Dr.Bass Steveo found 7s3p Module! Awesome Price!!

Let me throw in a comment on Rickards test. I would bet with his method of bottom balancing that he was not discharging with a cell level BMS. We don't know if his method of use killed two cells that were "weak"... but how weak were they really? Would a cell level BMS operating have saved the battery? Lots of detail missing in Jacks video.
 
bigmoose said:
Let me throw in a comment on Rickards test. I would bet with his method of bottom balancing that he was not discharging with a cell level BMS. We don't know if his method of use killed two cells that were "weak"... but how weak were they really? Would a cell level BMS operating have saved the battery? Lots of detail missing in Jacks video.
We know the cells were in a 3P configuration, since capacity is shared in a parallel setup I'd think the only way an individual cell could be at a lower voltage and SOC than the other two in the parallel string would be if it's a bad cell. Cells in parallel act as a single cell, unless one is defective.
 
JRP3 said:
Sutho said:
Why would you expect that these will be new and undamaged when they have most likely been pulled from an existing vehicle?

Because I don't believe all the modules they have were removed from vehicles. It seems a lot of them have been, but I believe that once A123 detected there was a problem with their modules, they stopped installing them in vehicles and backdoored them.

Victpower originally sent me some photos of some modules that appeared to be untouched. I am hoping that all the ones I receive are like this. Maybe just wishful thinking.....
 
Sutho said:
Buyers should not expect this module purchase to be entirely hassle-free. If that was going to be the case, A123 would have kept the modules and we would not have access to them at all....particularly at the price they are (were) selling for.

Totally agree, we cannot expect these to be perfect... We have to make sure not to put too much pressure on the supplier, or else they will no longer supply us.
 
SlyCayer said:
Sutho said:
Buyers should not expect this module purchase to be entirely hassle-free. If that was going to be the case, A123 would have kept the modules and we would not have access to them at all....particularly at the price they are (were) selling for.

Totally agree, we cannot expect these to be perfect... We have to make sure not to put too much pressure on the supplier, or else they will no longer supply us.

And where are they gonna stuff those modules or cells if not to us salvaging cents and going the cheap road? Bottom line is you get what you pay for.
 
HumboldtRc said:
Both sets of buss bars take solder after you scrape them with a knife.

The funny thing about the battery size is, my pit-bike battery box is 9.5 x 9.5 x 7", which is basically exactly the same size. But I can hold 6s 80ah of HK lipo in it. Compared to 7s 60ah of A123 cells, basically 50% volume difference between them.

Thanks for the pics, vid, and details!

I haven't seen your LiPo setup, but aren't you comparing LiFePO4 packaged in a protective case engineered to Western standards, to a LiPo pack that is essentially pouch cells in shrinkwrap? In one of my ancient threads about using a123 prisimatics, I did a comparison of an a123 prisimatic pack packaged similar to HK lipo, and found that LiPo was 15% lighter, and IIRC was 35-40% smaller. However, I did not include the weight or volume of the parallel/series power harness, charging harness, or BMS/LVC/monitoring boards that go into a LiPo setup, that I don't need for a123.

-JD
 
Sutho said:
They are dispatching 12 units today and 10 tomorrow.

22 units with 7s3p :shock: that makes conservatively 400v and 60Ah ... :twisted:
Are they meant for your DeLorean car conversion to EV project?
Impressive to decide to go with A123 instead of CALB .... :oops:
Only point, after I saw the pictures of the module ... It looks to me very painful to
operate modifications or repairs to that bitch of configuration if any cell goes dead .... :?

I was thinking of getting one module to turn it in a 18s1p -and 3 spare- pack, but
having seen how it is engineered, I see just plenty of pain :cry:

have fun!
 
I got part of my shipment today, and the 28s3p might be delivered this afternoon. Three 7s3p modules in a box weighed 102lbs. As you can see, they are indeed pretty rough, 2 modules were at 22.x v and the third at 19.x v, so I assume it has a bad 3p cell. The side of one box is slathered with thermopaste (yecch). I am booked for this evening, but I'll open them up if I have time. The 28s3p is the type of pack I want to use most, I hope it is in better shape.

-JD
 

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Interesting - this must be how they intended to heatsink them?

They do look a lot rougher than their photos would have suggested.

