List of small hatchback cars

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Re: List of small hatchback cars

Post by markz » Feb 08 2021 7:45pm

Do commercial vehicles fall under that warranty?
marty wrote:
Feb 08 2021 7:24pm
Things have gone from bad to worse. 2019 Honda Fit LX, 54,000 Uber miles. Warranty is 3 yr/36,000 mi basic, 5 yr/60,000 mi powertrain. So no luck with that.

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Re: List of small hatchback cars

Post by marty » Feb 10 2021 7:14am

LeftieBiker wrote:
Feb 08 2021 7:38pm
You could have a failing starting motor, or bad/dirty connections in the starter circuit. Check the tightness of the connections at the starter, solenoid if it's not mounted right on the starter, and the battery ground. I know you have good battery voltage, but here is a good routine to follow when shutting the car off. (I would try to disable whatever setting runs the lights after the car is off.)

* Turn off heater blower

* Turn off stereo if it's aftermarket.

* Turn off headlights.

* Gently press the gas pedal to slightly rev the engine to about 2-3,000 RPM for 10-20 seconds.

* Let it drop back to idle, then immediately shut the engine off.

This will counter the tendency of cars with small engines to drain the battery slightly at shutoff.
All good suggestions. Except not too sure about "rev the engine".

As to turning the headlights off. That would require rewiring my brain.
I leave the headlight switch in the auto position. Got a plastic bottle cap on the photocell so lights are always on when driving. Remembering to turn lights off and on is more then my brain can handle.
Re: (I would try to disable whatever setting runs the lights after the car is off.)
Believe me. I have tried. Been reading the owners manual for days. More expensive models have a Multi-Information Display. Mine just has a radio.

I copy:
Headlight Auto OFF Timer
Changes the length of time the exterior lights stay
on after you close the driver’s door.
60sec/30sec/15sec*1/0sec

Need the Multi-Information Display to change those settings. Could buy that Multi-Information Display part and who knows what else and rewire the dashboard.

Also wondering about cutting a wire to stop the headlights from coming on when I open the drivers door.

Took the battery to https://shop.advanceautoparts.com/ Says 340 CCA on the battery. Tester said 295 CCA and 13.06V

Put battery back in car. Should have wiggled the battery terminals before removing battery. They might have been loose but I am not sure. There was no visible corrosion.

Cleaned battery posts and terminals with a green scrubby and little wire brush. Put em back together with Vaseline all over. Hopefully that was the problem. Will also try prayer.
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Re: List of small hatchback cars

Post by marty » Feb 10 2021 7:17am

markz wrote:
Feb 08 2021 7:45pm
Do commercial vehicles fall under that warranty?
marty wrote:
Feb 08 2021 7:24pm
Things have gone from bad to worse. 2019 Honda Fit LX, 54,000 Uber miles. Warranty is 3 yr/36,000 mi basic, 5 yr/60,000 mi powertrain. So no luck with that.
The answer to your question is the same as Gays in the Military.
Don't ask, don't tell
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Re: List of small hatchback cars

Post by LeftieBiker » Feb 10 2021 2:59pm

All good suggestions. Except not too sure about "rev the engine".
2000 to 3000 RPM isn't going to hurt it, or even make much noise. You do it to bring the alternator speed up into its optimum range, to charge the battery a bit before shutting the car off. Just remember to let it drop to idle before turning it off, or you may dump some raw gas into the catalytic converter.
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Re: List of small hatchback cars

Post by markz » Feb 10 2021 9:21pm

How safe are small hatchback cars?
https://cars.usnews.com/cars-trucks/safest-small-cars

However, I'd take into consideration the build quality and resale value, only stick to Toyota, Nissan, Honda, and their equivalent high-end brands if they even have "small" cars to begin with Infinite (Nissan), Acura (Honda), Lexus (Toyota).

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Re: List of small hatchback cars

Post by markz » Feb 11 2021 6:56am

Because the lesser quality brands have cheap production methods with failure prone components. Why waste your money?
If your going to be buying a used car then by all means who cares what the vehicle looks like because its already going to be a late-late model, but why should paint be peeling off a vehicle that is 10 years old? Why should transmissions fail at 100k? Why buy a new Chevrolet for $20k when you can buy a Toyota for $28k. The difference of $8k is nothing. And if it is something then maybe you cant afford that car, maybe you should look for a 5 year old vehicle, and perhaps maybe not a domestic, maybe a Toyota, Honda or Nissan and maybe then you'd still have to go back to 8 or 10 year old vehicle.
JayMood wrote:
Feb 11 2021 6:10am
Why not just treat the car with anti-corrosion agents?

