PV NextGen FOC 100-180v 36kw max - $799
- Thread starter Powervelocity.com
- Start date
Powervelocity.com
100 kW
This is exactly the point. If you worry about crashing your phone, there are at least two solutions:
1. Don't crash. Frankly, when I crash hard, the phone is my least worry.
2. If you like to crash, get a $25 phone (and a good helmet). Mount it permanently, or carry it in your pocket (another security feature - think of it like a face panel on a stereo, especially, now that the new BT modules support keyless start via phone).
The big value in having a phone-based dash is it's updateability and connectivity. The UI can be refreshed new features added with ease just via software update. Integration with navigation, cloud. The sky is limit. Try to do that with a dumb display.
1. Don't crash. Frankly, when I crash hard, the phone is my least worry.
2. If you like to crash, get a $25 phone (and a good helmet). Mount it permanently, or carry it in your pocket (another security feature - think of it like a face panel on a stereo, especially, now that the new BT modules support keyless start via phone).
The big value in having a phone-based dash is it's updateability and connectivity. The UI can be refreshed new features added with ease just via software update. Integration with navigation, cloud. The sky is limit. Try to do that with a dumb display.
MJSfoto1956 said:
icherouveim
1 kW
Hello again,
I think the decision is made, even if we give 100 advices for a better product we cannot change their plans.
The future will show if it will be a good or a bad controller.
I don't know how the new system will work but if it will be like the old controller then it won't be very innovating. For example with the old controller just to change OVS setting you have to reflash eeprome thru the phone every time you change it and then to restart the controller!!
It doesn't work in real time like with nucular and adaptto controllers.
I think the decision is made, even if we give 100 advices for a better product we cannot change their plans.
The future will show if it will be a good or a bad controller.
I don't know how the new system will work but if it will be like the old controller then it won't be very innovating. For example with the old controller just to change OVS setting you have to reflash eeprome thru the phone every time you change it and then to restart the controller!!
It doesn't work in real time like with nucular and adaptto controllers.
Powervelocity.com
100 kW
Advice is appreciated and decisions are subject to change. No worries though, it will be great.
John in CR
100 TW
What motors has this been tested on? Any low inductance high Kv hubbies?
Powervelocity.com
100 kW
Yes, works will all kinds of motors including low inductance.
John in CR said:
TorgueRPM
100 W
It's awesome to see VESC software in an Ebike controller
ElectricGod
10 MW
This controller will be pretty impressive.
It will use the PV app...which has seen tons of development. IMHO, it's the best EV app there is and there's new development coming all the time!
If you don't know about the app...
1. Dashboard that shows all the important stuff like speed, watts, amps, voltage, miles, temps, etc.
2. GPS app...enter where you want to go and follow the screen prompts.
3. Controller programming for the entire PV product line.
4. BMS read support for a variety of smart BT capable BMS's.
An LCD running canbus or whatever is lame by comparison. The app does way more than any dedicated LCD and does it at the resolution of your phone. I have other controllers and dashboard options and they are not as good.
One of the limitations of the older PV controllers is the relatively low eRPM...50,000. This will be running at whatever VESC can do or maybe a little less.
Since this is VESC based, probably the mobile VESC app will program the controller? I wonder if the PV app will?
It will use the PV app...which has seen tons of development. IMHO, it's the best EV app there is and there's new development coming all the time!
If you don't know about the app...
1. Dashboard that shows all the important stuff like speed, watts, amps, voltage, miles, temps, etc.
2. GPS app...enter where you want to go and follow the screen prompts.
3. Controller programming for the entire PV product line.
4. BMS read support for a variety of smart BT capable BMS's.
An LCD running canbus or whatever is lame by comparison. The app does way more than any dedicated LCD and does it at the resolution of your phone. I have other controllers and dashboard options and they are not as good.
One of the limitations of the older PV controllers is the relatively low eRPM...50,000. This will be running at whatever VESC can do or maybe a little less.
Since this is VESC based, probably the mobile VESC app will program the controller? I wonder if the PV app will?
Powervelocity.com
100 kW
Shooting for 100K eRPM at least. VESC firmware was originally designed to target RC motors, so that should not be a problem.
ElectricGod said:
I always would prefer a dedicated, solid display with a solid mounting hardware to the steerer or head tube and then having throttle, e-brake and other things directly connected there on front with only one single wire going to the controller.
and btw: visability on smartphone displays in direct sunlight is ofter quite poor and waterproofing could be also an issue.
How often do you need GPS navigation if you go for a ride?
In my case less than 5% and then i use my own phone because i would not want to buy a second SIM card or mobile phone contract just for this..
ElectricGod
10 MW
madin88 said:
Sounds like the Nucular controller is the right option for you. It has all of those things. Of course its proprietary to a single controller product line too!
The PV app and monitoring module is usable on any EV, not just PV controllers.
I doubt you will see the effort put into the PV phone app and module get thrown away to do what you want. A low end LCD option is just not as good as this is. I'll live with maybe a little less visibility for the level of functionality I get in the PV solution. Water penetration is easily dealt with. Just about any phone out there has cases made for them to keep out water. Handle bar mounting for phone has been done a thousand times. As a super quick solution, wrap the phone in some kapton to keep out water.