Do you reckon you would fit 6 in a Vectrix? Maybe I should just finish mine with the thunderskys... :p
 
zEEz said:
Sutho said:
They are dispatching 12 units today and 10 tomorrow.

22 units with 7s3p :shock: that makes conservatively 400v and 60Ah ... :twisted:
Are they meant for your DeLorean car conversion to EV project?
Impressive to decide to go with A123 instead of CALB .... :oops:
Only point, after I saw the pictures of the module ... It looks to me very painful to
operate modifications or repairs to that bitch of configuration if any cell goes dead .... :?

I was thinking of getting one module to turn it in a 18s1p -and 3 spare- pack, but
having seen how it is engineered, I see just plenty of pain :cry:

have fun!

Yes....these modules were destined for the Delorean....if they are up to par. :roll:

If not, I will probably go with some high power LiMn204 modules. Current waiting for some sample of these to arrive as well.....
 
oatnet said:
2 modules were at 22.x v and the third at 19.x v, so I assume it has a bad 3p cell.
Did they offer you the same free replacement guarantee (+shipping you pay) just as they did for Sutho? :?:

Sutho, I hope that guarantee would *not* require you to return the bad module, because it would be a "worthless" guarantee if you had to do that. It seems just a digital picture showing the lower "defective voltage" of the pack voltage emailed to them should be sufficient to get a free module replacement (+shipping).

Oatnet is very experienced in configuring batteries & doing the spot welding etc., so he will be a good judge about repairing & replacing the 3p cells. I'm guessing all 3 cells must be bad now, since you're down 3v+. Nothing looks damaged from shipping, so it seems one of these modules was *not* really checked for correct pack voltage just before shipment? :?:

Oatnet, I sure hope your 28s3p module is perfect. :)
 
deVries said:
Sutho, I hope that guarantee would *not* require you to return the bad module, because it would be a "worthless" guarantee if you had to do that. It seems just a digital picture showing the lower "defective voltage" of the pack voltage emailed to them should be sufficient to get a free module replacement (+shipping).
No way, too easy to fake, and the "bad" module still has valuable components, as you know. Basically everyone better be ready to keep whatever they get.
 
Pressed for time, but I know you guys wanted some 28s3p Pron, so here it is. The DHL guy walked up to my garage with this 100+lb box in his arms like it was nuttin. :shock: 91.8v=3.28v/cell, quite reasonable for a half discharged pack. Right off the bat, I can tell these packs were meant to be sitting on a hard surface, not self-supported. I am sure the dents in packs came from them being boxed up, and the scratches could well have come from being moved around. I do get the sense that the pack is used.

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Received our three 28s3p packs today. Two modules are significantly out of square. It seems this is due to the shipping packaging or improper handling. All three modules are used and have heatsink compound on their bottom.

One of the significantly out of square modules has one corner of the black plastic top crushed and broken. The cell under the broken corner is crushed and there are a few other cells with tops pushed in. This module is reading only 25.7 volts. The crushed corner cell is shorted. The others cells mostly read between 0.5 and 1.0 volts. I would say this module was likely bad before shipment.

The other very out of square/bowed module with one large dent and some bent aluminum plate corners has a voltage of 92.5 volts. All its cells read very close to each other at 3.29 +/- 0.02 volts open circuit.

The third module is reading 77.4 volts. Each cell group is reading around 2.75 volts. This module is the most square of the three and its shipping crate bottom was not pushed and bowed out near as much as the other two.
 
Looking at the 28S3P packs that have been recd by other members i'm glad i have ordered three.
Fingers crossed I might get two good ones out of that :shock:

I was told there is no warranty anymore when I placed my order, so we are stuck with whatever we get.
If i wanted a warranty they would not sell them to me. :(

I suggest charge your 2.75v pack asap.
 
zaxxon said:
Received our three 28s3p packs today. Two modules are significantly out of square. It seems this is due to the shipping packaging or improper handling. All three modules are used and have heatsink compound on their bottom.

One of the significantly out of square modules has one corner of the black plastic top crushed and broken. The cell under the broken corner is crushed and there are a few other cells with tops pushed in. This module is reading only 25.7 volts. The crushed corner cell is shorted. The others cells mostly read between 0.5 and 1.0 volts. I would say this module was likely bad before shipment.

