Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Well I haven't got a surron so I'm not 100% sure but yes, at some stage the throttle will need to be an electric signal for the controller. So there will be wires. I would unplug and replug everything and check for loose wires as you go

Good luck
 
crazy_dave said:
O.K, Ive seen the hall sensor for sale on Luna and figured it was a wear item but had no idea what the hell it was or how to test/ replace it. There is not much info on the description. Could you please give me a dumbed down explanation of what it is and how to replace it?
Click to expand...

Y.T and Google can tell you what they do and how to test em - I bet my cock thats your problem.
Get your hands on a spare and a couple of beers.
Pop the side cover off your motor (can be done in the bike). You will see a green disk / ring screwed in there. These are your hall sensors. Unscrew and replace - carefully mark its orientation before hand.
The ugliest part of the job is de-pinning and re-pinning the connector - or cut n solder if that's easier; and getting the cable back through the motor gland.
Good luck and enjoy the transition to ebike wrenching. Problems like this teach you so much.
 
Man that is a hell of a wager! If you are that confident than it is worth my time to get the side cover off and see what is going on in there. Besides, a buddy of mine just turned me on to (Southern Tier- Lake shore frog IPA) Its not an over strong IPA but I’m loving it.
By the sounds of it, there is more than one Hall sensor in there. Do you know how many are in there, should I try to trouble shoot each one or just replace all of them while I have it open? Luna is sold out, is there a part# stamped on them; can they be sourced from a place like DIGI-KEY?
Thank you guys for all the help!
 
Ok I think I have a better understanding of the Sur-Ron hall sensor. From the pix I’ve seen it looks like there are a few hall sensors (3?) mounted on a single green, circular board. I was thinking that there were multiple green boards each with its own sensor.
So my game plan it to test the sensor on the bike. If a failure is found, I will remove the hall sensor board and try to isolate which hall sensor is bad on the board and replace it. For $25 buck it would be cheaper just to buy the assemble. However, Luna is sold out and I like to learn.
Does this sound good or is there a better way?
 
Can't you test the hall sensors from the connector? Why even bother trying to remove that small plastic center piece on the motor?

I wasn't able to get that little side cover off, I didn't try very hard but it is really in their tight and you will probably gouge the plastic in the process?
 
I do not see why we couldn’t. But then again I have no idea what the hell I’m talking about.
Id imagine if I left the connector plug in and probed for the backside that could work. I just don’t know the pin-outs.
If I unplugged the connector and probed the terminal would that still work? It would make sense that the hall sensor gets its juice from the same connector. IF I unplugged it would I still get a reading?
 
You can test the hall sensors from the connector but you need a way to power them. A 9v battery will work or any 5v USB source.

Another way is to penetrate the insulation on the wires and leave the plug in and use the bike to power it. Back probing the connector might work too but the connectors are sealed.

If the problem is intermittent you might not see it.
 
After having taken the motor apart, my recommendation is to not mess with the motor unless you have to. Even that center cap to get to the halls, I wouldn't mess with it if the halls tests fine at the connector.

This should be really easy to troubleshoot and pinpoint if its the motor, battery, or controller, or throttle.
 
Offroader said:
This should be really easy to troubleshoot and pinpoint if its the motor, battery, or controller, or throttle.
Click to expand...

Any suggestions on how I would go about doing this?
Sorry no IBS will touch this bike. The moment that they hear that its an ebike I get a dial-tone
 
To test if it’s the Bms,just do a temp bypass and see if that works.My Bms went out while on a ride and had to push home.It did a variety of odd things when it went out.One was it wouldn’t go into charge mode with the charger, charger would blink like the battery was below lvc .
 
crazy_dave said:
Offroader said:
This should be really easy to troubleshoot and pinpoint if its the motor, battery, or controller, or throttle.
Click to expand...

Any suggestions on how I would go about doing this?
Sorry no IBS will touch this bike. The moment that they hear that its an ebike I get a dial-tone
Click to expand...

I would try and find someone within driving distance that you can bring your battery pack and test to see if it works on their bike. What part of upstate NY are you in? That would be the easiest to trouble shoot the battery.

