New "TSDZ2 Torque Sensor Central Motor"

Waynemarlow said:
Yup just use a full outer cable all the way, most new bikes a re thus. most put the cable over the bottom bracket and along the rear stays.
Click to expand...

I'm seeing some people without the rear bracket thing at all. Or mounted upside down (like this guy: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7aSh4fLXA3Y)

I am also reading that the rear bracket/clamp will bite into the frame and chafe the paint.

How much sense does it make to not install the rear bracket and have the TSDZ2 rest forward against the downtube with part of an old tube in-between the frame and the motor?
 
Mike-P said:
Found a youtube video [youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-V3G0GSx4zg[/youtube] taking a completely different approach knocking the lot out from the rear which worked albeit probably potentially not too good for the health of the torque sensor. The only thing that seems looks faulty/seems odd is that only two of the three springs appear to exist - have brushed the area where I took it apart and scanned it with a bright light. Wondering if only two did exist and that's why as they weakened it suddenly stopped working / works very occasionally. The loss of power was immediately after the bike bounced, as it does on every commute, over a slightly depressed filled in trench across the road. Alternatively with the display issues as well could it be a fault with the controller? Pondering whether it would be best to get a new torque sensor and a new controller, or simply put it back together with three springs and see of it is okay. EDIT - think I'll get a new torque sensor and see if that cures it,
Click to expand...

You will need to remove the sprag clutch if you want to replace the torque sensor. I suspect this is easier to do before taking rest of the drive unit out. The large toothed gear can be inserted by hand so although its snug, it doesn't need special fitting tools.

My preferred method is to remove the case covering the clutch and toothed gear. Then screw the chainset back on again. At this point you will have extra leverage to pull against. Its easier if you still have the motor in the frame or you can cut an appropriate sized hole in a piece of wood and screw the retaining washer into that. That then gives you something you can brace your feet against whilst you remove it. Just make sure you have taken the circlips off first
 
ImpulsePurchase said:
You will need to remove the sprag clutch if you want to replace the torque sensor.
Click to expand...
Thanks for the advice.
skestans said:
I am also reading that the rear bracket/clamp will bite into the frame and chafe the paint.
Click to expand...
One solution is to wrap some rubber (bits of old inner tube) around the frame at the appropriate location which aside from stopping the bracket/clamp biting into the frame also stops any creaking noises arising there. I do have a problem with those parts in that the clearance to the seat post on my bike is tight meaning its awkward to get an allen key in the bolt head. Equally a normal bolt head is awkward to use due again to the tight clearances meaning any possible spanner movement is only very slight. Thinking of fitting a bolt from the underneath with a nut on top of the clamp but looks like the bracket will need to be filed down a bit on its underside to give a level surround to the bolt hole.
 
Waynemarlow said:
OK update on my water ingress problem.
Click to expand...

I am also suspicious that the spindle seals do not fit correctly. There should be some grip on the spindle shaft, but my drive side one seemed loose so I added extra grease to help keep water out. Of course, it should be lubricated anyway. I want to investigate this further sometime and try to find a better fitting seal. I haven't checked the non-drive side.
 
Hi,

Does anyone want to help out with a 50T design? Narrow/Wide - Offset 10mm... I think the offset needs to be closer to the outside ring... instead of in the center like it is - and the solid plate design... I think needs to have cutouts like most larger chain rings (same as stock 52T, and other common 110bcd styles)...

Also, I really don't have experience with this, I wing it as I go, and am not sure if I have it correct... I need to calculate the outside diameter and make sure that a chain is actually going to fit it... Any pointers? Anyone want to help? I can't offer much other than a free chain ring, but you will also be helping out the TSDZ2 community ;)

I can send the STP file if anyone wants to tinker with it, check the measurements... etc...

Couple shots of the design, and last one is the 50T guard I want to pair it with... Was thinking I should match the cutout/shape of it...
 

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Can someone tell me what items will not be displayed if I went with the small SW102 display and not the 850C display? I really do not need a speed display as I have a garmin and my phone with cyclemeter but I would like battery level and maybe estimated miles left or something like that. Temp maybe too.
Can the SW102 display be customized so show what I want with the OSF?

