New Crystalyte 5403 Review by Doc

Doctorbass

100 GW
Joined
Apr 8, 2007
Messages
7,495
Location
Quebec, Canada East
I just received my 5403 motor from Maxwell65 and as i never keep any ebike parts as is i wanted to open it and take a look of what it look like and wanted to share that with you :wink:

Hmmm!! I smell that great fresh new varnish in my lab... it seem that i have a 5400 motor opened :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen:

I will also measure all parameters that will help to include it in the ebike simulator and also the SWbluto simulator.

I took more than 40 different dimensions for your informations.

Please be advised that this motor construction have nothing to do with the known HS, HX, 9C, bafag etc.. THIS IS A TRUE BEAST.. this is the V8 454 of the ebike motor !

Heavy strong, wide so if you are lycra and hope to get a lightweight motor for your carbon fiber frame of 10 pounds.. This toy is not for you!

If you want to put 5kW+ in this motor without to bother with heat this is what you need

This is the 5403, Everything that the old great known X5 is but more powerfull and still tough as the X5 is.

My guess is that you can put more kW into this motor due to the wider stator armature and renforced wider magnets steel ring.

Old X5300 was 32.5mm wide and now the 5400 is 43.5mm wich is 33% wider and better copper fill and more steel for the winding.

WINDING NOT COMPRESSED ( larger motor width)
-Also they did not compressed the winding width to reduce the width. ( just like if they would put the winded motor into a press to redice the width of the winding width...)
The first X5 gen( with the rounded side cover) had a little bit the winding compressed.
The last gen of X5 ( with narrower motor width had the winding FULLY compressed was actyally really flat! on each side)

This lastest X5 gen ( X5400) is NOT compressed! I guess this reduce the stress on the winding skin and leave it in natural state.

The room between the wider area of winding and the side cover inner side is 3mm space




ELECTRICAL PARAMETERS:


Phase to Phase DC resistance ( direct at the junction of the winding terminal and the phase wire so no phase wire resistance included)
Current: 10.0A, Voltage across phase to phase 1.042V Resistance = 104.2 miliohm

Inductance Phase to Phase : ( measured across the phase wire wich change nothing to the inductance of the winding)
= 0.341mH

It's interesting to compare with the previous gen 5303 crystalyte motor parameters:

-inductance between two phase wire:

5303: 0.169mH
5403: 0.341mH

-DC resistance between two phase wires

5303: 0.097ohm
5403: 0.104ohm

( see also my comparison between all X5 crystalyte motor here:http://www.endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=16&t=19301&p=281141#p281141


MECHANICAL PARAMETERS:
Here is 56 pictures for your answer 8)
 

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Next:
 

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NExt:
 

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Looks like 16 gauge wires... perfect.. :lol:

Thing is a monster.. keep it coming!
 
neptronix said:
Looks like 16 gauge wires... perfect.. :lol:

Thing is a monster.. keep it coming!

It's actually 12 gauge. I compared with the turnigy 12 gauge and they look pretty similar diameter of conductor diameter

See pics

Doc
 

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Whoops! They looked so small compared to the anderson connectors. My mistake :)
 
neptronix said:
Whoops! They looked so small compared to the anderson connectors. My mistake :)


Yeah .. these are the PP75 amp comnnector not the PP30 :wink:
 
That's a big hub.

I wonder how much of a difference in efficiency this will be over my 1kW Golden, when its being fed 8kW. My little 12 FET is only good for about 9kW before it explodes, so I'm probably going to have to keep it at 80A until I get a gigantic controller.

Mine will probably show up Monday. Now, I just need to wait for my snazzy swingarm to show up, and my commuter can start doing rolling burnouts past lycra.

What kind of speeds should I expect in a 26" on 24S LiPo, 120% throttle? I'd take 52-55.
 
you will easily get that. With the 5304 and those settings I see between 55 and 60 mph.
Thanks for the picks Doc; i was foaming at the mouth to see it... Not dissapointed :)
 
ZOMGVTEK said:
What kind of speeds should I expect in a 26" on 24S LiPo, 120% throttle? I'd take 52-55.

