Cycle Analyst V3 preview and first beta release

teklektik said:

I ran some tests last night and this morning and could not duplicate the Watts/Amps difference - but it seems that symptom was really not in play - so, okay on that count.

The Gas Gauge is a software artifact so if your CA is showing the proper voltage, there is no hardware failure that could reasonably be causing this (I don't think...). Since it persists across a reflash, it sounds like an EEPROM or configuration issue.

I know the State of Charge gets written to EEPROM on power down, so I was wondering if you had some hinky value stored away that is giving it problems. But - the SOC value should be blitzed on a re-flash since it's not in the calibration parameter section of memory - so that sort of makes the EEPROM idea invalid.

But - the Gas Gauge uses a kind of interesting algorithm that combines historical Ah and open circuit voltage to track the SOC under all circumstances. It actually switches modes and looks at the open circuit voltage when the bike has no (little) current draw since that's the only time the voltage is close to 'open circuit'. It then looks up the OC voltage in a table (by chemistry) and determines the SOC. It generally takes a bit of time when it's making adjustments to the accumulated Ah reading (which is error-prone) to correct it to the more accurate SOC derived from the OC voltage.

• So - I''m wondering if you need to zero your amps so the CA can get a proper opportunity to do the OC voltage measure/correction to the SOC. If you have a non-zero 'idle current' it may not be doing the gauge update because it thinks the voltage reading will not really reflect OC.
  Just a guess - try the Zero Amps trick.

Failing that - maybe some more info:
Do the voltage and Ah read correctly?
What is the computed RBatt after a ride?
What are your battery config settings?

Click to expand...

wyvernwaddell said:

teklektik said:

I ran some tests last night and this morning and could not duplicate the Watts/Amps difference - but it seems that symptom was really not in play - so, okay on that count.

The Gas Gauge is a software artifact so if your CA is showing the proper voltage, there is no hardware failure that could reasonably be causing this (I don't think...). Since it persists across a reflash, it sounds like an EEPROM or configuration issue.

I know the State of Charge gets written to EEPROM on power down, so I was wondering if you had some hinky value stored away that is giving it problems. But - the SOC value should be blitzed on a re-flash since it's not in the calibration parameter section of memory - so that sort of makes the EEPROM idea invalid.

But - the Gas Gauge uses a kind of interesting algorithm that combines historical Ah and open circuit voltage to track the SOC under all circumstances. It actually switches modes and looks at the open circuit voltage when the bike has no (little) current draw since that's the only time the voltage is close to 'open circuit'. It then looks up the OC voltage in a table (by chemistry) and determines the SOC. It generally takes a bit of time when it's making adjustments to the accumulated Ah reading (which is error-prone) to correct it to the more accurate SOC derived from the OC voltage.

• So - I''m wondering if you need to zero your amps so the CA can get a proper opportunity to do the OC voltage measure/correction to the SOC. If you have a non-zero 'idle current' it may not be doing the gauge update because it thinks the voltage reading will not really reflect OC.
  Just a guess - try the Zero Amps trick.

Failing that - maybe some more info:
Do the voltage and Ah read correctly?
What is the computed RBatt after a ride?
What are your battery config settings?

Click to expand...

Thanks for the advice Teklektik..I'll try zeroing the amps in the morning and if that fails, I will grab that other info while the turkey is smoking...
Much appreciated

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Scott said:

I would like to know the specs on the external power plug coming out of the CA. I read on grin's website about using the CA to power lights and that it puts out 12.8v, but now when I look in the manual it sounds like it puts out the full voltage of the battery limited to 1A by a fuse.

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ebikes.ca said:

Power from Cycle Analyst
The included 5.5x2.1mm DC Power cable can be wired directly from the Cycle Analyst by opening the CA and soldering the red and black wires to the CA's V+ and Ground pads. Since the CA and Lumenator are usually both located on the front handlebars, this saves running the cable down to the battery pack. If you don't have a Cycle Analyst, you can make an Anderson Powerpole tap for use with Powerpole systems, or wire in to whatever connectors or terminals you have available on your battery.