The other very out of square/bowed module with one large dent and some bent aluminum plate corners has a voltage of 92.5 volts. All its cells read very close to each other at 3.29 +/- 0.02 volts open circuit.

The third module is reading 77.4 volts. Each cell group is reading around 2.75 volts. This module is the most square of the three and its shipping crate bottom was not pushed and bowed out near as much as the other two.
Since these large sized modules with more weight/size are *NOT* being crated with enough foam protection, which is obvious from Oatnet's pics, this may be a good reason to order the smaller 7s3p modules *and* get each module crated separate! Don't combine modules in one box.

If ordering the 28s3p, then I definitely suggest *insisting* that much more foam protection is used. These modules are expensive & there is no reason -or- "excuse" they should not package these much more carefully with foam padding all sides AND also covering the total entire module surface area too, imo. :idea:

Zaxxon, where were your three 28s3p modules shipped to? :?:
 
It looks as if the wood itself is not strong enough to contain the pack weight, I'm not sure adding more foam would prevent the bowing, though it would add some protection. Really disappointing that they are willing to ship a module that is at 27 volts.
 
JRP3 said:
deVries said:
Sutho, I hope that guarantee would *not* require you to return the bad module, because it would be a "worthless" guarantee if you had to do that. It seems just a digital picture showing the lower "defective voltage" of the pack voltage emailed to them should be sufficient to get a free module replacement (+shipping).
No way, too easy to fake, and the "bad" module still has valuable components, as you know. Basically everyone better be ready to keep whatever they get.
:lol: I have to disagree.

Seriously, how many DIY guys here buying these modules are going to lie, cheat, fake, steal about receiving a defective module! :shock: Zero! IMO. We are not thieves. We just want exactly what we were told we were getting... no more no less. That's a perfectly reasonable expectation and a standard that everyone can & should stand by... on both sides of this equation, meaning, seller & buyer. :idea:

Yes, we have to keep what is defective, since it would be unreasonable to return it. :wink:

oatnet said:
Three 7s3p modules in a box weighed 102lbs.
JD, please post the weight of just one module & check if there are any significant weight differences between the three 7s3p. Thanks! :D
HumboldtRC said:
The modules dimensions are 6.5" wide x 9" long x 9.5" tall

I don't own a scale, besides my little one I got from HK, so no weight. The shipping crate said 31kg and I think the cream weighs ~4 pounds, so the modules could weight 14.5kg...?? I'll take them to the a shipping store tomorrow and weigh them.
Have you had a chance to check the weight of your modules? We need to get an accurate weight for these modules. Thanks! :D
 
deVries said:
JRP3 said:
deVries said:
Sutho, I hope that guarantee would *not* require you to return the bad module, because it would be a "worthless" guarantee if you had to do that. It seems just a digital picture showing the lower "defective voltage" of the pack voltage emailed to them should be sufficient to get a free module replacement (+shipping).
No way, too easy to fake, and the "bad" module still has valuable components, as you know. Basically everyone better be ready to keep whatever they get.
:lol: I have to disagree.

Seriously, how many DIY guys here buying these modules are going to lie, cheat, fake, steal about receiving a defective module! :shock: Zero! IMO. We are not thieves. We just want exactly what we were told we were getting... no more no less. That's a perfectly reasonable expectation and a standard that everyone can & should stand by... on both sides of this equation, meaning, seller & buyer. :idea:

Yes, we have to keep what is defective, since it would be unreasonable to return it. :wink:
Yes, you'll get to keep it, and you won't get a refund. The seller has already stated as much. I'm sure everyone here is quite honest. I'm equally sure that the seller in China is not going to count on that honesty and start sending free replacement packs on the basis of a picture of a voltmeter.
 
Also, if you bring up the issue of their packing, you need to tread lightly. This vendor has already threatened to not sell to us over seas customers. If packing them becomes too problematic, they may just say no more sales. Trust me when I say they really don't need our business. There is more than enough of a market in china for these things. They really don't "need" to sell them out of country.
 
Guys, again, they are watching this tread. If you write here that you are ready to swallow every s**t do not expect anything else afterwards. In China are thousands of Victpowers and if some get international then they really need it, local marked is full. :|
 
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