FLYING with electricity

markobetti said:
http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=16728
Check out HALS pimped motor :) , maybe you can fly with this :) ?

Yah man! The glider is a pretty efficient rig w/its long wing span and light weight... Watt you guys need to do (if you want to sell to the folks that fly "normal" small planes) is offer two (or more) of those 12kW motors on one shaft, the way the electric drag racers have been remaking their fork lift motors... :D

Cheers
Lock
 
Yea Lock, that's the ticket!

Nice to see the propeller assembly can be retracted because a stalled blade acts like an air brake.
 
Nice Miles!

Closer video look at the plane here:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/technology/8394881.stm

...and their web site here:
http://www.solarimpulse.com/

from their site, "Specialized Partners" include:
Air Energy GmbH & Co KG: Lithium batteries and battery management
http://www.airenergy.de/html/index_english.html

Etel SA: Electric motor specialist, propulsion
http://www.etel.ch/

Institut de microtechnique de l'Université de Neuchâtel: Photovoltaic technology expert and specialist of new solar cells manufacturing processes
http://www2.unine.ch/imt

Micro-Beam SA: Electric motor driver specialist
http://www.microbeam.ch/

and other suppliers include:
AC Propulsion
Beringer (wheels and brakes I guess)
Sunpower (solar cells I guess)


tks
Lock
 
http://translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&sl=de&tl=en&u=http%3A%2F%2Fhome.arcor.de%2Ful-minimum%2Fminimum1%2B1.htm

:)
 
Nice! "E-Minimum"...

Michael Kellermann from Nürnberg, come on down!

minimum-e2.jpg


minimum-e1.jpg


Bits from Google Translate:
The euphoria of an electric motor with foot-launched - better ULs to 120 kg - knows no limits.

Even for the minimum is such a drive was built. Of course he is not allowed. This can now (spring 2009), no claim to the producers and hobbyists. The new rules have to be regulated only by the association. But a few photos so you can watch already.

Michael Kellermann from Nuremberg (09 11 - 53 59 05) has this black - Electrical - created minimum and assembled. It is not flown to date (Aero-Messe in Friedrichshafen, 2009) yet. But the racing season has indeed begun.

And when the battery is empty - no problem to recharge, you can fly with the gasoline engine. The E-unit can be replaced without great expense to the motor unit with the solo-stroke engines.

Man did Google mangle that :)

Lock
 
Dude! Dual Turnigy Outrunners! Very nice, I wonder what controller he is using. It's amazing how electric flight is now borrowing bits from the RC market just like we are doing on bikes. Great minds think alike?
 
etard said:
I wonder what controller he is using.

Judging by the circled leads in the picture

minimum-e2.jpg

I am going out on a limb and saying rc controllers of some type
the motors don't look to be sensored so would count out anythig but
i believe. I would also like to know the brand hes using etard he's puting
alot of faith (and his life i guess) into a pair of $US99 motors... Although
i gather if the motors die he can glide to terra firma?

KiM
 
i like the project but i agree with kim . the guy has a Diesel engine also , so if they stop he simply drives on diesel engine. ...
 
Flytec is now listing Dr.Ecks motors plus controllers for sale.
http://www.flytec.ch/e-drive/home.htm

Two flavours, 10kW (about $2,700US) and 13.5kW ($3,350US)... Then they want you to buy their controllers (10kw $1,680, 13.5kW $2,300US) and they have a separate controller "graphical interface" unit for about $670US

View attachment Flytec.jpg

Their description for the 10HP unit:
HPD 10

The HPD 10 motor is a notably lightweight, slowly running drive, coming with a very high specific performance and paramount efficiency. The drive is designed for the relatively low operational speed of directly driven 2-blade air screws of 1.3 to 1.5 m diameter, providing the highest possible efficiency along with only slight noise level.
It is in fact a PPS device (polyphase permanently energised solenoid synchronal machine), which is operated by a tri-phase output stage DST as brushless direct current motor. The motor has a current consumption of 190A at rated power of 10kW and electric continuous operation at 52 V battery voltage. It achieves herewith a rated speed of 2100 min-1 and a torque of 42 Nm. The threshold values are approx. 220 to 230 A, according to the output stage cooling, or 50 Nm torque accelerated during take-off phase.

The motor can also be supplied for a lower specific rotation speed/voltage upon request.

Technical Data HPD 10

max. voltage : 58 V
specific idle running speed: 47 U/min/V
specific nominal load speed: 42 U/min/V
rotational speed limit value: 2500 U/min
rated current : 190 A
max. motor current: up to 230A (in accordance to cooling)
Max. stator-temperature: 100° C
max. rated input power: 10'000 VA
nominal effectiveness: approx. > 93%
internal resistance phase to phase: 7,8 mOhm
total inductance phase to phase: 14,5 µH
Ri: 7,8 mOhm
coiling number: 36
magnetic pole numberl: 42
coil number: 18/36
constant torque: 0,22 Nm/A
Hallsensor feedback: without
vector group: delta connection
weight incl. connecting line: 3,75 kg
dimensions: dia. 21,8 cm – length: 7,1 cm



and their "Motor Management System"
Motormanagement system

Brushless direct current motors need an electronic controller which enables the rotary motion. The three components SDC, SDI and DST constitute a unit:
the motor management system.
The setpoint for the motor voltage, as well as the enabling of the motor are effected by the operating unit SDI (Smart Drive Interface). The central control SDC (Smart Drive Control) monitors all functions and transmits the preprocessed setpoint signal to the output stage DST (frequency converter). The output stage DST is directly powered by the battery. The DST converts the direct current into a three-phase alternating current which constitutes in the stator the rotary field for the motor.