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Re: List of small hatchback cars

Post by marty » Feb 11 2021 7:43am

Oh Markz,
Think you might have responded to a spammer? What spammer's do is reply to random posts on forums. Then latter when they hope no one is looking, they edit their post with a link to whatever they selling.

Links make the search engines rank them higher to get to the first page of results.

Links like this.

Endless Sphere - Index page
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Re: List of small hatchback cars

Post by Dauntless » Feb 11 2021 4:00pm

I suggest on top of that to stick to cars with cheap parts. I don't know today, but historically Honda's are expensive while the Mazda's are cheap. On top of that if the model sells better, there's more likely to remain an ongoing parts depot if the brakes are changed, etc. And a good aftermarket. It's easier to get aftermarket parts for the Ford Mustang than to get OEM.
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Re: List of small hatchback cars

Post by markz » Feb 12 2021 7:45pm

I kind of had that feeling, but I decided to rant about what I had to say any ways.
It kind of bugs me to see the defects in various vehicles that are 8+ years old. Most build them to last days past the warranty period.
Paint flaking off is a common failure.

Recently these daze I have been looking at crash tests on youtube.
It is very interesting to see the wide variety of safety even amongst the imports. The one that sticks out is the Toyota Sienna minivan which was a horrible crash envelope.

I wouldnt be to enthusiastic about driving a small car, or even a mid size car when most vehicles on the road are big trucks and suv's. That is especially so with older small/mid cars with their lesser then ideal crash quality aspects. Newer stuff has the better technology.

marty wrote:
Feb 11 2021 7:43am
Oh Markz,
Think you might have responded to a spammer? What spammer's do is reply to random posts on forums. Then latter when they hope no one is looking, they edit their post with a link to whatever they selling.

Links make the search engines rank them higher to get to the first page of results.

Cheap parts is a good, but also its good to have lots of space inside the engine compartment. You have to take off less stuff when replacing an alternator or thermostat. Some vehicles its very compact engine compartment, having to take out half the stuff just to replace simple parts. I always thought Kia's and Hyundai's were decent quality, I know they made heeps and bounds better quality then 10 years ago. There is a guy on youtube called Scotty, unique character, mechanic. Talks about how you should stay away from Hyundis. But if you had $30k to lease, finance or buy, then I'd say look at Toy's or Hon's or Nissans, rather then a Chevrolet, even if you have to buy those imports used. But if I have $5k to spend then buy whatever is mechanically sound. Don't take the dealerships word that its been inspected, and most importantly dont take the sellers word that somethings been done without receipt proof.
Dauntless wrote:
Feb 11 2021 4:00pm
I suggest on top of that to stick to cars with cheap parts. I don't know today, but historically Honda's are expensive while the Mazda's are cheap. On top of that if the model sells better, there's more likely to remain an ongoing parts depot if the brakes are changed, etc. And a good aftermarket. It's easier to get aftermarket parts for the Ford Mustang than to get OEM.

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Re: List of small hatchback cars

Post by marty » Feb 14 2021 9:39am

marty wrote:
Feb 10 2021 7:14am
Will also try prayer.
Forgot to say - Checked water level in battery. [Yes I know its not water in there. WEAR SAFETY GLASSES] Water was about 1/4 inch above what ever is inside the battery. Think water level is good.

Been driving. Me and Henry have a pretty good relationship. Who is Henry? Honda Fit named Henry Fit. Me and Henry listen to each other. Usually starter sounds happy. Car is not fixed :( Problem is that due to my paranoia of car not starting I can hear starter spinning slow. Only happens when driving short trips and turning car off at every stop. 20° weather don't help.

EricTheCarGuy explain this better then I can.