Thanks
Brandon
 
skestans said:
I am also reading that the rear bracket/clamp will bite into the frame and chafe the paint.

How much sense does it make to not install the rear bracket and have the TSDZ2 rest forward against the downtube with part of an old tube in-between the frame and the motor?
Click to expand...

I installed Tsdz2 on a Kona Honzo ST hardtail which has short chainstays and definetely no room for the rear clamp. So the motor is resting against the downtube, I did put some old tube between the contact points but that was eaten away after a couple of hundred kms, so apparently there is some slight movement even though the bolts and BB nut are really tight. With the steel frame there's no problem, the paint is chafed but no dent in the tube after 1000km. Aluminium frame might not be as durable though.
 
eyebyesickle said:
Hi,

Does anyone want to help out with a 50T design? Narrow/Wide - Offset 10mm... I think the offset needs to be closer to the outside ring... instead of in the center like it is - and the solid plate design... I think needs to have cutouts like most larger chain rings (same as stock 52T, and other common 110bcd styles)...

Also, I really don't have experience with this, I wing it as I go, and am not sure if I have it correct... I need to calculate the outside diameter and make sure that a chain is actually going to fit it... Any pointers? Anyone want to help? I can't offer much other than a free chain ring, but you will also be helping out the TSDZ2 community ;)

I can send the STP file if anyone wants to tinker with it, check the measurements... etc...

Couple shots of the design, and last one is the 50T guard I want to pair it with... Was thinking I should match the cutout/shape of it...
Click to expand...

Search for my post about how I configured a dual chain rings with great chain line. PM me if you can't find the post with photos.
 
RicMcK said:
eyebyesickle said:
Hi,

Does anyone want to help out with a 50T design? Narrow/Wide - Offset 10mm... I think the offset needs to be closer to the outside ring... instead of in the center like it is - and the solid plate design... I think needs to have cutouts like most larger chain rings (same as stock 52T, and other common 110bcd styles)...

Also, I really don't have experience with this, I wing it as I go, and am not sure if I have it correct... I need to calculate the outside diameter and make sure that a chain is actually going to fit it... Any pointers? Anyone want to help? I can't offer much other than a free chain ring, but you will also be helping out the TSDZ2 community ;)

I can send the STP file if anyone wants to tinker with it, check the measurements... etc...

Couple shots of the design, and last one is the 50T guard I want to pair it with... Was thinking I should match the cutout/shape of it...
Click to expand...

Search for my post about how I configured a dual chain rings with great chain line. PM me if you can't find the post with photos.
Click to expand...

Nice, I remember that post. I've tried a few configurations myself in the past as well. This a bit different however, as on that setup the inside 42T still only has 5mm offset, and the teeth are not narrow wide... This would give 10mm offset on the inside, on a 50T... and the teeth are narrow wide... So I think it is still worth making...
 
ilu said:
skestans said:
I am also reading that the rear bracket/clamp will bite into the frame and chafe the paint.

How much sense does it make to not install the rear bracket and have the TSDZ2 rest forward against the downtube with part of an old tube in-between the frame and the motor?
Click to expand...

I installed Tsdz2 on a Kona Honzo ST hardtail which has short chainstays and definetely no room for the rear clamp. So the motor is resting against the downtube, I did put some old tube between the contact points but that was eaten away after a couple of hundred kms, so apparently there is some slight movement even though the bolts and BB nut are really tight. With the steel frame there's no problem, the paint is chafed but no dent in the tube after 1000km. Aluminium frame might not be as durable though.
Click to expand...

Interesting. Is it because the motor gets really hot and it damaged the inner tube you put as protection? Or did the inner tube get abraded away?
 
I posted this in the OSF thread, but it was suggested here is more appropriate.

I made a video demonstrating my motor concerns, sorry about the wind noise but the motor sound is important to hear. This was using v0.19 for VLCD5. I have no idea if this is normal so please tell me how this compares to your motors, no matter if you are running stock or opensource firmware.

[youtube]20iHVS-A5dQ[/youtube]
 
skestans said:
Interesting. Is it because the motor gets really hot and it damaged the inner tube you put as protection? Or did the inner tube get abraded away?
Click to expand...