The SDC constitutes the central element of the entire motor management. The SDC monitors the motor, the battery, the electric power, the enabling signals and the system monitoring. When developing the device, the highest possible safety for motor and the user was an essential aspect. All process conditions are monitored by two independent processors. As soon as an unsafe condition appears, either caused by failure, or by incorrect operating conditions, the SDC cuts off the system. The motor is safely decelerated and then switched to currentless mode. Due to the functional principle of the brushless direct current motor it is impossible that the motor just starts to rotate.


Not sure whether the motor requires that large cooling fan or not :wink:

Tks
Lock
 
Lock said:
Two flavours, 10kW (about $2,700US) and 13.5kW ($3,350US)... Then they want you to buy their controllers (10kw $1,680, 13.5kW $2,300US) and they have a separate controller "graphical interface" unit for about $670US

In aviation, weight is crucial. All manufacturers know that the first step is to lighten the aviator's wallet.

Nick
 
Hehe... sounds like the marine world... lighter wallets and heavier boats... :lol:
I assume the flytec product is built to very high quality and efficiency standards
tks
loCk
 
Apologies if this was posted before, but here is another self-feathering (so awesome) solution. I used to fly a Skywalk Tequila paraglider and happened on their site again today and ran into this using the Eck motor:

http://www.skywalk.info/News/article/1817
http://www.razeebuss.com
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TyFP2eDtQJw

Very expensive, but I really love that the batt is in the front to balance the weight more.
 
Hi,
I´m Johannes from Nürnberg and I´m involved into the Elektro-Minimum project of Mr. Kellermann.

Here some tech. specs:
Two BLDC motors from Hobbyking, 8Kw peak each.
Two Jeti Spin 200 speed controllers
Battery: LiFePo 10Ah each cell , i guess there are 12 cells serial and four of these packs parallel ( I first had to ask him what the actual configuration of the batteries)

And here some pics:

4064132964_b7119dc26d.jpg


(My DIY-Segway in front)

4064135322_afbe391d98.jpg


4063385423_050bf5ddc7.jpg


4064131760_bc35d18a19.jpg


For more pictures just take a look at my Flickr page:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/37711826@N07/sets/"]http://www.flickr.com/photos/37711826@N07/sets

This solution is working very well for the first version of this drive, it has a feasible rate of climb and a 10min runtime on full throttle.
The next big changes will be a direct drive with a single motor and the change from LiFePo4 cells toward LiPo cells from Kokam.

@AussieJester: Your fears about these chinese motors are absolutely justified, the rotor bell is too weak and at a certain rpm it starts to fall in resonance....wich means that the magnets can get loose!!! :shock:
With a reinforced rotor its working well for testing, but the final version will have a singe motor of higher quality and durability.

If you have any questions i can hand them over to the owner of this.
 
Fabulous Johannes! Welcome to the Endless Sphere. Interesting to note both folding and fixed props in the pics? I'm guessing the folder was an improvement?
Also curious to know what a ten minute run-time translates to as typical flight times (guessing that most time spent aloft is just unpowered gliding?)
Cheers
Lock
 
someone with some aeronautical expertise tell me why you couldn't take something like this
01.jpg


and then add two of those colossus 12kw motors driving each their own propeller like those nice folding jobs our new friend has on his. house all the batteries and electronics in that center enclosure instead of the jet engine that they plan on putting in there. better yet have one of each and have them be interchangable. I wonder how much weight would be added to throw some of that nano solar film over the top of the whole thing, it could add range and allow the thing to charge in the sun when you are not using it.
 
some other interesting prop design, changes the pitch of the prop while in use. I don't think you would be able to fold the blades down with this design, but it could be used to increase the efficiency of the whole system.
http://www.ultralightnews.com/Ivoprop/inflightultralightmodel.htm
electricpropsystem.JPG


though I must say that it is quite expensive and complex. the folding prop seems like it could be done diy, but the pitch changing one seems to have to many parts that would be hard to replicate with off the shelf parts.
 
gestalt said:
someone with some aeronautical expertise tell me why you couldn't take something like this...
HAHA! Had to look that up. Fabulous! It's intended primarily as a glider, so only powered for ten minutes of flight time. Plans called for a jet engine... Couldn't find any details about amount of thrust involved... `Steada "exterior" props, perhaps replace the jet with electric fan?

This RC model good for 28lbs thrust...
TF_8000_1.jpg


Lock
 
gestalt said:
some other interesting prop design, changes the pitch of the prop while in use...

Nice one gestalt... from that page:
This results in substantial savings in fuel, engine wear and noise.

It'd be nice to see some actual figures on fuel savings/how efficiency changes with the pitch... The sense I get for the powered paragliders and fixed wing ultralights is that they motor off the ground and some inflight but also switch off and glide much of the time? Better to utilize thermals to maintain height versus battery power? Anyway, if so, I'll guess the folding prop would generate better overall efficiency over the length of flight if unpowered gliding is part of the plan...
Lock
 
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