Don't want to watch video? Read the words :)
greetings viewers car got here today
let's talk quickly about how to check a
battery every car's got one even the
electric ones you don't check the
electric ones like this it's a whole
different process this is just for the
normal 12-volt car battery six volt but
I don't know how many of you out there
with 6 volt batteries in your cars
unless you got something really wicked
old and in that case you probably want
to put an 8 volt in there because they
have them now and it's really good for
storing them for long periods of time
I'm off on a tangent if you suspect that
your battery is low and let's just say
just about any electrical problem on
your car the Alpha and Omega of the
electrical system in your car is the
battery if your battery isn't good and
isn't is not in good condition the rest
of the electrical system will either
have to compensate make up for or suffer
as a result of that battery not being
good particularly with like say your
luxury cars that have lots of electrical
doodads and gadgets and all kinds of fun
things heated and cooled seats all that
stuff is really hard on an electrical
system I'm of the opinion I've even seen
brand new cars come in that barely crank
over and I wonder if they are gonna
crank over in fact I've had customers
with new cars come in and say my car's
not cranking very fast can you check the
battery I agree with them it seems that
these days that batteries at least that
come with the vehicle originally are
engineered within a couple of electrons
of just enough and they're probably
doing this to save cost but as a result
if the battery gets weak in any way
shape or form it could manifest in all
kinds of electrical issues in the car so
I'm gonna just get to the whole thing
right now you will need a battery load
tester this is one that I just got kind
of cool didn't cost a whole lot but what
you want to do is connect it to the
battery let's do that now whenever
you're talking about
you really have to be mindful of a
couple of things it really is important
that the battery is clean if it's not
clean and there's a bunch of goopy stuff
up here clean it off with the solution
of baking soda and water and a brush
clean all off the whole top because
believe it or not the voltage can bleed
off of the battery as a result of the
dirt that's on top of it so you want to
make sure that not only the battery is
clean but most importantly the terminal
connections where the battery actually
meets the car is clean because if
there's any corrosion or resistance in
this area it's gonna hamper the
performance of the batteries so you want
to make sure that the terminals are nice
and clean and also here's the other
thing if your battery's dead you can't
start the car don't do this test just
don't do it because you need to have a
fully charged battery in order to figure
this out there may be something draining
the battery you know there could be a
whole host host of things but you cannot
check a battery's condition without it
being fully charged I have fully charge
of this battery took it out and drove it
I had some other things to look at on
this car but I know this batteries is
fully charged it's it's going to be so
I'm going to connect the clamps you have
positive for positive that would be the
right one and you have negative for
negative as you can see right now my
battery is actually over 12 volts now
this switch right here controls a load
tester and I'm gonna do something I
should have done before if you're
working around a battery a particularly
one that stinks smells like rotten eggs
it's got a hydrogen gas around the
outside of it and could potentially
explode so I'm gonna grab my safety
glasses this way if it explodes I'll be
able to play the lead from Phantom of
the Opera but I'll still be able to see
okay so now we see I'm a little over 12
volts you want to load the battery not
for an extended period of time but the
magic number here is gonna be 9 volts if
this battery goes below 9 volts when I
load test it then I
replace the battery because I know it's
fully charged I know it's not gonna get
better so if it falls below 9 volts
chuck it and you can see I'm just going
down to about 11 volts I could do an
entire episode just on batteries but
this is just on checking one really
quick so 9 bolts is your magic number
you've got some numbers on the top here
and cold cranking amps being probably
the most important one
this one has 540 cold cranking amps you
want to make sure that the battery
that's in the car is able to crank the
car over in the coldest of conditions
because that's when the battery has to
work the hardest
that's what net number there does and
this is cranking amps at 32 degrees
Fahrenheit that's 675 so this is
basically what this what the amperage of
this battery can put out during those
cold conditions and that's basically how
battery capacity is measured if you
truly want to do this test you actually
go through and do some calculations
based on the cold cranking amps for the
amount of time that you would actually
hold the load on the battery in order to
determine accurate condition but this is
a quick test to basically say if you're
below 9 volts get rid of it what 9 volts
are below let's say if you do the load
test and it's below 9 volts chuck it but
if it's above 9 volts like I had there
around 11 and you're having a battery
drain problem you gotta look elsewhere
which is what I've got to do here so
here's a battery that I know is bad I've
had it charging up for a while but you
can see it's even the best charge I can
get is not even 12 volts but when you
hit the load way down there so yeah and
I won't even come back up so that's what
a bad battery normally does like I said
I could do a whole video just on
batteries and how they work and all that
and I probably will at some point in the
future but this is just to quickly show
you what the check and what to look for
while you're checking it questions
comments always welcome that kind of
thing down below here you can always
visit me at Air Cargo com a link is also
posted below in here and you know as
usual I
to go out there into the world and
really think about what it is to stay
dirty

