My pleasure. You should post photos of yours as well if you decide to dust her off! I could not pass up on this bike even tho i already have 4 others. Like most EV enthusiasts things tend to get out of hand I really like the look and feel of the Voloci but unfortunately I have a need for more power/speed. I have a few different plans to change things drastically, none of which are actually set in stone.Scoot440 wrote:Thanks for documenting and posting this! I have a Voloci gathering dust in my project pile and this inspires me to get to work on it!
Great information in this post! You told me a few things i already did not know. I also tried to see if he would ship the item, he must have got sick of the emails I couldn't not buy it at that price tho! all that sleek aluminum!electricalbicycle wrote:Saw that bike on ebay and wanted to buy (it was really cheap) but he wouldn't ship and that was that. Glad to see an enthusiast got it and that you are posting your ideas and results. I already like what you did with the battery (more details, please).
One thing you will find is that the stock Voloci throttle only goes from about 0 to 2.5V rather than the 0 to 5V your controller is probably expecting.
"Mopedmart" on ebay got many of the moped parts from whoever was building Volocis at the time when they went out of business. Mopedmart has the stock Voloci handlebars, headlight, forks, rear shock, controls, disc brakes, tires, headset nut, mirrors and left handlebar switch. Mopedmart has some Voloci moped parts but not things like the controller, throttle, motor, battery pack, etc.
I am troubled by the motor's Hall sensor timing as the motor stator can turn (in theory) and the Halls aren't fastened to that but rather to the frame.
I called/emailed Kollmorgen but they no longer support that motor.
Also checked with SAFT who makes the NiMH battery pack but they don't have the original drawing/spec for the battery pack and it would have been roughly 3X what they are available for locally and would take months to get here from France anyway.
Two things that I did was to replace the brakes immediately with Avid BB7 180 mm and to add the TrailTech Striker gauges (especially good for Voltage and lets you set TWO low Voltage alarms). I did LED lights but kept the Halogen headlight and replaced the flasher with one for LED lights.
The Voloci failed partly because of the battery technology. You seem to be using modern technology and I would like to know more about what cells you are using, what BMS and where it is located, what charger you are using. Are you planning to have a removable battery pack?
Thanks for posting! Those little scooters kick! literally.flathill wrote:nice score
keep the original clean look
nova cruz was way ahead of their time
Their scooter was bad ass
made in america including the bldc motor and sinus controller
made in 1999
dot com bust killed em
That is a good question on the halls. i noticed that they mounted to the left side of the frame..odd I didnt think to mess with them since they did not seem to have ever been tampered with.electricalbicycle wrote:I thought maybe your low torque was due to the motor stator moving relative to the Hall Sensors that are on the frame. IF you do take the frame apart, punch mark the stator and frame so you can get it back exactly where it was. Oh, and be really, really, really careful with the magnetic rotor and stator as you put them back together. They have a tendency to want to snap off fingers!
I have not found any service info for the Voloci. I'd love to know how to set the Hall Timing and I would love to know what parts of the firmware can be tweaked to make it go faster or be quicker off the line. I know it is no motorcycle, but acceleration is still fun.
I heard that ALL the Voloci info was on V is for Voltage site but the original site closed and all the info was lost (so I was told). Would love to have the parts list and service manual and info about the firmware code for the Voloci.
I see you have a thumb throttle for your aftermarket controller...so no need to worry about compatibility of the Voloci throttle with the controller. Next, you might make sure that the controller can put out the current that the Voloci wants (stock should be about 40A).
Voloci claims 2 hp which would be about 1500W.
The Voloci controller had the motor controller and several other functions (battery level, for example) and also had the 36V to 12V downconverter. When you install an aftermarket controller, you loose the battery level (LEDs near the handlebars) AND the 12V to run the lights and horn.
IF you are abandoning your stock controller, you can get a small DC-DC converter that will probably fit under the stock controller cover. You can also mount it under the seat. 36V and 12V are accessible at the controller and also under the seat (36V from the "ignition switch").
You will have to swap your stock turn signal flasher relay if you go to LEDs, but there are lots of LED flashers available.
BatterySpace.Com has a NiMH battery pack that will fit the stock Voloci NiMH case if you want to go that route. Check out their stock 6601.
When you search "Voloci" on the web, you will find that NYCeWheels has several articles and reviews of the original bike and that they took over production from spare parts when NovaCruz quit making them. They had a few odds and ends a couple of years ago but they are completely out of parts now (they were closing out a Voloci NiMH charger and a rear rack...but now gone). I bought a NOS controller from them a year or so ago and they said that was their last Voloci part.
My photos are on a different computer and I will have to figure out which to post.
I cant comment on that one, would all be speculation.electricalbicycle wrote:Help with a SLA Voloci?
Anyone have a stock SLA Voloci that they can post photos of? I am curious about how they connected the batteries to the controller. They have a 50A fuse and you remove the fuse before doing firmware upgrade and other service. Is that the only disconnect for the battery?