Next would be to quickly check the halls connectors. That is the connector in the picture it has 6 wires, one of the wires wrapped in white cloth is for the temperature gauge. I would get small alligator clips to attach to the male contacts. Check to see if the connector from the controller has 5+ volts first. Then use a battery to power the halls and check to see if they cycle properly.

If halls work, then just swap out the controller with another one. They are dirt cheap I picked up a non x-version for $100 bucks.

Halls connector
ivJWC43.jpg


Halls connector, the white cloth wrapped wire is temp probe, don't worry about that connector.
zrOJCk5.jpg


Halls connector with white cloth wire removed, you have a red, black, yellow, green, and blue wire. Just test those wires using youtube as a guide. Red and black are probably +5 volts and ground. The white cloth wire was the temp probe wire.
Then you have two wires going into a single pin, that is for the temp probe negative side, and the other wire is most likely the ground for the halls. The temp probe and halls usually share the same ground wire, I guess they do this to simplify things.

eavuIg5.jpg


If halls checks out, and if battery checks out, then check the controller or throttle.
 
Right. The halls normally run at 5v from the controller but you can use a 9v battery for testing. They're rated for 24v.


I did a ride video using a $35 dash camera mounted to a bar that hooks on to the straps on my backpack. The picture quality isn't great but not terrible. I figured for $35 if I crashed or the thing fell off it would be expendable. It's powered by a little USB phone charger power bank. I can use the same mount for my phone camera, so I might try that next time.

Img_1752.jpg

The ride is through China Camp State Park, which is close to my house. Nice scenic ride along the San Francisco bay. You can see lots of bicycles but most of them ride on the trails up in the hills. The road is bumpy as hell but the suspension works great with softer settings.

RIDE VIDEO:
[youtube]Qpjt0OJ99LM[/youtube]
 
Offroader said:
crazy_dave said:
Offroader said:
This should be really easy to troubleshoot and pinpoint if its the motor, battery, or controller, or throttle.
Click to expand...

Any suggestions on how I would go about doing this?
Sorry no IBS will touch this bike. The moment that they hear that its an ebike I get a dial-tone
Click to expand...

I would try and find someone within driving distance that you can bring your battery pack and test to see if it works on their bike. What part of upstate NY are you in? That would be the easiest to trouble shoot the battery.

Next would be to quickly check the halls connectors. That is the connector in the picture it has 6 wires, one of the wires wrapped in white cloth is for the temperature gauge. I would get small alligator clips to attach to the male contacts. Check to see if the connector from the controller has 5+ volts first. Then use a battery to power the halls and check to see if they cycle properly.

If halls work, then just swap out the controller with another one. They are dirt cheap I picked up a non x-version for $100 bucks.

Halls connector
ivJWC43.jpg


Halls connector, the white cloth wrapped wire is temp probe, don't worry about that connector.
zrOJCk5.jpg


Halls connector with white cloth wire removed, you have a red, black, yellow, green, and blue wire. Just test those wires using youtube as a guide. Red and black are probably +5 volts and ground. The white cloth wire was the temp probe wire.
Then you have two wires going into a single pin, that is for the temp probe negative side, and the other wire is most likely the ground for the halls. The temp probe and halls usually share the same ground wire, I guess they do this to simplify things.

eavuIg5.jpg


If halls checks out, and if battery checks out, then check the controller or throttle.
Click to expand...
Thank you!
Hey would you mind emailing me this info? PIx didn't come though. I think its security. freeride772001@yahoo.com

Got another one for you guys. Battery box lid will not open now and the battery is still in side. The key tumbler has no tension. The barrel will rotate freely with no resistance. Any ideas of how I can get the lid open to service the latch?
 
crazy_dave said:
Got another one for you guys. Battery box lid will not open now and the battery is still in side. The key tumbler has no tension. The barrel will rotate freely with no resistance. Any ideas of how I can get the lid open to service the latch?
Click to expand...