Lets try some periods. commas, Capitals and paragraphs.
I'm of the opinion I've even seen brand new cars come in that barely crank over, and I wonder if they are gonna crank over. In fact I've had customers with new cars come in and say my car's not cranking very fast can you check the battery. I agree with them it seems that these days that batteries at least that come with the vehicle originally are engineered within a couple of electrons of just enough, and they're probably doing this to save cost. But as a result if the battery gets weak in any way shape or form it could manifest in all kinds of electrical issues in the car.
Note where Eric says "engineered within a couple of electrons of just enough"

My guess as to what's going on with Henry Fit? Battery is really small. Smallest battery I have ever seen in a car. How big is it? Lets measure using the internet.
Group Size 151R
Length 7-3/4"
Width 5-1/8"
Height 7-1/4"

Stupid battery is just too small to hold enough juice to spin the starter motor. Having headlights come on because I am too stupid to turn headlight switch to the off position does not help. Headlights come on when opening the drivers door and exiting car. Headlights come on when I press the button on the key to open the doors. Henry thinks he is being helpful to help me see in the dark. Really really want to disable this 15 second headlight timer. 15 seconds is what I think the headlight delay timer is set for. Should measure it.

YouTube puts the text on the right of the screen. Below video see 3 dots. Click - Open transcript.
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Re: List of small hatchback cars

Post by markz » Feb 14 2021 9:14pm

Are there headlight lamps/bulbs that use ultra-low wattage but put out lots of lumens?
Compare LED house lamp lights to old school 60w incandescent bulbs, tbh I prefer the old school bulbs and dont care for the money savings on the electricity.

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Re: List of small hatchback cars

Post by Dauntless » Feb 15 2021 12:39am

Yes there are. LEDs, HIDs, lots of fun things.

https://bestheadlightbulbs.com/brightest-headlights/
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Re: List of small hatchback cars

Post by markz » Feb 16 2021 7:50pm

Those sound expensive. For those that want to be cool with blue'ish headlight beams, would be the same ones to install a rear wing or lower a vehicle.

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Re: List of small hatchback cars

Post by neptronix » Feb 16 2021 9:07pm

I have an interesting efficiency hack.

Some companies make teflon based lubricants meant to be used in automotive oil, power steering fluid, gear boxes, etc.
This can produce some solid proven gains in efficiency and engine life. Transmissions with this additive are know to run significantly cooler, indicating a drastic reduction in friction.

Considering how absolutely nasty Teflon is, i wouldn't want to use it in my engine oil for sure, as i don't know of a proper way to dispose it; but perhaps it could make it's way into the used oil supply chain, and produce better fuel economy for someone buying cheap oil? i don't know.

However, the fluid replacement interval for a transmission is 100,000 miles, so a half quart of Teflon being discharged from a car twice over it's life is not much of an environmental toll.

Might be worth a horsepower or two.. and a small gain in MPG.. which matters in a car like mine that has 103 horsepower, lol.
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Re: List of small hatchback cars

Post by neptronix » Feb 16 2021 9:10pm

HID lights are cool and can have a fantastic light output/tone. They don't have to be done all ricer-like, and tend to use less power.

In fact as we speak, i'm basking in one that's oriented towards producing UV rays.
The output is something like 2 times greater per watt versus an average incandescent.

Could drop ~50 watts continuous off your alternator load and free up a single MP ( monkey power ). :mrgreen:
"Love and compassion are necessities, not luxuries. Without them, humanity cannot survive." - Dalai Lama

My first major build: 1.6kW 8T MAC motor on a Trek 4500 MTB.
Monster MTB: Leafmotor 1500w @ 4kW on a Turner O2 full suspension.
The monster scooter: Heavy duty Cannondale semi recumbent - under construction.
Blue Dream: Maxaraya FS semi recumbent and high efficiency mid-drive - under construction.

