life (2012), and 48 7,5A a123 (2018?). Controller programmable EB3 12 FET. Charger Balancer 14s: TP1430C. Mercury (rarely). Buzzer.https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source= ... 6dXxc9-lNW

zeccato   10 mW

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Re: Controller to limit PAS to 25kmh, Throttle unlimited

Post by zeccato » Feb 07 2019 9:11pm

amberwolf wrote:
Feb 07 2019 7:35pm
BTW, even if the CA does not have a way to limit the speeds separately, you cna just wire it so the throttle doesn't go thru the CA, but goes directly to the controller, paralleled (via diodes) with the CA's throttle output. Then the CA can limit the PAS in whatever way you like, while the throttle just directly does what you do with it.
I think that if you can change on the fly (quickly) the programming via a display is not legal anyway.
Full susp. folding 20 swxh r. (2011),. batt. 48v. 25A Life (2012), and 48 7,5A a123 (2018?). Controller programmable EB3 12 FET. Charger Balancer 14s: TP1430C. Mercury (rarely). Buzzer.https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source= ... 6dXxc9-lNW

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Re: Controller to limit PAS to 25kmh, Throttle unlimited

Post by amberwolf » Feb 07 2019 9:30pm

hias9 wrote:
Feb 07 2019 7:54pm

I would prefer to not use a CA display to keep it stealth, but it seems like there is no other way.
I'm sure there's controllers out there, like Zeccato's, that limit like you want. You may just have to keep poking around for a while.

The CA doesn't have to be on the handlebars; you can install it anywhere you like, including in a bag or battery case, etc. If you have the USB cable to program it with, you don't even need the LCD, so it could be removed, making the actual CA PCB inside really small and easy to place inside something else.

hias9   10 W

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Re: Controller to limit PAS to 25kmh, Throttle unlimited

Post by hias9 » Feb 08 2019 4:02am

@zeccato: So you can set the speed limit independently for PAS and throttle for those EB3 controllers?

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Re: Controller to limit PAS to 25kmh, Throttle unlimited

Post by zeccato » Feb 08 2019 4:24am

hias9 wrote:
Feb 08 2019 4:02am
@zeccato: So you can set the speed limit independently for PAS and throttle for those EB3 controllers?
That's right.

Then I think you have to keep in mind how much W and speed you program with the throttle, and the pass adjusts separately up to a reduction of 30%, and up to 1500W peak (max 30A motor phase) 50kmh I think there are no problems.
Remember, you have to solder the wires pas (1 wire?) here:
https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewt ... 4#p1440254
Full susp. folding 20 swxh r. (2011),. batt. 48v. 25A Life (2012), and 48 7,5A a123 (2018?). Controller programmable EB3 12 FET. Charger Balancer 14s: TP1430C. Mercury (rarely). Buzzer.https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source= ... 6dXxc9-lNW

hias9   10 W

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Re: Controller to limit PAS to 25kmh, Throttle unlimited

Post by hias9 » Feb 08 2019 11:33am

Thanks. Let‘s say the throttle would be set to 2000W peak and 60kmh max.
If reduction is set to 30%, power would be 1400W peak and 42kmh max for the PAS?
Or can it go down to 30% of the throttle values? (600W, 18kmh)

zeccato   10 mW

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Re: Controller to limit PAS to 25kmh, Throttle unlimited

Post by zeccato » Feb 08 2019 3:04pm

The configuration of 48v. 16s life, 30A motor phase and 10A continuous, with swhx 24v. (2011) = 50kmh throttle,
30% pas = about 22kmh, and it gets softer, (and you can program a start delay to the pas).

over 2000W with 25A continuous I broke the gears, and I don't know how far the pas gets, maybe 30kmh?
or less?.

tomorrow I measure w and speed.

keep in mind that this controller gives double the
of power when compared to my old gm v2 48v 30a 50A peak,
at 25A 55 fase motor: it reared up, (too powerful for swxh).
Full susp. folding 20 swxh r. (2011),. batt. 48v. 25A Life (2012), and 48 7,5A a123 (2018?). Controller programmable EB3 12 FET. Charger Balancer 14s: TP1430C. Mercury (rarely). Buzzer.https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source= ... 6dXxc9-lNW

zeccato   10 mW

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Re: Controller to limit PAS to 25kmh, Throttle unlimited

Post by zeccato » Feb 09 2019 12:03pm

My mention of the 22km/h is wrong,

Today I measured max 15-16km/h of the pas,
with about 100-180W continuous, and 250-299W peak,
once per half a second was 390W.

The throttle was 1200 peak.

I think that with 2000W of thottle, you can get the pas to go at 25km/h (+ 3% allowed by law? = 27-28km/h legal).
Full susp. folding 20 swxh r. (2011),. batt. 48v. 25A Life (2012), and 48 7,5A a123 (2018?). Controller programmable EB3 12 FET. Charger Balancer 14s: TP1430C. Mercury (rarely). Buzzer.https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source= ... 6dXxc9-lNW

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Re: Controller to limit PAS to 25kmh, Throttle unlimited

Post by casainho » Feb 11 2019 1:51pm

hias9 wrote:
Feb 06 2019 12:47pm
Is there any controller (for lower power ebikes) which is capable of limiting speed to 25kmh when only PAS is active?
When the throttle is engaged, the speed should not be limited at all.
Use the KT motor controllers with our flexible OpenSource Firmware, were you have all the configurations possible.
Developer of the Flexible OpenSource firmware for EBike motor controllers (TSDZ2 and KT) and LCDs (KT-LCD3 and Bafang 850C color LCD).

If you like my work, please consider making a donation. I am being using the donations to buy needed resources for my developments. My paypal: casainho AT gmail.com.

hias9   10 W

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Re: Controller to limit PAS to 25kmh, Throttle unlimited

Post by hias9 » Feb 12 2019 5:57am

I just took a look at the documentation. Thanks a lot for the awesome work!

I see that it would be possible for example to limit throttle to 20kmh (parameter „no PAS“) and leave PAS unlimited.
But how do I have to set the parameters to limit PAS to 25kmh and leave the throttle unlimited?

zeccato   10 mW

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Re: Controller to limit PAS to 25kmh, Throttle unlimited

Post by zeccato » Feb 19 2019 4:59am

hias9 wrote:
Feb 06 2019 12:47pm
Is there any controller (for lower power ebikes) which is capable of limiting speed to 25kmh when only PAS is active?
When the throttle is engaged, the speed should not be limited at all.
I think a second (which I mentioned) controller that does what you want: it's the Nucular.
Full susp. folding 20 swxh r. (2011),. batt. 48v. 25A Life (2012), and 48 7,5A a123 (2018?). Controller programmable EB3 12 FET. Charger Balancer 14s: TP1430C. Mercury (rarely). Buzzer.https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source= ... 6dXxc9-lNW

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