Where is the 50A fuse located? Is it inside the battery compartment or is it outside the battery compartment where it is accessible?
The original seals are still in good shape, but i have a feeling I am not going to be using the stock side covers. I may make new ones down the road. Still have an idea! Thanks for all of your pictures and knowledge on the Voloci so far, it has been an interesting read! I saved all of your pics to my HD just incase, the picture of the new ones boxed is *drool*electricalbicycle wrote:I am not sure how important sealing all the parts is. The controller should probably be well sealed. The rubber o-ring may be a problem, so I used Teflon Valve Packing. This stuff is like string and you just lay it in the groove that used to hold the rubber ring.
There are rubber rings on both sides of the motor stator where the touch the side plates and a rubber ring on the controller cover.
I saw this website, i read the ES post from fetcher on him flashing his friends Voloci. I had a feeling I wasn't going to go that route, but you never know i kept all the stock parts. Could come in handy some day.electricalbicycle wrote:http://www.kanda.com/blog/general/resur ... motorbike/
(or just search for "Kanda Voloci")
These guys make a keyfob flasher that on which they will load the Voloci firmware 3.12 from the web. This makes flashing the last code into any Voloci controller very simple.
I don't have the history of the various versions of the code but 3.12 was last and was stable. I THINK that earlier codes may have allowed faster acceleration and maybe a mile or two faster (again, not sure). I think they may have slowed the bike a bit in order to get more miles per charge (again, my guess).
PS they are very nice people...
commented on this a little earlier, but as you'll see things are a bit different now, when you purchased the 2 new Voloci's how is the power? do they pull you at 30mph up hill and take off quick? cause it seemed weaker than a 36v hub on a bicycle to me. But then again I was using a regular brushless controller(3 different types/voltages). I'm not sure if it being sine wave or not has anything to do with it. It's not weak battselectricalbicycle wrote:Low speed/low torque on a Voloci could be that the throttle output is too low for an aftermarket controller (Voloci only goes to about 2.5V where controllers expect about twice that).
Or, could be that the aftermarket controller is set too low .
Or, could be that the stator moved relative to the Hall Sensors (or vice versa)
Or, could be bad phase on motor or controller
Or, could be misconnection of phases. The Voloci motor wires do not come out of the motor/frame A-B-C, two of the wires are reversed.
Or, could be weak batteries
Or, could be current limiting on the battery pack
Or, could be bad connection between battery and controller or between controller and motor
It's been a while, sorry for the late reply. Thanks for all the info you've added to this thread. The hub motor is a little 2 heavy for the bike. And as of now the project is on a slight hiatus for a few reasons. First I got the new BHT brushless motor and I'm mounting it to my other bicycle frame at the moment and secondly... I'm in the works of getting a custom swingarm made for the Voloci to accept the hub and make it a little stronger.electricalbicycle wrote:WOW!
You've done a lot!
I gave a thought to putting in a hub motor in the rear and will be very interested in your experiences. I checked out a 3kw (or thereabouts) rear hub at a e-bike conversion place and thought it was too heavy...and that ended that. Everything else about converting the Voloci to rear hub motor appealed to me but the weight put me off.
i thought the "unsprung weight" would affect the ride too much. My guess, not having done it. I am looking forward to your report. I may yet re-think my re-thinking.
My current thinking is that I may use a "mid-motor" on a special bracket that I need to design and have made up. The bracket would allow the motor to extend to however far it needs to on the left and right of the frame and it can be as large a diameter as it needs to be. I would keep the chain length the same but the motor would sit higher than in the stock Voloci (it would be outside and over the frame rails).
One thing I like (and depend on) is being able to carry the Voloci on a bike rack on a 1-1/4 hitch on the back of my small car. Even the SLA version may be too heavy for the rack (not sure). I want to keep it as lean as I can and I prefer a removable battery if I can get the capacity.
Oh, one thing you may have noticed is that the foot pegs have small springs and balls that give it a detent.
Someone mentioned a chain tensioner. I have experienced that the chain tension is difficult to set and hold. Seems like you tighten the bolt and it messes up the setting and you can get into an endless cycle back and forth. One of the appeals to me of a rear hub motor was doing away with chain tension. For the Rear Hub design, my thought was to duplicate the part that is used to adjust the chain but drill ONE HOLE right in the center. No adjustment needed or possible!
Not sure if you noticed but your shot with the frame rails resting on the table is the best bike stand I have found. You can work on the whole bike (where the front wheel goes between the legs of the table and the rear wheel sticks up in the air). I have run the bike on the table with the rear wheel in the air and that works well for doing experiments with aftermarket controllers, controller settings, batteries, etc., etc.
Thanks again for posting and sharing your ideas and progress. Makes me want to start working on mine.
Thanks I really like the look of it. But my need for speed made me tear it apart. It's okay tho, i have plans to make it a sweet commuter ride.Whiplash wrote:Very cool bike! Never seen one but I have sketches of my own design that look almost identical! Lol!