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Re: List of small hatchback cars

Post by Dauntless » Feb 17 2021 1:50am

neptronix wrote:
Feb 16 2021 9:07pm
Some companies make teflon based lubricants meant to be used in automotive oil, power steering fluid, gear boxes, etc.
Ever heard of Slick 50? Teflon additives in the engine have never made a good reputation. And I understand the government has cracked down on claims that it's a good thing. But Slick 50 is still in business, so I don't know what to say.

https://www.latimes.com/archives/la-xpm ... story.html

https://www.fluoramics.com/wp-content/u ... _52-54.pdf
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Re: List of small hatchback cars

Post by markz » Feb 17 2021 5:24am

What do the professional engine builders have to say about additives and teflon?

I watch a transmission shop on youtube who tear down lots of transmissions. One video showed that whatever additives the customer added, extremely damaged the seals and gaskets. The shop could not tell the viewers which additives were used but added whatever the additive was, stunk real bad. Every seal ended up being oversized.

Channel name was Precision Transmissions out of Amarillo, Tx
https://www.youtube.com/c/PrecisionTransmission/videos

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Headlights on with ignition

Post by marty » Feb 18 2021 11:13am

marty wrote:
Feb 14 2021 9:39am
Having headlights come on because I am too stupid to turn headlight switch to the off position does not help. Headlights come on when opening the drivers door and exiting car. Headlights come on when I press the button on the key to open the doors.

Really really want to disable this 15 second headlight timer. 15 seconds is what I think the headlight delay timer is set for. Should measure it.
My goal here is to have headlights and parking lights come on when key is in run position. That it that's all. All lights on all the time for safety.

Think that having headlights and parking lights come on when car is off is not doing anything good with battery.

Preliminary plan.
CUT BLK B10
CONNECT TO LT GRN M3

Looks like the MICU Multiplex Integrated Control Unit is what I think MICU stands for. This contraption is doing all the thinking as to when the headlights come on.

Thanks to someone named marty we can all look at wire diagrams and repair information here.
2019 Honda Fit. Wiring diagrams
HEADLIGHT SWITCH

0) OFF
1) PARK
2) AUTO
3) HEAD

Wondering why nothing is connected to ● 2

If I am comprehending wire diagrams correctly? MICU decides when the headlights and parking lights should be allowed to come on. BLACK wire.

LT GRN at connector M3 is hot when ignition key is in ON position.

Would ya all like a fuse in the black wire? 10A?
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Re: List of small hatchback cars

Post by neptronix » Feb 18 2021 1:25pm

Dauntless wrote:
Feb 17 2021 1:50am
Ever heard of Slick 50? Teflon additives in the engine have never made a good reputation. And I understand the government has cracked down on claims that it's a good thing. But Slick 50 is still in business, so I don't know what to say.
I've looked extensively into this and not found any fatal flaws with using PTFE other than the environmental considerations.
It was interesting to read tufoil's website. They are more specific about the properties of their additives than any other manufacturer i've seen.

Liqui-moly from ceratec seems more environmentally friendly, but doesn't appear to deliver notable gains in many tests i've seen.
"Love and compassion are necessities, not luxuries. Without them, humanity cannot survive." - Dalai Lama

My first major build: 1.6kW 8T MAC motor on a Trek 4500 MTB.
Monster MTB: Leafmotor 1500w @ 4kW on a Turner O2 full suspension.
The monster scooter: Heavy duty Cannondale semi recumbent - under construction.
Blue Dream: Maxaraya FS semi recumbent and high efficiency mid-drive - under construction.

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Re: Headlights on with ignition

Post by marty » Feb 19 2021 6:13pm

marty wrote:
Feb 18 2021 11:13am
marty wrote:
Feb 14 2021 9:39am
Having headlights come on because I am too stupid to turn headlight switch to the off position does not help. Headlights come on when opening the drivers door and exiting car. Headlights come on when I press the button on the key to open the doors.

Really really want to disable this 15 second headlight timer. 15 seconds is what I think the headlight delay timer is set for. Should measure it.
My goal here is to have headlights and parking lights come on when key is in run position. That it that's all. All lights on all the time for safety.

Think that having headlights and parking lights come on when car is off is not doing anything good with battery.

Preliminary plan.
CUT BLK B10
CONNECT TO LT GRN M3

Looks like the MICU Multiplex Integrated Control Unit is what I think MICU stands for. This contraption is doing all the thinking as to when the headlights come on.