Wow, you're really not having good luck. Below is the only picture I could find of the latch area. There is a metal housing around the latch. You want to snake something in the crack and try to pull the latch back toward the seat. Something like a bent coat hanger. It would probably help to remove the seat, but that's kind of a pain too.

battery door latch.jpg
 
The Sur-ron is just an amazing bike, and I'm sorry to say this may be as good as it will ever get for a performance ebike. Every time I ride this bike I'm blown away by how great it is.

I of course did some minor modifications, new fork, new controller, new handlebar, new rear wheel, new brakes, thumb throttle upgrade. I say minor because what they replaced wasn't that bad and performed the same exact function.

I've been riding it so hard lately off-road, really beating it to death, and this bike just doesn't break. I don't even do daily checks anymore for loose bolts and spokes. I just don't even check them anymore, maybe once a month. The bolts just don't loosen up, and I rebuilt the rear wheel so the spokes don't loosen up anymore.

I really like the 18" shinko 241 3 in tire. I have been riding it at 9 PSI, and that is with a regular tire tube and no rim lock. It just doesn't need any of that and I ride up steps often, the tire doesn't slip on the rim. Don't get me wrong, sometimes I do worry if the tire will slip riding up steps but it just doesn't. I still really believe the 18" x 3.00 tire is the perfect size, and the front stock tire is really the best all around tire combination you will get, and they are the same height.

The Shinko 241 3.00", does wear out rather quickly, not nearly as bad as the stock tire but this is good because its soft rubber and just right for the light bike, and cheap and available enough to replace.

Even though I'm using the stock battery, the Nuclear controller really adds a lot more power to the bike, a lot more acceleration and seems to add even more top speed. It adds a lot more fun to the bike. Plus it adds regen so I don't mind braking and wearing my pads out.

The handling of the bike is just amazing, it turns so sharp, it seems well balanced, its comfortable, its predictable. The shinko rear and stock front hardly ever slip out on me. Slow speed riding or fast speed riding are both amazing.This bike will ride as stable as a motorcycle at 50MPH, but then have the agility of a mountain bike slow speeds.

The greatest thing about this bike is that it doesn't overheat, the motor simply stays cool, under 75C, even if its 100F outside and your riding up steep hills, with lots of stops and starts,. Anyone who comes from hub-motor bikes should know just how annoying it was dealing with overheating motors.


ox0bTUT.jpg
 
The question is, what would I improve on the bike with a new model?

I think the only thing I can think to improve is designing the frame and geometry around 27.5" forks and 19" motorcycle tires.

Unfortunately you can't get quality 26" forks anymore as they are obsolete, everything is 27.5 and 29". I was lucky enough to have bought the last of the 26" fox forks.

Yes, I know you can throw a 27.5" fork on the bike but from my extensive research in downhill biking forums and asking many people on the forums who race downhill bikes, it is not recommended and not a good idea to do this as you will most likely change the geometry for the worst. I like the fact that sur-ron handles like a motorcycle at 50MPH and like a mountain bike at 15 MPH.

I do know many guys use 27.5" forks but I don't think they are pushing the bike extremely hard off-road and are not as sensitive as I am to the handling.

That being all said, just design the bike to come with a 27.5" fork this way we have decent fork selections and don't have to use the wrong size just to put a high quality fork on the bike. I don't want to be stuck with cheap 26" fork selections.
 
Offroader said:
The question is, what would I improve on the bike with a new model?

I think the only thing I can think to improve is designing the frame and geometry around 27.5" forks and 19" motorcycle tires.

Have you seen this the GM-X?

Unfortunately you can't get quality 26" forks anymore as they are obsolete, everything is 27.5 and 29". I was lucky enough to have bought the last of the 26" fox forks.

Yes, I know you can throw a 27.5" fork on the bike but from my extensive research in downhill biking forums and asking many people on the forums who race downhill bikes, it is not recommended and not a good idea to do this as you will most likely change the geometry for the worst. I like the fact that sur-ron handles like a motorcycle at 50MPH and like a mountain bike at 15 MPH.

There is a Hydrogen On Demand Drive being made for the GM-X

200 miles range. 400cc power. weight of a 150cc. no charging or need to fill with hydrogen. Just add water.