Powervelocity.com
100 kW
Most phones, even very old ones, can be used as dashboards. Android or iOS, doesn't matter. As it was pointed out here earlier, those phone can be had for next to nothing, so they can be used as permanent dashboards. With that said, a specially made dashboard can be added later if enough people want it. It's just not the focus right now.
andrebandre
100 W
- Joined
- Dec 2, 2015
- Messages
- 108
danielrlee said:
+1
ElectricGod
10 MW
andrebandre said:
There's a new module coming out soon. I think focus will be on the phone based app since there is so much functionality here that an LCD based option would limit significantly. The new module will bring new features that have been in demand for a while. Honestly, you guys that want an LCD are going to miss out on most of the functionality the phone app has in it. I've been a steady user of the app and modules since nearly day one and I have yet to find it to be bothersome or difficult and certainly NOT a deal breaker in any way.
This is the current module that communicates with the EV and your phone. There's capability in the telemetry module for future growth in differing directions. In the lower left area are 4 through holes for connectivity to things that can use I2C. It's not yet implemented for anything, but that's just programming and firmware. It's not impossible to implement an LCD based dash board that connects here. Of course, the question that comes to mind for me is, why would you want to? The phone app is excellent!
MJSfoto1956
10 kW
ElectricGod said:
+1
coolbobjoe
1 W
- Joined
- Jul 6, 2017
- Messages
- 62
One more thing to charge, turn on, and have connectivity issues with. Also almost always harder to see under bright sunlight also. Hardwired has peace of mind. That some bluetooth glitch isnt going to leave you stranded or the likes. Had quite a few dropped bluetooth handshakes with a new Samsung S9. Not saying it doesn't or cannot work. But sometimes dedicated hardware is nice. Personally I already have too many screens on the bike. Bms, cav3, bluetooth from bms, and now bluetooth from controller. If the app could be run simultaneously in multi window mode along with my bms app which is highly more accurate on wattage display I would be more keen to using both or even switching. But resolution is the key there. Multiple decimal points please... otherwise calibration will rarely be accurate
coolbobjoe
1 W
- Joined
- Jul 6, 2017
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Also it's nice to be able to read motor temp. Not just controller temp!
ElectricGod
10 MW
coolbobjoe said:
Motor and controller temps have been in the app for something like 6-10 months. The app and module get regular updates so there's new functionality coming out pretty regularly. This is old functionality! Some things need new hardware (module) if you want the latest functions and others are just new stuff in the phone app. If something is hardware based, there's a chance you could need a new module to take advantage of some new feature, but then the app is always backwards compatible with which ever version of the module you have too.
The app and module have pretty good connectivity and lots of redundancy around BT connectivity. If you do disconnect, it will probably go unnoticed as reconnecting gets retried with very good results. Early on in development BT connectivity issues were a priority to make sure it was solid and reconnected rapidly. That has NOT been an issue in a very long time. Comparing what you get in a Chinese implementation with a super cheap BT module and what's in the module and app is not a fair comparison.
I can't speak for your phone specifically. I personally own 6 phones that I use for testing. I don't know how many Vadym has, but it's safe to say connectivity over BT is pretty good. I rarely notice BT connectivity issues and they never leave me stranded...NOT EVER. The controller will work with or without connectivity working.
Smart BMS access is supported in the app. You currently can't program them, but you can view status. So that's one less app you need to run. The PV app has done this for something like 6 months. You can completely eliminate that CA. The module and app do everything a CA does and in a much nicer format.
The module and app have various calibration functions and you can manually set your shunt value if it doesn't display the actual current. This all functionality that has been in place for something like a year.
It sounds like I eliminated your BMS app and the CA and put 100% of that functionality into the PV app before you even knew you wanted us to!
ElectricGod
10 MW
coolbobjoe said:
Done! Read my other comment. It has been implemented for a long time now.
MJSfoto1956
10 kW
coolbobjoe said:
Just went out for a spin on my bike in bright sunlight. No issues reading the iPhone display running the PowerVelocity app -- even through dark sunglasses and a tinted visor. And prominently shown below the speedo was both controller and motor temps side-by-side.
Note: I don't know about Android, but the iPhone works splendidly outdoors.
Michael
ElectricGod
10 MW
MJSfoto1956 said:
I test on both platforms. IF there is an issue with visibility, it's just becasue some phones don't do as well in the sun as others. That's not the fault of the app in any way. My oldest phone is a Samsung S3 and IMHO, it's just fine in the sun.
I was thinking about charging. All my EV's have onboard USB charging. This is super easy to implement.
ElectricGod
10 MW
The current PowerVelocity app:
I can't show active data since I'm away from any EV's ATM (At work). I can't show the BMS page for the same reason. I'd like to see any dedicated LCD solution do all of this!
Dashboard: (Notice the dual temps)
GPS app:
Slide out menu:
Setting screen:
BT scanning/selection: (Found in the settings screen - CONNECT button)
Performance statistics:
Controller settings: (Notice how in settings the app is looking for my controller.)
I can't show active data since I'm away from any EV's ATM (At work). I can't show the BMS page for the same reason. I'd like to see any dedicated LCD solution do all of this!
Dashboard: (Notice the dual temps)
GPS app:
Slide out menu:
Setting screen:
BT scanning/selection: (Found in the settings screen - CONNECT button)
Performance statistics:
Controller settings: (Notice how in settings the app is looking for my controller.)
coolbobjoe
1 W
- Joined
- Jul 6, 2017
- Messages
- 62
How do you read motor temp when the seller didnt have any point on BT module for input nor would advise on it? Coming from experience of returned controller due to heavy flaws like the onboard temp sensor being DOA. No temps displayed was even more fun
Powervelocity.com said:
I would like to have used such older phones with not that great resultion, but then i noticed that single screens like speed, rpm watt or so did overlap and one was above the other which did look messy. Hopefully this has been fixed now!
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