It was abraded, the contact point is very small and only a ring around it was left so I took it away and left the motor as it is. As you can see the motor housing is bent, soon I'll do some maintenance and I hope there's no problem opening that bolt. Some sort of wedge between the frame and motor would be good to divide the force on a larger area. The torque is so strong that soft rubber will not last, perhaps 3D printed plastic or something might work.

ATTACH]
 
andrea_104kg said:
New battery for tsdz2, made with liitokala 26650 50a 13s3p 720wh
Click to expand...
That cells seems very cheap, powerful and light. 500Wh for about 100 euros.
 
I just ordered my TSDZ2 motor setup from ECO-Cycles. I know this question is like asking how to walk but what battery is the best out there? I want one with a BMS that has Bluetooth to monitor the batteries from my phone and I want a well built battery that is going to last. I prefer a shark style on a rail mount for easy removal. I'm looking at batteries from EM3ev.com.

Sorry for the loaded question in advance. Also is there a better place to post this question?

Brandon
 
famichiki said:
I posted this in the OSF thread, but it was suggested here is more appropriate.

I made a video demonstrating my motor concerns, sorry about the wind noise but the motor sound is important to hear. This was using v0.19 for VLCD5. I have no idea if this is normal so please tell me how this compares to your motors, no matter if you are running stock or opensource firmware.

[youtube]20iHVS-A5dQ[/youtube]
Click to expand...

an user report this:
If you want to know the symptoms when your torque sensor is broken:

.When you press the pedal and stop the motor continue working a time
.you feel more power assist than normal
.your battery lasts minus
.when the torque is full broken you feel irregular assist
in this post: https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=28&t=98665
I hope it's not your problem :(
 
andrea_104kg said:
an user report this:
If you want to know the symptoms when your torque sensor is broken:

.When you press the pedal and stop the motor continue working a time
.you feel more power assist than normal
.your battery lasts minus
.when the torque is full broken you feel irregular assist
in this post: https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=28&t=98665
I hope it's not your problem :(
Click to expand...

Thanks for the info. The unusual thing is that the torque sensor operation seems ok, but is higher than Casainho's recommendation.

I've tested the reading with the factory viewing menu, Mbrusa's firmware, and my own code.. the reading is smooth and stable. The plotted torque graph seems a similar shape to Casainho's.

Apart from these effects, while pedalling the feeling is good.

It's been like this since new, so this is why I am so confused! :shock:
 
ilu said:
It was abraded, the contact point is very small and only a ring around it was left so I took it away and left the motor as it is. As you can see the motor housing is bent, soon I'll do some maintenance and I hope there's no problem opening that bolt. Some sort of wedge between the frame and motor would be good to divide the force on a larger area. The torque is so strong that soft rubber will not last, perhaps 3D printed plastic or something might work.
Click to expand...

if the rubber pad was actually abraded, and not simply crushed all the way thru it (pinched), then it is not torque by itself, it is that the motor housing is moving away and then toward and then away from the frame, rocking forward and back. it might also be moving side to side, if the abrasion marks are not all lined up from front to back.

so the way to fix this is to add a brace to the housing that fixes it to the frame in a triangulated way, meaning that in addition to the bb shell connection, it also has an arm from the housing fixed to another part of the frame so that it makes a triangle thru the frame and housing, since a triangle can't be "bent" at it's points. that way it can't rock back and forth.

if it has side to side rocking, for instance from pedal pressure, then the tolerances of the bb bearings or the bb shell mounts need to be tighter, so that it has no play. (since there isn't an easy way of adding a triangulating arm like there may be for the other problem).
 
Amberwolf, you are right. There is definetely some movement. The housing moves up and down, as I ride a lot offroad and with all the bumps and drops the motor probably moves a tiny bit down abd then back up by it's own torque. I tried to prevent this by clamping the bottom part of the chainstay bracket against a chain guard tab in the frame, but I can see now that it is not strong enough. I think I can come up with something more secure with some basic hardware store stuff. What I mean is to just clamp the motor between the top tube and a flat part between BB and chainstays.
 
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