The Hydrogen drive replaces the swappable battery. same size. uses hydrogen combustion that generates electricity on demand with a battery as part of the mix.

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1cz7819qfwgYWesSQ7nsS7qlofSC_DrYv/view?usp=drivesdk

I do know many guys use 27.5" forks but I don't think they are pushing the bike extremely hard off-road and are not as sensitive as I am to the handling.

That being all said, just design the bike to come with a 27.5" fork this way we have decent fork selections and don't have to use the wrong size just to put a high quality fork on the bike. I don't want to be stuck with cheap 26" fork selections.
Click to expand...
 

Attachments

  • GMSbike.jpg
    GMSbike.jpg
    135 KB · Views: 2,061
  • WhiteBackground3.jpg
    WhiteBackground3.jpg
    129.4 KB · Views: 2,061
Made this video of a ride I did in my city split into a few parts. Shows how many things you can do with Sur Ron in a large urban city.
Video was from a bar mounted dash cam Git G3, that is set to record every time I turn on my bike.

[youtube]IJY3GXqTYms[/youtube]
 
Since there isn't anyplace close by I can ride on dirt, I ride mainly on pavement. Yesterday I did a ride on Lucas Valley Road, which is popular with ICE motorcycles. I started out with a cop car right on my tail, so I turned off and let him go by. Didn't get pulled over this time. I apologize for the downward camera angle as I was trying to keep the Cycle Analyst screen in view. I'll have to do it again sometime with a better camera angle. At the end of the return trip, I show the screens from the CA with ride stats. It was pretty hot, around 95F and I was on full throttle for minutes at a time. Motor was borderline too hot to touch at the end. I think just parking it in the sun would have gotten it that hot.

Outbound leg:
[youtube]Q3QRqC2CYiU [/youtube]

Return leg:
[youtube]T7-VDXRx8R8 [/youtube]
 
I'm officially in the two Sur-ron club. I have a green one that was in second? shipment a couple years ago, and black x model arrived today. The X definitely has more power. I have a 59 tooth sprocket on green bike, and the x is still more powerful on the low end. Top end, of course, is no comparison. I like the noise difference too. X is much quieter. Seat is better, key is different. Not much else I've noticed so far.

Luna shows it coming with a front fender. There's kinda a origami thing included. Not what I expected, I trashed it. I'll use the same topeak one I used on green bike. I also am unsure of the claimed headset upgrade. Luna says it has a better one but it feels "clicky" like the old one. Maybe they forgot to send it? I'll change that too. Oh yeah it has a shock protector rear fender. That's nice IMO
 
artisanstone said:
I also am unsure of the claimed headset upgrade. Luna says it has a better one but it feels "clicky" like the old one. Maybe they forgot to send it?
Click to expand...

Does anyone know if there is supposed to be an upgraded headset included? I reached out to Luna but that might be a slow process.
 
Would it have been (included) or (installed). Luna should be able to tell you what (should) be in there. Only way I to know for sure would be to open it up and see.

No updates on my basket-case Sur-Ron yet. Anyone know if I can get a Hall sensor from another source than Luna?

What is the deal with the electric throttle that Luna is offering? Does it replace the cable throttle and the speed controller?
 
Kauaiguy said:
They come with the Hd roller bearings now From the factory since last year December.
Click to expand...

Thanks, bud. I guess I'm buying another cane creek headset. I had hoped differently.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Similar threads

EVGator
EEB Mid Drive Bike - Complete or Part out
Replies
3
Views
999
skeetab5780
skeetab5780
R
    • Like
A critique of mid-drive riding recommendations (and hub drive criticisms)
Replies
15
Views
5,084
Bullfrog
B
N
Hi! I am new. There is a small problem with the ...
Replies
2
Views
702
amberwolf
amberwolf
D
Super 73ish Retro Wheelie Bike
Replies
0
Views
612
Dogboy1200
D
mickyd
Can I replace my BBS02 motor core / rotor with a BBSHD?
2
Replies
27
Views
4,107
sp1n4d0
S
Back
Top