Thanks to someone named marty we can all look at wire diagrams and repair information here.
2019 Honda Fit. Wiring diagrams
HEADLIGHT SWITCH

0) OFF
1) PARK
2) AUTO
3) HEAD

Wondering why nothing is connected to ● 2

If I am comprehending wire diagrams correctly? MICU decides when the headlights and parking lights should be allowed to come on. BLACK wire.

LT GRN at connector M3 is hot when ignition key is in ON position.

Would ya all like a fuse in the black wire? 10A?
CORRECTION BLK B10 wire. Copy from:
2015-19 ELECTRICAL Electrical System - Testing & Troubleshooting - Fit
COMBI SW GND (LT)
Ground for combination switch
Less than 0.2V at all times

It's a ground. That explains why it's black. Going to need a relay.
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Will it smoke?

Post by marty » Feb 20 2021 12:50pm

I have come to the conclusion that I have no idea what I am doing when it comes to electricity. This Multiplex Integrated Control Unit MICU is not helping anything. This will not stop me from completing this project! Headlights on with ignition. Lets continue. Disregard all past posts. Think I was being stupid. Controlling the - input on light switch is what I did on my last car. 2003, electricity was simpler back then.

AUTOMATIC LIGHTING CONTROL UNIT-SENSOR
This is a photocell in the center at top of dashboard below the windshield. I keep a bottle cap on it so lights stay on all the time with the combo headlight switch in the AUTO position. Problem is that with light in ON mode, headlights and parking lights come on when I press button on key to open the door. Headlights also come on when you open drivers door when car is off. Think that all these lights are draining the battery.

Yes I know that the solution to this issue is to simply turn the lights off. So then how do I remember to turn them on?

Take a look.
automatic_lighting_control_unit-sensor_removal_and_installation.png
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how does a photocell work ?

After 1 minute of study, I would say more light makes more volts.

PUR / Purple wire, Terminal 2, Terminal name TSUN, What the frock does TSUN stand for? The SUN is that big hot thing in the sky. It makes light.

PUR / Purple wire 0.2V when its dark. 4.9V in bright light. Use a relay. If ya been hanging out at:
https://www.the12volt.com/relays/relaydiagrams.html
Ya familiar with these relays. Think they were originally used in Chrysler?
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Cut the Purple wire. Using relay, Wire it so when ignition is in RUN position, Purple wire gets cut. Where does this Purple wire go? Not seeing it in all the drawings? To the unknown? I need a picture. OK here goes a picture. Will it smoke? Will this work?
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marty   10 MW

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Headlights on with ignition

Post by marty » Feb 20 2021 1:10pm

After thinking about this? If I thinking correctly? At night things will be exactly as they are now.
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Dauntless   100 GW

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Re: List of small hatchback cars

Post by Dauntless » Feb 20 2021 1:49pm

neptronix wrote:
Feb 18 2021 1:25pm
I've looked extensively into this and not found any fatal flaws with using PTFE other than the environmental considerations.
It was interesting to read tufoil's website.
The question is of efficacy. I remember it used to be something like 50 times the price of a quart of oil. And nobody can prove it actually DOES anything.
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neptronix   100 GW

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Re: List of small hatchback cars

Post by neptronix » Feb 22 2021 11:51am

Dauntless wrote:
Feb 20 2021 1:49pm
The question is of efficacy. I remember it used to be something like 50 times the price of a quart of oil. And nobody can prove it actually DOES anything.
They have proven that these fluids work actually. The biggest indicator is significantly lowered heat in all the tests in gearboxes. And in the case of the transmission, a ~$30 bottle every 100,000 miles which provides even a 1% gain in fuel economy over time is very economical.

Most importantly, PTFE reduces friction in cold conditions, so it will have a huge impact when the car is cold. This reportedly has a big impact in transmission longevity.

Drivetrain losses in a car are in the 15% range. The transmission is probably ~10% of that loss. So the transmission is a sizeable target.
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markz   100 GW

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Re: List of small hatchback cars

Post by markz » Mar 03 2021 8:19pm

I'd prefer a vehicle that does not record driving data
https://www.ctvnews.ca/sports/detective ... -1.5332382
Detectives look at SUV's 'black box' from Tiger Woods crash

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