Input Power
The internal DC-DC converter of the Cycle Lumenator efficiently steps down any input voltage in the range 15-100V into a constant 750mA current source driving the four Cree XP-G LEDs in series at about 12.8V. Click on the graph to the left to see the input current requirements of the light over its full input voltage range.

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teklektik said:

Not sure what you are looking for.
Please describe what did not reset.

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EdwardNY said:

I want to reset the total miles and amp hour of the batteries. In the manual for v2 it says there is a "full reset" option where you hold the button for 6 seconds after a normal reset. However, it does nothing.

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• How can I set up the CA so that the battery only gets discharged down to 10%? (Paul said keeping the battery in a charge level between 10 and 90% prolongus its lifetime)
• CA3 seems to add more cycles to the battery. I charged it 3 times and it shows 5 cycles. How does this happen?

Joe Perez said:

teklektik said:

Config parm summary updated to reflect additional linear sensor parameters...

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Thanks for that- this had been causing me some consternation prior to actually receiving the unit and seeing how it worked.

Also, a note on the use of "other" temp sensors:

I'm awaiting the delivery of a MAC motor from Cell-Man. These motors are fitted with an LM35 temperature sensor, which is different from either the LM335 or the NTC thermistor that Justin suggests. Specifically, thermistors and LM335s act like resistors or zener diodes, which conduct current to ground depending on temperature. As such the CA-3 is fitted with a pullup resistor on the "NTC" pad. Although the part number seems quite similar (LM35 vs. LM335), these devices are quite different.

The LM35 is an active device, which outputs a positive voltage which varies with temperature. Cell_Man selected this device over the passive devices which Justin suggested to enable folks without CAs to use a simple voltmeter to measure temperature (the LM35 outputs 10mv / °C, so it reads nicely on even a simple $5 voltmeter.) However the internal architecture of the LM35 is such that it won't work properly with a pullup voltage applied to its output- it can only source current, not sink it.

So, to use one of these devices, you need to remove the pullup resistor (R17) from the CA board. It's a tiny little surface-mount part, but shouldn't be too difficult if you have a pair of irons to lift it up tweezer-style:

Having removed this resistor, you can pick up 5v at the adjacent pad to supply operating power to the LM35, and then calibrate the software for 0 degrees = 0 volts and 100 degrees = 1 volt.



EDIT:

The NTC input on the CA tends to float high when unconnected, or when connected to a device which cannot sink current to ground on its output such as the LM35. With the circuit configured as described above, I saw false-high readings of 100 degrees or more, just from the stray voltages floating around the circuit.

This has been solved by simply placing a pull-down resistor between the NTC pad and ground, to eliminate the stray voltage. I've tested the circuit with a 390 ohm resistor (simply because it's the first small-value I happened to pull out of the pile), and it is now giving me a believable indication of 22-23 degrees while resting at room temperature. I haven't load-tested the bike yet to see how it performs as the motor warms up (I'm tethered to my workbench at the moment owing to the lack of a functional battery, and I found out the hard way that using your rear brake as a dyno load doesn't work for very long.)

Too low of a resistor value will negatively impact the performance of the circuit, as the output of the LM35 is relatively weak- it can only source 10ma on its output. I may experiment with larger resistor values to see if I can still hold down the float voltages while pulling less current from the LM35, though even at 390 ohms I'm loading it pretty lightly- less than 4ma at 150 degrees (1.5v).

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Animalector said:

Was there a resolution to the bug where the CA fails to boot? I don't particularly like the Fix of "turn it on and off a few times".

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Dartman said:

Hi, I like to share that I have CA v3 boot issue too, what few other has described here.

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• diagnosing this matter is a top priority, and
• Grin will promptly exchange any unit that repeatedly demonstrates this behavior - which will also have the benefit of getting additional test candidates in hand at Grin. Please contact ebikes.ca directly.