I hope its a lot more than that.... My 5304 does exactly 52-55mph @ 100v 80amps. I would hope the 5403 will do mid 60's @ 100v 100amps.
 
ZOMGVTEK said:
That's a big hub.

I wonder how much of a difference in efficiency this will be over my 1kW Golden, when its being fed 8kW. My little 12 FET is only good for about 9kW before it explodes, so I'm probably going to have to keep it at 80A until I get a gigantic controller.

Mine will probably show up Monday. Now, I just need to wait for my snazzy swingarm to show up, and my commuter can start doing rolling burnouts past lycra.

What kind of speeds should I expect in a 26" on 24S LiPo, 120% throttle? I'd take 52-55.

My 5303 and 25.5 inchs wheel ( maxxis 24 x 3.0) and 30s lipo and 11kW is exactly 113kmh ( 70mph)

With the added torque this motor give i expect to get the 80mph with 15kW continuous.

This motor will compete seriously with the cromotor i think. Yes it weight alot more.. but the new motor armature that contain more copper and more steel will be a great benefit !

Doc
 
ryan said:
As someone who just rewired the phase and halls for an x5304, how is it that these don't pinch and break more often?

I only had onw problem with the hall wires on a X5. these seem to be good and the room in the axel is enough to carry 3 x 10 gauge wires + 5 hall little wires.

If you take care to not pinch the wires, they will last as long as you keep the motor.

Doc
 
I have tested the original 12 gauge teflon and the PP75 connector for fun.

I connected two of the phase wires using the stock PP75 connector and connected my 0-100A psu set to 50A.

After 5 minutes of continuous 50A current, the two 12gauge teflon wire of the hub motor came to 60 celsius wich is not bad !

Teflon melt at 260 celsius... :twisted:

Doc
 
Hey Doc, great information. Can you do a video of the motor running so that we can hear it at speed?

Ambrose
 
Accountant said:
Tell us about the exact weight please.

The total weight is exactly 15kg ( 33pounds including the washers, nuts and axel spacers that's) that's 7.5 more pounds than the previous X5300 serie

Everythging look to be made STRONG on that motor!.. more copper, more steel etc. It will certainly take more time to overheat.... wich is perfect for drag race :twisted: :twisted:

I will run it once i will have upgarded the phase wires for 10 gauge one and also.

I have two plans with this one: running at 30s lipo on my kelly ( max 293A burst)

or running 20s lipo or 24s LiFePO4 A123 with my 36 fets EXTREME 4110 version ( expect 450A burst)

Doc
 
Tehre is something that i dont understand:

I have looked at the previous pictures that LOWRACER posted about his 5404 motor and it look like his stator sides was compressed, making it narower and the motor magnet ring look like narrower too :|

Here is the one of Lowracer:` ( the 5404)
file.php


http://www.endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=24805&hilit=5400




On mine the stator sides is not compressed and the rotor magnet ring is wider :|

file.php



The overal motor i got is wider and the side covers are a trade off between the last gen X5 and the first gen X5 . It have the Hex screw really apparent adding width to the motor

file.php



But his motor is really narrow with the screw and side cover narrower... and also it look like the overall width seem like 1.5cm narrower on the Lowracer motor :?

file.php



Well.. this extra width can be considered as pros or cons... It can be used as extra room for installing better inside cooling... or it can be considered as difficult to fit in a bicycle swing arm...

I will contact Max about this important difference..

So that mean it exist TWO version of this 5400 serie motor....

Doc
 
According to this picture the winding is adding 6.5mm extra on both side of the stator ( 13mm for both side)

http://www.endless-sphere.com/forums/download/file.php?id=52793

Wich is 55mm total width for his stator...
You can see here how it was flattened after the compression:
file.php



Here you can see the 6.5mm width of unwounded copper on each side
file.php




On mine i measured: 64mm wich is 9mm wider!!! so on the Lowracer stator the winding is compressed by 4.5mm on each side! ( just like the last gen X5 was....


But on mine it's exactly like the previous gen X%.. uncompressed...

file.php


Lowracer got a botor that weight 12kg INCLUDING THE RIM AND SPOKES
file.php




Mine is 15kg MOtor ONLY.... WTF !! :shock:
 
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